The Ideal Shed Thread

[Duncan Gibbs]

Okay, as some of you may know I'm vacating my office by the Tweed River due to the sudden onset of full time employment and redundancy of the need for a full office. I'll be moving a fair whack of stuff into storage as my home doesn't have enogh space for all my stuff. The Pippin will live in the carport for a while. We have a small shed which has a fair bit of gardening equipment in it already, but I WILL be making room for my tools and my bodgy workbench. To upshot is that I lose the shed at the office.

To remedy this drastic situation I will have a steady income and a site where I hope to build a new and customised shed/workshop equiped with all the right mod-cons for knocking out the odd wooden boat. To this end I ask you all to put on your thinking caps and suggest tools that will be needed and construction techniques that will be economical but also provide for the practical needs of boatbuilding as well as be in keeping with the bucholic character of our land (pictures coming).

The tools I already have include a swivelling metal work vice, power planer, variable speed disk sander/polisher/grinder, belt sander, detail sander, orbital sander, drill, egg beater drill, two brace and bits, hand panel saw, hack saw, a fair few clamps (springs and Fs, but will always get more), jig-saw, stanley #4 plane, low angle block plane, draw knife, spoke shave, circular saw, heat gun, a few cheap scrapers, claw hammer, small "tap tap" hammer, screw drivers including my multi-bit stanley ratchet, bevel gauge, 4 work horses, flat and round rasp, course file, course rat's tail file and a couple of soft sanding blocks. There may be a cople of other things I've left out but this is pretty complete.

Obviously I will want a concrete floor to the shed and obvious things include a table saw, thicknesser and dust extractor.

I want peoples' recommendations for tools and which brands and models will be suitable for my initial purposes (vessels up to 30') as well as roof spans for a skillion roof that will span about 8 to 10 metres. I will try and get as much weatherboard to clad the outside with along witha few old timber windows so the shed will look as if it's been in-situ for as long as the house has and suit the character of the place.

Roofing options I've already thouht about include sips-panels, normal roofing iron/colourbond with insulation, but I'm in no way set upon any single solution other than using a skillion.

Photos of tools/products/solutions are welcome and requested!

Goforyalife!!

[donald branscom]

I would make sure you can open both ends of the building. Good air flow and light.

[The Bigfella]

If you can list all your tools like that..... you haven't got enough.

My son said to me a while back that he thought I was mad having so many angle grinders - until he worked on a job with me. Two have wire brushes - wheel and cup, others have grinding disk, cutting disk, flap wheel, 3M wheel - etc. Then of course, there's the big polisher...... and on it goes. I'd rather buy another grinder than spend half the day changing backwards and forwards. Sometimes it doesn't matter having cheap tools - eg the two grinders with wire brushes are $20 Chinese cheapies - the others are Hitachi, Bosch. etc.

It even pays to have cheap chisels laying around at times - I had to use a chisel when the boat was on the slip the other day to get a prop shaft key out - and I recently used a real cheapie to cut the back of a car at the wreckers a month or so back. For building something though - spend up young man, spend up.

Thinking about useful tools - a disk sander / linisher combo, a Triton Superjaws and a decent drill press all feature highly - oh yeah - an air compressor.

[Paul Girouard]

Obviously I will want a concrete floor to the shed and obvious things include a table saw, thicknesser and dust extractor.

Photos of tools/products/solutions are welcome and requested!

Dunc your choice of flooring I'd reconsider if at all possible, a nice wood floor , although hard in ways to achieve, would be a better flooring option.

Getting a wood floor would allow attaching molds, lofting , and in general be easier on your legs and feet.

My shop / studio is a concrete slab and ever shop I've worked in has had a concrete floor , hard on the body really.

The other beauty of a wood floor is vac ducts and such can be run in the crawl space .

A sloped lot would be a easier site to do the wood floor thing on.

[Duncan Gibbs]

All good so far! Yes and yes and yes on the following: Ability to open the space up/light, grinders will come (inc. the all important bench grinder and coffee grinder ), chisels I have a couple but a good set will be nice, and the other things Ian mentioned. The floor will have to be concrete, at least initially Paul as we have termites aplenty here. Perhaps a section could be 16mm structural ply raised on stud framing timber layed out on the concrete? The slope is there but I'll be cutting a platform out on the site larger than the shed will be, and providing access for vehicles/trucks so we can take deliveries of garden stuff like mulch, gravel and rocks. Bandsaw, cordeless: Yes and yes!

Really hope to hear from the following gents too: Mr Smalser and Sir Jimbo Ledger, as well as seeing some general shots of you workshop too Paul.

Pictures! Pictures!

Inspiration and suggestions: http://www.carbatec.com.au/

Roofing structures?

[Jim Ledger]

I was buying a bit of angle iron last week and chatting with the lady writing up my order. "Oh", she says, "my husband used to do some woodworking, metalwork, mostly, though. I've still got all his machines. Would you be interested?"

"Well, that depends, maybe".

And she hands me the list of machinery, two pages, close-spaced typewritten. I've been meaning to get over there and have a look.

You see, that's the kind of thing you should be looking for. If you can wait a while, my wife will be doing the same thing. "Could you make me a list like that, Jim?" she asked the other day. "Well" I told her, "the major stuff, OK, but I'm certainly not going to list every hammer and rat-tail file like that Aussie bloke, Duncan whatsis."

Went to a yard sale yesterday and picked up about half of what you just listed, Stanley brace, practically new, big box of auger bits, mostly unused, bunch of unused files, pair of new leather work gloves. "Twenty bucks" the guy told me. Oh, and there was also four new polishing compound sticks, rouge, tripoli, and a couple of other kinds.

You remember that bandsaw, don't you, Duncan. Still waiting its turn to be fixed up. Found a nice old South Bend metal lathe a couple of weeks ago which is going to come in handy for this and that. I'll have to put them on the bucket list.

Better get moving, Duncan. It's a race, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. No point in having a nice shed if you've nowt to put in it.

As for the shed, make it a big 'un with three phase power if you can. Lots of bargains in the three phase machines, and better stuff, too.

[Tylerdurden]

If I ever have to do it again I am going with High cube shipping containers. Nice wood floors, super secure and windows are easy to put in. If you need shelving or equipment mounts just weld them on.
If you inclined to move just make sure the weight is reasonable and have it trucked to the new site. As far as opening on both ends they can be had with doors on each end too. Just pour footing columns to set them on. Besides your recycling without using lumber.

My dream shop would be two fortys side by side with twenty feet of interior wall cut out to make a 20 x 16 foot open space. A bow roof shed off of one end would complete the space. I figured I could have it all for under 15 k.

[Jim Ledger]

Here's a nice shed for you, Duncan. Not mine, wish it was, though. Started out as two mobile classrooms, stuck together, pulled apart, side additions added, clerestory added, a couple of greenhouses stuck on one side. Very cosy.

[Robmill0605]

My .02 cents;

The four corners of a woodworker who is serious about the craft revolves around four machines when setting up a shop/shed.
1. heavy duty tablesaw capable of accurate work .
2. good quality bandsaw, the old Delta, Rockwell, Cresent, Yates etc. cast iron beauty's have it hands down over Taiwan imposters.
3. heavy 8" or larger jointer, Northfield ( I'm in love with mine). Allows you to buy rough dimensioned lumber at a fraction of milled stock.
4. Planer, 15" or larger floor model.
With these four " corners" of the shop, you can take any piece of wood and shape it, or mill it to any size. You break the bonds of lumberyard dimensioned stock, and can even mill lumber from a backyard tree.
Once I had all four machines, it frees one to think outside the box and if your project calls for 7/8", or some odd size, no problem.
When you are building a project, and you start off with perfectly flat, and square stock, the work becomes about the craftmanship from there.
I mill my stock, let it stablize a day or so, and come back with hand tools to remove machine marks etc with a finely tuned smoothing plane.
There a lot of bargains out there as someome else stated if you can restore an old machine.
Here's my 1950 Northfield jointer I restored as an example, 1150 lbs of jointer.

[Jim Ledger]

A nice view of part of the interior



A nice chair in front of the stove, a very nice feature for an older guy.



One of the stuck-on greenhouses. this one is for spraying finishes.



You can see why it becomes hard to make that list for your wife.

[Robmill0605]

If I ever have to do it again I am going with High cube shipping containers. Nice wood floors, super secure and windows are easy to put in. If you need shelving or equipment mounts just weld them on.
If you inclined to move just make sure the weight is reasonable and have it trucked to the new site. As far as opening on both ends they can be had with doors on each end too. Just pour footing columns to set them on. Besides your recycling without using lumber.

My dream shop would be two fortys side by side with twenty feet of interior wall cut out to make a 20 x 16 foot open space. A bow roof shed off of one end would complete the space. I figured I could have it all for under 15 k.

I really like this , building a shop like this would pay for itself just in the labor saved in building from scratch. It would also be somewhat fire proof .
Great idea.

[Mrleft8]

I second Paul's comment on the floor. I wrecked my back working on concrete floors in other peoples' shops. The two shops/barns that I built for myself both had/have 2x6 T&G flooring, and it's far and away the better option. What's "Skillion"? (Besides a REALLY big number)

[Duncan Gibbs]

That's a payer Lefty!...

A skillion is a flat roof with a small fall on it to allow drainage. It doesn't snow here.....











yet!

And it's goodnight from this side of the Pacific Rim. Thanks for the pic's and comments people! Keep 'em coming. (Thinking of container architecture too Mark!)

Cheers and good night!

[coelacanth2]

My barn is 20' by 40' (wish I had gone 45' as my builder/friend suggested) with a man door at one corner and a 16' by 18 ' rollup door at the other 2 windows per side, 3' block kneewall topped by 16' sidewalls, concrete slab to fend off the termites and carpenter ants. On the project list is a cupola for looks and ventilation and a couple of modest skylights for light when the sun gets too high to come in the windows.
Many years ago, a friend of mine was building a shed to house his little sawmill (60 inch Belsaw) and was going to roof it with metal. At my sugesstion, he added 6 translucent panels - it made all the difference, esp for safety. Same with a couple of polebarns roofed with Fiberglass a few of the translucent panels really help.
I'm still wiring mine lotsa outlets, outlets near each other on different circuits. Industrial type power useful.
I started off with a portable dust colector, "upgraded" to a big 2 horse stationary, and wish I hadn't bothered. For a full time production shop, such a beast makes sense. For what a time limited amateur does, I could have saved my money and the hassle of running all the ductwork, although it does look cool.
I really like my Dewalt planer and 12' slide compound mitersaw.
I still like my 25 y.o. Craftsman radial arm saw for it's versatility, and kept in tune it's pretty accurate. I heartily agree with THE BIGFELLA multiple drills and grinders are useful when working fast. I find that my time is worth more than a drill or grinder - there's only so much allotted.
Good luck, and have fun

[Paul Girouard]

Who cleans your shop Jim Ledger?

Come on thats a show room for tools right? Hell theres no dust on the lower shelfs , none between the vertically stored lumber , WHERES THE DUST!!!

[Hwyl]

[Captain Blight]

You see that enormous hose leading off the back of the bandsaw? That's where the dust is. It's managed well from the get-go, so there isn't a bunch of crap floating around in the air and settling on everything.

Duncan, I like your idea of a 16mm ply floor on on top of a plywood slab. Like it a lot. This would let you run wiring and ducting beneath the floor and still be able to access it at any time. Brilliant me old china!

[Paul Girouard]

Duncan, I like your idea of a 16mm ply floor on on top of a plywood slab. Like it a lot. This would let you run wiring and ducting beneath the floor and still be able to access it at any time. Brilliant me old china!

5/8" / 16 mm is to light weight unless your sleepers are 12 " / 304mm OC . The tools would dance on that.



TerryLL wheres "a" / the cobweb , theres gotta be one some where Very clean shop , wheres the boat get built? Looks pretty full , or is it a working shop , not a dream boat builder

[Daydreamer]

I've got serious shop envy of anyone who has a shop. I was working in my garage and got booted out by SHMBO. This was in mid-build of my skiff. It has been a bear trying to finish working outside and dealing with the weather.

I too am interested in shop building designs and construction and am looking forward to the responses to Duncan's questions. Where I live, most people end up building a metal building with a concrete floor but as far as I know, none of them are boat builders and most are just used for storage. To me, the metal building lacks character although they go up quick and you don't have to worry about termites. Great pics so far.

[Canoeyawl]

A plywood floor on treated 2x4 sleepers over concrete is a good idea.
The ducting for dust collection can be framed in under the floor.
As mentioned, concrete floors will hurt your back, break your favorite plane or chisel if it slips out of your hands, are difficult to heat and you can't nail anything down...

[Paul Girouard]

Paul,
My plan is to loft over the end of the shop with the man door (12 x 24 loft) and move the vertical lumber storage against the wall. That will give me a 12 x 36 building space in front of the overhead door for the boat build (my fourth), which will be either an Alpha Beachcomber dory or a Caladonia yawl.

No spiders, sorry.

Cleanest shop I've ever seen , that I can recall anyway.

I looked at our profile info , just what is a textile equip. manf. make? I know we had textile mills back in R.I. where I'm from, so looms and such where then 60's common, but I figured all that type stuff had been exported off shore.

I've seen some great looms that local women (mostly) have in thier homes, works of art almost.

Just curious , nice shop , I wish mine where so clean. Maybe, meaning I not willing to spring for all the dust control equipment you have.

[Jim Ledger]

Who cleans your shop Jim Ledger?

Hey, that's not fair. Although, I'd like my shop to look like that. There's not even any sanding dust clinging to the walls. That's one of the toughest things to clean. Even blasting with an air hose at close range won't dislodge all of it. Painting over is the real solution.

In practice, I find that I've got to accept a certain minimum of dust, often a lot more, as the energy and time required to totally clean a shop could be put to better use building something. And, as you all know, dust comes from everywhere and it goes deep. Every box in every drawer, every nook and cranny on every machine, clean it out and next week it's back.

Look, here's one. Look at the dust on the floor. Router dust, I'll bet, or maybe electric plane, who can tell. The point is, I'm getting a little tired of you, Paul, and that Lefty laughing at me for having such a clean shop.

[Jay Greer]

Over the years, I have had the opportunity to work in a variety of shops with a variety of floors. The first shop I ever worked in for pay was Carl Chapman Boat Works in Costa Mesa CA. Chappie had a clay floor in the building area. It allowed for all manner of options to support hulls in frame, cast keels and even dig down when clearance was needed in certain areas under a keel. The clay floor had the added bonus of not damaging tools that were dropped. And, it was easier on the human frame than a hard, punishing concrete floor is. Machines were set on a concrete pad in an bump out to the main shed.
My current shop, which is under construction, has a two inch T&G floor over one inch ply on ten by fourteen inch joists, taken from an old mill building. There is a secondary foundation sorrounding the hull construction area with lifting hatches giving access to a pit under the hull being built. Here the bonus is, easy access to the inside of an inverted hull or easy access to keel bolts and rudder posts. It may seem like overkill! But the years have finally taught me what works best on feet, backs, hulls and dropped tools.
Jay

[Paul Girouard]

My current shop, which is under construction, has a two inch T&G floor over one inch ply on ten by inch joists, taken from an old mill building. There is a secondary foundation sorrounding the hull construction area with lifting hatches giving access to a pit under the hull being built. Here the bonus is, easy access to the inside of an inverted hull or easy access to keel bolts and rudder posts. It may seem like overkill! But the years have finally taught me what works best on feet, backs, hulls and dropped tools.
Jay

That sounds heavenly Jay

Jesh Jim it was joke , I wish my shop was clean as well , but like you said the dust goes every where. Whats a mother to do

I'd like to see some photos of Lefty shop , how dirty is it? You've been in it right? At the ESB party.

[Bob Cleek]

Aesthetics aside, Tyler's suggestion for recycled cargo containers is spot on unless you want to get into major construction. A couple of forty footers side by side with a roofed space in between. Cut doors in the sides, windows, wire it up and you're set. Leave the space between a dirt floor if you are planning on building a boat of any size in there.

The most important thing I've learned in decades of building shops is the essential requirement of ORGANIZATION. Invest in good rolling tool chests. "A place for everythhing and everything in its place. There is no point collecting tools if you can't find them when you need them.

Second, put EVERYTHING you can on rollers. This gives you flexibility. A bunch of stationary power tools parked in one corner are a lot more useful than a "Norm style" shop with huge blocks of iron fastened to the floor.

Third, don't forget that you need space for wood and materials storage. Wood will soon take up the most space over anything else. Saving worthwhile offcuts will save you lots of money and tons of time running to the lumber yard. The same goes for fasteners. A well organized system for storing bits and pieces is a must have if you don't want to be constantly hung up because you can't find the right nut to fit the right bolt.

[Jim Ledger]

Jesh Jim it was joke , I wish my shop was clean as well , but like you said the dust goes every where. Whats a mother to do

I'd like to see some photos of Lefty shop , how dirty is it? You've been in it right? At the ESB party.

That's "jeesh", Paul,. I know a joke when I hear one. And, yes, I've seen Lefty's shop. Clean as a whistle. But then,you know, Lefty's also had decades, yes, decades of practice building shops. And he actually makes the odd thing or two in them, as well. But clean, like a hospital in there. Air conditioned too.

[JimConlin]

Some other Aussies had a good solution.
See this video

[Paul Girouard]

That's "jeesh", Paul,.

The spelling police are out in force today, and punctuation, grammar, formatting errors, etc.?? Maybe the double question marks eh

Dunkey must be snoozin eh, what say Bruce!!!

[P.L.Lenihan]

Man o man, some of you guys are killing me with your fully equipped operating theaters...er...a...work shops.


Duncan, unless you intend on changing your line of work and opening the GIBBS MIGHTY BOAT WORKS LTD, I would suggest keeping it low tech and simple for that once or twice in a life-time mighty boat re-build.Go with a bowshed.You can dismantle the bows for handy storage when not needed and it is a breeze to set up,(especially as snow is not exactly a big concern down your way),and readily extended(lengthened) by throwing another bow together.A bowshed can also be easily added to the end of your garage for a handy extension.

All my power tools(all 5 of them) fit into the back of my car and the hand tools(all 8 of them) go into the tool box. Don't ever let the abscence of every tool in "the catalogue" thwart your building desires. It certainly never stopped me

Good Luck!

Peter

[Jim Ledger]

"Fully equipped workshop"? Interesting concept. Does one exist? Can one exist? Can two exist simultaneously?

All that good Canadian brew must be turning you a bit philosophical today, Peter.

[Paul Girouard]

"Fully equipped workshop"? Interesting concept. Does one exist? Can one exist? Can two exist simultaneously?

All that good Canadian brew must be turning you a bit philosophical today, Peter.

Amen Jim , MORE TOOLS eh More power tools as well , OK a few nice hand tools is OK as well

[Paul Girouard]

Paul,
My web site is listed under contact info in the profile menu. Check there to see the stuff I currently make.

You're right about the industrial textile industry being mostly gone from the US, but the hobby textile industry is alive and thriving. Knitting, weaving, spinning and related arts are big business in the US.

Lots of people are raising animals for their fiber: goats, sheep, alpaca, llama, yak, musk ox. Likewise, there are hundreds of small businesses like mine supplying traditional tools and equipment.

Yup thats what I sort of was thinking of. Those looms I've seen are quite nice , one , maybe all , where able to be linked to home PC for design or some reason.

So you make just the shuttles it seems. Why not the whole loom?harder to market, ship , less demand as folks only need one or two where as , like tools , you more than likely can never have "enough" shuttles maybe.

Nice niche market , looks like you make nice ones, shuttles that is.


Theres quite a few hobby farms here on Whidbey with critters , llama's , etc. used for what your talking about.

[Duncan Gibbs]

Okay got some shots of the site. As you can see it's a bit steep but I've worked out a cut and fill pad of about 12-14 metres wide is possible (the blue stuff is carpet layed down to keep the weeds at bay):



The cut will necessitate a section of blockwork wall up in this corner near the house:



The liquidambers were planted before the block was purchased. We'd have planted poincianas or something a teansy weansy bit more sub-tropical if we'd had our way... Oh well!

My timber stack, quivering in anticipation of a table saw, thicknesser, etc...



Excellent contributions! Keep 'em coming!!

[Ethan]

Some great input here - from folks who have obviously been around the block on this issue.

A few thoughts:

I seem to remember a call for contributions from our host awhile back on the subject of boatshops. If I remember correctly, a feature spread was in the works on the subject. Anybody heard regarding the status of that endeavor?

What about security? As in, "I have a shop, but it's not in my back yard"? Or, "The meth heads are running wild in the countryside"? I know, I know - get insurance! I'm here to tell ya though, the feeling of opening up your shop one morning and finding that someone has helped themselves to your gear ain't a good one! Aside from insurance and stout doors, has anybody come up with or seen some particularly good ideas for keeping things from walking away? I'm thinking concertina wire and rabid rottweillers...

I think Duncan's situation is similar to those of us in the southern US in terms of climate. No snow, and temps uncomfortable (I know, it's relative!) for only 1-2 months a year. I would suggest that a workable solution in that case is a smaller "core" building, to house machinery, etc. that needs to be secured, augmented by an outside, covered work area. For example, I'm leaning towards a 20' x 30' building (downstairs shop area with 11' ceilings, upstairs lofting floor) that opens onto an outside 30x50 roofed work space. While everyone's priorities are different, I found that the savings from not enclosing the 30x50 area will allow me to go with a hybrid timberframe construction for the building, thereby giving the place some character. The savings would also free up the necessary funds to lay a wooden floor over the slab, build some stout trusses engineered to do some moderate lifting, and maybe....just maybe....span an I-beam over the 30x50 space. I've really come to appreciate the ability to lift and move heavy items. That 1960's General of Canada 24", 3 phase planer is only a good deal if you can get it off the means of conveyance home!

Having said that, I see Tyler and Cleek's point - left unchecked, the shop can become a never-ending project with a life of its own and preclude any boat work getting done! Many a beautiful craft has been built in a bowshed or next to a converted shipping container.

Also FWIW, I did a little experiment 5 years or so ago. I, too, had heard about the deals to be had with old 3 phase equipment. So, I created a spreadsheet listing what I "needed" to get and then tracked the costs of new, modern equipment and actual 3 phase pieces offered for sale (eBay, school auctions, etc) over the course of the next year. Factored in the cost of a rotary phase converter, having it wired in by an electrician, shipping, restoring older machines to operable condition, etc. What I found at the time was the cost of the 3 phase stuff, all said and done, was about 15-30% higher than buying new. However, what a purely cost based analysis doesn't reveal is the huge leap up in quality and scale that you get with the older stuff. That introduces some special considerations (i.e., the above mentioned material handling challenges, space required to house and use), but the end result is pretty astounding, both in capability and economy.

Best of luck Duncan. I not only look forward to this discussion evolving, but especially to seeing you make the project a reality!

Ethan

[botebum]

This is the shop. It's about 20' by 30' enclosed-


Inside-

I labled it to show my brother what it looked like and to practice some computer skills. There's a bandsaw now as well.
Rule number 1 for building a shop- Make it 50%-150% larger than you think you need. At the very least design it and place it to allow it to be expanded. I feel like I've got 5 lbs of sh!t in a 2 lb sack. I have plans to expand but no $ to do it right now.

Doug

[Duncan Gibbs]

Cool Doug!! Yea'... I got da boom box too!! Been listening to the Piano Competition Yo!

[Larks]

Dunc, I went through the exercise of looking at the whole range of options for building my shed and ended up going back to the good old Titan barn with a loft over one end under the high middle roof section for sails etc.

The only problem I had was that I built it as an 8m x 10m with the plan to build a 23' Scruffy Secret somewhere down the track (and site restrictions with a slope at the back of the building site). Problem was that the H28 opportunity came along and I had to "extend" the middle bay by a metre and raise the loft to fit the H28 inside.

What I'm trying to say is.....no matter what you build the bloody thing won't be big enough!!! (So maybe try and set it up with the potential for future extensions in mind?)

[PeterSibley]

It's not big enough !!!

[Larks]

But I can see how nicely you've been able to extend behind it.........

[tossedman]

When I grow up I want a shed like that of Bob Albers. RodB has been documenting Building Peterson's Schooner "Susan" in 7 threads that are a fabulous read. They can be found here.
Here's some of Rod's photos of Bob's shop:




See post #35 in this thread for more.

Please note that none of this is mine all the credit goes to RodB and Bob Albers. I just drool over the shop and the boat within.

Todd

[Ethan]

I agree with tossedman - that shop and RodB's posts are pretty awesome.

Rod mentioned in a previous thread that Bob designed and engineered the trusses himself. If I remember correctly, the trusses were built from 2x? onsite and have a pretty impressive lifting capacity. Sure wish I could peek at the design.....

Clear span....the unsung hero.

[WX]

Hi Dunc, Don't have any timber either in the ground or close to it. If you go for iron roofing allow plenty of headroom and if you can, insulate it. My shed, rough as it is is termite proof. I used either gal stirrups for upright posts or steel piers up to bearer height. Build it so you can open it right up in summer and close it up in winter, that though breeze the last few days has been rather chilly.
Flooring ply makes a top floor though it can be a bugger to fit together.

[PeterSibley]

But I can see how nicely you've been able to extend behind it.........

It may be small ,but it's very warm .

[skuthorp]

Our new place has a 60X22ft steel shed with 2phase power, concrete floor, lighting, insulation and a stove at one end. Even a small bathroom. House is just a shell, but who cares!

[Duncan Gibbs]

Going for something a smidge bigger than yours Jeff: 63' by 34' (19.2 x 10.5 metres for those of us who subscribe to the French system of measurement in the crowd).

Anyhoo, here's the first doodles.

Plan with section line shown:


And section:



This is something that could be achieved in distinct stages:

1. Cut & fill and placement of DGB 20 (roadbase) and plant out the perimeter.
2. Bring in the container; 40 foot high cube, half office half storage, so it will have windows and doors cut into it at one end.
3. Pour the slab; 150mm 25mPa with a 250mm turndown at the edges. Place the container in its final position.
4. Build the retaining wall needed at the end nearest the house.
5. Chemset spiggots into the slab and erect portal frames. I'm not sure which to use: Steel or Composite timber, this will come down to cost and ability to support dead loads when lifting machinery, turning hulls and so on. Timber frames will need some clearance from the ground as per Gary's point about termites.
6. Whack on the roof. This will happen immediately after the frames have been erected if they are to be timber.
7. Clad the sides and put in doors, roller doors, louvres and vents.
8. Start putting machinery in/install timber floor over slab keeping an apron of slab clear to allow for protection against to ol' termites.

I reckon 6 months including approvals from my local council and about $20-25k AUD: What say ye all?

[Jim Ledger]

Looks great, but why draw such a small boat?

Watch out for the fill, though. Maybe pilings or concrete filled sonotubes under the footing, in the locations of the posts, down to undisturbed earth. In the event that the fill settles.

And a bigger door, of course.

[Larks]

'gotta agree with Jim there Dunc, if you're not planning on getting it engineered and passed/approved through council - drill a few 300mm holes along the beam of the slab down to the natural ground so that the slab is essentially tied in to the same bit of dirt throughout and possibly add a few cross beams where the weight of the boat will be.

Apol's if we're telling you how to suck eggs here mate and if you are getting it passed through council no doubt you'll have these details anyway.

Do you realise though that you're very likely setting off a bout of shed envy on the forum?? (my little 10mx8m Titan is starting to look very second cousin!!)

[PeterSibley]

Going for something a smidge bigger than yours Jeff: 63' by 34' (19.2 x 10.5 metres for those of us who subscribe to the French system of measurement in the crowd).

Anyhoo, here's the first doodles.

Plan with section line shown:


And section:



This is something that could be achieved in distinct stages:

1. Cut & fill and placement of DGB 20 (roadbase) and plant out the perimeter.
2. Bring in the container; 40 foot high cube, half office half storage, so it will have windows and doors cut into it at one end.
3. Pour the slab; 150mm 25mPa with a 250mm turndown at the edges. Place the container in its final position.
4. Build the retaining wall needed at the end nearest the house.
5. Chemset spiggots into the slab and erect portal frames. I'm not sure which to use: Steel or Composite timber, this will come down to cost and ability to support dead loads when lifting machinery, turning hulls and so on. Timber frames will need some clearance from the ground as per Gary's point about termites.
6. Whack on the roof. This will happen immediately after the frames have been erected if they are to be timber.
7. Clad the sides and put in doors, roller doors, louvres and vents.
8. Start putting machinery in/install timber floor over slab keeping an apron of slab clear to allow for protection against to ol' termites.

I reckon 6 months including approvals from my local council and about $20-25k AUD: What say ye all?

That's the same size as mine Dunc ...if you want to have a look and see if it's big enuff ?

Comment :: that's a lot of fill to put a slab on .How about a ply floor on piers at on end for the polite work (enclosed to keep the dust out ) and in 12 months when the rest has settled ...and it will , lay a slab then (if you must ! ) I prefer a dirt floor in a boat shed .

and pleaseeeeeee pitch the roof ...not a skillion ! One good place for some C section trusses .

[Duncan Gibbs]

Just a small boat? Maybe there's another behind it... Two of the same maybe... Didja tink of that Sir Jimbo?

As for the cut and fill, I specify compaction rates in my line of work all the time: Ain't nothing like a five tonne excavator going over and over and over the same bit of fill as well as putting in a 500mm deep keyline trench to hold the compacted fill as well as ensuring the whole shebang drains properly. Whack a floating over the top slab with an F82 mesh and Y16s in the turndown around the edge and there it will remain for well over a century.

Ground works and this local council are my areas of expertise!

Structure? I'm hearing bigger doors... Like it! Like it!

Roof and framing???? Floor structure???

[Duncan Gibbs]

and pleaseeeeeee pitch the roof ...not a skillion ! One good place for some C section trusses .

Why for no skillion? Much cheaper that a truss! Whatcha got agin skillions Peter? If I was going to go down the pitched path then I'd probably go for something like 200 I beams heavily braketed at the apex, with the ends and mid spans on 150 or 175 UCs. That would keep the volume of the space clearer than a truss.