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Thread: Hoagies

  1. #1
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    Every Saturday, in a suburb of Cleveland, the Woolworths made a sandwwich of fresh bread, and ham, and salami, and cheese. Topped with Eyetalliand dressing and shredded iceburg.

    It was some ethnic thang, I wanta say Polish or Lithuanian. There was some Philadelphia connection.

    Boy they were good! We could only afford them five times a summer. Around a buck, back when a dollar was real money.

  2. #2
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    italian ish, and being from S.E. pa I know them well. also known as a sub., submarine sandwich etc. don't forget the tomato and onion

  3. #3
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    "YOU WANT HOTS WITH THAT?!"

  4. #4
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    Yeah man, hots!

    So where does the word "hoagie" come from? It sounds Polish or otherwise mid European. And there were a lot of Poles in Cleveland.

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    Hoagie – Hoagies are built-to-order sandwiches filled with meat and cheese, as well as lettuce, tomatoes, and onions, topped off with a dash of oregano-vinegar dressing on an Italian roll. A true Italian Hoagie is made with Italian ham, prosciutto salami, and provolone cheese, along with all the works. It was declared the “Official Sandwich of Philadelphia” in 1992.

    The Hoagie was originally created in Philadelphia. There are a number of different versions to how the Hoagie got its name, but no matter what version is right (historians cannot seem to agree on the correct version), all agree that it started in Philadelphia or the towns' suburbs.

    (1) The most widely accepted story centers on an area of Philadelphia known as Hog Island, which was home to a shipyard during World War I (1914-1918). The Italian immigrants working there would bring giant sandwiches made with cold cuts, spices, oil, lettuce, tomatoes, onions, and peppers for their lunches. These workers were nicknamed “hoggies.” Over the years, the name was attached to the sandwiches, but under a different spelling.

    (2) Another version on this story says that workers at Hog Island did bring this type of sandwich for lunch, but it was never called a hoagie. The story goes, that one day an Irish worker, who everyday carried an American cheese sandwich, looked enviously at his co-workers’ lunches and said; “If you wife will make me one of those things, I’ll buy it from you.” The man went home and said to his wife “Tomorrow, make two sandwiches, one for me and one for Hogan,” his co-worker’s name. So everyone started calling the sandwich “hogans,” which eventually go shorten to hoagie.

    (3) In 1925, Augustine DiCostanza and his wife, Catherine, opened their grocery store called A. DiCostanza's grocery store in Chester, Pennsylvania. According the family lore, the grocery store stayed open well past midnight to accomodiate the gamblers who held card games at the Palermo's Bar on the same street. According to Augie DiCostanze, granddaughter of Augustine and Catherine:

    One summer afternoon back in 1925, one of the men who cut the game deciced to take a break and he walked into the store to get a pack of cigarettes. Mom as cooking the the back kitchen and the aroma penentrated throughtout the store. The aroma apparently whet the man's appetitie and he asked Mom if she would make him a sandwich. "OK, pick out what kind of lunchmeat your want," she said. He looked into the case and with an Itallian hand waving gesture said: "Put everything you have in the case on it." Mom took a long loaf of Vienna bread, sliced it lengthwise and proceeded to put on all of the lunchmeat. . . . "What are you cooking that smells so good?" the hungry gambler asked. "I'm frying sweet and hot peppers," she replied and without asking she put a few pieces of the pepper on the sandwich. He left and an hour later the place was filled with hungry gamlbers asking for a sandwich. Mom sold out of everything that day. It was the beginning of a new creation, soon to become know as the Hoagie.

    (4) The last story says that during the Depression (1929-1939), out-of-work Philadelphian Al DePalma went to Hog Island near the naval shipyards to find work. When he saw the workers on lunch bread eating their giant sandwiches, his first thought was, "Those fellas look like a bunch of hogs." Instead of applying for a job at the shipyard, he opened a luncheonette that served these big sandwiches. He listed them on the menu as “hoggies” named for the hogs he saw during that lunch hour.

    During the late 1930s, DePalma joined forces with Buccelli’s Bakery and developed the perfect hoagie roll (an eight-inch roll that became the standard for the modern-day hoagie). By World War II during the 1940s, he turned the back room of his restaurant into a hoagie factory to supply sandwiches to workers at the shipyard. DePalma became know as “The King of Hoggies.” At some point after World War II, the “hoggie” became the “hoagie.” It is said that because his customers kept calling them hoagies, he changed the name.

  6. #6
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    There is some indication that the name "hoagie" is derived from type of sandwich eaten by the shipbuilders that worked on Hog Island.

    Hoagie

  7. #7
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    In New England, it's a 'sub sandwich' (short for 'submarine').

    'Hoagie', I thought, was the Philadelphia way of saying it....

    There's also 'grinder', but not sure where in the U.S. that is popular....

    There's also the 'bomb', which was something of a regional name, I think. Back in my college days, I lived around the corner from the 'Hawk Shop', which was a sub shop partially owned by Boston Red Sox alumni Ken Harrelson (known as 'the Hawk'). The 'Hawk Bomb' was their signature sandwich: steak, cheese, mushrooms, onions, peppers, salami, and no charge for grease.

    I survived on those during my sophomore year!

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    Angry

    Donn, your a fast draw.

  9. #9
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    I've had grinders in Connecticut, subs in Boston and Ohio, Hoagies in PA and Ohio, and Po Boys in the south. It all depends on who's making the sign/menu.

  10. #10
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    I heard them called "zepps" as well; presumably after "zepplin". Ever heard of a pepper and egg sandwich; it is breakfast fare that I have only seen in Philly.

  11. #11
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    [img]smile.gif[/img] Keep the Hoagie lore coming. [img]smile.gif[/img]

    They were a treat. I've eaten my share of subs and Italians, but there was sumpthin different in those Hoagies. Only on Saturday. It was special when mom said, let's have hoagies.

    [ 12-26-2005, 06:29 PM: Message edited by: ishmael ]

  12. #12
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    It is often the roll that makes the hoagie. Lots of great Italian bakeries around Philly.

    Recipe

    [ 12-26-2005, 06:40 PM: Message edited by: Karl A. Hilbert ]

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    Here's the Italian

    Italian

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    Ok, the best sub in the world is at Tommy's, in Columbus, Ohio. He hid a few habaneros in them to spice them up, and there is no other sub, anywhere I've been, that comes close. You choose the ingredients from a huge list, but they all include wonderful fresh bread and his own imported EVOO (and the peppers). Built, toasted in the pizza oven, and wrapped in foil for takeout. MMMMMM!

    This is the one I'm talking about...been there since 1963:

    <img src= "http://tommyspizza.com/arlington/arlington.jpg">

    If you're ever in Columbus (can't imagine why!) check it out!

    http://www.tommyspizza.com/index.html

    The shrimp pizza's pretty good, too.

    [ 12-26-2005, 06:47 PM: Message edited by: Donn ]

  15. #15
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    around philly though, a real hoagie is made on a roll from a small local bakery called amaroso's.I have had the sandwiches at others areas of the country, but without those rolls they don't taste the same

  16. #16
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    .
    I ate Hoagies in Philly and the famous Cheese Steak Sandwich too;loved 'em both. I had several different kinds of "subs" when I lived up in Boston. Had absolutely delicious muffalatta's in New York, but better'n all of them is the " Po Boy " sandwich, from the South.

    Fried oyster Po Boy's, shrimp Po Boys, Ham n' Cheese PoBoys', or, you name it ! Fantastic !
    'Course, I think a Po Boy is really nothing more than a sub, or a Hoagie, or a muffalatta by another name, only better tasting.

  17. #17
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    When I was 21 I worked at an ancient sheet metal shop in South Camden. You could walk for blocks on the brick sidewalks and never hear a word of English. Everyone sat out in front of their apt buildings. I used to buy steak sandwiches and hogies at a little (Italian of course) shop. Wonderful! Later I got a job teaching school in Blackwood Terrace NJ. I'd give one of the kids money for a hogie at a little place across the street. They'd load it with hot peppers to see if I could take it. I ate every one they brought me!

  18. #18
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    (an eight-inch roll that became the standard for the modern-day hoagie)
    Sounds like 'alf a hoagie to me. Usually around here it's a 14 or 15 inch loaf.
    I asked one "sub" maker in the SF bay area to put mine in the pizza oven for a few, to toast it up a bit, I thought he'd die. Kept shaking his head as he finished up with the lettuce and onion. It was better but still no hoagie.

  19. #19
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    Hoagie was also the name of a person, the person that drove the horse that pulled the canal boats on the Erie Canal.

  20. #20
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    Hoagie Charmicacal, too. [img]smile.gif[/img]

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    It is "sub" in most of NJ, but Hoagie around philadelphia. There seems to be some connection between the oven-toasted variety and the term "grinder."

    The oven-toasted subs are absolutely great, same ingredients, but the cheese is placed over the lettuce, tomato, and onions, then the sandwich is placed, open, in the pizza oven just long enough to toast the bread and melt the cheese.

    Its like baked alaska, hot on the outside and cold on the inside.

    Quiznos doesn't even come close.

    One big debate is whether a hoagie should have the top of the bread cut clean off, the meat and dressings laid on the bottom piece, then the top piece lowered down onto it, or, as is more common in south jersey, the bread is sliced from one side, but the other side is left attached, and the meat is layered in sideways, covering both the top and bottom of the bread, and the lettuce, tomato, etc, is sort of inside and contained by the meat.

    The first method, cut all the way through, construct a horizontal layer cake, I perceive to be a north jersy thing, the second method, cut from the side, wrap the meats around the salad, is a south jersey thing. The second method is best for the hot toasted grinder, though.

    White House subs in Atlantic City, undeservedly famous for its subs, serves a hideous concoction unworthy of the name. Made on "atlantic city bread," a style that produces something as flavorful as wonder bread, it uses the side-construction method, but they cut the meat very thick, and they use genoa salami (which to me is like coarse baloney, yuck), instead of dry salami or best of all, soppresata.

    Cheese steaks suck as well, sheer horror succeeding on hype alone.

    However, in South Philly, right across from one of the most famous cheese steak emporia, is a pplace that specializes in the roast pork, broccolirabe and provolone sandwich. These roast pork sandwiches are the real deal, no reconstituted powdered american cheese poured over formed and shaped lips, ears and assholes. this is genuine roast pork, sliced thin, fried with bitter brocolirabe, then sharp, pungent, real provolone is melted over the top. A culinary treat, as opposed to a guilty trash food pleasure.

    [ 12-27-2005, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: PatCox ]

  22. #22
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    Youse guys are makin me hungry...

    However, in South Philly, right across from one of the most famous cheese steak emporia,

    Would that be "PAT's" ??

    [ 12-27-2005, 11:42 AM: Message edited by: Gary E ]

  23. #23
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    yup it's PAT'S, cheesesteak capital of the world right by the stadiums....and we wonder why Andy Reid is a little on the heavy side

  24. #24
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    doubled that for some reason

    [ 12-27-2005, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: jack grebe ]

  25. #25
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    They are NOT hoagies, grinders, or subs. They are called heros. Best had with the works from a NYC deli.

  26. #26
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    A 'Hero' to me is on a round bun.

    <img src= "http://www.blackdiamond.ca/lunchsnacks/images/hero_sand.jpg">

  27. #27
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    thats a keiser roll donn.....got a history on that too

  28. #28
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    only if it has a frozen...nonfunctioning left hand....At least Willie did...

  29. #29
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    Is "hero" related to "gyro"?

  30. #30
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    Pat's??? Tony Lukes on Oregon Ave.

  31. #31
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    Thats right Troutman.

  32. #32
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    Originally posted by jack grebe:
    thats a keiser roll donn.....got a history on that too
    No, but I do for the Kaiser roll:

    "The Kaiser roll, also called Vienna roll, is a crisp crusted roll the size of a hamburger bun. It was supposedly created in Vienna, and is thought to have been named to honor Emperor Franz Josef. Also known simply as a hard roll."

  33. #33
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    Kaiser rolls. . .must be the Brokeback Mountain chat room. How about some little finger cakes to.
    Kaiser rolls. . .ha, ha.

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