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Thread: Biden's Betrayal?

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    and yes, that was a different hearing. the benghazi hearing, with the horn rimmed goggles.

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Quote Originally Posted by L.W. Baxter View Post
    at this point, what difference does it make.

    on a thread titled "biden's betrayal?" you are demanding that i prove my bona fides to defend the president's alleged attempt at dealmaking, by providing some non sequitor criticisms of my own.

    shrug.
    You sure are fond of reframing people's statements in a way that would have certain other forumites scolded for "straw man" tactics.

    You're welcome to defend Biden anytime you want. No bona fides have ever been needed for that.

    But of course a defense offered by someone who is so biased that they have never acknowledged any shortcomings in the person they are defending isn't worth all that much. If you can't bring yourself to admit--even to yourself--that relying on McConnell's good faith for dealmaking is a bad idea, then you're not as perceptive as I thought you were.

    I haven't offered any criticisms of "your own" (your own what, exactly?) at all. My criticism is for Biden's apparent trust of McConnell. I was simply wondering if your support of Biden is reasoned, or falls into the Biden Bro category. Absent evidence to the contrary, it looks like Biden Bro. You have no obligation to offer evidence to the contrary. I'm not sure you could even if you wanted to, but you're free to give it a shot.

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  3. #38
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    it would be nice lf at some point people remembered that no matter the p.r. spin, Biden is an anti-abortion conservative Catholic. I suspect this 'deal' of his was easy for him to self justify.
    Last edited by Durnik; 06-30-2022 at 04:25 PM.

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boatbum View Post
    So if he made a deal, what does he get in return? I could see any benefit to him in the article. Maybe I missed it
    From McConnell, nothing more tha empty promises and smoke and mirrors.
    Actually I think rather than 'negotiation' being the word. it should be 'blackmail'.

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    There seems to be no compromise with the current crop of Republicans. The Democrats need to be tougher than trading a lifetime appointee for a "promise".

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    80 year old Biden making deals with 80 year old McConnell about the future.
    ITS CHAOS, BE KIND

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    .
    It is foolish for any Democrat to trust the word of Mitch McConnell. I say that as one of his constituents for 23 years.
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  8. #43
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bow View Post
    80 year old Biden making deals with 80 year old McConnell about the future.
    Precisely, and how many people in the US are eligible to be President? And that and donald is the best you can do?

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    So you think McConnell can't be trusted? This came from Associated Press just one hour ago:

    McConnell warns Dems of fallout for reviving Biden bill

    WASHINGTON (AP) — Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell threatened Thursday to derail a bill designed to boost semiconductor manufacturing in the United States if Democrats revive their stalled climate and social policy package.

    The rejuvenation of the Democratic reconciliation package, central to President Joe Biden's agenda, remains a work in progress and is far from certain. But with some signs of progress in the negotiations, McConnell is moving to complicate Democratic plans by warning that Republicans would react by stopping separate semiconductor legislation from moving over the finish line in the coming weeks, despite its bipartisan support.

    “Let me be perfectly clear: there will be no bipartisan USICA as long as Democrats are pursuing a partisan reconciliation bill," McConnell tweeted, referring to the shorthand name for the computer chips bill that passed the Senate last year.

    Both chambers of Congress have passed their versions of the legislation, which would include $52 billion in incentives for companies to locate chip manufacturing plants in the U.S. Lawmakers are now trying to reconcile the considerable differences between the two bills, but at a pace that has many supporters worried the job won't get done before lawmakers break for their August recess.

    White House press secretary Karine Jean-Pierre said McConnell was “holding hostage" a bipartisan package that would lower the cost of countless products that rely on semiconductors and would yield hundreds of thousands of manufacturing jobs.

    “Senate Republicans are literally choosing to help China out compete the U.S. in order to protect big drug companies," Jean-Pierre said. “This takes loyalty to special interests over working Americans to a new and shocking height. We are not going to back down in the face of this outrageous threat."

    Democrats have eyed using reconciliation — a special budget process — to pass parts of their agenda through the 50-50 Senate because it allows them to circumvent the filibuster and pass legislation with a simple majority. It was anticipated that any new reconciliation package Democrats pursue would include provisions designed to lower drug prices for many consumers.

    Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y. and Sen. Joe Manchin, D-W.Va., have been talking intermittently for months in an effort to craft a whittled-down version of the massive environment and social program measure that Manchin killed in December.

    As part of that drive, Democrats are expected to submit language reducing prescription drug costs to the chamber’s parliamentarian in coming days, according to an official familiar with the process.

    The parliamentarian, Elizabeth MacDonough, must affirm that the provisions adhere to Senate rules. That would allow Democrats to use special procedures that would let them approve the legislation in the 50-50 chamber over unanimous Republican opposition.

    The prescription drug provisions would be crucial to the bill because they could produce hundreds of billions of dollars in savings by reducing federal costs.

    Those savings would be used to pay for other initiatives under discussion dealing with climate, energy and possibly health care subsidies for low earners. Schumer and Manchin have yet to reach agreement on other potential parts of the bill, which Schumer is hoping the Senate would consider as early as late July.

    The prescription drug provisions would let Medicare begin negotiating prices for the drugs it buys from manufacturers next year and increase federal subsidies for premiums and co-pays for some low-income people, according to a summary obtained by The Associated Press.
    There is more and you can read it.

    McConnell warns Dems of fallout for reviving Biden bill (msn.com)
    "Where you live in the world should not determine whether you live in the world." - Bono

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  10. #45
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Think about it. McConnell is willing to derail a vital semiconductor bill that the automobile and every other high-tech industry needs if he doesn't get his way on climate and social issues.
    "Where you live in the world should not determine whether you live in the world." - Bono

    "Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip." - Will Rogers

    "Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others." - Groucho Marx

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    [IMc - Biden attempts to preserve the compromises of civility with what seems like betrayal. The real question may come down to whether Biden's search for the old ways will lure McConnell past all reason, or whether all this will so frustrate Democrats that November is a disaster.]

    'Indefensible': Outrage as New Reporting Shines Light on Biden Deal With McConnell
    The president has reportedly agreed to nominate an anti-abortion Republican to a lifetime judgeship. In exchange, McConnell has vowed to stop blocking two Biden picks for term-limited U.S. attorney posts.

    JAKE JOHNSON
    July 1, 2022

    The details of President Joe Biden's deal with Republican Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell to nominate an anti-abortion lawyer to a lifetime federal judgeship came into clearer focus on Friday, sparking fresh calls for top congressional Democrats to block the proposed agreement.

    Slate's Mark Joseph Stern reported Friday that "McConnell will allow Biden to nominate and confirm two U.S. attorneys to Kentucky"—positions that are term-limited—if the president nominates Republican lawyer Chad Meredith to a post on the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Kentucky.

    "Under the arrangement, Meredith would take the seat currently occupied by Judge Karen Kaye Caldwell, a George W. Bush nominee," Stern noted. "Caldwell submitted her move to senior status on June 22, which, once complete, will allow Meredith to take the seat. A lawyer with connections to the Kentucky governor's office who is familiar with the agreement told Slate that Caldwell conditioned her move upon the confirmation of a successor—specifically, the conservative Meredith."

    The terms of the deal as well as its timing—right on the heels of the Supreme Court's decision last week to strike down Roe v. Wade—infuriated Democratic lawmakers and advocates who are currently fighting to shield reproductive rights from Republican officials like Meredith, who defended anti-abortion laws during his tenure as Kentucky's solicitor general.

    Rep. John Yarmuth (D-Ky.), who had planned to recommend nominees for the Eastern District in the case of a vacancy, told Slate that Biden's deal with McConnell is "indefensible" and that he has expressed his "outrage" to the White House, which has yet to publicly acknowledge the arrangement.

    "I understand how brutally manipulative Mitch is, but at some point you have to stand up to him," Yarmuth told the outlet. "You have to just confront him and say, 'No, we're not gonna appoint your people. We're not gonna let Mitch McConnell appoint judges and other federal officials in a Democratic administration.'"

    McConnell's ability to obstruct Democrats' U.S. attorney nominees despite being in the minority stems from the majority party's—and, apparently, the president's—continued adherence to the "blue-slip" tradition that gives senators veto power over nominees for posts in their home states.

    Senate Republicans abandoned the blue-slip courtesy when they were last in power, and progressives have urged Democrats to follow suit.

    Ian Millhiser, a senior correspondent for Vox, slammed the Biden-McConnell deal as "unconscionable" and called on Democratic leaders to ensure Meredith is not confirmed.

    Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.), the chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, "should pledge that Meredith will receive no hearing," Millhiser wrote.

    "And Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer," Millhiser added, "should pledge he'll get no floor vote."

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  12. #47
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Disappointing. I wish I could say "surprising" but it isn't.

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  13. #48
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    If L.W. Baxter is checking in on this thread, I'd be curious to hear his reaction to this deal: giving McConnell 1 lifetime anti-abortion federal judge for Kentucky, in exchange for a promise not to obstruct the appointment of 2 term-limited prosecutors for Biden.

    Even apart from McConnell's complete lack of good faith operations, that deal sounds like a loser to me. Especially coming on the heels of Roe v. Wade being overturned. I imagine that an awful lot of people who voted for Biden are not happy with this news. And doing things that you know will make your voters unhappy seems...

    Well, it seems like bad leadership to me.

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  14. #49
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    mitch mcconnell is the fulcrum we are balanced on.

    president biden is fighting for his political life, which for the time being, like it or not, is our political life.

    biden fights on two fronts: a)to keep together the coalition of voters to win a national election, and (b) insure that, should he win, the results be honored.

    mcconnell will soon be head of the legislative branch. he is uniquely positioned to decide the fate of our democratic republic. that is the lens through which i view this lopsided dealmaking.

    the jan. 6 coup attempt was blocked by mike pence. the next coup attempt will be blocked by mitch mcconnell, or not at all.

    even before that, mcconnell will have influence over the presidential impeachment that is coming in '23.

    but, as i said in #22, probably would be better for biden to do nothing, call the opposition evil, signal impotent rage, like a good prog. that'll show em!

    do you think bernie will run in '24...

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    I'd imagine that a lot of people that voted for Biden don't understand or follow any of this. Also, a lot of people who voted for Biden in order to oust T***p. Then, a lot of people voted for him to maintain the status quo of Neo-feudalism. I don't think anybody thought he was going to be a champion of the people, if they did, they were stupid.
    No, but a lot of people who voted for him, seeing him for what he is--a status quo center-right career politician, but still eons better than Trump or any other Republican--will not be happy with this. Not only the poor judgment shown by trying to cut a deal with McConnell, but the callous twisting the Roe v. Wade knife in the still-fresh wound.

    Seems like a particularly bad move with mid-terms coming up. Unless Biden and the Democrats are looking to ditch progressive voters and hope they can make up for the loss by grabbing anti-abortion conservatives who hate Trump. But then, with Roe v. Wade overturned, those conservatives have less reason to vote for Biden anyway.

    I just can't see much of an upside to this deal for Biden or for the party. I'd be very interested in hearing what it might be, if someone else sees it.

    Tom
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  16. #51
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    Quote Originally Posted by L.W. Baxter View Post
    mitch mcconnell is the fulcrum we are balanced on.

    president biden is fighting for his political life, which for the time being, like it or not, is our political life.

    biden fights on two fronts: a)to keep together the coalition of voters to win a national election, and (b) insure that, should he win, the results be honored.

    mcconnell will soon be head of the legislative branch. he is uniquely positioned to decide the fate of our democratic republic. that is the lens through which i view this lopsided dealmaking.

    the jan. 6 coup attempt was blocked by mike pence. the next coup attempt will be blocked by mitch mcconnell, or not at all.

    even before that, mcconnell will have influence over the presidential impeachment that is coming in '23.

    but, as i said in #22, probably would be better for biden to do nothing, call the opposition evil, signal impotent rage, like a good prog. that'll show em!

    do you think bernie will run in '24...
    I can see why you think as you do, I suppose, though I still disagree with you. Whether you're right about McConnell being the fulcrum or not, though, he is a bad faith actor who can't be trusted, or negotiated with. That is the lens you should be viewing this lopsided dealmaking through.

    The rule "First do no harm" is a good one, not just in medicine, but in many areas of life. In my opinion, Biden broke it, big time, with this move. It's going to cost him much more than not trying to make the deal would have cost him.

    If McConnell has enough influence to block a coup, and he does, it will be for his purposes, not for the good of the nation. He is not persuadable either way. I really thought you were perceptive enough to understand this, but I guess not.

    Tom
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  17. #52
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    Default Re: Biden's Betrayal?

    I dont think your present setup is adequate to prevent the degredation of the state. And neither is ours.

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