Losing friends in divisive times.

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  • CWSmith
    New Hampshire
    • Nov 2008
    • 44064

    #16
    Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    I have many relatives who hunt. As far as I know, they have traditional hunting guns. They don't carry in public and they keep their weapons in a safe. I have no problem with them. However, they are the old NRA. The new NRA is a diiferent beast entirely. I could not keep a friend who carried a gun in public.
    "Where you live in the world should not determine whether you live in the world." - Bono

    "Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip." - Will Rogers

    "Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx

    Comment

    • George Jung
      Senior Member
      • Jan 2004
      • 31057

      #17
      Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

      So you boys feel that if you can’t do ‘perfect’ in one move, you just give up and do nothing? Wow. Almost appears you prefer ‘nothing’.
      There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

      Comment

      • bobbys
        Senior Member
        • Jun 2009
        • 30716

        #18
        Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

        I dont talk politics or religion with my friends, I will listen to them. I have never asked anyone how many guns they own. Yeah , my liberal friends like to lecture me but I dont engage. Course if they come over I make them bow to the Sarah Palin shrine.

        Comment

        • SeanM26
          Senior Member
          • Jun 2019
          • 643

          #19
          Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

          Not at all. But everyone is saying that we need to "ban these weapons of war!" With no input on what will happen once they are banned.

          Give me an honest answer of how you think we can reasonably remove these firearms and I will consider it.

          Comment

          • George Jung
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2004
            • 31057

            #20
            Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

            Originally posted by SeanM26
            Not at all. But everyone is saying that we need to "ban these weapons of war!" With no input on what will happen once they are banned.

            Give me an honest answer of how you think we can reasonably remove these firearms and I will consider it.
            you may have a point. Damn difficult to even imagine, isn’t it? If only we had a blueprint, guidance from someone who had been through this, successfully. Too bad that doesn’t exist, eh? Bet you’d jump at that!
            There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

            Comment

            • Decourcy
              Wood butcher
              • Nov 2017
              • 4460

              #21
              Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

              Originally posted by Gib Etheridge
              Just stop selling ammunition, period. If someone can prove that they actually need it then they can take the safety course and get very well vetted before getting a one time permit to purchase a limited amount.

              Let them bear all of the arms they want, nothing says they have the right to purchase ammunition.

              I don't see any other way
              I don't actually think that ammunition controls are a bad idea. It isn't perfect, because there are massive stockpiles of factory ammo, components, and Knowlege about how to make powder if required, but it would be far more effective that controlling the guns.

              Comment

              • Decourcy
                Wood butcher
                • Nov 2017
                • 4460

                #22
                Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                Originally posted by George Jung
                you may have a point. Damn difficult to even imagine, isn’t it? If only we had a blueprint, guidance from someone who had been through this, successfully. Too bad that doesn’t exist, eh? Bet you’d jump at that!
                Once again:

                Americans made up 4 percent of the world's population but owned about 46 percent of the entire global stock of 857 million civilian firearms."[5] U.S civilians own 393 million guns. That is 3 times as many guns as the armed forces of the Russian Federation (30.3 million), China (27.5 million), North Korea (8.4 million), Ukraine (6.6 million), United States (4.5 million), India (3.9 million), Vietnam (3.8 million), Iran (3.3 million), South Korea (2.7 million), Pakistan (2.3 million), and all the other countries (39.7 million) combined.[6] American civilians own more guns "than those held by civilians in the other top 25 countries combined."[7]


                "American civilians own nearly 100 times as many firearms as the U.S. military and nearly 400 times as many as law enforcement."[8] Americans bought more than 2 million guns in May 2018, alone.[8] That is more than twice as many guns, as possessed by every law enforcement agency in the United States put together.[8] In April and May 2018, U.S. civilians bought 4.7 million guns, which is more than all the firearms stockpiled by the United States military.[8] In 2017, Americans bought 25.2 million guns, which is 2.5 million more guns than possessed by every law enforcement agency in the world put together.[8] Between 2012 and 2017, U.S. civilians bought 135 million guns, 2 million more guns than the combined stockpile of all the world's armed forces

                Comment

                • Jimmy W
                  SE USA MS or sometimes GA
                  • Feb 2010
                  • 29135

                  #23
                  Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                  Originally posted by SeanM26
                  Not at all. But everyone is saying that we need to "ban these weapons of war!" With no input on what will happen once they are banned.

                  Give me an honest answer of how you think we can reasonably remove these firearms and I will consider it.
                  Have a buy back program offering a reasonable price then lock up anyone caught with one for several years. The nut cases will have a hard time getting one to murder groups of people with.

                  Comment

                  • gypsie
                    NSW Australia
                    • Jun 2010
                    • 8151

                    #24
                    Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                    Originally posted by Decourcy
                    No, but "it's effective" matters more. I expect other actions, possibly more effective, are harder.
                    No mass shootings in Oz since certain guns were made illegal.

                    I'm not actually sure what you are trying to say.
                    You seem to be championing the cause of 'it's hopeless so leave it alone', yet slipping around saying anything specific.

                    There is also a generational thing, in a hundred years time the ban will remain and the number of automatic weapons would be greatly reduced.

                    The very first thing to do is ban the guns, then follow up with 'actions' (is that raiding houses?) that can support that law.
                    Its the first step in the thousand mile march. This is why gun lobbyists send up every obstacle against a ban - it is the very first step and as long as it is not taken nothing further will happen.
                    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

                    Comment

                    • gypsie
                      NSW Australia
                      • Jun 2010
                      • 8151

                      #25
                      Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                      Originally posted by Decourcy
                      Once again:

                      Americans made up 4 percent of the world's population but owned about 46 percent of the entire global stock of 857 million civilian firearms."[5] U.S civilians own 393 million guns. That is 3 times as many guns as the armed forces of the Russian Federation (30.3 million), China (27.5 million), North Korea (8.4 million), Ukraine (6.6 million), United States (4.5 million), India (3.9 million), Vietnam (3.8 million), Iran (3.3 million), South Korea (2.7 million), Pakistan (2.3 million), and all the other countries (39.7 million) combined.[6] American civilians own more guns "than those held by civilians in the other top 25 countries combined."[7]


                      "American civilians own nearly 100 times as many firearms as the U.S. military and nearly 400 times as many as law enforcement."[8] Americans bought more than 2 million guns in May 2018, alone.[8] That is more than twice as many guns, as possessed by every law enforcement agency in the United States put together.[8] In April and May 2018, U.S. civilians bought 4.7 million guns, which is more than all the firearms stockpiled by the United States military.[8] In 2017, Americans bought 25.2 million guns, which is 2.5 million more guns than possessed by every law enforcement agency in the world put together.[8] Between 2012 and 2017, U.S. civilians bought 135 million guns, 2 million more guns than the combined stockpile of all the world's armed forces
                      What are you saying?
                      It's too hard so don't do it?
                      It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

                      Comment

                      • gypsie
                        NSW Australia
                        • Jun 2010
                        • 8151

                        #26
                        Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                        Originally posted by SeanM26
                        So hypothetically, we ban all semi-automatic rifles that fire medium caliber cartridges. How do we get the 5+ million out of circulation?
                        That is actually a completely different problem and (counter intuitively) unrelated.
                        Banning guns and ammunition is an issue of legislation, enforcing it is a matter of policing. As it happens, #2 gets easier if #1 is in place.
                        It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

                        Comment

                        • Jimmy W
                          SE USA MS or sometimes GA
                          • Feb 2010
                          • 29135

                          #27
                          Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                          Originally posted by gypsie
                          What are you saying?
                          It's too hard so don't do it?
                          That is exactly what he is saying.

                          Comment

                          • Hallam
                            Senior Member
                            • Feb 2012
                            • 6853

                            #28
                            Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                            Originally posted by Garret
                            The alienation of friends is a result, not a cause. All due to the division in today's US.
                            And when you speak of division, this was a key tactic of Trumps election campaign with the employment of Cambridge Analytica targeting false news videos and information on Face book with the use of data mining to build profiles of voters etc etc during the last election.
                            A great documentary on this is now out on Netflix.
                            The Great Hack

                            Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

                            If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

                            "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
                            Bruce Cockburn

                            Comment

                            • Dave Wright
                              Senior Member
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 1147

                              #29
                              Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                              Originally posted by CWSmith
                              I have many relatives who hunt. As far as I know, they have traditional hunting guns. They don't carry in public and they keep their weapons in a safe. I have no problem with them. However, they are the old NRA. The new NRA is a diiferent beast entirely. I could not keep a friend who carried a gun in public.
                              We have a relative who always carries, including at family gatherings, it's visible if you are observant. Most people aren't. It's not something I do, or ever desire to do, but I've known him since he was a kid, I like him and I don't consider him a threat. He has never gotten out of line with relatives or strangers. He's also a Trump supporter, the only one in our extended family. I seldom discuss politics with him. He has other qualities that I feel outweigh these two factors. If you ever needed assistance in almost any way he would provide it, relative or not. He's pleasant and interesting to be around. What could I possibly gain losing him as a friend / relative? Part of the socialization process is getting along and functioning cooperatively with all sorts of people. I have no reason to think ill of him.
                              Apple products have always been silly expensive,
                              no one told anyone to buy an iPhone, there are plenty fine cheep non apple cell phones.

                              Comment

                              • mdh
                                Banned
                                • Oct 2004
                                • 6665

                                #30
                                Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

                                Would a prohibition against guns work better than drugs, alcohol, prostitution, or immigration?

                                Comment

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