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Thread: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

  1. #736
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by davidagage View Post
    I think that next week I will start to rig up a bath too.
    Greg, on the last page you were talking about splining...
    What I have started to do is exactly that. I cut the edge nails out using a thin blade on the angle grinder, then shaped and fit splines into the gap and epoxied them in. Since the boat is wooded, as a final measure I plan on 1 layer above and 2 layers below the waterline of xynole..
    Have you posted any pics of what you are doing with the splining David? I had a quick look but couldn't see anything recently but it'd be a thread worth posting if you're able.
    Larks

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  2. #737
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Looks heaps better Greg.

  3. #738
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Will do Greg, I post up some stuff later today.
    "The desire to build a house is the tired wish of a man content thenceforward with a single anchorage. The desire to build a boat is the desire of youth, unwilling yet to accept the idea of a final resting place." -Arthur Ransome

  4. #739
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    from July 2008 until Jan 2011 so about 2 and a half years, with the first year being a particularly dry one.
    In retrospect .Could it have been avoided ? Water bath from the first ? More paint ?
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  5. #740
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    In retrospect .Could it have been avoided ? Water bath from the first ? More paint ?
    all of the above plus not going away to Darwin for 2 years
    Larks

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  6. #741
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Yeah, that couldn't have helped !
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  7. #742
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Hi Greg, of course it could be many places, but it just looks like the view from about here across to Fraser, as you come out from Tuan Creek: 25°41'38.33"S 152°55'27.18"E

  8. #743
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    I guess what it's shown is that the timber will expand back to close the gaps. So I guess you don't have to worry too much about the keel drying out again as you know that it'll take up once she's afloat again. If you're going to use splines, you wouldn't want to put any between the planking and deadwood would you as that"ll tear open if glued in the next time the boat comes out for a spell. I know you were thinking you might sheath this hull, as I'm going to with the Twister, but you have such unstable keel timber that I don"t think you could risk it, could you? If you sheathed it with the timber dry, I think even the moisture in the bilge might swell the timber enough to cause delamination and I don"t think you could sheath it successfully with the timber swollen with moisture. I think if you did decide to spline and sheath or even just spline, it"s got to be a job that starts above the deadwood only. All guesswork on my part but that" s. how it looks to me! Really an interesting exercise seeing so clearly what that timber did!

    Rick

  9. #744
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Impressive... I can imagine somebody building a backbone with this wood and using really dry wood... Imagine after the tremendous amount of pressure when that wood will swell up!

    Thanks for sharing the process. Happy for you!
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  10. #745
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    As you say Rick, the purpose of the exercise was to see what would happen to the timber so I'm very pleased at how well it has reacted. It has put my mind to rest about what was my biggest concern with the hull and pretty much resolved the question of sheathing for me, which I was never particularly keen on anyway. Peter, the PO, was telling me that he was responsible for the strip of glass along the garboard because he'd never been able to resolve a leak along there but I think having cleared the old caulking out of there before soaking up I should now be able to caulk that properly from the outset.

    I will still spline a few of the gaps in the huon pine strip planking and the plan is to attack that over Christmas. I'd like to get those gaps, the garboard seam and keel/deadwood bolt caulking and some paint splashed around the deadwood over the next two weeks so that if I end up having to go away for work again I can leave her back in the bath comfortable that she is reasonably stable and ready to start fitting out.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
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  11. #746
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Would it be a good idea to go over the surfaces you're going tp paint with a heat gun just before you paint so that the surfaces remain dry while you paint?
    Rick

  12. #747
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by RFNK View Post
    Would it be a good idea to go over the surfaces you're going tp paint with a heat gun just before you paint so that the surfaces remain dry while you paint?
    Rick
    It will have a couple of weeks to dry out a bit before I do paint it so I expect to be able to trap most of the moisture within the timber while having a dry enough surface to paint, but if not the heat gun sounds like a good idea. This evening I plan to give it all a bit of a scrub with sugar soap while I still have the pump and before I move the framework for the bath out of the road, leaving the membrane under the boat ready to reinstate when I'm ready.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  13. #748
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    A trick I have used to paint wood that had been soaking is to brush it with methel alcohol 20 minutes or so before painting it. I have done this before priming seams for caulking, and painting full bottoms. I just put the alcohol in a can and used throw away brushes. (put your ciggy out first) If I was to do it again on large surfaces I think I would try a spray bottle. Your project / progress looks great. Cheers
    Stay calm, be brave....wait for the signs. Possibly precariously prevaricating.
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  14. #749
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve McMahon View Post
    A trick I have used to paint wood that had been soaking is to brush it with methel alcohol 20 minutes or so before painting it. I have done this before priming seams for caulking, and painting full bottoms. I just put the alcohol in a can and used throw away brushes. (put your ciggy out first) If I was to do it again on large surfaces I think I would try a spray bottle. Your project / progress looks great. Cheers
    Thanks Steve, sounds like a useful tip.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  15. #750
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Acetone is faster than alcohol for sucking moisture out of wood. Prior to the invasion of the "modern boat builder", we just did our work using, traditional materials. If one is willing to search, the old tools and materials can still be had.
    Jay

  16. #751
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    After a bit of a scrub with sugar soap and moving a bit more of the bath structure away, here's another shot showing the lower gap as well,s o both gaps have closed up very nicely:



    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  17. #752
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    I'm quite surprised at the amount of take up there Greg, those gaps were quite something.
    be modest, and be proud of it.

  18. #753
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Greg - great to see the thread busy again, this looks really encouraging. I am tempted to get our Deadwood into a bath of some kind as soon as possible once we get the shed around her. Will remember to photograph and measure the gaps..

    P

  19. #754
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by euro View Post
    Greg - great to see the thread busy again, this looks really encouraging. I am tempted to get our Deadwood into a bath of some kind as soon as possible once we get the shed around her. Will remember to photograph and measure the gaps..

    P
    It has been worthwhile Peter, just be sure to use a decent membrane for the bath though, I first used heavy plastic - concreting moisture membrane plastic - which I thought would be durable enough........ it's very annoying to go through the exercise of jacking up the boat bit by bit to drag the plastic under the hull, cushion the plastic both sides where the blocks sit on it and then set up the bath structure only to find that the plastic has sprung a leak from catching somewhere either when you've been dragging it through or where it wasn't cushioned well enough between blocks and base.

    The idea of the bath structure, with ply bent up against the hull as close as possible and bits of carpet, foam or whatever stuffed behind it where it doesn't quite meet the hull, is to minimise the amount of water needed behind it to wet the hull and therefore the weight of it wanting to collapse the bath. It doesn't need much, when I emptied mine the water was over the deadwood inside the hull but amounted to only about 30 gallons or so before I got in with the hose to wash it out after draining it.

    I used pool salt to salt the water and I pumped the bath out into a 44 gallon drum which I was able to empty at work through the filtration system that they use on the boat wash-down bay. It was full of old antifoul, sawdust, a bit of ethylene glycol and goodness knows what else so I wasn't keen to just dump it in the yard (to kill the grass where I don't want grass) or down a drain.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  20. #755
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Larks
    ... it's very annoying to go through the exercise of jacking up the boat bit by bit to drag the plastic under the hull, cushion the plastic both sides where the blocks sit on it
    We're lifting the boat across the yard tomorrow into her new position... I'm half wondering whether we should bed down a sheet of DPM between the blocks which the keel stands on, ready to form a water jacket when we need it.

  21. #756
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by euro View Post
    We're lifting the boat across the yard tomorrow into her new position... I'm half wondering whether we should bed down a sheet of DPM between the blocks which the keel stands on, ready to form a water jacket when we need it.
    By DPM I assume you mean Damp Proof Membrane Peter, which may be just what I was using early on and it did hole very easily. Here's another thread on the exercise if it's of any interest: http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...oak&highlight=
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  22. #757
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    I'm quite surprised at the amount of take up there Greg, those gaps were quite something.
    I'm not! Both Blue Gums, Southern and Sydney, have quite large shrinkage ratios: 6% radial/12% tangential and 5%R/9%T respectively.
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  23. #758
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    The thing to avoid now is an expansion / shrink again cycle.

    I wonder if the expansion might be less on subsequent cycles.

  24. #759
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by euro View Post
    We're lifting the boat across the yard tomorrow into her new position... I'm half wondering whether we should bed down a sheet of DPM between the blocks which the keel stands on, ready to form a water jacket when we need it.
    I wonder if laying the membrane on a bed of clean fine sand would be of any advantage ? It should stop hard spots where the keel could damage the membrane ...unless of course you planned to have the structure blocked high and free .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  25. #760
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    I've procrastinated long enough over the repairs to my hull planking so finally today I started on the dirty work of sanding/grinding back the antifoul to see exactly what I'm up against.

    I did have grand designs of stripping back all of hull to bare wood but it is such a mongrel job that I've pretty much resigned myself to dealing with the broad areas that I have to work on for repair and will give the rest of the antifoul a rough strip back just to the hull paint.

    I've done about a quarter of what I need to do and it took me all day, though half of that was dithering about thinking about it, part was trying to get my sander/polisher to work after a false start, part spent buying a new sander/polisher and finally about 4 hours of actual work. Fortunately Kate rescued me with a cup of tea half way through, it really is a prick of a job:

    I couldn't get a full shot of the tented hull, but I've wrapped the whole hull to try and contain the dust from impregnating everything in my shed. This is really what's made the whole job such a chore. However as this shows it's doing a pretty decent job of keeping the shed reasonably dust free:




    Meanwhile, inside the tent:



    and very much in need of a cuppa:






    It's just as well I have the right hat for the job:



    So the plan is to put a decent days work in to knock this rotten job over tomorrow and the actually start splining on Tuesday.

    I'm using the purple clean and strip discs on a variable speed ryobi sander/grinder/pilosher:


    http://www.google.com.au/search?q=pu...w=1024&bih=672
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  26. #761
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    I just tried one of those discs for the first time a couple of days ago. I was removing old gyprock cement (blue glue) from a beam we removed. It seemed to work well but wore down pretty quickly and they're not cheap! What did you think of it for your job?

    That job you're doing really looks like hell! Working in a plastic tent full of dust in Qld in summer! Lucky it's been so cool this year! I envy your capacity to get your boat indoors but I like my outdoor setup for some jobs!
    Rick

  27. #762
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Have you got a remote air supply set up Greg ...it would be a blessing .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  28. #763
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by RFNK View Post
    I just tried one of those discs for the first time a couple of days ago. I was removing old gyprock cement (blue glue) from a beam we removed. It seemed to work well but wore down pretty quickly and they're not cheap! What did you think of it for your job?

    That job you're doing really looks like hell! Working in a plastic tent full of dust in Qld in summer! Lucky it's been so cool this year! I envy your capacity to get your boat indoors but I like my outdoor setup for some jobs!
    Rick
    I've been reasonably pleased with these purple ones, I can't remember the brand and had meant to take a pic' of one to include here. I'd tried others which did wear quickly but these ones seem a lot more robust, the sales rep from our abrasives supplier, Australian Industrial Abrasives, talked me into grabbing a few and I'd happily say that they are much much better than what I had previously bought from Bunnings.

    I'd been thinking of your shed today Rick and wishing I could move mine outside more easily for this sort of job, but then I'd probably cover the house in blue dust so it may be just as well to be in where I am, despite the discomfort.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  29. #764
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Have you got a remote air supply set up Greg ...it would be a blessing .
    No, I could probably have borrowed a couple of extractors and ducting from work before I locked the keys in the office, but I'd be happy to have no reason to have to go back there.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  30. #765
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    The best way is to do it on a windy day when the neighbours are out.


    You can get a fan and that really big ducting from Bunnings for not much money. If you blow it into a bush, that'll trap most of it and you can then sweep most of it up later.
    Rick

  31. #766
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Sitting here typing this, and a blasted possum and baby just climbed out of our kitchen wall. Gave Trace a bit of a start! Isn't renovating fun?
    Rick

  32. #767
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    A friend made up a very simple version Greg . A small blower ...anything will do even a hairdrier I'd say . A face shield as per whipper snipping with an elasticised bib glued on to maintain the air around your face and a length of creepy crawly hose as a flexible air supply. So much better than a respirator.

    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  33. #768
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Good start to the New Year! Happy boat!

  34. #769
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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    I like to have a helper standing behind me with a leaf blower for that crappy job.
    She is looking good!

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    Default Re: H28 "Larrikin" rebuild

    Even doing ****ty jobs for your own (future) enjoyment is better than working at a job you hate. I'm glad you're out of the job Greg & hope that better employment options will soon overwhelm you.

    Do try not to breathe that dust mate, it could shorten our enjoyment of your company quite considerably.
    Keep It Simple: KISS it better.

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