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Thread: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

  1. #1

    Default Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    I need to make new chainplates for my 22 foot sloop so I'm thinking of converting from turnbuckles to deadeyes. I've got 3/16 x 1.5" silicon bronze flat bar, but I'm not sure how to form the fore-aft eye at the top that accepts the bolt for the lower deadeye. I don't have great tools to form a nice round radius myself so I was thinking of buying bronze rod and having a little section tig welded to the end of the bronze flat bar, then I'd drill the hole for the bolt. Or, maybe a leaf spring shop could use their press to form the eye.

    Can anyone think of al alternative? Where to people get chainplates for deadeyes?


  2. #2
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Most people just buy the appropriate deadeyes that fit over a standard flat chainplate. For example from here https://www.colligomarine.com/produc...e-distributor- I don't know of anyone making some from bronze, but a good set of files can take care of that.

    The eye would probably have to be hot bent, and you want it welded shut afterwards. That's why it's simpler to either weld in a piece of tube, or directly a ring.
    For a no weld solution make the tang a little longer and epoxy and rivet doublers to them to get to the recomended radius of 5-6 rope diameter for the holes. Wich brings you right back to custom bronze terminal, only buildt up instead of carved from a block.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    why combine the worst of each system?
    choose one
    fitting /no fittings
    you do need all that crap....adding 6 more things to break make how much sense?




    I've had at least half a dozen boats retro fitted with West Indian style "top timbers". In my case I laminate them ,mix up the grain to make grain tear out more difficult..In the islands they are a grown nog of some kinna tree
    Last edited by wizbang 13; 09-16-2022 at 09:40 AM.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Don't try to bend copper alloys hot. Anneal them, allow them to cool slowly and then bend them, or the stock will break.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  5. #5
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    I have forged quite a bit of copper and bronze boat parts.
    Some bronzes don't work well if too hot, you need a darkened room to do it, a dull red, just barely is about right, below (1600°f if you have temp sticks)
    Copper and bronze alloys generally get stronger if cold worked.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    This is how I made the deadeyes for my small daysailer:

    Deadeyes.jpg

    The wood faces are epoxy bonded to the bronze plate. In the event of a bond failure the load will get transferred directly to the 1/8" thick bronze but the shroud/stay won't collapse. There are holes drilled through the bronze so that epoxy bonds wood to wood. No welding, no bending and a direct connection to the chain plate via a simple pin with pin keeper.

    Jeff

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    why combine the worst of each system?
    choose one
    fitting /no fittings
    you do need all that crap....adding 6 more things to break make how much sense?




    I've had at least half a dozen boats retro fitted with West Indian style "top timbers". In my case I laminate them ,mix up the grain to make grain tear out more difficult..In the islands they are a grown nog of some kinna tree
    How do those nogs attach the rest of the boat? Are they extensions of a frame or sistered to one?
    Steve

    If you would have a good boat, be a good guy when you build her - honest, careful, patient, strong.
    H.A. Calahan

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    On island boats, they will be a piece of frame next to a frame, but the whole boats are built like that...grown,always something alongside.
    I fine lamming them far superior.We can mix up the grain, bend them or point them however we want
    The actual attachment to the hull depends of the hull construction, whether epoxy, bolts, screws....
    How far they extend down also depends on construction

  9. #9

    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Quote Originally Posted by jpatrick View Post
    This is how I made the deadeyes for my small daysailer:

    Deadeyes.jpg

    The wood faces are epoxy bonded to the bronze plate. In the event of a bond failure the load will get transferred directly to the 1/8" thick bronze but the shroud/stay won't collapse. There are holes drilled through the bronze so that epoxy bonds wood to wood. No welding, no bending and a direct connection to the chain plate via a simple pin with pin keeper.

    Jeff
    Jeff this is clever! Looks great!

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Quote Originally Posted by preserved_killick View Post
    I need to make new chainplates for my 22 foot sloop so I'm thinking of converting from turnbuckles to deadeyes. I've got 3/16 x 1.5" silicon bronze flat bar, but I'm not sure how to form the fore-aft eye at the top that accepts the bolt for the lower deadeye. I don't have great tools to form a nice round radius myself so I was thinking of buying bronze rod and having a little section tig welded to the end of the bronze flat bar, then I'd drill the hole for the bolt. Or, maybe a leaf spring shop could use their press to form the eye.

    Can anyone think of al alternative? Where to people get chainplates for deadeyes?

    I’m in the process of getting my chainplates cast, it turns out that it’s not anywhere near as costly as I’d expected and I know that I won’t have any issues created from trying to “work" a bronze flat bar to shape myself, which I’d been considering. In my case I’m getting the chainplates, a porthole, rudder gudgeon and a few other bits and pieces cast at the same time and I’ll clean up and polish the castings myself.

    You can make your own patterns to match the curve of the hull using @4 laminates of thin strips of MDF or ply and then glue a couple of thicker cheeks to the top where the fore-aft eye would be. Shape the whole thing with rasps, files and sand paper, use builders bog to fill any imperfections. Don’t drill out the eye in the pattern, drill it out on the cast bronze chainplate.

    PS: I tried working some bronze flat bar in my forge and had very mixed results, including areas that simply crumbled because I didn’t read the heat correctly no matter how careful I was. Suffice to say that it was enough for me to not have any confidence in the strength of forging bronze flat bar to shape myself, at least without a lot of wastage and practice and direct instruction - (in my experience it’s not something that I could pick up from youtube instructions......) .
    Last edited by Larks; 09-17-2022 at 06:47 PM.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  11. #11

    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    I’m in the process of getting my chainplates cast, it turns out that it’s not anywhere near as costly as I’d expected
    It's rude to ask what you are paying for the casting, but I've got to ask!

    It does look like a costly process. I should look into this, I could easily make the patterns.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Bronze Chainplates for Deadeyes

    Quote Originally Posted by preserved_killick View Post
    It's rude to ask what you are paying for the casting, but I've got to ask!

    It does look like a costly process. I should look into this, I could easily make the patterns.
    As an example, the most expensive and complicated casting that I’m getting is for a porthole and the foundry has estimated AUD275.00-320.00 (USD180-210) for the set, including the glass retaining ring, flyscreen ring, the face piece (? - external mounting ring) and the wing nuts and locking bolts. Based on that estimate which was cheaper than I expected I haven’t bothered asking for one for the chainplates, I’m just going ahead with them.

    [IMG]IMG_3961 by Greg Larkin, on Flickr[/IMG]

    [IMG]IMG_3995 by Greg Larkin, on Flickr[/IMG]

    [IMG]IMG_3960 by Greg Larkin, on Flickr[/IMG]
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

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