Redwing update

[WX]

http://books.google.com.au/books?id=...arance&f=false

Hmm, okay the distance between the forward edge of the prop and the aft end of the skeq should be prop dia x .3. So mine actually needs to be around 114mm...and I forgot about the locking nut. Back to the calculator.

[WX]

It comes to 1590mm...I'll buy a 1600mm length.

[WX]

Decided to tackle the blocking around the inboard end of the stern tube today. I figured the easiest way was to laminate it out of scrap ply...seeing how I have so much.
Remember this is all dry fit so no surfaces have been prepared.

All voids will be filled with thickened epoxy.
First layer.


Next layer.


And the next.


Okay that got boring, here's how it will look.

[WX]

And one from the top



Another little job I thought I'd start thinking about it is bunk cushions. I have some vinyl floor covering left over from my sail panel templates so I put it to use. Normally V-Berth cushions are made up of two wedges split in the middle. However I have a mast through mine so I decided on dividing them at number two frame, The aft one should be fairly straight forward but the forard one will be interesting as I want a semicircle in the aft edge to fit around the mast.

I thinking navy blue.

[RFNK]

Gary, I'm a big fan and strident defender of plywood but .... I wouldn't use it for a shaft log or anything like that. These areas are prone to moisture penetration along with vibration and, with plywood, you'll have end grain all over the place. Even the highest quality plywood will break down through end grain penetration. Why not use the same approach with scraps of a more resilient timber that you'd surely have lying around your place? It'd be cheaper too as you'll use less epoxy.
Rick

[WX]

Gary, I'm a big fan and strident defender of plywood but .... I wouldn't use it for a shaft log or anything like that. These areas are prone to moisture penetration along with vibration and, with plywood, you'll have end grain all over the place. Even the highest quality plywood will break down through end grain penetration. Why not use the same approach with scraps of a more resilient timber that you'd surely have lying around your place? It'd be cheaper too as you'll use less epoxy.
Rick

Fair enough comment Rick and I do have a goodly amount of timber offcuts.
The upside is I can use my ply bits as templates.

[WX]

Okay Rick this the MkII version.

I've used Hoop Pine for the bottom and top layers, the rest is Flooded (Rose) Gum offcuts from my keelson.

With the ply version I didn't bother with trying to match the angle of the cut with the angle of the stern tube but with this thicker material I decided to. Rather than get too fiddly with it I decided I'd use the arc of the saw blade to do it for me.



I don't have a Dadoe blade so it's multiple passes. This is actually the top layer, I didn't bother taking photos of the whole operation.

Okay that's the last cut out done. The first layer is in two parts, the back part sits on top and the front part slides in under the tube. It took me three goes at that one, I kept getting the bevel the wrong way up...wadda ya mean I confuse easily?


Bevelling the top edges.

[WX]

This is the seconded layer in place. I have quite a lot of 45 degree strips left over from the mast build which good filler pieces around the tube. It will cut down on the amount of epoxy filler I'll need.


First dry fit.


From the side.


All the edges sanded off and drill holes done...just add epoxy and it's all done.

[WX]

Excuse the syntax errors, it's been quite a day.

[RFNK]

Hi Gary, looks good to me. But, you'll probably hate me for saying this ...... this area of the boat can get pretty wet and stay wet. Hoop pine isn't very rot resistant (I think) so wouldn't you be better off making that bottom layer from your flooded gum or something that's a bit more resistant?
Rick

[Larks]

Or give it a very good dose of Everdure before glassing it all up???

[WX]

I have some TPA to mix with the epoxy Greg. I don't think I'll have any problems with it.
I pick the SS rod for my prop shaft tomorrow. 1.6m @ 25mm cold drawn 316 = $130.

[WX]

Hi Gary, looks good to me. But, you'll probably hate me for saying this ...... this area of the boat can get pretty wet and stay wet. Hoop pine isn't very rot resistant (I think) so wouldn't you be better off making that bottom layer from your flooded gum or something that's a bit more resistant?
Rick

By the time I'm finished with it Rick, water won't get near it.
I'm also thinking instead of having drips from the stuffing box going straight into the bilge I'd build a water proof box under it to catch the drips. Which can then be pumped out.

[WX]

Picked up the rod for my prop shaft today, I should know early tomorrow morning if everything is aligned properly...fingers crossed.

[P.L.Lenihan]

Very nice series of pictures Gary! I look forward to seeing how she'll look once your done with the engine hook-up.Epoxy and F'glass will be your friend all over and around the pillow blocks inside.


Continued success!!!

Cheers!

Peter

[WX]

Thank you Peter.

My prop shaft is 200mm longer than I ordered, so maybe I can make an extra very very short one.


My alignment is still a bit out which I can fix one two ways, or mix of both. The stern bearing could come up a fraction or I can shim the front engine mounts.


This a tray I am putting together to catch the drips from the stuffing box. The idea is to run a drain hose from it to an easy to reach plastic bottle/container. The whole thing will be epoxy saturated with some TPA mixed into the first coat.

[WX]

Yesterday was let's make a prop shaft day, which involved a trip to Peter Sibley's as he owns a lathe and an even longer trip by another fine gentleman who had the skills to drive it.

The day began with much fiddling, twiddling and general adjusting while Nick worked out how to drive it.


The important step is to get the right ratio for cutting the thread for the nut...much maths later we were ready to try it on a length of scrap. Happy with that it was set up the blank rod in position.


Cutting the thread.




Once the thread was cut it was onto the taper for the prop. here we are test fitting the prop.

[WX]

Here we have the high tech support for the other end of the shaft.



Now it got interesting for me because I didn't know the coupling not only had a taper but it needed a nut on the end inboard end of the shaft as well.


By this time it was getting late in the day and once it was all done bar the keyways I had to head for home. Sadly I had hoped to share a beer or two and have a yarn with Nick...next visit I guess.
Here's the completed shaft.


And now for the moment of truth.
This end looks good.

[WX]

And the inboard end? Well this is where it got depressing.



I knew it was going to be out a bit but I figured I could raise the front of the engine and fiddle a bit at the stern bearing.
However as you can see there is quite an error and I am going to have to open up the skeg again...I really should have waited till I had the shaft ready. Anyway rather than cut away the whole skeg again I will try routing in from the Starboard side.

[RFNK]

Gary, is the tube actually straight? If it is, then the shaft alignment at the prop isn't out by all that much. Why can't you realign the engine on its mounts? It's not going to matter for your boat if the engine isn't perfectly aligned fore and aft.
Rick

[WX]

Hi Rick, I tried jacking up the front of the engine but it's pretty bad. Ripping it out is a pain in the freckle but it's the easiest option and after a days work I almost have the stern tube free. Just think, a bit more patience and this would not have been a problem. reversing is going to be a zen exercise.

[WX]

Okay the stern tube is out and after a day of removing wood with anything I own that can remove wood from difficult places I am now back to a good sized hole in the boat. I now have a pretty good idea of the correct alignment and only need to trim a bit more to allow for the stern tube. It's a work in the garden day tomorrow but Monday should see me gluing timber back in around the stern tube and a prop shaft sitting where it should be.
What a waste of 2 weeks work.

[WX]

Okay I have the new alignment set up and it's smooth as. Just have to repair and shape the skeg and it's on to the potentially really interesting job of setting up my mold and pouring the ballast.

[WX]

With prop shaft aligned I started rebuilding the skeg around the stern tube today. A slow steady job of laminating in strips of Oregon that has taken me most of the day.

[WX]

A few photos showing the process of re aligning the prop shaft and stern tube.
Stern tube exposed.



Tube removed and starting to chop out timber above it.


All re aligned and filling back in around the stern tube started.



Because the prop is now offset slightly to starboard the skeg gets a bump.

[WX]

Here we have the new shape all glued and filleted in place.



The aft section above and below the shaft still needs to scalloped and that will happen next. Here's a photo with the prop on.

[PeterSibley]

That looks entirely satisfactory Gary ! Congratulations on a flexible solution .

[P.L.Lenihan]

At first there was hollering happiness seeing you get the shaft set up and worked on.Then, there was stupified silence as I saw your (mis) alignment issue.After this, there followed days of directionless drifting about as I wondered often to myself, "How-n-hell is Gary gonna put this affair right?"

Now at last, there is nothing but cacophonous cheering and the popping of corks! Well played Gary and bravo on your willingness to just do it!!



Cheers!


Peter

[WX]

Thank you Peter,...and Peter.
I'm rather keen to get back at it tomorrow and I'm really quite pleased with how it has worked out. I still have the inboard end to rebuild and I think I will do the shape a bit differently this time...I'm not sure how but it's bound to be interesting.
To fill in around the stern tube I used a number of triangular lengths of Oregon that were from the birdsmouth cuts on the mast staves. I found they nestled into the space quite well.

[ben2go]

See,I would have never thought to do that.I would have been in the bilge,killing myself to mover the entire drive line over.Good thinking on that one.

[wardd]

i have a question about prop shafts

what would be the problem with using something along the lines of a pto shaft as used on farm tractors to simplify engine and shaft alignment?

[WX]

i have a question about prop shafts

what would be the problem with using something along the lines of a pto shaft as used on farm tractors to simplify engine and shaft alignment?

It has been done and there are any number of configurations one can use. The limits are imagination, room, $ and engineering skills.

I've taken what I consider the easiest option to correct my mistake. I figure it's going to make reversing in one direction a bit harder but that is just going to be another of life's little challenges.

[donald branscom]

Better make sure those pipe legs on that lead melting drum do not sink into the ground.
Also if you put a grease fitting on that stern tube and pack it full of polypropylene grease it will never leak.

[WX]

Better make sure those pipe legs on that lead melting drum do not sink into the ground.
Also if you put a grease fitting on that stern tube and pack it full of polypropylene grease it will never leak.

I'll probably chuck a dob of cement under the legs, I still have to level it anyway.
About the grease, you have just answered a question that has been playing around in my mind, thank you. I'm going to put a drip catcher under the stuffing box just to be on the safe side. I'm going to try for dry bilges.

[donald branscom]

I'll probably chuck a dob of cement under the legs, I still have to level it anyway.
About the grease, you have just answered a question that has been playing around in my mind, thank you. I'm going to put a drip catcher under the stuffing box just to be on the safe side. I'm going to try for dry bilges.

With the stern tube packed full of grease it will NEVER leak and you could loosen the stuffing box not and no water will come in at all. I have used this method and it works very well.

[WX]

Okay, there's a few voids to fill and a 20mm thick strip of hardwood to go along the bottom of the skeg but I think the shaping is about done.
I did a bit more shaping after this photo.

I tacked a batten along the bottom edge and marked a line each side to plane to.



With the bottom of the skeg cleaned up and a bit more sanding it's starting to look finished.


And one looking aft.

[Larks]

Nice work-around Gary, obviously not what you'd have preferred but it looks like a good functional outcome. As far as making it difficult going astern, you may even have fluked an offset that might just balance the prop' walk...?? Probably not but it makes a nice thought to look forward to seeing the effect.

[PeterSibley]

As long as the fish like it ..

[WX]

Thanks Greg. I guess I will find out next year, I'm going to try for a launch date before the 6th of July...my 60th birthday.

[RFNK]

With the stern tube packed full of grease it will NEVER leak and you could loosen the stuffing box not and no water will come in at all. I have used this method and it works very well.

I have this arrangement on Pipsqueak. There's a grease nipple on a hose leading up to just under one of the cockpit hatches. At the end of each day, if we've run the engine, I just give the grease a top up with about half a pump of the grease gun that I have on a clip in the hatch. It does work well but I couldn't say that it's entirely drip free.
Rick

[WX]

I have this arrangement on Pipsqueak. There's a grease nipple on a hose leading up to just under one of the cockpit hatches. At the end of each day, if we've run the engine, I just give the grease a top up with about half a pump of the grease gun that I have on a clip in the hatch. It does work well but I couldn't say that it's entirely drip free.
Rick

There's a grease cup on my stuffing box and I can replace it with a grease nipple.
I've been expecting someone to comment of the SS screws holding the stern bearing in place but maybe you've all realised they are temporary. I'm thinking of bonding in either bronze or monel studs. If I am correct I can't use 316 Stainless as it will react with the bronze stern bearing. Opinions welcome on this.

[The Bigfella]

Yep

[WX]

Yep

So is that yep, I need to use silicon bronze or monel?

[PeterSibley]

There's a grease cup on my stuffing box and I can replace it with a grease nipple.
I've been expecting someone to comment of the SS screws holding the stern bearing in place but maybe you've all realised they are temporary. I'm thinking of bonding in either bronze or monel studs. If I am correct I can't use 316 Stainless as it will react with the bronze stern bearing. Opinions welcome on this.

With a stainless shaft and bronze prop ?

[The Bigfella]

By all means then... go ahead

[WX]

With a stainless shaft and bronze prop ?

Yeah, it seems to be a case of the horse has bolted eh. Oh well I was going to fit a zinc anode anyway.

[Larks]

A zinc anode on the shaft is a must, not something to be thinking about, something that you MUST HAVE!!!!

My bronze stern bearing was held in with SS coach screws that I've taken out for the moment, not a thing wrong with them and they looked like they'd been there for a while . As long as you keep an eye on your shaft anode and it keeps sizzling away I can't see why you'd have a problem as that incompatible SS/bronze union of shaft and prop is exactly what the anode is there to protect. If you're particularly worried fit one in front of the prop and another directly behind the bearing - depending on how much shaft you have hanging out there, or screw one to the hull just above the new shaft casing.

[WX]

I reckon I've got enough room to clamp one on the shaft between the prop and stern bearing. Maybe a poor choice of words on my part Greg but I wasn't considering a zinc anode as optional.

[WX]

I took the prop shaft in to an engineering works today to get the key ways cut and I should have it back next week. I think I might have to make the keys myself. It can't be that hard.
I wanted to replace the neoprene hose connecting the stuffing box to the stern tube. The piece of hose is only about 150mm long which is half the minimum length I could buy, the bloke said look I'll sell you a radiator hose as it is the same price. I now have enough hose to keep the boat happy for years.
Also picked up a box of SS hose clamps and a grease nipple for the stuffing box.

[WX]

Apart from a short stub of metal pipe that will be welded to the top for the wiring I finished cutting out the parts for my masthead crane.
The angle grinder got quite q workout today.


The next job was to sand back the skeg and get a second coat of epoxy on it.



Now that I have the aft end of the stern tube sorted it time to repair the mess I made at the inboard end.