Lee wants a new trimaran design...

[Lee.007]

Ok guys, thanks to the help from many of you on here, I built my first sail boat ever, the Misty Sunrise. I had a blast doing so and also sailing it is exhilarating. Now I am addicted. Is there a rehab facility somewhere?

So, I need to build another boat so the wife and or family can tag along. I want it to be small and trailer-able like my first one. I will design in hinged akas to make it easy to fit on the road, so overall width does not worry me. I probably won't start construction for another year, so I have plenty of time to research and design so I get it right. Or closer to right than my first one anyway. Here is the list of what I want:

*Trimaran multi-hull

*Efficient enough hull design to paddle at 2.5 to 3 knots comfortably

*100 to 120 sq feet of total sail area, probably Bermuda rig for simplicity, maybe a jib too.

*21 feet max length overall

* Beachable with flip up leeboard and flip up rudder

*Seating for two minimum

*Capacity to haul 800 pounds of people and or camping gear

*cedar strip built, or stitch and glue

*150 to 200 pounds max boat weight

*A little more freeboard than a kayak so I don't get soaked, but I want the long and narrow kayak shape for the main hull, with a flat or slightly narrow stern

*Amas that displace at least 200 pounds each so I can step off a dock onto them and they don't sink.

I have looked at the CLC Shearwater double, Chesapeake tandem and triple, and the Bootlegger tandem, but they don't seem to have the extra freeboard I am looking for. I also am eyeing Nick Schade's Great Auk. But if I used them for the main hull, I want bigger amas than the clc sail rig.

I once read an old book that had a Glen L design in it called the "Folding Schooner". I think it will be too wide, and a little too long, but it has the right idea.

SO, Does anybody have any plan or design suggestions that meet my very picky and possibly unfeasible requirements? Thanks in advance for your thoughtful suggestions!!

Lee (commander of the Misty Sunrise)

[Touchatout]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

As your examples that canoe is too small for your need.
But she is thinked to be used with her "trimaran kit":
http://www.kaamosboats.com/toucanoe.htm

On same site you'll find a bigger "family canoe" but not with "trimaran kit".
Anyway they can fuel your brain...

[swoody126]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

more "fuel for the brain"

https://duckworks.com/trilars-plans/

sw

[NeilMB]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

If you want strip planked, Gary dierking's ulua is a winner and can be stretched as far as 24' https://duckworks.com/ulua-plans/

If you're okay with less elegant hull forms, the rest of his designs are just waiting to succeed https://duckworks.com/gary-dierking/

[JimD]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...



Small trimarans | Lunada Design

Some ideas from Lunada. But I doubt any tri with proper sized outriggers for sailing is going to paddle decently. And your weight restrictions might be a problem too.

[FishoutaFlorida]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

I probably won't start construction for another year, so I have plenty of time to research and design so I get it right. Or closer to right than my first one anyway. Here is the list of what I want:

*Trimaran multi-hull

*Efficient enough hull design ...

SO, Does anybody have any plan or design suggestions that meet my very picky and possibly unfeasible requirements? Thanks in advance for your thoughtful suggestions!!

Greetings Lee,

You know when I look at your list here, I'm seeing design parameters that you have found need to be applied to get what you want. And I'm pretty sure that you've already searched the market for a potential candidate. But these comments also look a lot like a start to a planning project manual that could just as easily be applied by yourself to generate a design!

Based on your existing boat, you've learned a lot! If you were to find another boat design, it would have to perfect for you to build it exactly as shown on the plans. It looks like you've got a lot of CAD documentation out there, so no matter which way your design went, you would have a head start. And with the folks who've watched and contributed to your first project, well there is tons of experience and knowledge out there to bounce ideas and refine the end product. Just my 2c worth, but you've got such a nice looking boat, have a lot of applicable baseline drawings, a list of your specific objectives...design what you want and build it! I know it's problematic to start at the beginning, but your attitude, ingenuity and stick-to-it ways have impressed me and I'd like to see what you could come up with.

Plan B? Get someone else's design and do the best with it, which would probably be pretty good as well.

Thanks Lee! I'll be looking to see which way you decide to go!

Eric

[Woxbox]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

OK, Lee. I'm going to take another shot at convincing you that the Seaclipper 20 is the right fit. Check out this video.

[Stora Le]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

Is this too small for you?

https://bandbyachtdesigns.com/sailboats/minitrimaran/

Viktor

[Lee.007]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

OK, Lee. I'm going to take another shot at convincing you that the Seaclipper 20

I am tempted Dave. But from looking at the rigging and the way the mast is mounted, I am a little intimidated by all that hardware. Looks kind of expensive to build too. I was wanting to do another birdsmouth mast, simple partner and step design.

[Lee.007]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

But these comments also look a lot like a start to a planning project manual that could just as easily be applied by yourself to generate a design!

Thanks for the vote of confidence Eric! And yeah, I am really close to just rolling my own.

[Lee.007]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

I am on staff duty tonight(All night duty where I sit in the battle captain's chair and answer the phone in case the world explodes) and have plenty of time to stroll the internet and look at boats. The more I look, the more I think I want a marriage of the Seaclipper 16 and the Slingshot 19. I just might have to buy plans for both, and do a kit bash. Or maybe just roll my own completely. Thanks to all for the brain fuel!!

I like the ideas behind the flat hulls. I bet it just slides right up on the beaches. But I don't think I like the dagger board idea. I was sailing a few weeks ago, and I was about 50 meters from a clay cliff shoreline, when my leeboard nailed an underwater ridge that was just high enough to drag the leeboard. It was too deep for me to see it though. Luckily, it just rotated the aka a bit in the lashings, and also on the leeboard mounting bolt. I was clipping along at about 6 mph when I hit it, so I think if it had been a dagger board it might have done some damage. Since I don't have a depth finder, I gotta depend on my knowledge of the lake, and my eyeballs. There was no buoy or anything marking that ridge. I wonder how many power boaters have lost their prop on it.

So do ya'll reckon the Seaclipper would be alright with a leeboard??

[Gary Dierking]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

Take a stroll through the last 14 years of my blog on sailing canoes. Anything with one outrigger can also be made into a trimaran. The 20' Tamanu would suit you and can carry four people. http://outriggersailingcanoes.blogspot.com/

[upchurchmr]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

Lee,

Perhaps you could help me understand a little more.
Are you planning on having the amas bouyancy low enough that they will submerge rather than the main hull rising out of the water?
Why do you want so little sail area? A Hobie 16 has about 215 sq. ft. There were thousands of them, but it doesn't seem to match your intended use. The Hobie weight would be much less than your maximum, so it would tend to be harder to keep upright than the wide beam, heavy loaded weight and small sail area.
Do you want to keep the seating inside the main hull, or would you put seating area outside the main hull like the Seaclipper 20? Note that a mutihull day sailor needs to allow the crew to move forward going upwind and move aft when reaching. You have already seen the result of placing the crew too far aft and sinking the stern. Performance gets compromised quickly. This is the major concern with the Lightning 19 IMHO.
Stayed masts have been around a long time. Plenty safe and more controllable for performance than a free standing spar, unless you have a sailmaker who will change the sail multiple times to get it right. Yes it will be a bit more expensive, however if you can find a Hobie 16 mast and rig it can be pretty cheap.
How much freeboard?

The folding schooner is much too wide for a multi, unless you just want something to putter around - go slow.

Have you looked at the Trica 540? Meets most of your criteria except perhaps the 800# of loaded weight. And perhaps the freeboard. But you do get the freestanding mast!

I think you are asking for too little boat weight, and too much load. But that is where these studies generally start.

I hope you continue discussing your desires.

[Lee.007]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

Are you planning on having the amas bouyancy low enough that they will submerge rather than the main hull rising out of the water?

Nope, not at all. I want the ama buoyancy to be enough so that if I step off a dock onto the ama, it does not sink like the clc amas do.

Why do you want so little sail area?

Its not that I want little sail area, just trying to make sure I don't overpower the boat. I just don't know how much sail area is needed for a given boat weight / payload to make it go fast. Is there a book or website somewhere that tells me that?

Do you want to keep the seating inside the main hull, or would you put seating area outside the main hull like the Seaclipper 20?

Actually, the more I look at the Seaclipper 20, the more I like it. And the wife likes that one too. So probably put the seating on the outside on some hardboard "trampolines". I really like the idea of being able to put a tent up over the cockpit and sleep on the trampolines. I have an old tent I could cut the floor to fit!

How much freeboard?

Enough that I don't get soaked with spray. The Seaclipper 20 looks like it fits that bill.

Have you looked at the Trica 540?

I have not. Never heard of it, so now I have to investigate that one too!!

[Lee.007]

Re: Lee wants a new trimaran design...

OK, Lee. I'm going to take another shot at convincing you that the Seaclipper 20 is the right fit.

Ok Dave. I think you are going to win. But I gotta build it out of cedar. Not because I have to, but because I want to. I'm just kind of stuck on the natural wood look. Everywhere I go with my Misty Sunrise, people are amazed just because it is made of cedar strips. I had one guy tell me he would swear I spent a million dollars on it. I said, "Nope, less than $1500 actually." He called me a liar. He was drunk, so I didn't take any offense. I just laughed as I sailed away.

I am thinking of using the same construction method I used for my amas. Lay the strips down side by side flat, glue the edges together kind of like hardwood flooring, fiberglass one side, then stitch and glue together with the fiberglassed side inside. I am thinking of making the strips 1 inch wide, and 1/4 inch thick. Glue the panels together long enough and wide enough to cut out the panels needed for the boat.

Can anybody talk me out of using this construction method?