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Thread: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

  1. #1
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    Default Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Hi all, I'm new (read "ignorant") to boats and boat-building.
    The only experience I have that is remotely close is that I have been building my own surfboards and fins for a few years.
    I glass with epoxy and have done some vacuum bagging of veneers.

    I want to build a simple canoe that paddles and sails easily and can carry 2 people.
    Looking to build with the stitch and glue method < 16' long.

    I'm using google search to look through the archives for info on outrigger canoes.
    Finding a lot of dead links and still have some (ok, a LOT) of questions hahaha

    Ideally, the boat would paddle well and (if/when) wind arises, be rigged in the water and sail easily up and down wind.
    I assume I might need to under-power it.

    I'm wondering where to place the akas for paddling. Specifically where 2 people would sit on this boat? I imagine one near the tail and one near the middle?
    I waffle about wether to make it shunting or tacking. Currently leaning towards tacking

    I initially thought that a largish ama with plenty of planing ability and significant weight could be the best of both worlds on a tacking outrigger. Kinda bridge the gap between pacific and atlantic style. But after reading further, realize that such an ama might not paddle well. So I *think* I might want to do a smaller sleeker ama and just underpower the sail and include small trampolines on both sides for keeping the boat upright.

    Also, hull shape...
    I'd like to design my own hull because that's part of the fun. I plan to do some scale models with posterboard.
    I've seen some V hull canoes that look simple and have their own appeal and I've seen some hulls that are mostly V with a flat strip up the middle.
    What are the benefits to either?
    I'm guessing that the hulls with the flat will allow for a little more volume but tend to pivot without a leeboard/daggerboard/keel?
    And the the V hulls might not need a leeboard/daggerboard/keel?

    Anyway, thanks in advance for any info/help and please correct me of my ignorances

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Austin, TX
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Dooder,
    https://duckworks.com/gary-dierking/
    https://duckworks.com/vaa-motu-plans/
    https://www.solwaydory.co.uk/

    If you haven’t looked through Gary’s work check it out. Lots of great work on different hull shapes, ama shapes and construction, and sail types. You can build his hulls with double amas if you want. Do you want the amas for sailing power or as a safety tricycle? If it just for safety I’d look at Solway’s take. It’s a good one. In my experience a 16’ sailing canoe gets small quickly, I have moved up to 17.5’. For 2 people I’d be looking at 17’-19’. There has been good work done on multi hulls that don’t really need dagger or center boards. I have seen this done with asymmetrical cross section shapes, something pickup up from the Pacific Islanders. Hobie amongst others have built this way. Personally I like big boards and I can not lie. Have fun you a have a deep design project ahead.
    Last edited by Matt young; 10-22-2022 at 11:30 AM.
    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
    -The Dude-

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Thank you!
    Probably for safety tricycle hahaha
    I will check those links

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Also, I don't know why I've limited myself to 16' other than number of plywood sheets...
    Hmmm, maybe I can go longer...

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
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    Coromandel, NZ
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing


  6. #6
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Dierking View Post
    thanks Gary!
    I am interested in your Wa’apa design. Does it paddle well?

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    The hard chines on the Wa'apa make it easier to maintain a course over a round bottomed hull. No need for skegs or rudders. If you don't plan to sail it you can slim down the ama for less drag. waapa16.jpg

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Been spending a lot of time on your blog and reading through other Wa’apa build blogs you’ve linked.
    Wasn’t keen on the take-apart hull at first but it’s grown on me.
    1) because it means that I could glass the whole thing in my 8x10 shed and still end up with a 16+Foot canoe.
    2) because I could build the ends first and get in the water asap and build the middle later.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Also easier to transport than a full size boat.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing


  11. #11
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Gary, your book is on my Christmas list
    hoping to start building a Wa’apa in the new year using 4mm ply.
    In the meantime, I’ve been going through some of the build blogs linked from your site outriggersailingcanoes
    I wonder if it would be possible to use a brad nailer to hold the panels before doing fillets and fiberglass?
    The nails could stay in after fiberglass and paint.
    Wondering if I should also ask Santa for a brad-nailer?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
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    Loon Lake, Washington
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    You may wish to look at my Dart tacking outrigger canoe thread in the Building / repair section!

    It's my design of a 50/50 sail/ paddle outrigger canoe. Two sheets of ply for the main hull and one more for the ama. I decked the ends, so I used up another half a sheet and I'm not sure its worth the extra weight. Holds two people just fine. I might recommend more rocker next time around though.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    Quote Originally Posted by Dooder View Post
    Gary, your book is on my Christmas list
    hoping to start building a Wa’apa in the new year using 4mm ply.
    In the meantime, I’ve been going through some of the build blogs linked from your site outriggersailingcanoes
    I wonder if it would be possible to use a brad nailer to hold the panels before doing fillets and fiberglass?
    The nails could stay in after fiberglass and paint.
    Wondering if I should also ask Santa for a brad-nailer?
    I'm not sure how you would hold two panels of 4mm together with brads. I've never been impressed with how much skill it takes to get fair chines with stitch and tape, and that's why I still use chine stringers. I have fastened them with a narrow crown stapler.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Outrigger Canoe 50/50 paddling/sailing

    You might like to look at the Open Canoe Sailing Group site
    http://www.ocsg.org.uk

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