Best Examples of Decorative Puzzle joints

[Asgeir]

Nick Schade Petrel
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[Asgeir]

Another Nick Schade Petrel - simpler puzzle joint but still a very nice example

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[Asgeir]

BOW Pram built by Nicolas Arnoult

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[Woxbox]

Here's my Nick Shade Night Heron. I didn't make this one -- I bought it from the guy who did in a class taught by Nick about 13 years ago. The panels are stained before they are assembled. If you peruse the CLC Catalog you'll see more examples. It makes a simple plywood stitch and glue boat look like something. It also makes putting together the kit panels a no brainer. You can't put the wrong pieces together, and you can't misalign them either.

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[Asgeir]

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Wave scarf - Old Mission Boat Company paddleboard deck.

[Sandlapper]

Strengthens the joint? All if these complex plywood joints are weaker than a simple scarf or lap joint. The only reason for using such joints is to make assembly easier or fear of skill in making a scarf. Interrupting the long grain of the wood weakens it.

[Woxbox]

I've never seen or heard of one of these joins failing. It's plywood, usually sandwiched between fiberglass.

[David G]

Strengthens the joint? All if these complex plywood joints are weaker than a simple scarf or lap joint. The only reason for using such joints is to make assembly easier or fear of skill in making a scarf. Interrupting the long grain of the wood weakens it.

Old argument, long settled. They're perfectly fine, structurally, and make it a bit easier for the kit builder, who is often no woodworker.

[Garret]

Strengthens the joint? All if these complex plywood joints are weaker than a simple scarf or lap joint. The only reason for using such joints is to make assembly easier or fear of skill in making a scarf. Interrupting the long grain of the wood weakens it.

This comes under the "Simple is best, except when complicated looks really cool" rule.

I like 'em!

[Sandlapper]

Its simple construction practice. like what you like but I'm still correct and making a good joint in other than plywood is important? Tage Frid is spinning in his grave. They can be perfectly adequate and pretty in a non critical place but are still not very strong when stressed.

The glass skin is the real strength part and the curlicues themselves are weak.

[Breakaway]

Here's my Nick Shade Night Heron. I didn't make this one -- I bought it from the guy who did in a class taught by Nick about 13 years ago. The panels are stained before they are assembled. If you peruse the CLC Catalog you'll see more examples. It makes a simple plywood stitch and glue boat look like something. It also makes putting together the kit panels a no brainer. You can't put the wrong pieces together, and you can't misalign them either.

Night Heron cropped.jpg

That's cool, Wox! Looks great!

Stained: So not painted? What's the final topcoat?
I am not questioning the validity of the process, just curious about the specifics.

Kevin

[lupussonic]

Good in tension.. a force a boat usually sees on deck when going over a wave.

Does this count as a puzzle joint?

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[Garret]

Its simple construction practice. like what you like but I'm still correct and making a good joint in other than plywood is important? Tage Frid is spinning in his grave. They can be perfectly adequate and pretty in a non critical place but are still not very strong when stressed.

The glass skin is the real strength part and the curlicues themselves are weak.

I get your point & don't disagree that a good scarf is stronger, but how many of these joints have broken?

[Woxbox]

Kevin -- The panels are stained then assembled, and then sealed and glassed with epoxy. UV-blocking varnish goes over the final epoxy coating. Oil-based stains are out, but alcohol and water-based stains work fine.

Depending on the ply and stain color choices, the wood grain will show to varying degrees.

[John Meachen]

Good in tension.. a force a boat usually sees on deck when going over a wave.

Does this count as a puzzle joint?

IMG_0261.jpg

I'm sure the marking out was a mild puzzle.I'm equally sure that a CNC router could cut several boat kits in the same time it took.Both equally relevant connections for their intended purpose.

[P.I. Stazzer-Newt]

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[Asgeir]

Enso joint by Jonas Winkler (see Shaper Origin: https://hub.shapertools.com/creators...47230010df27a1 for more details)
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[John Perry]

I did simple triangular fingers, I think they are likely to be close to the strength of a good scarf joint or better than that with a layer of fibre glass cloth on the out of sight side only. After assembly of the panels the whole boat was fibre glass sheathed on the visible side.

I dont think the interlock of any shape puzzle joint fingers will hold long and relatively narrow panels accurately in alighnment. To keep long narrow panels aligned prior to gluing I made the cutting files with small holes at the ends of each long panel so that when two panels were assembled on a flat horizontal bench the panels could be adjusted such that a tight string (the purple string in the picture) lay over all the holes. The joint was then glued with thick polythene each side to avoid sticking to the bench. The boat was painted inside and out so there was no point making finger joints with pretty shapes. All the plywood panels were cut out by a company with a water jet machine using .dxf files which I made myself.

Amazing that a high pressure waterjet can cut plywood so easily - indeed I once visited a shipyard where they cut 150mm thick steel plates with a waterjet, in that case I think with abrasive powder added to the water.

[Sandlapper]

I get your point & don't disagree that a good scarf is stronger, but how many of these joints have broken?

OK, the good points of puzzle ply joints are well taken, but misunderstood as well. A simple mental test to do is to eliminate the glass sheath and then make a judgement. I have no doubt about the determination.

[Woxbox]

And why would anyone worry about tests that apply stresses which are never replicated when the object is in use?

And I might add that when I built my Autumn Leaves, I the 18' long sides of the boat were glued with puzzle joints and then bent around the bulkheads. It took a lot of force to pull the double-ended hull's sides together at stem and stern. The puzzle joints had no glass on them at this point. Did they fail? No.

[Breakaway]

Dave--thanks for the answer above.

Kevin

[Jfitzger]

OK, the good points of puzzle ply joints are well taken, but misunderstood as well. A simple mental test to do is to eliminate the glass sheath and then make a judgement. I have no doubt about the determination.

This is from CLC:

"Scarf joints are definitely stronger in absolute terms, because there's more surface area for the glue.

However, puzzle joints never let go at the puzzles; just like scarf joints, they break on the wood, alongside the joint.

So one way to look at it is that scarf joints probably give you 600% of the strength you need to hold planks together, and puzzle joints give you maybe 400%. Either way, the wood's breaking before the glue in the puzzle joint lets go."

No one's arguing about whether a scarf is better for solid wood only that it is more than adequate for thin plywood. The locking puzzle joints actually do have mechanical strength in 2 of the 3 axis of possible movement. I scarf because it's all jigged up in my shop but if I had a CNC I'd switch in moment.