All I’m getting for Christmas is Crippling Sciatica Again

[Joe (SoCal)]

L4 & L5 disk bulging and pressing on the sciatic nerve. They can do a micro surgery out the same day and then PT I’m trying to make an appointment with my Orthopedic specialist to do another MRI and see what our options are.

That said day 3 or steroids have made their magic I’m ambulatory now.

[Ted Hoppe]

surgeons are going to give someone seeking a quick medical incision fix for them first. Highly paid cutters gotta cut so they will advocate they should and get you into physical therapy afterward. I know you need to go into this with a positive attitude which is the right way to think. But people who get this kind of treatment are risking some mobility issues and unintended consequences that results from even micro surgeries. I have filmed many of this micro surgeries for UCSF, Stanford and Medtronics. It is rare that there is a follow up on the success and full pain free recovery. Usually, people learn to live with the pain.

I would advise using the non invasive electro equiscope first with intuitive physics therapy and wholistic life medicine. What ever happens, it is going to the PT and not the surgery that help you find a relief. My close friend Dr. Doug has had amazing results for his patients with his simple electro equiscope for nerve and inflammation. Three sessions and you will feel a huge difference. There are excellent providers in OC using this too. Check it out.

[Joe (SoCal)]

No one said I was going to have surgery I said I was referred to an orthopedic back specialist. First an MRI to see what our options are.

I absolutely HATE taking an MRI.

[Tom from Rubicon]

63 to 67, and Rob again 70. Traction by a MD physiotherapist. Take a good long break from the Missionary position.
It just aggravates what is likely a genetic spinal disorder. I wouldn't say anything, if I didn't go there too.

Tom

[wizbang 13]

From the speed you jumped to steroids, I recon you will welcome surgery like a fancy meal.

[George Jung]

Hehehe.... we all bring a history, and a prejudice, to this, eh?

I'm not a big fan of steroids - but they can certainly buy you time, and relief. I'm not a fan of surgery - but at some point, it may be your best/only/last option. Despite the detractors, the surgeons I know don't recommend surgery unless they've exhausted all other options. Why? Because, at that point, they will no longer have anything else to offer.

Not familiar with the 'non invasive electro equiscope', and couldn't find any info on a literature search, only advertisements promoting it. Your Orthopedic surgeon likely is familiar.

[Ted Hoppe]

George - the electro equiscope is a game changer. It is a tissue stimulator and helps nerve repair themselves. Anything to give cause increased healthy blood circulation and stimulates cellular repair is worth a shot. I was skeptical too but I have seen results in patients myself. People with spine, shoulder, knees and feet problems have great fast turnarounds - within weeks of first treatment and is only required for just a few weeks. The cost is low and insurance companies have begun to cover it over usual chiropractic medicine that never ends.

[George Jung]

Being non-invasive - certainly worth looking at. Again - not familiar with it.

[Joe (SoCal)]

From the speed you jumped to steroids, I recon you will welcome surgery like a fancy meal.

This is not my first sciatica rodeo, so I know exactly the relief that a course steroids can provide which allow me to become ambulatory without searing white hot pain. It allows me to think a little clearer and stretch, walk and most importantly sleep. I've gone to this same orthopedic back specialist and guess what I didn't opt for any invasive treatments.

So you may be wrong in your assumptions.

I will be talking to him about all the options you have all been so kind to offer.

[Gary Davis]

Umbilical stem cells are a miracle for my pre-surgery knee. Pain-free almost a full year.

Don't know if they inject them in your back though. Its worth investigating.

[Ted Hoppe]

Even I can see the bulge in the spine right there. Undoubtedly will take a specialist with a very sharp knife.

rhinowhiteprofile.jpg

[Joe (SoCal)]

I’m done with this pain I can’t move. I can’t think straight. It’s driving me mad. No one his answering my calls or is available.
Im one 4 Tylenol with codeine steroids wither a bottle of wine to wash it all down.
I’m turning into a very angry upset pained person I’m in so much pain I can't take it anymore.

[Gerarddm]

Try to avoid the oxy, Joe.

[LeeG]

I’m done with this pain I can’t move. I can’t think straight. It’s driving me mad. No one his answering my calls or is available.
Im one 4 Tylenol with codeine steroids wither a bottle of wine to wash it all down.
I’m turning into a very angry upset pained person I’m in so much pain I can't take it anymore.

ok now it sounds like fire alarm time. Just to point out the obvious a bottle of wine will weaken your general ability to cope, across the board. It won’t “get you through” this it’ll just weaken your immune system, liver and turn you into a real drama queen. No more stupid ass taking friends to the airport stunts even if the seats are comfortable.

[Dave Wright]

I’m done with this pain I can’t move. I can’t think straight. It’s driving me mad. No one his answering my calls or is available.
Im one 4 Tylenol with codeine steroids wither a bottle of wine to wash it all down.
I’m turning into a very angry upset pained person I’m in so much pain I can't take it anymore.

It's rough. When it gets really bad the only thing on your mind is trying to find a variation of the fetal position that reduces the pain, but you can't find one. You hope, but nothing helps, only the passage of time. Maybe hours, maybe a few days. Some relief will come, and when it does, try to avoid anything that might set it off again. Time got you through the last occurrence and it should get you through this one. You can't work or do anything until you get some relief. Decide what action to take after the pain subsides a bit. It's really bad, it's worse than kidney stones, and kidney stones are fleeting and relief is quick. Sorry man, it's a real bitch. Relief WILL come.

[Geftb]

You got to move it move it.
https://youtu.be/B8eTYU4bjFg

[Joe (SoCal)]

You got to move it move it.
https://youtu.be/B8eTYU4bjFg

So exactly how do you do that loverly yoga stretching on the floor move when you CAN'T move ? how do you do all that when just breathing makes it impossible? How to you get on the floor and even watch a YouTube video about someone getting on the floor to do some stretching or exercise when just to going to the bathroom takes you 45 minuts crawling on all fours stopping halfway just to have a good cry and the thought of crawling back to the bed gives you a panic attack ?

[wizbang 13]

Been in a pool yet?

[Geftb]

So exactly how do you do that loverly yoga stretching on the floor move when you CAN'T move ? how do you do all that when just breathing makes it impossible? How to you get on the floor and even watch a YouTube video about someone getting on the floor to do some stretching or exercise when just to going to the bathroom takes you 45 minuts crawling on all fours stopping halfway just to have a good cry and the thought of crawling back to the bed gives you a panic attack ?

ive been there. It lasted weeks.
You need to move it and let it know it’s safe to move.
The nerve contracts the muscle which tightens the nerve and around you go.
how you accomplish that is up to you.
If you can type the above you can watch a short video
Good luck

[Dave Wright]

ive been there. It lasted weeks.
You need to move it and let it know it’s safe to move.
The nerve contracts the muscle which tightens the nerve and around you go.
how you accomplish that is up to you.
If you can type the above you can watch a short video
Good luck

When you really get it BAD you finally realize that something is impacting the nerve sheath. You have NO idea what might be contacting the nerve sheath. It could be muscle, it could be bone, it could be cartilage, it could be an evil god. An MRI is the best we have to diagnose the problem, but even that might be inconclusive.

The affliction is unique to the affected individual. Telling someone who's every move brings on pain "to move" suggests that you don't understand the situation. It's the same for every other "home grown" solution. Everyone thinks that what has worked for them will work for everyone else. This simply isn't true for every case.

If the pain subsides enough to allow the individual to move he can gently try any or all of the "home grown" solutions. The solution might work, or the pain may go away independent of the solution, or the solution may bring the pain back with a vengeance. The patient is stuck for hours, days, or weeks. An experienced and honest conventional medical practitioner is the best source of advice. Of course relief may come after consultations with witch doctors, faith healers, chiropractors, and the guy next door, with no observable connection between the advice and the relief.

[Geftb]

Sarah Key’s has dedicated her whole life to treating back pain. I dont think there is much she hasn’t seen, and she says you have to move it. The vid above is not a yoga session. If you can get your knees up through the pain you can begin the recovery. (Not easy)
She was the woman who ol’ (then) prince Charlie himself called in when his sciatica was going off. Not sure I would call her a “home grown faith healer”.

[Scrib]

Joe you gotta get the inflammation down! Ice on the L5 for 10 min every 30 min + 4 ibuprofen every 4 hrs. After 2-3 hours that MIGHT get you able to at least move around enough to take a pee! I am also not new to the sciatica rodeo. If it looks like a diskectomy is a viable solution go for it. It’s a 30-40 min procedure as an out-patient, a week on the couch, some PT and unfortunately you’ll then have to go back to work. Been there, done all the so called remedies including a multiple visits with a pain management doc who loved sticking needles in my back. Bad back sucks big time. My Christmas sciatica is easing up a bit so I can mostly sleep and the unheated seat in my Tacoma is most comfortable, go figure. Keep smiling!

[Canoeyawl]

There all kinds of pain, and many people suffer, some silently. Back pain is a scenario where you want to be very careful what you suggest, as great damage can be done with the wrong "treatment".
Having obdurately ignored a serious back injury by following well meaning advice and going to a chiropractor led to a far more serious injury. This was followed up with years of various drug regimens of which opioids offed the most relief by far. I refused surgery, reasoning the most common cause of back pain is back surgery.

It was 20+ years before I really learned to live with it. (A large part of that was learning what "not to do")
I.e. "If you drop something on the floor, leave it there", and "Every part of your body is connected to your back"

I do hope Joe finds some relief soon. It seems that surgery has better results with leg pain than back pain.

My physical therapist was the most help. Ultrasound treatments twice a week for months offered much relief, even smiling for a few hours after each treatment.
(He often referred to the "Peacock Syndrome" or overdeveloped chest and upper body as being among the majority of his male patients.)

[Geftb]

There all kinds of pain, and many people suffer, some silently. Back pain is a scenario where you want to be very careful what you suggest, as great damage can be done with the wrong "treatment".
Having obdurately ignored a serious back injury by following well meaning advice and going to a chiropractor led to a far more serious injury. This was followed up with years of various drug regimens of which opioids offed the most relief by far. I refused surgery, reasoning the most common cause of back pain is back surgery.

It was 20+ years before I really learned to live with it. (A large part of that was learning what "not to do")
I.e. "If you drop something on the floor, leave it there", and "Every part of your body is connected to your back"

I do hope Joe finds some relief soon. It seems that surgery has better results with leg pain than back pain.

My physical therapist was the most help. Ultrasound treatments twice a week for months offered much relief, even smiling for a few hours after each treatment.
(He often referred to the "Peacock Syndrome" or overdeveloped chest and upper body as being among the majority of his male patients.)

A trip to the chiro was also what left me unable to walk, or lie down, crawling to the toilet, or breathe without pain,no medication touched it, etc.
It was Sarah’s book which a friend gave me that started my healing. So I pass it on whenever I see it in others. I would recommend (for a back pain sufferer) watching all her videos and reading all her books.
she knows her stuff.
the leaving things dropped on the floor. 100% I remember having my first (standing up) shower in 3 weeks and dropping my towel. Went to pick it up and went down with the same excruciating pain for another fortnight...
It may sound hippy chit to some, but you need to learn to talk to your pain, you need to face it to move through it.
Sarah teaches how to do that backed with decades of exp. if you find a good therapist? (not easy in itself) you can bring the knowledge with you. The excruciating pain will pass. There are no easy fixes, or magical helpers. Be kind to those around you.

[Joe (SoCal)]

I have an appointment on Jan 3rd with an orthopedic back specialist. The last time I went to see one and after my MRI he specifically said if I went to a chiropractor there would be a good chance with my condition I would end up permanently confined to a wheelchair for life.

Talking to the Orthopedic specialist I’m looking into Gabpentin therapy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabapentin until I can get into PT and other therapies It’s non steroidal and non Opiate its a nerve blocker

[Canoeyawl]

I suspect many of us working stiffs have had back issues, either genetic or by injury, but I didn't get on well with the non-opiate non-steroidal drugs
They left my "stomach" (which is usually cast iron) a mess w/internal bleeding on a large scale... Whatever they give you look up the side effects and pay close attention.
(If you can escape being a junkie (and recognize that when it is happening) opioid's are good solution for pain relief, but the medical community at large is now terrified of liability associated with abuse.

Naproxin: which is cheap, considered benign as far as addiction and a "go-to" for back pain is a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug. (They didn't list these same side effects 40 years ago, in fact they didn't list many of them until people started dropping dead)


"You should not use naproxen if you have a history of allergic reaction to aspirin or other NSAID (nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drug).Naproxen can increase your risk of fatal heart attack or stroke, especially if you use it long term or take high doses, or if you have heart disease. Even people without heart disease or risk factors could have a stroke or heart attack while taking this medicine.
Do not use this medicine just before or after heart bypass surgery (coronary artery bypass graft, or CABG).
Get emergency medical help if you have swelling of the face or throat, chest pain, weakness, shortness of breath, slurred speech, or problems with vision or balance. Stop taking naproxen and notify your physician if you notice stomach pain, tiredness or weakness, yellow skin or eyes, nausea, vomiting, bloody or black and sticky bowel movements, skin rash, unexplained weight loss or weight gain, or swelling of the hands and feet.
Naproxen may also cause stomach or intestinal bleeding, which can be fatal. These conditions can occur without warning while you are using this medicine, especially in older adults.
Before taking this medicine

Naproxen may also cause stomach or intestinal bleeding, which can be fatal. These conditions can occur without warning while you are using this medicine, especially in older adults."

https://www.drugs.com/naproxen.html

[Yeadon]

We give Clyde a half a gabapentin when he’s chased too many squirrels around the backyard.

[JayInOz]

Joe try lying on your side and very slowly bringing one leg up as high as you can- like knee to the chest. It might take a bunch of attempts but there is always a position that eases the pain a little. It's when you have to move again that it will get ya And try a wheat bag in the microwave- the help I got was marginal but it did help. You have pressure on the sciatic nerve. Now try to imagine having the nerve slowly crushed in two by a bone fragment which then remains lodged between the vertebra and the severed nerve ends for six weeks before surgery Mine was more than twenty years ago. I have severe loss of muscle mass in the right leg, greatly reduced muscle control, numbness from knee to instep and pain. And I can no longer run which took me a long time to come to terms with because running fast was about the only thing I was really good at. I do have a nice collection of walking sticks and make more all the time JayInOz

[epoxyboy]

Joe you gotta get the inflammation down! Ice on the L5 for 10 min every 30 min + 4 ibuprofen every 4 hrs. After 2-3 hours that MIGHT get you able to at least move around enough to take a pee! I am also not new to the sciatica rodeo. If it looks like a diskectomy is a viable solution go for it. It’s a 30-40 min procedure as an out-patient, a week on the couch, some PT and unfortunately you’ll then have to go back to work. Been there, done all the so called remedies including a multiple visits with a pain management doc who loved sticking needles in my back. Bad back sucks big time. My Christmas sciatica is easing up a bit so I can mostly sleep and the unheated seat in my Tacoma is most comfortable, go figure. Keep smiling!

That "4 ibuprofen" very much depends on the tablet size. 400mg four times over a 24 hour period is pretty much the top end of the range, and you're encouraged to take that with food and liquid so it doesn't rot a hole in your gut. 200mg tablets are common here, 4 x 4hourly would damn near have you in liver failure or something.
Out of curiosity, how are dosages defined in non-metric USA? Presumably not milligrams, but what?

Pete

[Dave Wright]

We give Clyde a half a gabapentin when he’s chased too many squirrels around the backyard.

Our almost 13 year old husky has been getting 500 mg a day of gabapentin for the past 4 months. It seems to help her arthritis pain. Of course the silly bitch is lying on the wet grass in the rain right now. Since age 11 she has refused to sleep nights in the house. She spends every night in a dog house on the back porch, even when temps are in the teens F.

[Joe (SoCal)]

8/9 day update.

Still having severe sciatic pain, although a little less I can make it to the bathroom without crawling and all fours screaming in pain.
I still have that one position within 1.23 deg where I can sleep after taking a 5mg THC chocolate a bottle of wine and about 12 puffs on a THC vape pen to get to the coma level sleep needed.

Today I went to an orthopedic doctor who took x rays and had a brief consultation. He prescribed an MRI tomorrow. The MRI is my living breathing nightmare, I have Valium prescribed for. It seems that for my spine MRI an open MRI is not as good of an image. So depending on the MRI, After that he recommends physical therapy twice a week as possible therapy.

I’m sorry I’m still in severe pain, I cant sleep, I cant think, I’m becoming a nasty spouse, father, and boss.

I do not like this Joe

[Besserwisser]

Not wanting to quote meself...but I wish you'd try an anti-inflammatory like Celebrex 200mg.

Double the initial dose and then take according to instruction thereafter. In a week, you'll be fine.

For me, it's been a wonder pill so many times over the years. PT can't hold a candle to it.

Sent from my MI MAX 3 using Tapatalk

[SaltyD from BC]

Similar issues over the years but not quite ever to Joe's extreme. If it wasn't for Advil for muscle and joint pain, (active ingredient ibuprofen an anti intinflammitory) I don't know what I'd do. I'm taking max doses of extra strength the last while, working on stretching, hoping. Good luck with it Joe.

[Dave Wright]

I’m sorry I’m still in severe pain, I cant sleep, I cant think, I’m becoming a nasty spouse, father, and boss.

I hope that you get better soon. Try to find some humor in the pain every now and then. I can remember after a couple of months of pain thinking: "if those bastards promoting intelligent design could just experience sciatica for a few weeks they would shut up for good!"

The argument from poor design holds; there is no perfection in the human design, no god would give you this kind of pain Joe.

[Joe (SoCal)]

Not wanting to quote meself...but I wish you'd try an anti-inflammatory like Celebrex.

Double the initial dose and then take according to instruction thereafter. In a week, you'll be fine.

For me, it's been a wonder pill so many times over the years. PT can't hold a candle to it.

Sent from my MI MAX 3 using Tapatalk

This is the first time I'm hearing of this - So far NO, none , nadda anti-inflammatory has done a single thing.

I have soooooooooooooooooo many remedies that have been suggested to me from day one it's almost hard to keep up with the all the: Stretches. remedies, pt, herbal & traditional medications yadda yadda yadda.

I got a pain shot in my ass, a course of steroids, Tylenol with codeine etc etc etc and NOTHING WORKED