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Thread: The "flying lateen" rig???

  1. #1
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    Default The "flying lateen" rig???

    Ran across this whilst browsing Craigslist ... the prototype boat (a highly-modified Cal20) is for sale:

    http://www.flyinglateen.com/welcome.html

    Essentially, the rig consists of a lateen sail mounted within a three-legged "tri-pod" mast, which allows the sail to turn to any point of sail without interference from the mast.

    I'd be curious to hear any comments about the idea ... the concept seems sufficiently obvious that I've got to believe someone's tried it before.

  2. #2
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    yup lotsa times.....a 50 footer outta Beuafort N.C. a few years ago...was built for a circumnavigation...made it maybe 1/2 way and they gave up...tried for a looooooong time to sell the boat....
    Wakan Tanka Kici Un
    ..a bad day sailing is a heckuva lot better than the best day at work.....
    Fighting Illegal immigration since 1492....
    Live your life so that whenever you lose, you're ahead."
    "If you live life right, death is a joke as far as fear is concerned."

  3. #3
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    I have actually been able to see this boat under sail on several occasions. In my opinion, it does not perform as well as the origional rig. When running dead down wind, some fancy adjustments are needed. And, it is slow in stays!
    Jay

  4. #4
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    Cool web site and detail. I like the idea and the effeciency of a simple setup. I've never been one dwel on the "old way" if there is a better/easier way to do it. Like a lot of sailors, I spend most of my water-time solo and a rig like that looks like you could leave the dock a little quicker for enjoying a day of sailing.

    Tommy

  5. #5
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    Default One valid criticism is the increased windage resulting from - -

    the multiple spars.

    At the opposite end of the spectrum, I like unstayed masts better.

    Moby Nick

  6. #6
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    Default

    Here's the saga, written by Olaf Harken, about the development of a somewhat similar rig for a larger boat, Procyon :

    http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/sho...d.php?p=112103
    "Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates." ~ Mark Twain


  7. #7
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    There is at least one big old iceboat still sailing in the Hudson River fleet that has it's original lateen rig using a similar, but bi-pod mast system. It's around 100 years old. The bipod legs cant forward up top and it uses a short pedestal gooseneck on the boom instead of having a third leg out front. The lateens were the fastest thing on the ice on certain days, and the slowest on other days, so they never made much of an impact on the sport, but the concept of hanging a lateen between the legs of a multi-poled mast system is nothing new.

  8. #8
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    Moby Nick,

    Unstayed masts? Might I suggest a look at a Soft Wing sail. http://www.omerwingsail.com/

    Compared with the conventional Elan 37 rig, the Omer has 23.5% less sail area, but better performance, especially in light airs where boat speed can exceed wind speed. The Polar diagram illustrates performance very well.

    Pericles

  9. #9
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    Old pic showing a similar rig


    Some older iceboats used them too
    Brian T. Cunningham
    SWIFTWOOD - my schooner rigged trimaran sailing kayak
    http://members.aol.com/swiftwood/

  10. #10
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    Brian, That first boat, I can not really tell what I'm looking at, do you have a link to that photo?

  11. #11
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    Reminds me of an Auqua Cat I sailed on as a kid in the early sixties. If he wanted a single-sail rig, there's a thing called a catboat that I like...

  12. #12
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    Philip, it looks like some sort of Pacific proa (outrigger to windward). I assume that they just swivel the sail until it's pointing the other direction when the boat shunts.

  13. #13
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    I think it was called Mary and the Lamb, or something like that. Craig O'Donnell wrote about it in Messing About a while back. Might be on his cheap pages site.
    Wes White

  14. #14
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    Also on Piscataqua River Gundalows.

    But why use a tripod(heavy) when it will work with one short rotating pole.

    <a href="http://tinypic.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i8.tinypic.com/2rpxtlx.jpg" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic"></a>
    Last edited by donald branscom; 09-03-2007 at 11:51 PM.
    I love the smell of fresh cut plywood in the morning.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pericles View Post
    Moby Nick,

    Unstayed masts? Might I suggest a look at a Soft Wing sail. http://www.omerwingsail.com/

    Compared with the conventional Elan 37 rig, the Omer has 23.5% less sail area, but better performance, especially in light airs where boat speed can exceed wind speed. The Polar diagram illustrates performance very well.

    Pericles
    Looks expensive and heavy because you have twice as much cloth.
    and how do you get it down in a hurry?
    The photos all show near calm conditions.
    I love the smell of fresh cut plywood in the morning.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wes White View Post
    I think it was called Mary and the Lamb, or something like that. Craig O'Donnell wrote about it in Messing About a while back. Might be on his cheap pages site.
    Correct, and it's from 1898!
    Here's a link
    http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/06/designs/proa/
    Brian T. Cunningham
    SWIFTWOOD - my schooner rigged trimaran sailing kayak
    http://members.aol.com/swiftwood/

  17. #17
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    Thanks, the duckworks diagram explains it, goes in either direction, amazing.

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