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Thread: Banned Books

  1. #1
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    Default Banned Books

    Let's see the stories about all the books being banned across the US for being "provocative" or "obscene"

    I will start with a series of books by the group "girls who code" about girls learning to write apps and programs for the computer sciences.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/girl...schools-2022-9
    "If you think you are too small to make a difference, try sleeping with a mosquito"

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    I'm still wondering why so many think books are more harmful than bullets.
    "Banning books and not guns seems backwards. Can't think of anyone ever shot by a book

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Not to defend these yahoos at all, but although 'banned' sounds dramatic, what it really means is 'removed from the school library'. The local library has at least three of the 'Girls Who Code' titles (link), and with three mouse clicks and $10, anyone in York can get them from Amazon. Removing them from a school library is far less effective than they might hope. The publicity might have exactly the opposite of the intended effect, in fact. This is not the 1650 Index Librorum Prohibitorum.

    OTOH, I'm kind of mystified why they did this; the books seem totally innocuous. Maybe there's a non-binary character who goes by 'they', and the evangelicals had a hissy fit?
    Last edited by Keith Wilson; 09-26-2022 at 12:26 PM.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: Banned Books


  5. #5
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    We have 3 nuts running for the local school board on the back-to-the-past-that-never-was platform. One's platform is cherry-picked biblical mis-quotes. So far she's written several wacky letters to the editor of our local paper. She didn't show up for the League of Women Voters candidate forum. 3 of her fellow travelers did, 2 kept their more erratic rants in check but one had a hissy fit when he was told to anwer the question but that he could editorialize in his closing remarks. The library basement was SRO and most seemed to be from the saner side of the city residents; that was re-assuring. The city and school libraries have not "banned" any books so far this year.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    The publicity might have exactly the opposite of the intended effect, in fact.
    Yup, history tends to support that:

    In the late 1980s, much to the indignation of the British government, this book was published in Australia:

    Spycatcher.jpg

    The British government banned its sale in England, although oddly they didn't manage to do so in Scotland.

    Ultimately the publicity led to about 2 million sales...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spycatcher

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    They are afraid of truth, it ruins their entire agenda

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    It's impossible to actually ban a book locally - i.e. effectively keep people in York PA from being able to read it - short of building a wall around the town, and cutting off all internet access and outside deliveries. Taking 'Girls Who Code' out of the school library is pretty much just right-wing 'virtue signalling'. Not to defend it in the slightest; it's both stupid and wrong, but ineffective; sort of like Trump, whose incompetence is his greatest virtue.
    Last edited by Keith Wilson; 09-26-2022 at 01:42 PM.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: Banned Books

    If only tfg was imperfect

    D65E42D9-B053-4FB6-BF5F-C35E8B7BF9B5.jpg

    He's such a disgusting man

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    So, have they bowlderised their bibles, are there 'edited' versions around?

    They shouldbe greeted with laughter and ridicule every time thy speak

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    MC-squared has a good lyric:

    "God is all around, Buddha's at the gate
    Allah hears your prayers it's not too late"

    I wonder how long before they go after this sort of thing?
    "Where you live in the world should not determine whether you live in the world." - Bono

    "Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip." - Will Rogers

    "Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    MC-squared has a good lyric:

    "God is all around, Buddha's at the gate
    Allah hears your prayers it's not too late"

    I wonder how long before they go after this sort of thing?
    Considering that most of it's being driven by fundamentalist evangelicals . . .

    Last edited by Keith Wilson; 09-26-2022 at 03:59 PM.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Keith is more optimistic than I am. States like Florida and Texas are working up state-wide bans of books from public libraries. Oklahoma even as a law to take effect in November to bar certain materials from the internet - if it makes it past court challenges.

    Nothing new here. In the fall of '61 I was twelve and entering seventh grade. Mom had given me a copy of "Lord of the Flies" that her book club was reading. It was spotted by an English/Latin teacher monitoring the halls among the books I was carrying.

    Confiscated.

    But as Mom had given it to me, the principal said I could take it home but not to bring it to school.

    Ever.

    The next morning I had it. In the middle. Had to read. In the way of twelve year olds, I forgot the prohibition.

    Busted big time . . .

    . . . Until they phoned Mom to pick me up as I was suspended.

    Mom was a tiger. Not in defense of her insouciant son, but of literature and freedom.

    Two years later "Lord of the Flies" was read in ninth grade English.

    And Mom won a seat on the school board on a 'read good literature' platform.

    Small minded oppression is omnipresent.
    ..

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Considering that most of it's being driven by fundamentalist evangelicals . . .
    Considering... two out of three of the examples will be unacceptable to them...

    ...and she often tweaked the lyrics to be in support of Obama singing "Yes we can! Yes we can!"

    Then you have Boebert and her type who want to do away with separation between church and state (and I doubt she approves of my church very much or your wife's).
    "Where you live in the world should not determine whether you live in the world." - Bono

    "Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip." - Will Rogers

    "Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    I first learned about "Girls who Code" through Amazon-Smile. The Amazon-Smile program donates a little bit every time one purchases through them, and you must pick the charity. I picked program "Girls who Code", the books were not part of it at the time. The program at that time had a very hard time coming up with their success rate because it was 100%. Even they said it can't be that good but nobody's failed yet. Teaching an adolescent girl to code has some effect they have yet to get to the bottom off. But it seems to put them on equal footing with the boys, and once that happens there is no holding them back.
    The books I don't know much about but I doubt there is anything there to ban.
    This is the GOP trying to keep women "barefoot and pregnant".

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    The Central York (PA) School District claims that they haven't banned those books. If you navigate to their website, you get this popup:

    Attachment 120237

    According to the article, the ban was at the behest of a [nutter] group called Moms for Liberty that started in Florida a year or so ago, around the time that DeSantis started making noise about a presidential run. Its founders have close ties to the Florida GOP, and there are some questions about its funding: it may well be an astroturf organization.

    https://www.mediamatters.org/critica...g-moms-liberty

    They have some interesting ideas about what sorts of books kids should not be allowed to read:

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/far-ri...luther-king-jr

    Accompanying that letter is an 11-page spreadsheet with complaints about books on the district’s curriculum, ranging from popular books on civil rights heroes to books about poisonous animals ("text speaks of horned lizard squirting blood out of its eyes"), Johnny Appleseed ("story is sad and dark"), and Greek and Roman mythology ("illustration of the goddess Venus naked coming out of the ocean...story of Tantalus and how he cooks up, serves, and eats his son.") A book about hurricanes is no good ("1st grade is too young to hear about possible devastating effects of hurricanes") and a book about owls is designated as a downer. ("It’s a sad book, but turns out ok. Not a book I would want to read for fun," an adult wrote of the owl book in the spreadsheet.)
    The best is their getting het up over a picture book called Sea Horse: The Shyest Fish In The Sea:

    https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2021/09/...seahorse-sexy/

    It is apparently, "too sexy for their love". It describes seahorse mating and has [gasp!] watercolor illustrations of seahorses touching tails and bellies:

    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    In the fall of '61 I was twelve and entering seventh grade. Mom had given me a copy of "Lord of the Flies" .
    \

    Good on your Mum for standing up for Lit., but that book is a dark view of humanity that has been debunked to my satisfaction.

    But still, it can be read . . However, I would assign it only with cautions and disclaimers.

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...-for-15-months

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    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    \

    Good on your Mum for standing up for Lit., but that book is a dark view of humanity that has been debunked to my satisfaction.

    But still, it can be read . . However, I would assign it only with cautions and disclaimers.
    I wouldn't. More essential till truth regarding the human soul there than most other books -- viz., certain prominent American pols. And others.
    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Books and their ideas come and go from the public consciousness. The issue is not what should be assigned in a given year an place, but rather what (if any) should be banned.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Lawd, I loathe pinheads.
    Gerard>
    Albuquerque, NM

    Next election, vote against EVERY Republican, for EVERY office, at EVERY level. Be patriotic, save the country.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas Carey View Post
    I wouldn't. More essential till truth . . . .
    dunno what you mean by that, but whatever . . .

    hazing to the point of murder, as in Lord of the Flies, is not normal behavior . .

    that being said, human nature is both quite variable and malleable . .

    we are fortunate that the percentages of people who don't mind, or even enjoy, killing humans is quite low - they are of course psycho-paths.

    After calculating the conjoint mean of their results with meta-analytic procedures, based on a total sample of 11,497 people, it can be estimated that the prevalence of psychopathy in the general adult population is 4.5%.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    \

    Good on your Mum for standing up for Lit., but that book is a dark view of humanity that has been debunked to my satisfaction.

    But still, it can be read . . However, I would assign it only with cautions and disclaimers.

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...-for-15-months
    I think that you miss the point of the book, it is a thought experiment, as is 1984, Gormenghast, and others of that ilk.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  23. #23
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas Carey View Post
    The Central York (PA) School District claims that they haven't banned those books. If you navigate to their website, you get this popup:

    Attachment 120237

    According to the article, the ban was at the behest of a [nutter] group called Moms for Liberty that started in Florida a year or so ago, around the time that DeSantis started making noise about a presidential run. Its founders have close ties to the Florida GOP, and there are some questions about its funding: it may well be an astroturf organization.

    https://www.mediamatters.org/critica...g-moms-liberty

    They have some interesting ideas about what sorts of books kids should not be allowed to read:

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/far-ri...luther-king-jr



    The best is their getting het up over a picture book called Sea Horse: The Shyest Fish In The Sea:

    https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2021/09/...seahorse-sexy/

    It is apparently, "too sexy for their love". It describes seahorse mating and has [gasp!] watercolor illustrations of seahorses touching tails and bellies:

    It's likely they have a big problem with males getting pregnant... OMG!

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Considering that most of it's being driven by fundamentalist evangelicals . . .
    The Muslim demonstration I cited was about the same size as the local MLM demonstrations.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Considering that most of it's being driven by fundamentalist evangelicals . . .
    The Muslim demonstration I cited was about the same size as the local BLM demonstrations.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Banned Books


    I think it is ironic that a group of women who have been convinced they need to hide themselves from the world are accusing others of "brainwashing" their kids.

    Fundies got to be fundies...
    Steve

    If you would have a good boat, be a good guy when you build her - honest, careful, patient, strong.
    H.A. Calahan

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    Default Re: Banned Books

    I still like what Clark Kerr (former president of the University of California system) had to say. I'll tweak what he said just slightly:
    "The purpose of education is to make students safe for ideas, not to make ideas safe for students."
    “Aren’t you supposed to be the gentlemen who lie for the good of their country?”
    “That’s diplomats. We’re not gentlemen.”
    “So you lie to save your hides.”
    That’s politicians. Different game entirely.”

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    I'd like to think the purpose of education is to teach young people how to read, write, think, and provide them with a set of facts about the world and its history.
    "Banning books and not guns seems backwards. Can't think of anyone ever shot by a book

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Banned Books

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    I'd like to think the purpose of education is to teach young people how to read, write, think, and provide them with a set of facts about the world and its history.
    Today's schools do a surprisingly good job of teaching tolerance. It's a necessary social skill and required to have peace in the schools. This is misrepresented by some as advocacy and I hate to say it, but in a few instances they are right. It only takes the very few fools to make an entire group look stupid.
    "Where you live in the world should not determine whether you live in the world." - Bono

    "Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip." - Will Rogers

    "Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx

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