I think I agree with a Republican!

[CWSmith]

It had to happen sooner or later.

The headline is misleading, but the text says it better. If you are judged to be too young, too inexperienced, too lacking in judgement to drive a car, then you probably should not be allowed to cut off your dingus! That said, do we really allow youngsters to have that surgery?

That being said, I am less sure of the hormonal treatments solution, but I do know many women who object to trans women playing on women's sports because of an unfair advantage.

Oklahoma Gov. Stitt gets standing ovation calling for bill that 'bans all gender transition surgeries'

Oklahoma GOP Gov. Kevin Stitt is calling on lawmakers in the Sooner State to deliver a bill to his desk that "bans all gender transition surgeries" for minors.

The request from Stitt, who's currently serving in his second term as governor, came during his 2023 State of the State address in Oklahoma City.

"We must protect our most vulnerable – our children," Stitt said, explaining that "minors can’t vote, can’t purchase alcohol, can’t purchase cigarettes."

"We shouldn’t allow a minor to get a permanent gender altering surgery in Oklahoma," he continued, receiving a standing ovation. "That’s why I am calling on the legislature to send me a bill that bans all gender transition surgeries and hormone therapies on minors in the state."

As governor, Stitt vowed to "never shy away from calling out right from wrong" and insisted that he "will not be intimidated by partisan interest groups or make decisions based on groupthink."

Stitt's comments align with a pledge he made last fall to prevent Oklahoma minors from undergoing "life-changing" gender surgeries in his state.

"We have a duty to protect minors from a lot of things: we don't let them drink, we don't let them get tattoos," Stitt told Fox News last October. "Their brains aren't fully developed."

"This is not something we're going to allow to be done to minors and use taxpayer dollars," he added at the time.

Stitt, who has consistently touted the state's belief in "traditional family values," told Fox last year that "healthy children being permanently altered either through hormone therapy" or some other type of surgery is "not going to happen in Oklahoma."

First elected governor in 2018, Stitt said Monday as he addressed state lawmakers that he "will continue my responsibility to lead, not follow."

Last April, Stitt made headlines after he signed a measure to ban non-binary gender markers on birth certificates.

In addition, Stitt, a month prior in 2022, signed a bill prohibiting transgender girls from playing on female sports teams, one of many such bans being signed into law across the country.

Other conservative states, including Alabama, Arkansas, Tennessee and Texas, have passed laws prohibiting gender-confirming treatments for minors.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ok...149c907a41c7d9

[Canoeyawl]

I prefer to think of this as "none of my business", actually not to think of it at all

[George Jung]

Certainly, reservations over this type of care - which I do not provide. But there are specialists actually educated on this area of medicine - and my preference is for this care to be decided by patients, in consultation with those folks who actually know something.

As you might guess - IMO, that 'leaves out' the politicians.

And I'm definitely 'against' our politicians mandating how I (and everyone else) lives their lives. One more loss of freedom, independence.

[SaltyD from BC]

I prefer to think of this as "none of my business", actually not to think of it at all

What needs to be done to make you president. ... of the world! You got my vote at least

[stromborg]

"We must protect our most vulnerable – our children," Stitt said, explaining that "minors can’t vote, can’t purchase alcohol, can’t purchase cigarettes."

I'll go one further and suggest we ban all forms if indoctrination. No more taking your kids to church, they can only go after turning 18.

[Keith Wilson]

This has little to do with 'protecting vulnerable children' and a great deal to do with anti-trans bigotry. One can make a case for prohibiting surgery, but hormone treatments are far better if done early. None of his goddamn business, or mine either.

Despicable creatures.

[Ted Hoppe]

It is beyond to me to contemplate the issues around this for these individuals. The profound depression and anguish for those in their gender struggle is real and the physical surgical reassignment still leaves a huge hole.

The most thorough follow-up of sex-reassigned people—extending over 30 years and conducted in Sweden, where the culture is strongly supportive of the transgendered—documents their lifelong mental unrest. Ten to 15 years after surgical reassignment, the suicide rate of those who had undergone sex-reassignment surgery rose to 20 times that of comparable peers. This had lead me to believe; There is no clever way to figure it out what to do or exact advice to give. There is no magic bullet. Nobody likes to see another suffering but then again once done; does it really solve the identity problem if the mental fracture remains.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

I prefer to think of this as "none of my business", actually not to think of it at all

Same here.

[Paul Pless]

I think I agree with a Republican!

dont do that

[David G]

DEJA MOO ---

When you're sure you've heard this bull before...

[AlanMc]

i vote to chop all the kids wankers and boobs off. a gender neutral population benefits us all.

[George Jung]

lead by example, Al!

[Keith Wilson]

i vote to chop . . .

You do understand that not only is this kind of treatment 100% voluntary, but somebody has to really really really want it and try very hard to get it, and it affects only a vanishingly tiny minority of the population, right?

[Jimmy W]

Boston Children’s Hospital Center for Gender Surgery

Gender dysphoria occurs when there is a conflict between the gender you were assigned at birth and the gender with which you identity. This can create significant distress, and you may feel uncomfortable in your body. The Center for Gender Surgery at Boston Children's Hospital offers gender affirmation surgery services to eligible adolescents and young adults who are ready to take this step in their journey. It is the first center of its kind in the U.S. in a major pediatric hospital setting.

Our approach to gender surgery

As the first pediatric center in the country dedicated to the surgical care of transgender patients, we take an interdisciplinary approach from the start to ensure exceptional patient care. Our skilled team includes specialists in plastic surgery, urology, endocrinology, nursing, gender management, and social work, who collaborate to provide a full suite of surgical options for transgender teens and young adults. Our experienced anesthesia team works to provide culturally sensitive care to the gender-diverse community. By partnering with the hospital's nationally recognized Gender Management Service (GeMS), which provides a range of medical options for transgender youth, we help young people with gender identity concerns transfer seamlessly to surgical care if and when they are ready.

The center currently offers vaginoplasty, metoidioplasty, phalloplasty, chest reconstruction, breast augmentation, facial harmonization and other gender affirmation surgeries to eligible patients. We are guided by the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (WPATH) standards and other criteria to surgically treat people who are stable in their gender identity and have documentation of persistent gender dysphoria. You do not need to be a GeMS patient to have surgery at the center. All genital surgeries are only performed on patients age 18 and older.

Can you name anywhere in US that is providing this to those under 18?

[AlanMc]

You do understand that not only is this kind of treatment 100% voluntary, but somebody has to really really really want it and try very hard to get it, and it affects only a vanishingly tiny minority of the population, right?

so you support the gender affirming sex surgeries for minors... awesome!

[AlanMc]

Boston Children’s Hospital Center for Gender Surgery



Can you name anywhere in US that is providing this to those under 18?

a quick google search would get you there bro

[LeeG]

Nothing like passing laws to adress a problem that doesn’t exist. Republican Party wants the gov’t in every one’s business. Obviously contraception should be the next area to pass a law no one needs.

[AlanMc]

exactly lee. if anything, we need to pass laws to enshrine a minor's right to make these life altering decisions on their own. i know they can't decide to drink on their own, but penis removal is entirely reversible from what i've heard.

[CWSmith]

A lot of you are saying that you prefer not to think about it.

Here's the way I think of it:

If a parent is opposed to medical treatment and uses prayer exclusively to combat a child's cancer, do we as a society owe anything to that child in the way of protection? I think we do, although many disagree with that.

If a parent believes that pedophilia is a natural part of family life, does the state have the right to intervene?

If a parent believes that Bobby gets what Bobby wants, or that males are evil (as some do), does the state have the right to intervene?

There comes a point where a person is considered an adult and can make irreversible life-altering decisions, but shouldn't we set rules for child protection until that point?

[George Jung]

Boston Children’s Hospital Center for Gender Surgery



Can you name anywhere in US that is providing this to those under 18?

so you support the gender affirming sex surgeries for minors... awesome!

Nothing like passing laws to adress a problem that doesn’t exist. Republican Party wants the gov’t in every one’s business. Obviously contraception should be the next area to pass a law no one needs.

exactly lee. if anything, we need to pass laws to enshrine a minor's right to make these life altering decisions on their own. i know they can't decide to drink on their own, but penis removal is entirely reversible from what i've heard.

As typical for a card-carrying RWW, ol' Al, again, misrepresents... well, everything. Everything is a quest to promote the lies of the Republican Party. Well done, Komrade!

[AlanMc]

here's what i think. when upwards of around 90% of all gender dysmorphic teens grow out of it by adulthood without any life altering decisions made on their behalf.... it should be a CRIME to give out life altering hormones and perform body mutilating surgeries on minors. i don't give a rat's rear what any grown adult wants to do with themselves, just leave the kids out of it.

[George Jung]

A lot of you are saying that you prefer not to think about it.

Here's the way I think of it:

If a parent is opposed to medical treatment and uses prayer exclusively to combat a child's cancer, do we as a society owe anything to that child in the way of protection? I think we do, although many disagree with that.

If a parent believes that pedophilia is a natural part of family life, does the state have the right to intervene?

If a parent believes that Bobby gets what Bobby wants, or that males are evil (as some do), does the state have the right to intervene?

There comes a point where a person is considered an adult and can make irreversible life-altering decisions, but shouldn't we set rules for child protection until that point?

IMO, a bit of straw in this one! So.... who should decide? Me? You? How about..... the pt/family/physician/psych team? Hmmm? That'd be my preference.

[AlanMc]

As typical for a card-carrying RWW, ol' Al, again, misrepresents... well, everything. Everything is a quest to promote the lies of the Republican Party. Well done, Komrade!

oh george, what a swindler.

[George Jung]

here's what i think. when upwards of around 90% of all gender dysmorphic teens grow out of it by adulthood without any life altering decisions made on their behalf.... it should be a CRIME to give out life altering hormones and perform body mutilating surgeries on minors. i don't give a rat's rear what any grown adult wants to do with themselves, just leave the kids out of it.

Hmmm.... Al, it's not that I don't trust you*..... but I'm gonna need some references for that one. Sounds like one of your WAG's.

*and a real reference. You know... science.

[George Jung]

oh george, what a swindler.

Yes. Yes, you are. And typical of your tribe.

[AlanMc]

hey george, are you prescribing minors with HRT?

[CWSmith]

IMO, a bit of straw in this one! So.... who should decide? Me? You? How about..... the pt/family/physician/psych team? Hmmm? That'd be my preference.

I tell you what, answer my questions about healing by prayer and pedophilia and then we'll discuss genital mutilation.

I want to see if you draw the line anywhere before we discuss where.

[Jimmy W]

a quick google search would get you there bro

I still don't see a name here.

[L.W. Baxter]

the language and posturing of this proposed law is pure culture war exploitation of the issue. i can't agree with one word.

however, anyone who has had significant interaction with young people in the last decade knows that gender confusion is having a fashion moment. in other words, the trend is significantly driven by peer pressure, expectations, and the chance afforded to be special.

which is not to say that the experience is not authentic.

i had a mullet when i was 15. it was not an affectation. that was my real hair and i thought it looked cool.

i don't mean to trivialize something traumatic. i do think that the culture of young folks is doing a lot of self harm. this republican grandstanding is just kicking kids when they are down.

[Jimmy W]

Now long before Republicans require the morality police to be present whenever a woman or person that considers themself to be a woman sees their doctor? What will they call this police force? They claim to want a smaller government, but want to make more and more things illegal.

[ShorelineJohn]

I do have to agree with the OP, this one is hard (no pun intended). The big thing I keep wondering about, is how much of this is caused by societies roles for each gender? Now at least in the USA it is much easier for a girl to pursue boy things, even in the movies you see it all the time, the girl that knows more about cars than all the boys. Now if a 7 year old boy wants to wear a dress to school it's a completely different thing. But you don't need surgery or hormones to do that.
You could probably achieve it by just getting rid of the republicans.

[CWSmith]

i don't mean to trivialize something traumatic. i do think that the culture of young folks is doing a lot of self harm. this republican grandstanding is just kicking kids when they are down.

You had me until the last line. Yes, the Republicans are grandstanding by adopting a 1% problem while they systematically do nothing for the poor, the working middle class, for education, etc. However, if "the culture of young folks is doing a lot of self harm", shouldn't we do something to mitigate that harm? We are attacking social media because it does harm to the self image of young people. Shouldn't we do the same to give those young people time to decide for themselves whether they want irreversible surgery?

[McMike]

It's between the parents, child their doctor.

I mean if AlMac is correct, we should be stopping the indoctrination into religion until the age of 18. You know, we have to think of the fragile mind of the children and let them mature before making such a choice. We are either free or not free Alan, which is it?

[L.W. Baxter]

You had me until the last line. Yes, the Republicans are grandstanding by adopting a 1% problem while they systematically do nothing for the poor, the working middle class, for education, etc. However, if "the culture of young folks is doing a lot of self harm", shouldn't we do something to mitigate that harm? We are attacking social media because it does harm to the self image of young people. Shouldn't we do the same to give those young people time to decide for themselves whether they want irreversible surgery?

after years of interacting with you cw, i am certain that your concern is sincere. let me allay your concern a bit: gender reassignment surgeries and hormone therapies are not common. mental health physicians know "what's up". loads of kids are going through phases and coming out the other side without having been biologically meddled with. i know a couple of girls myself. they are young women now.

what you are missing is the cynicism of gov stitt. if his concern were as sincere as yours, he would have no need for an announcement of an absolutist approach, in language and posture certain to trigger the other side in the culture war.

in other words, by his demeanor and tactics, stitt turns a mental health issue into just another right vs. left battlefield. that is not the behavior of a person who legitimately cares for, or worries for, kids struggling with something he doesn't understand. which he makes no effort to understand or make room for.

[CWSmith]

after years of interacting with you cw, i am certain that your concern is sincere. let me allay your concern a bit: gender reassignment surgeries and hormone therapies are not common. mental health physicians know "what's up". loads of kids are going through phases and coming out the other side without having been biologically meddled with. i know a couple of girls myself. they are young women now.

what you are missing is the cynicism of gov stitt. if his concern were as sincere as yours, he would have no need for an announcement of an absolutist approach, in language and posture certain to trigger the other side in the culture war.

in other words, by his demeanor and tactics, stitt turns a mental health issue into just another right vs. left battlefield. that is not the behavior of a person who legitimately cares for, or worries for, kids struggling with something he doesn't understand. which he makes no effort to understand or make room for.

Thank you and I can't disagree with you in general. Still, common sense seems to demand that there be limits on this. The proposal of setting a minimum age for this is really no different than it is for a great many other things.

Now, I doubt I will agree with anything else this @ssh@t is likely to say, and I have no doubt he is using this as a great big game of "Look! Squirrel!", but still it just does not seem unreasonable to me.