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Thread: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boom?

  1. #1
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    Default Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boom?

    Hello,
    lst timer here.

    I haven't received a response from PT Watercraft or CLC regarding the mast inside and outside diameter for the PT 11 or "Spear" models... does anyone here happen to know someone who owns one and could give me the measurements? Mast height too if possible.
    I'd like to see if I can retrofit this rig to my boat. Thank you in advance if anyone has the info.
    If I don't hear back via emails, soon, I'll try calling both outfits again.

    I have a f.g. "Orca" 10.5' dinghy similar in shape to a Penobscot 14-ish...they were built in Mt. Vernon, WA by Earl Hanson for years.
    Mine is fiberglass (I know...) but:

    (It's mold was made from a wooden dinghy in British Columbia and was rumored to have originally been outfitted with a steam engine (!)
    It's a centerboard, catboat rigged presently with a sprit sail. I was told the orginal wood boat was from the '20s or '30s.

    My father worked untangling nets on the Gertrude L. Thebeau in Glocester in the '30s for pocket change as a kid. (this boat raced and beat the Canadian Bluenose Fishing Schooner (the one on the dime). I offered to trade Earl some photos my dad took for one of his dinghy with the original engine but that never happened and he's retired a few years now.)

    Anyway, I lurk here (for a long time now) and figured someone would likely have built a PT 11 or knows someone who has...
    Thank you if you can help.
    Cheers, DPD

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    might ax the designer ?
    sgoodall@telus.net

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    Thanks Wizbang, you gave me an idea to contact the sailmaker/builder who supplied the PT 11 rigs. Due to a security upgrade glitch yesterday a.m.(?) this post vanished (on my computer) but is back now, so I replied on a 2nd thank you post in the building forum/threads...so you'd see it.
    Still experimenting with my existing sprit sail rig to see if I'll keep it now that I've finally tweaked things enough to get it to go to weather in the meanwhile.
    Cheers, DP

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    If you're not set on the PT Watercraft rig, the Duckworks Scout https://duckworks.com/scout-sailing-package/ might be similar enough, and it's available. 58 SF sail area with a carbon fiber 2-piece mast and no boom but sail has full length battens. Mast is 40 mm outer and 32 mm inner diameter at the base, and I believe it's around 17 ft in length but can get exact measurements if you need them.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Loudon View Post
    If you're not set on the PT Watercraft rig, the Duckworks Scout https://duckworks.com/scout-sailing-package/ might be similar enough, and it's available. 58 SF sail area with a carbon fiber 2-piece mast and no boom but sail has full length battens. Mast is 40 mm outer and 32 mm inner diameter at the base, and I believe it's around 17 ft in length but can get exact measurements if you need them.
    Hi Jack, thanks. I did go over to see/fit the Duckworks Scout/Portage Pram mast and it would fit my mast step pretty painlessly. Unfortunately they didn't have the sail on hand so I could see how far it would go over the stern/sheeting angle/leads, etc. The Pram sail is close to. my existing sail's size (supposedly 46sq.ft. so I'd like to try it with their sail on hand sometime.
    I'd have to make an arch or other thwart-y support for a carbon mast (higher than my existing partner) so we'll see.

    I wanted to compare the Duckworth rig with PT's and see if the boomed rig would be way too large for my boat. I have reservations about the lack of reefing with the Duckworth and any sleeved sail so mulling it all over.

    If you or anyone here knows of a video or know of a Scout owner who has pics of it under sail I'd love to see the Duckworth boomless battened sail in action. Their Portage Pram launching video only shows it sailing for a few seconds in a mere breath of wind...
    Thanks again. Appreciate it.
    DP

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    Quote Originally Posted by Dinghy Pipedreams View Post
    Hi Jack, thanks. I did go over to see/fit the Duckworks Scout/Portage Pram mast and it would fit my mast step pretty painlessly. Unfortunately they didn't have the sail on hand so I could see how far it would go over the stern/sheeting angle/leads, etc. The Pram sail is close to. my existing sail's size (supposedly 46sq.ft. so I'd like to try it with their sail on hand sometime.
    I'd have to make an arch or other thwart-y support for a carbon mast (higher than my existing partner) so we'll see.

    I wanted to compare the Duckworth rig with PT's and see if the boomed rig would be way too large for my boat. I have reservations about the lack of reefing with the Duckworth and any sleeved sail so mulling it all over.

    If you or anyone here knows of a video or know of a Scout owner who has pics of it under sail I'd love to see the Duckworth boomless battened sail in action. Their Portage Pram launching video only shows it sailing for a few seconds in a mere breath of wind...
    Thanks again. Appreciate it.
    DP
    I have the Scout sail kit for my 9-1/2 ft pram but it will be a week or three before the boat is finished and has its first sail. I do have dimensions of the sail as I had to carefully measure it to determine center of effort. The Scout sail does have a single reef, unlike the Portage Pram.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Loudon View Post
    I have the Scout sail kit for my 9-1/2 ft pram but it will be a week or three before the boat is finished and has its first sail. I do have dimensions of the sail as I had to carefully measure it to determine center of effort. The Scout sail does have a single reef, unlike the Portage Pram.
    Jack, If you wouldn't mind, I'd appreciate the sail's dimensions. I need to determine where the center of effort will be on my dinghy.
    I enjoy sailing boomless on a 10.5'er and (I think...now that I have my spritsail dialed in better MAY stay with it) but that lower batten on yours, intrigues me. When you get to sailing if you have some video footage down the road...well, you have an audience if you want one! ;-)
    I originally thought of going to more sail area as I don't have to worry about boom dragging in the water, etc. but would have to determine if I have a decent sheeting angle without a boom kin or other rope or rod traveller arrangement.

    I've been surprised by the "relaxed" level of marketing that Duckworth has used for this sail/rig compared with PT 11's many videos showing their boomed rig under sail in all conditions. They have been very helpful trying out the mast in my step, etc. and discussing the sail area(s).

    I think if they could show both the Scout and the Pram sailing "actively" they'd sell more rigs without the "unknowns". I can't find any Scout videos on YouTube with your sail by private owners either.
    I like the the windward ability of the PT rig but (so far) prefer to remain boomless for quick rigging when anchored out from our 31ft cutter".

    Do you have an idea of how high above your mast partner you need an additional thwart or arch support to prevent carbon breakage?

    Thanks for the discussion and info. I was reticent to ask about carbon masts for a "fiberglass classic" here but everyone is so helpful.

    It'll be ironic if I end up liking my boomless sprit rig after all but either way, I'll learn a lot-learning more...

    I can PM a private email addy if you need one when you have mesurements or videos, etc. Otherwise...here...
    No big hurry. Still figuring out my sprit re-rigs and testing things out to see if I keep it.

    My previous dinghy cruising dinghy was a Minto with a boomed cat rig. That boat went to weather very well. I think I'm getting the sprit rig close to the Minto's windward abilities finally.
    Cheers,
    DB
    Last edited by Dinghy Pipedreams; 05-25-2022 at 02:44 PM.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    Quote Originally Posted by Dinghy Pipedreams View Post
    Jack, If you wouldn't mind, I'd appreciate the sail's dimensions.
    Do you have an idea of how high above your mast partner you need an additional thwart or arch support to prevent carbon breakage?

    The sail dimensions in metric (for easier math) are: Luff 341 cm, Foot 200 mm, Head 85 cm, and Leach 325 cm. The roach extends 20 cm max beyond the leach. When stretched, the luff will be a bit longer than the 341 measured.

    There is an 8-5/8" sleeve suppled for mast support, and I think this is all the bury that's required, though it seems low and I have a mast partner higher than this.

    Yes, not a lot of online information from Duckworks, but they are easy to contact and have been very good to deal with.

    I did some trial rigging today, don't know why the photo turned sideways. My boat is 9-1/2 ft long, so you have an idea of scale.

    IMG_2992.jpg

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Inside/Outside Diameter of PT ll 's (PT Watercraft) Carbon Mast and length of boo

    Awesome, thank you Jack. Super nice of you to measure for me (and all). You did a nice job on your pram too. Bet you're excited to check the boat and rig out together soon. I'll be getting out on a lake early next week again to try more tweaks and theories with my spritsail rig in the meanwhile. Will be interested in hearing what you like/dislike once you're sailing.
    Cheers! DP

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