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Thread: The left's circular firing squad.

  1. #71
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    No, it is not an epithet to the lefties. It is a compliment.

    Show me one single instance of a leftie using it as an epithet. There is no such critter.

    Your sentence gets the Fractal Wrongness award of the day.

    (The Bobster was yesterday's winner)
    I'm pretty sure that by "Reds" OR means conservatives.

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  2. #72
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by George. View Post
    That's exactly what I mean, perhaps with less emphasis on the residue of Marxism.



    Thank you, LW. That's exactly why I critique it. I was woke (by PM's definition) long before the term was coined. But when being woke conflicts with my liberal principles, I draw the line.
    How can being aware of injustice conflict with liberal principles? Are your liberal principles oppressive and conservative in that they do not want to improve?
    I would edit your post if I were you, as I suspect it does not say what you intended.
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  3. #73
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    If awareness of injustice leads to wanting to remedy it with more injustice, I draw the line, PM.

    And when awareness of injustice leads to an obsession with minor things that prevents the big issues from being tackled, it is dismaying.

  4. #74
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    i think it is important, how we talk about things.

    but, i am insulated from the paralyzing effect of too much controlling of expression, of too much concern for the minutia of injustice, of too much emphasis on leveling every field.

    to me, in my little life, thinking and caring about how our society can become friendlier and less discriminatory, through promotion of a fresh set of social mores, has no downside. the process is hardly new, either. some racial epithets have been verboten for generations, to give a very basic example.

    the reactionary movement in the u.s. appears bent on reclaiming even the right to call black people *******. witness the tale of morgan wallen (speaking of crummy country music) who was taped using the word with friends. public chastising ensued, but....his album sales skyrocketed. using that epithet made him a star. for a particular demographic. the demographic that uses "woke" as an epithet.

    so, when i hear the word "woke" tossed around, do i get triggered? yeah, maybe a little. i know what is going on. i'm against it with every fiber of my being.

    but, on another morning and another cup of coffee, i can read the o.p., and get it, totally. it's a problem.

  5. #75
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by L.W. Baxter View Post
    i think it is important, how we talk about things.

    but, i am insulated from the paralyzing effect of too much controlling of expression, of too much concern for the minutia of injustice, of too much emphasis on leveling every field.

    to me, in my little life, thinking and caring about how our society can become friendlier and less discriminatory, through promotion of a fresh set of social mores, has no downside. the process is hardly new, either. some racial epithets have been verboten for generations, to give a very basic example.

    the reactionary movement in the u.s. appears bent on reclaiming even the right to call black people *******. witness the tale of morgan wallen (speaking of crummy country music) who was taped using the word with friends. public chastising ensued, but....his album sales skyrocketed. using that epithet made him a star. for a particular demographic. the demographic that uses "woke" as an epithet.

    so, when i hear the word "woke" tossed around, do i get triggered? yeah, maybe a little. i know what is going on. i'm against it with every fiber of my being.

    but, on another morning and another cup of coffee, i can read the o.p., and get it, totally. it's a problem.
    Read the sports pages if feeling vexed..

    Course my liberal neighbor used to steal my morn paper..

    I told him read it and at least throw it back.

  6. #76
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by bobbys View Post
    Course my liberal neighbor used to steal my morn paper..
    I don't believe that any more than I believe your claim to have seduced your boss's wife.

  7. #77
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    bobbys is always 'unbelievable'.

  8. #78
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown;[URL="tel:6687787"
    6687787[/URL]]I don't believe that any more than I believe your claim to have seduced your boss's wife.
    This one keeps on giving.

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by leikec View Post
    Sorry, but it’s pretty hard to take you seriously when you write (and apparently believe) this nonsense…

    The “residue of Marxism” in progressive politics in America is roughly equivalent to the leftover residue of caramel nougat left in a 35 year old candy wrapper. It’s laughable, especially when compared to the overwhelming authoritarianism and fascism of the extreme right (particularly in today’s GOP where the “extreme right” includes 95% of the party).

    Jeff C
    Where did the "critical" in Critical Legal Studies come from?

    I'll grant you, among white wokers there is a great deal of comic book anarchism.

    What further step would a woke person have to take to be a critical race theorist?

    Where did the "critical" in "Critical Race Theory" come from?
    Last edited by Osborne Russell; 07-01-2022 at 08:32 PM.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    I don't believe that any more than I believe your claim to have seduced your boss's wife.
    .
    Cost me a lotta money.

  11. #81
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    I don't believe that any more than I believe your claim to have seduced your boss's wife.
    It was his wife that felt guilty and told me so i give them some credit.

  12. #82
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Talking to someone with an open mind is always a joy.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Former Top Obama Advisor David Axelrod Shreds Biden, Says He's 'Not in Command'
    By Bob Hoge | Jul 01, 2022 10:30 PM ET

    Brian Kersey
    The man who masterminded both successful presidential campaigns for former President Obama, strategist David Axelrod, has harsh words for the current Commander-in-Chief saying, “There is this sense that things are kind of out of control and he’s not in command.” Appearing on CNN’s “The Lead with Jake Tapper” Thursday, he added, “so, you know, this is a very, very fraught environment for him right now.”


    The first question that pops into my mind is, does this have Obama’s blessing? It’s hard to imagine that Axelrod, now a CNN commentator, would criticize the Democratic Party’s standard-bearer without running it first by his former boss. My second question is, how long does this guy want to work at CNN? Because if he keeps spouting off like this, he’s bound to upset some folks at the left-leaning network who have been covering for Biden since day one of his presidency. Paging Brian Stelter and Oliver Darcy…


    Axelrod didn’t stop there though, continuing to rip the president:

    Inflation, no one president can control inflation, but it is a gale force wind right now. It’s affecting politics.

    You heard him on gas prices today. He talks about the gas tax holiday, but he is not going to get the gas tax holiday and there are a lot of Americans who are skeptical about whether that would help.

    It’s true that no one president can control inflation, but one can certainly exacerbate the problem with profligate spending. Biden’s out-of-control layouts include mega-bills like the $1.2 trillion infrastructure bill and the $1.9 trillion American Rescue Plan providing for COVID relief. Throw in tens of billions more sent to Ukraine. Think all this might have something to do with inflation?


    Don’t forget that Biden wanted to spend more—up to $5 trillion more on the Build Back Better bill, but was only stopped because he couldn’t get the votes. Imagine how much worse inflation would be had that behemoth made it through Congress.

    House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy said in November of 2021 that Biden’s monstrous agenda was even bigger than the New Deal and that “Never in American history has so much been spent at one time.”

    The resulting inflation has come at a cost:


    Tapper asked Axelrod about an AP-NORC poll which shows that 85 percent of respondents think the country is headed in the wrong direction. “That frankly points to disaster for Democrats in November,” Tapper argued. Axelrod agreed:

    If you were looking at the chart, you’d say the vitals are not good. The President’s approval rating’s at 38%. His economic ratings are low. Consumer confidence is down. The number that you mentioned.

    The two also discussed the filibuster, with both acknowledging that although Biden has recently suggested pausing it for an abortion vote, he can’t actually make that happen. Tapper flatly declared, “Well he’s not going to be able to get it done,” because he simply doesn’t have the votes. Axelrod once again concurred.


    Being a loyal Dem and also a CNN contributor, Axelrod at least had to make a (weak) attempt at optimism, claiming that the recent overturn of Roe v Wade might galvanize the progressive base. “You know, If I were a Republican strategist, I’d be a little bit worried about that right now,” he said.

    No David, Republican strategists are not worried about that right now. They can read polls too.

    Axelrod has been critical in the past of the Biden Administration, but he seems to have really taken off the gloves in this interview. Does he have the Big O’s blessing, as I asked earlier? Is this a sign that a wave of Dems will soon jump the Biden ship and try to force him out of the race in 2024?

    Or are they clearing the decks for Michelle Obama?


    Bob Hoge
    Bob Hoge is a RedState contributor, proud father and small-business owner. He is shown sporting his Covid beard, which his wife has since forced him to shave. Say hi on Twitter @Bob_Hoge_CA

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    Me being called a privileged Nazi for saying that women need to acknowledge that evil exists and to act accordingly is woke-ism

    Not being allowed to be critical because I'm a white old guy, no matter how right I am, is woke-ism.

    The term is so effective because it's true for many on the left. .
    I never once saw any of this, but I am less active in politics than formerly . .

    To me, this is what is going on . .

    https://johnpavlovitz.com/2021/05/05...=johnpavlovitz

    "Woke" is Republican-speak for anyone who gives a damn about other human beings or the planet; a dog-whistle slur against expressions of humanity that seek or to spread resources, opportunity, power, and a voice to more people.

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    More of you fractal wrongness.

    I joyfully admit to being "woke" - and aspire to become more woke every day.

    You really have no idea about how the world works.
    OK, then answer the question.

    What's the difference between "woke" and "liberal"?

    Can a "liberal" be "woke"? If not, what is required to move from "liberal" to "woke"?

    Is it possible to be "woke" and anti-CRT?

    David G and Wi Tom have no answer. What's yours?
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    if "woke" means that one is in favor of a new suite of social mores, while c.r.t. is a prescription for an entirely new legal system, there is no reason why they can't be separable.

    they should be separated. you've got to keep them separated.

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    OK, then answer the question.

    What's the difference between "woke" and "liberal"?

    Can a "liberal" be "woke"? If not, what is required to move from "liberal" to "woke"?

    Is it possible to be "woke" and anti-CRT?

    David G and Wi Tom have no answer. What's yours?
    I'm reluctant to engage on this basis because of the way you've framed the question.

    "Woke" (used in a political or moral or psychological sense) is a relatively new introduction to the language. As such, its meaning is fluid. Still defining itself. RWW's have tried to capture it and define it pejoratively. Lefties used it in various ways.

    You are acting as if there is a team of lexicographers sitting as authorities and ruling on usage, definitions, and spelling. And that their definitions always (conveniently enough) comport with your inclinations.

    So... any discussion, any parsing, any critiquing of the use of the various terms needs to start with definitions. Until then, you're just pizzling up a rope.
    Last edited by David G; 07-04-2022 at 10:32 AM.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I'm reluctant to engage on this basis because of the way you've framed the question.

    "Woke" (used in a political or moral or psychological sense) is a relatively new introduction to the language. As such, its meaning is fluid. Still defining itself. RWW's have tried to capture it and define it pejoratively. Lefties used it in various ways.

    You are acting as if there is a team of lexicographers sitting as authorities and ruling on usage, definitions, and spelling. And that their definitions

    So... any discussion, any parsing, any critiquing of the use of the various terms needs to start with definitions. Until then, you're just pizzling up a rope.
    You're acting as if because by inventing a word, or a usage, you discovered new content, which only that term or usage can express. Defining is up to you; you having asserted the term.

    What's the difference between "woke" and "liberal"? I'm not talking to lefties or righties, I'm talking to you. Answer the question, or admit that you can't. We'll take it from there.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    You're acting as if because by inventing a word, or a usage, you discovered new content, which only that term or usage can express. Defining is up to you; you having asserted the term.

    What's the difference between "woke" and "liberal"? I'm not talking to lefties or righties, I'm talking to you. Answer the question, or admit that you can't. We'll take it from there.
    Another example of a faulty premise. Definition is not up to me. Definition will come, or the word will fade from common usage due to being too vague, over time - from how 'the people' come to use it.

    If you'd like to reframe, and provide your own definition 'for the purposes of this discussion' then we could proceed on that tentative basis.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by L.W. Baxter View Post
    if "woke" means that one is in favor of a new suite of social mores, while c.r.t. is a prescription for an entirely new legal system, there is no reason why they can't be separable.

    they should be separated. you've got to keep them separated.
    Yes, they are separable on that basis. Liberalism is in favor of a new suite of social mores. CRT is a prescription for a new (relatively, not really) and antagonistic theory of the legitimacy of the state.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Another example of a faulty premise. Definition is not up to me.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    Yes, they are separable on that basis. Liberalism is in favor of a new suite of social mores. CRT is a prescription for a new (relatively, not really) and antagonistic theory of the legitimacy of the state.
    agreed.

    and who is conflating them, the liberal left, or reactionary right?

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    Are you responsible for what you say?
    Sure... and??
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    The position of the reactionary right can be dismissed out of hand. They're even more ignorant. Both "Make America Great Again" and "CRT" are anti-rational.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Sure... and??
    What's the difference between woke and liberal? What does woke mean that liberal doesn't?
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    CRT, wokeness, progressivism, and liberalism are all the same.

    In essence they recognize that injustice exists and that it needs to be opposed.

    There is something wrong with that only in the fevered hate-filled minds of the Reich.

    And why do you think anyone should be obliged to respond to your lame questions ??

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    What's the difference between woke and liberal? What does woke mean that liberal doesn't?
    Using which definition of 'woke'? I've offered you the opportunity to specify, in order to better make whatever point you're attempting to make, but you've passed. So I'll pass.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Using which definition of 'woke'? I've offered you the opportunity to specify, in order to better make whatever point you're attempting to make, but you've passed. So I'll pass.
    To repeat, any definition you choose. You use, you've chosen. So explain your choice.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    To repeat, any definition you choose. You use, you've chosen. So explain your choice.
    Alright... if it'll help you move forward, here ya go --



    • Woke is a slang term that is easing into the mainstream from some varieties of a dialect called African American Vernacular English (sometimes called AAVE). In AAVE, awake is often rendered as woke, as in, “I was sleeping, but now I’m woke.” 'Woke' is increasingly used as a byword for social awareness.



    Definition of woke

    (Entry 1 of 2)

    chiefly US slang
    : aware of and actively attentive to important facts and issues (especially issues of racial and social justice)

    But we will only succeed if we reject the growing pressure to retreat into cynicism and hopelessness. … We have a moral obligation to "stay woke," take a stand and be active; challenging injustices and racism in our communities and fighting hatred and discrimination wherever it rises.— Barbara Lee… argued that … Brad Pitt is not only woke, but the wokest man in Hollywood … because he uses his status—and his production company Plan B—to create space for artists of color, with such films as 12 Years a Slave, Selma, and the upcoming film Moonlight.— Giselle Defares



    woke

    /wōk/

    verb

    • 1.past of wake


    adjective

    • 1.alert to injustice and discrimination in society, especially racism:informal"we need to stay angry, and stay woke"




    David G
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    What's the difference between woke and liberal?
    I'm not leaving.

    -- Mike Pence

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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    What's the difference between woke and liberal?
    Why?

    Do you have a point you're trying to make? Is it germane to something of import?
    David G
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Why?

    Do you have a point you're trying to make? Is it germane to something of import?
    I've made my point many times over, which you pretend not to know.

    No point discussing a point with someone who takes no responsiblity for what they say. There can be no honest discussion with the dishonest.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post
    CRT, wokeness, progressivism, and liberalism are all the same. In essence they recognize that injustice exists and that it needs to be opposed.
    An answer at last, but . . . it's wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandtown View Post

    There is something wrong with that only in the fevered hate-filled minds of the Reich.

    And why do you think anyone should be obliged to respond to your lame questions ??
    The Enlightenment demands intellectual honesty.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    An answer at last, but . . . it's wrong.

    The Enlightenment demands intellectual honesty.
    You're not communicating. And you're blaming your several correspondents, instead of looking at your own contributions. My impression is that you need to explore one of two options.

    1. An assessment of cognitive capabilities.

    2. A study of essay writing and/or rhetoric.

    When you start making sense again, I'll happily re-engage.
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    Default Re: The left's circular firing squad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    An answer at last, but . . . it's wrong. .
    Your arrogance is mighty off-putting.

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