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Thread: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

  1. #1
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    Default Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Heard on the news just now: the hackers didnít shut down the pipeline. They hacked the billing system. Company executives shut it down because they feared not being able to properly bill their customers.
    The Algorithm Is Watching

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bow View Post
    Heard on the news just now: the hackers didnít shut down the pipeline. They hacked the billing system. Company executives shut it down because they feared not being able to properly bill their customers.
    *Gobsmacked*

    I'm sure the executives aren't complaining about the prices that are the result of their actions. Nor the large panic and sales that it incurred.
    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails."
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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    D'eau!

    Rattling the teacups.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Hmm. And reports are that the company actually paid a ransom, somewhere in the range of $5M.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux


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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    That’s what I thought. It makes sense.6
    IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    And so the next world war slowly begins using the electronic weapon of its inventing nation.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    And so the next world war slowly begins using the electronic weapon of its inventing nation.
    And half of congress doesn't think we need to invest in cyber security.
    "alternative facts (lies)" are a cancer eating through a democracy, and will kill it. 1st amendment is not absolute.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Expect power grid attacks at some point. The old adage that war is just aggressive economics holds true. Nukes took full scale war off the table, and we've about reached the limit of proxy wars. Trump decided to kick off more aggressive trade wars, so now we can look forward to infrastructure attacks. It should be interesting if it reaches the point of trade route blockades. Which we seem to be setting up in a few places now.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    The FBI says it was a Russian gang, not the Russian government. Not sure how to separate the two.
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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bow View Post
    The FBI says it was a Russian gang, not the Russian government. Not sure how to separate the two.
    The Russians aren't sure either.
    Rattling the teacups.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bow View Post
    The FBI says it was a Russian gang, not the Russian government. Not sure how to separate the two.
    Last I read Ukranian.

    Btw when Trump was in office you couldn’t separate Trump, Manafort, Cohen, Guiliani from the US gov’t.

    I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest that blaming Russia or some other gov’t is disinformation for domestic infotainment needs,

    https://krebsonsecurity.com/2021/05/...nsomware-gang/
    Last edited by LeeG; 05-13-2021 at 02:57 PM.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeG View Post
    Last I read Ukranian.

    Btw when Trump was in office you couldn’t separate Trump, Manafort, Cohen, Guiliani from the US gov’t.
    That may or may not be true.

    If it was a Russian group, I'm sure they would love to blame the Ukranians. If it was a Ukranian group, I wouldn't be surprised either.
    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails."
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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    OK - the billing portion gets hacked. You are in charge of pumping millions of gallons of oil & gas across the US. Are you going to just cross your fingers & hope it's only the billing system? 'Spose they hadn't shut down the pipeline & it turned out that the pipeline software had also been hacked & 2 million gallons of gasoline poured out into towns & cities along the pipeline. Wouldn't everyone scream about how they shoulda shut down?

    I think they did the only thing they could do.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    " Only billing."
    Not being able to bill could/ would result in creditors recalling loans, no more credit, no payroll, contractors stopping work, etc. Then what? Gov't bailout?

    Shut off its money supply and you'll shut off the pipeline for sure.

    Kevin
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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by Garret View Post
    OK - the billing portion gets hacked. You are in charge of pumping millions of gallons of oil & gas across the US. Are you going to just cross your fingers & hope it's only the billing system? 'Spose they hadn't shut down the pipeline & it turned out that the pipeline software had also been hacked & 2 million gallons of gasoline poured out into towns & cities along the pipeline. Wouldn't everyone scream about how they shoulda shut down?

    I think they did the only thing they could do.
    honest question:

    how hard is it for a large organization to protect themselves from such attacks and to have adequate backup systems and data in case such attacks do get past security?

    we've all on a personal and business level lost data, but these latest attacks (especially state sponsored or state sanctioned versions) are pretty frikking sophisticated
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoez View Post
    That may or may not be true.

    If it was a Russian group, I'm sure they would love to blame the Ukranians. If it was a Ukranian group, I wouldn't be surprised either.
    Plus it depends where they're from in Ukraine. Some places in Ukraine are Russian and there are plenty of Russians there too! And more on the border every day. Wouldn't put it past them to figure out how to use Ukrainian servers, and I'm no cyber expert but say that confidently.
    One of the most enduring qualities of an old wooden boat is the smell it imparts to your clothing.

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    honest question:

    how hard is it for a large organization to protect themselves from such attacks and to have adequate backup systems and data in case such attacks do get past security?

    we've all on a personal and business level lost data, but these latest attacks (especially state sponsored or state sanctioned versions) are pretty frikking sophisticated
    And a good question!

    Speaking from my experience (others will add more I'm sure) there are 2 issues I've seen. The biggest is "Can't happen here" or "We're not important enough to get hit" and/or "We can't afford it" from management. The other is IT staffs that don't know all the options. Having a good disaster recovery plan is not cheap. You have to identify what might get hit, have a place for all the data to be backed up safely, and the more recent addition (since the ransomware attacks became prevalent) of how to get the desktops back up & running. Historically, the concern was "We've lost our data - how quickly can we get a new server & data restored?". With ransomware, every computer is infected, so just getting back data wont work - as a workstation will send out its worm to re-encrypt.

    So - before data is restored, all servers & workstations (as well as some hubs, storage devices, etc.) have to be completely sanitized: disks formatted, operating systems reinstalled, all applications reinstalled (Bob in accounting has a program we bought 12 years ago & depends on it, where are the disks & keys for it?), etc.

    It's a huge, time-consuming task, but with proper planning (where have we heard that before?), the task can be reduced: have not only good data backups, but images of all the different workstations. If a workstation has to be rebuilt from install disks, you have 1) know what has to be installed & 2) have all the CDs etc. to do it. For some users, that could take 10+ hours. With a ghost (image of the disk) it can be done in 30 minutes. However, the ghosts have to be kept updated - and that takes resources (hardware, software & people) to do.

    Then you add people bringing their own devices in & connecting to the network. Your phone, tablet, etc. can & will have a copy of the worm if it was hooked up to the network. You won't know it, but the next time you hook up, boom - reinfection. Many companies are switching to separate networks for personal devices, but keeping them truly separate is not easy.

    I know of one company that only has about 75 users & 5 or so virtual servers. They have a full-time person who does nothing but DR work, and if they get hit, they'll need 3 or 4 more people working crazy hours to get back running in a week or so.

    It's a nightmare - not made easier by gov't not taking it seriously. I could go on, but dinner's ready
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    Garret, I used to do computer hardware repair - A commonly held position among DP supervisors was 'I don't have time to do backups' (circa 1980 / 1990 ) - I can't tell you how many DP managers I encountered, who were packing up their desks as I was attempting to fix hard disk drives / and recover what data I could ( no backups in several years, really [!])



    Rick

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    Default Re: Pipeline shutdown: Part Deaux

    From another thread. http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...57#post6448957

    Even if able to restore data, a lot of data will be made public that the company likely doesn't want to be released to the public.

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