Chartering a Sailboat in Greece

[Joe (SoCal)]

Renee and I are planning our 10th anniversary next September. The plan was to fly into Naples, spend two weeks driving down the Amalfi Coast, down to Sicily, then across to Bari, then a flight or a ferry to Greece for two weeks.

Then I got an idea how about we fly from Bari to Athens and charter a sailboat and sail around the Aegean Sea and the Greek islands

Looking at this charter company https://www.clickandboat.com/us/boat...in&radius=0.61

I really don’t know what it involves, I’m figuring a 38 ft LOA or nothing bigger than 42 ft LOA.
Whats required ? I mean obviously I know how to sail. Has anyone here done anything like this ?

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[Ted Hoppe]

You will need to know where in Greece you want to start. Each region in the Aegean can be different. You may want to 8 night 7 days including stay on board the night before the charter.
Thoughts of a back up cruising Croatia might be wise.

Also many charter including moorings require a keelboat certification. ASA can be done in 2 weekends

[J.Madison]

In Europe they are pretty strict about having some kind of certification. The ASA bareboat course is sufficient but you'll need to plan ahead a bit to get it in time.

I've chartered in Croatia and Greece, loved them both. The sailing can be boisterous, 30 kts in the afternoon is common.

It is so nice to tie to the wall in some ancient village and get a liter of wine while looking over the harbor.

[Joe (SoCal)]

Thanks guys looking into getting certified. There is a class right near me in Dana Point.

https://www.aventurasailing.com/asa-courses

The importance of ASA Certificates:ASA Certificates have become the standard used by most bareboat Chartering companies and Sailing clubs. Whether in national or international waters, your certificates along with your experience (Log book) are foundational elements in the Chartering community requirements.

[stromborg]

I took the ASA 104 Bareboat Cruising certification course a few years ago with the idea I'd do some chartering. We did, once, out of La Paz Mexico. (It was a bit of a disaster but that is a story for an EBS someday). My course was a week-long liveaboard experience, a lot of fun, I have been recommending it to folks who want to try sailing bigger boats. The ASA offers an IPC (International Proficiency Certificate) to go along with their US based training.

They say:
"ASA strongly recommends you apply for an International Proficiency Certificate if you are chartering in the Mediterranean as well as the inland waterways of Europe and northern Europe. Most charter companies accept this certificate as adequate proof of bareboat skipper proficiency including Kiriakoulis Charters which has 300+ locations in the Mediterranean. As countries differ in their requirements, travelers should always check with their destination prior to attempting to charter."

I can't vouch for this, they are in the business of selling certifications after all. But it is worth checking out, like I said the course I took was a lot of fun and I definitely learned things I hadn't sailing smaller boats.

[Andrew2]

We chartered a 46 Benateau out of the Sunsail fleet in the bay of Volos, then sailed to the Outer Sporades (think Mama Mia)
Flew into a Military field, then bussed it to the village where the boats were moored. There were several groups of smaller boats with 'minders' there doing flotilla cruises.
Six of us meant we had a cabin each couple, leaving the saloon free. Boat was quite new and well fitted. We opted for the extra genaker to make it more interesting.
On the weather, it was in September, so in that area it didn't have the strong winds in the afternoon, but enough to sail comfortably. Only two of us were experienced. My brother had a Yachtmaster cert, so they were happy with that. I have a lot more sea time, but no certs. I understand that a 'log' of my experience would have served.
September is end of season, so things were a bit quieter than my previous trips and there was no problem with space in harbours. No night sailing, mainly while your GPS might be spot on, the charts are old and not very accurate. I understand they can be up to a mile out in places.

The only negative was when we returned to base some of the flotilla crews were young party animals and kept us awake most of the night with their noise.
Chatting to one of the lead crews, there had been a revolt from the family boats and they had to split up from the party lot, as they were at it every night. Bit of a frosty atmosphere on the bus to the airport......
A2

One little note. We were in a very small island port, along with a flotilla of 27ft boats. Got talking and asked to look at one. The three crew said, 'Oh, it pretty rough compared with yours. No matter, I have sailed most of my life in boats like yours. Then asked them if they fancied a look at the Benny. Of course and lots of oos and aahs. But, when we talked about what things cost, we were not paying much more, per head, than they were.

[dutchpp]

How to do it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sn8fD8TEBxc

[Henning 4148]

Sounds like a very nice idea!

About the certificate - the charter company will be able to tell you what you need. And you will have to present what they need as a minimum.

About boat size - a big boat is nice when you are out there in a bit of a blow. And it can be nice if you are in harbour, although you will not need 42 feet of living space for the two of you for a week. Where a big boat is not so nice is when it comes to maneuvering into a berth in harbour, especially if there is wind as well. Here, a small boat is nicer. So - if available, looking into the 32 ft range might make a lot of sense if it is just the two of you. My wife and I were once sent out by a charterer on a 37 footer as they had to reshuffle their boats due to some defects and the 28 footer we had ordered was not available any more - with just two on board, berthing that thing felt a bit like berthing an aircraft carrier - the distances to cover on deck during the berthing were really a bit much. With 4 people on deck, it would have been a breeze, but smaller is more beautiful for a small crew.

The layout you have posted shows 6 bunks -- with saloon sofa likely 7 - taking into account luggage, that layout would probably work well for 4 people plus luggage. It is more living space than you need if you are only two on board.

Last point - make sure your wife wants to go sailing before you sign up ... And get her to obtain the same certificates that you obtain. Having two people on board who have at least basic skills to handle the boat increases your resilience dramatically (think about the question "what happens if the skipper is out of order?").

[dutchpp]

And how not to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAfhCX9No5c

[Norman Bernstein]

Wife and I have chartered bareboat many times… mostly out of Tortola, but also out of St. Martin and St. Lucia. Call me if you want to get a practical overview.

[ron ll]

Six of us (three couples) bareboat chartered a flush deck Frers 50 through Moorings in Tortola in the early 80s. All six of us were qualified racing skippers, Moorings just ask us for sailing resumes, no other certification required then. Great time, always intended to do it again in Greece, but never happened. I’m sure much has changed since. I think most boats are catamarans now, among other things.

[Gerarddm]

Myself, I wouldn't charter over 38'. Keep it simple, and easy to handle for two people.

[Dan McCosh]

As for chartering, we spend New Years 2000 in the BVIs, a chartering Moorings boat. Thought we had plenty of experience, having spent most summers cruising in the Great Lakes. Had several incidents anchoring, due to the incredibly poor holding ground in most anchorages. Lots calmer, and much shorter passages than most of our past journeys. Lesson is that local knowledge is more important than boat handling. The Med can get nasty, but I don't know anything about Greece. You have to watch out for sirens.

[CollinR]

You could try the Ionian, a bit further from Athens, but possibly less crowded. Sail in the footsteps of Odysseus on the wine-dark sea! SailIonian have a good fleet and an excellent reputation (with me, anyway!). I wouldn't charter anything over 38 feet for just the two of you, you would need radios to keep in touch on deck!

Cheers!

[dutchpp]

"A friend" went on a 7 day sailing vacation in the Greek isles.
The first day het was struggling behind the chart desk ( they used paper charts back then) preparing his course, the distance, wind direction, currents, obstacles, water depth etc. etc between his homeport and the port of destination on the next island 15 NM away. After doing the math he left the harbor and he realized he simply could see the next island in the beautiful blue sea.
His navigation preparation turned out to be perfect
The next trip was planned with a little less stress.

[ron ll]

^^ When we pulled out of the Roadtown marina in the BVI on the Frers 50 that drew probably 8’, I was on bow watch and I hollered excitedly to my buddy on the helm that I could see bottom! He said the depth sounder showed 60’. I said we didn’t yet know if the sounder was accurate. Turns out it was, but coming from the PNW waters, if you can see bottom, you’re probably already aground.

[Yannis Xanthakis]

It happen that I partly live in one of Greece‘s sailing capitals, Lefkada.
Western Greece, where Lefkada is, is much more suited to a sailing holiday than the Aegean, due to wind, waves and landscape. The Aegean is, of course, wonderful, but under the wrong conditions, you may end up motoring the nights and sheltering ouzo drinking during the day ;-))
I am often out of Internet these days, so I may connect at some point later.

[Ted Hoppe]

Joe - how about we get Tidbit back and send her to Europe. I'll pay for the shipping and storage. You and I can alternate - we use her to do all the euro canals and to sail from Venice to Greece. You can to hate me for suggesting this or love me with equal enthusiasm.

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[Joe (SoCal)]

Do you have any idea how slow a 17 ft catboat sails?
It would become a Homer level voyage of the Aegean, not to mention a very poor blue water sailboat, with deplorable accommodations for my beautiful bride

I do however love your enthusiasm Just don’t piss me off because I’m not a vegetarian, and I enjoy my protein

[Ted Hoppe]

Do you have any idea how slow a 17 ft catboat sails?
It would become a Homer level voyage of the Aegean, not to mention a very poor blue water sailboat, with deplorable accommodations for my beautiful bride

I do however love your enthusiasm Just don’t piss me off because I’m not a vegetarian, and I enjoy my protein

Sailing down the canals in a catboat or along the coast means you aren't suffering. You stay in nice hotels and airb&bs nearly every night. Shop locally for lunch and eat at fabulous restaurants, become part of the scenery. Would be most epic. A magical time. A series of summer days you would treasure in ways that a large charter boat could not do. A charter is going to cost you 10k a week minimum. I am suggesting something more for thousands less.

[Joe (SoCal)]

Sailing down the canals in a catboat or along the coast means you aren't suffering. You stay in nice hotels and airb&bs nearly every night. Shop locally for lunch and eat at fabulous restaurants, become part of the scenery. Would be most epic. A magical time. A series of summer days you would treasure in ways that a large charter boat could not do.

So a sailboat can do all the euro canals and to sail from Venice to Greece without removing the mast ?

[Ted Hoppe]

So a sailboat can do all the euro canals and to sail from Venice to Greece without removing the mast ?

you build a cradle to hold the mast and shelter. Tidbits mast is easy to manage. Two folding bikes. A ice chest. Hand in the water kinda days.

when ready sailing along the Adriatic is done in a series of day hops. Cheap harbors with great beauties with a small boat. Heck sailing in the Venetian lagoons would be incredible while you planned to sail to Trieste and Split and more.

[Ralphie Boy]

Excellent idea! If you go to the Cyclades, I recommend Naxos.

[Tom Wilkinson]

Excellent idea! If you go to the Cyclades, I recommend Naxos.

Second that!


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[Joe (SoCal)]

you build a cradle to hold the mast and shelter. Tidbits mast is easy to manage. Two folding bikes. A ice chest. Hand in the water kinda days.

when ready sailing along the Adriatic is done in a series of day hops. Cheap harbors with great beauties with a small boat. Heck sailing in the Venetian lagoons would be incredible while you planned to sail to Trieste and Split and more.

You've obviously never unstepped and then stepped a mast on a 58 year old wooden catboat.

[Ted Hoppe]

Nice. That seem quite easy.

I have stepped and unstepped many masts. I am sorry you would think it too hard. That has never been my way of thinking on such small boats and have seen first hand how many do it in Europe. Asking someone to help is part of this adventure. It is not the places you go but the people you meet along the way that makes the adventure.

would you mind I looked into buying and sending Tidbit myself then? I could easily do this with a sanderling or sandpiper as well but having a cool one of a kind American boat might be more fun.

[Dan McCosh]

A friend shipped his 30-ft. double-ended cutter to Europe a couple of decades ago, and spend about 10 years cruising in Europe waters. One year, he stored the mast and motored through the canals of Europe. Had a great time. As to the question of size, his wife once responded to what it was like living on a small boat for an extended period of time: "Imagine living in your bathroom."

[Ted Hoppe]

^ not sleeping on the boat at night for the most part makes all the difference. I have to ask folks why they chose misery over comfort. Nobody gets a reward for being miserable. The wicked nice idea of a small boat like a delicious catboat is one can camp along side or or likely tie up along the banks and find a room for few euros. May even be better if organized into a raid.

I am still interested in joining folks like Frank (FF) on his summer raids in Holland and along the Low Countries. This is part of my inspiration to follow what he and his gang has done and go further afield. Each week a trip; a new adventure on a fresh water I have never seen with folks I have yet to meet.

[Joe (SoCal)]

Nice.
would you mind I looked into buying and sending Tidbit myself then? I could easily do this with a sanderling or sandpiper as well but having a cool one of a kind American boat might be more fun.

From what I understand from the institute that is looking after and teaching people how to sail, Tidbit is not for sale at this time.

[Ted Hoppe]

I recognize that the boat is for training and she is loved. Usually most boats donated are held for a season or 3 even if they have true intrinsic value to organization then released. They tend to eat up an organizations budget and it is far better tax wise to move them and get new one.

I'll get a boat to Europe in the next years. I can't currently sell or give away one of my lovely boats which is in excellent condition. I play with the idea of sailing down to Ensenada and putting on a transport ship for Spain or Genoa. It is about 15k. It might be better to do that. I never cared if I profited from any boats I have done. It is in the restoration, use and sharing of them that I care about. I am most happy when I can share with warmth what I have with others.

[Joe (SoCal)]

Tidbit has been beloved and cared for and maintained for over 7 years now and I talk or email them once a month or so. They seem to be extremely well funded, and love having Tidbit in their stable. She's a small boat that is easy to sail with a huge cockpit to take out a lot of kids and adults and teach them to sail. They offer sailing classes on her every season and she is one of the more popular boats they have. FWIW they charge for the sailing lessons.

​Our fleet consists of two keel boats, two Capri centerboard boats, One Snipe centerboard boat, three 420 centerboard boats, one Catboat (Tidbit), and eight Optimist Pram centerboard boats.

This beautiful Catboat Tidbit is a historic recreation of traditional catboats from the 19th and 20th centuries. She is a very stable centerboard boat, and though she doesn't sail upwind as efficiently as a sloop with a main and a jib, she is a sweet ride.

That photon on their website gives me so much joy because of this photo of my daughter at the very same helm.

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So I don't think they are interested in letting her go, and besides I retain the opportunity to sail her anytime I'm back east as well as retain first right of refusal should they ever wish to sell her. That was all included in my donation requirements.

Hey but good luck you seem to know what you are doing

[Ted Hoppe]

I have bought many treasured boats. First right to sail...tidbit.

[Joe (SoCal)]

I have bought many treasured boats. First right to sail...tidbit.

I retain a right to sail, and first right should they sell ( typo corrected almost immediately after I posted )
Sorry Ted but there is a contract with me for the the time they have the boat.
Last time I went sailing and met with the director and staff and they seem like amazingly honest caring mariners so I think they will hold up our agreement.

Hey but tell you what if you want to buy it I'll inquire and see if they want to sell it and then I'll sell it to you at a significant profit

[Ted Hoppe]

Then go get it. We can talk about what you think you can charge me later.

sailing out of Dana point would be nice

[Joe (SoCal)]

I don't have the time, space or resources that I once had with a dedicated barn for winter sanding, painting and varnishing and as I've said it before she is not a suitable blue water boat to use here. Hey but if you want her the ask will be in the low six figures if I feel like brokering a deal.