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Thread: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the US?

  1. #71
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoez View Post
    For the interconnect, that $2B may not seem cheap to you. Distributing the cost among the various players is likely much less intimidating. I know that the sums of money that rolled around that business were large.

    The motivation? As always - more money. You can't sell what you can't deliver.

    Right now the consumer electricity rates are low. Wasn't last winter. How many users had multi-thousand dollar bills from that period of time?
    Well, the information I have says that average costs for Texas in 2020 are less than the national average, and much less than blue states.
    That's 8th lowest in the nation.


    As for the $2B being a large number and not realizing there are other people involved: guess what, the neighboring utilities are have not been clamoring for an interconnect the past 50 years. Indeed, the grid to the north of Texas has withdrawn from the Three Amigos Project (SPP).



    https://www.eia.gov/electricity/state/

  2. #72
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by Garret View Post
    How Texas has embraced wind & solar is a really good thing & you are to be applauded for it. However, it doesn't do much good if you can't get the power produced to the customer.
    But we can get the power to the consumer. The problem with our grid last summer were the generating facilities, not the transport. Do you really think all of that would have been built if there was no way to get the power to the consumers?

  3. #73
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    One of the best investments the Republicans have ever made - the 'claim' that last years Dixiecrats are the same as todays Democrats. The gift that keeps on giving!
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  4. #74
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I'm sure you're absolutely correct, and it wouldn't be worth your time to conduct the sort of open-minded research you yourself suggested.

    To be fair, you have shown the ability to change, grudgingly, your perspective if consistently hammered with enough facts and enough voices. But I don't have the time or inclination to help you work thru your process at the present time. Good luck.
    I do conduct research into this. I have been posting actual facts all day. You guyus make assertions, and are willing to post no sources to back them up. And I am the one who is not open minded?

    Ok, you win. Texas's grid sucks. The rest of the US's grid is in wonderful shape. Texans are idiots, the blues states are geniuses.

    Meanwhile, those idiots in Texas will likely double their solar capacity this year.

  5. #75
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    Well, the information I have says that average costs for Texas in 2020 are less than the national average, and much less than blue states.
    That's 8th lowest in the nation.


    As for the $2B being a large number and not realizing there are other people involved: guess what, the neighboring utilities are have not been clamoring for an interconnect the past 50 years. Indeed, the grid to the north of Texas has withdrawn from the Three Amigos Project (SPP).



    https://www.eia.gov/electricity/state/
    Sounds short-sighted to me.

    You might want to ask yourself why some places pay more for electric costs than others. The answer might not be as simplistic as you think.

    Also, you *MIGHT* want to re-evaluate your opinion of how cheap your electric cost are. https://www.chooseenergy.com/electri...ates-by-state/
    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails."
    -William A. Ward



  6. #76
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    One of the best investments the Republicans have ever made - the 'claim' that last years Dixiecrats are the same as todays Democrats. The gift that keeps on giving!
    I have never made the claim that the democratic party has not moved to the left. I have not heard many republicans make that claim. I have read many people on this forum make that claim (Mr Wilson repeats it often).

  7. #77
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    In an earlier post 'who was in charge (of Texas) way back then?'.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  8. #78
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    I fear we lose sight of the simple fact, our infrastructure, INCLUDING DELIVERING ELECTRICITY, needs to be improved and modernized.

    Is ANYONE here opposed to fewer blackouts? Where we have charging stations or charge electric vehicles at home, we're going to need MORE electricity, are we not?

    Decisions need to be made by people who realize this and will decide based on what's good for the country, not what's good for some particular pockets.
    "alternative facts (lies)" are a cancer eating through a democracy, and will kill it. 1st amendment is not absolute.

  9. #79
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    So how does that work, say, in this example? As I recall, Texas decided (many moons ago) they didn't want the Feds involved in their state, their governance, their electricity. And yet - when poor decision making (for whatever reason) resulted in a disaster, and hundreds of deaths - they wanted a butt-load of Federal money to make things right.

    Seems to be a disconnect.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  10. #80
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    So how does that work, say, in this example? As I recall, Texas decided (many moons ago) they didn't want the Feds involved in their state, their governance, their electricity. And yet - when poor decision making (for whatever reason) resulted in a disaster, and hundreds of deaths - they wanted a butt-load of Federal money to make things right.

    Seems to be a disconnect.
    Seems no one wants to be held accountable for decisions they make.
    "alternative facts (lies)" are a cancer eating through a democracy, and will kill it. 1st amendment is not absolute.

  11. #81
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoez View Post
    Sounds short-sighted to me.

    You might want to ask yourself why some places pay more for electric costs than others. The answer might not be as simplistic as you think.

    Also, you *MIGHT* want to re-evaluate your opinion of how cheap your electric cost are. https://www.chooseenergy.com/electri...ates-by-state/
    As to how I evaluated Texas's, I used the data provided by the US government, I do not know where "choose energy" gets tfeir data from, not whom they are. I suspect, based on their name, they are an organization advocating more deregulation, but that's just a guess.

    As to why Texas is lower rates than most. Several reasons: relatively low natural gas price (doesn't have to be picked as far), competitive end user suppliers, lots of wind power.

  12. #82

    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Well, cheap electricity won't do you a hoot or holler any good if the power is out for days at a stretch. Doesn't seem like your electricity is all that cheap either (though the opportunities to game the pricing are more varied, so maybe it is): https://www.electricchoice.com/electricity-prices-by-state/

    Suffice it to say--while synchronization of the Texas grid to elsewhere may seem a horrific task, there must be an advantage to it. El Paso moved itself out of the Texas grid after the last major winter distribution failure and they kept their lights on (and AC blowing) this time.

  13. #83
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Don't know who electric choice.com is. Can't understand why you guys don't trust the US government's data and keep using these pseudo marketing sites as your data.

    No one said there would not be advantages to being hooked up with the other grids.

  14. #84
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Fact check: El Paso has been connected to the Western grid for 60 years, not "after the last major winter distribution failure".

    Weird postings on this thread...

  15. #85
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    We used to be hooked up with DC ties-acynchronous. I suspect they are still active.

  16. #86
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    The DC ties connecting the western and eastern grid are still active, though they have limited capacity and are supposedly in need of upgrades. I know it they have been a major bottle neck in getting wind power from Great plains to the west coast. But hey, we have it on George's authority, the feds are on it, it's being fixed.

  17. #87
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U


  18. #88
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Sorry, I thought you were referring to the east-west DC Ties.. Yes, those are still functional, but rather low throughout also.

  19. #89
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    "While experts have stated that more grid connections to other states would allow California to export its excess solar and wind generated electricity to other states during sunny times of the day, and to import wind generated electricity when wind is blowing in other Western states but not in California, the legislature has resisted allowing more connections for fear of losing sovereignty over the state's electricity supply"

    Don't know how accurate that quote is from Wikipedia's article about California's grid.

  20. #90
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    Don't know who electric choice.com is. Can't understand why you guys don't trust the US government's data and keep using these pseudo marketing sites as your data.
    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    As to how I evaluated Texas's, I used the data provided by the US government, I do not know where "choose energy" gets tfeir data from, not whom they are. I suspect, based on their name, they are an organization advocating more deregulation, but that's just a guess.
    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    Oh, look, Texas's grid has 26% of the nation's wind energy, and is 9% of the nation's solar energy.

    https://www.chooseenergy.com/data-ce...tion-by-state/
    https://www.chooseenergy.com/data-ce...tion-by-state/

    But our business model is way inferior to everyone elses, and there is no motivation in Texas to build these things, especially since they would all be in the relatively unpopulated parts of the state and our grid will never be upgraded to move that electricity to where it is needed.
    Gee, I don't know who Chooseenergy.com is - I don't know why you don't trust the US Government's data on renewable energy in Texas.

    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails."
    -William A. Ward



  21. #91
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    Default Re: Hey Texas, why is your power grid pretty much disconnected from the rest of the U

    Peb - you are flailing. Your power system is structured dysfunctionally. I explained how. I explained why. And I suggested you look into it.

    Until you address that... all the pointing out of engineering details, all the facts about winter failure due to equipment icing NOT due to distribution inefficiencies, all your reaching of all sorts... you are not gonna solve the toad in the punchbowl. Good luck!
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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