Ukraine

[Johan R]

Screw that noise. That ain't peace.

As is your opinion of the UN, its better than nothing......right?

[SaltyD from BC]

A different conversation bought on by your distaste of the word "war", when everyone else was being annoyed that "special military operation" was not being called the war it was and is.

You need to look further back to find "invasion". Why not take your own advice....DO IT.

You're not very good at this. Ask them what janitor work pays, you might be better suited.

[Johan R]

"CGTN is funded in part or in whole by the Chinese Government."

29 F ing minutes FO

Zelensky saying he is open to working with the Chinese peace plan. Probably a good idea you are not in charge with your CCP-phobia.

[George Jung]

No way a rusbot is ever going to concede any point - and this one is a major contender for the 'Black Knight' award.

Arguing with an idiot/troll only gives him oxygen.

[Peerie Maa]

You nailed that, but the slash is superfluous.

[Canoez]

Zelensky: Ukraine will "work with China" if they show respect for international law and territorial integrity

[L.W. Baxter]

A different conversation bought on by your distaste of the word "war", when everyone else was being annoyed that "special military operation" was not being called the war it was and is.

You need to look further back to find "invasion". Why not take your own advice....DO IT.

should i go back to before you died

[sandtown]

Here are some job openings for those of you who are good at whitewashing US and NATO history . .

Ron DeSantis nods approvingly . . from KOS

Yes, DeSantis is attempting to write into law that any history that suggests the United States did not always fully live up to the “universal principles” of the Declaration of Independence (a document written by a slave-owner!) is not fit for inclusion as a general education course—the ones that students will be required to take. . . . The direct requirement of the bill would be history courses that didn’t admit to the existence in U.S. history of slavery or the internment of Japanese people during World War II.

[AdB]

This is getting absurd. You people do realize you're literally sponsoring these trolls and that way actually helping Russia? (Trolls like this usually get payed per post, if you ever wondered about all these rows of 'one post per sentence' replies.)
Discuss them if you must, complain, whine, make fun of them, but do NOT interact with them. And please don't quote them. Getting quoted is like hitting the jackpot for an aspiring young troll.

[George.]

On the contrary. If Russia pays by the post, we are helping it to bankrupt itself while having no effect.

[LeeG]

“Chinese peace plan” There is one?

[LeeG]

Looks like Putin’s advisors were right up there with the neocons in presenting pleasing intel for a prefered outcome.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...main_p001_f002

The humiliations of Russia’s military have largely overshadowed the failures of the FSB and other intelligence agencies. But in some ways, these have been even more incomprehensible and consequential, officials said, underpinning nearly every Kremlin war decision.
“The Russians were wrong by a mile,” said a senior U.S. official with regular access to classified intelligence on Russia and its security services. “They set up an entire war effort to seize strategic objectives that were beyond their means,” the official said. “Russia’s mistake was really fundamental and strategic.”
.
.
There are records that add to the mystery of Russian miscalculations. Extensive polls conducted for the FSB show that large segments of Ukraine’s population were prepared to resist Russian encroachment, and that any expectation that Russian forces would be greeted as liberators was unfounded. Even so, officials said, the FSB continued to feed the Kremlin rosy assessments that Ukraine’s masses would welcome the arrival of Russia’s military and the restoration of Moscow-friendly rule.
“There was plenty of wishful thinking in the GRU and the military, but it started with the FSB,” said a senior Western security official, using the GRU abbreviation for Russia’s main military intelligence agency. “The sense that there would be flowers strewn in their path — that was an FSB exercise.” He and other security officials in Ukraine, the United States and Europe spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive intelligence.

[AdB]

... while having no effect.

That's the big question, isn't it. The Russian troll farms sure are convinced it's worth the money.
Just ask: how many silent readers on this forum are like 'well, I haven't thought of it that way. The guy gets a lot of flak for sure, but he does have a point there. And he won't give up so he must be certain of his case.'

[George.]

That's the big question, isn't it. The Russian troll farms sure are convinced it's worth the money.
Just ask: how many silent readers on this forum are like 'well, I haven't thought of it that way. The guy gets a lot of flak for sure, but he does have a point there. And he won't give up so he must be certain of his case.'

On this forum? Few or none.

[JimD]

^ Pretty much zero.

[skuthorp]

This is getting absurd. You people do realize you're literally sponsoring these trolls and that way actually helping Russia? (Trolls like this usually get payed per post, if you ever wondered about all these rows of 'one post per sentence' replies.)
Discuss them if you must, complain, whine, make fun of them, but do NOT interact with them. And please don't quote them. Getting quoted is like hitting the jackpot for an aspiring young troll.

What he said.

The Russians are working from the Nazi playbook in this war, from massacres and mass graves in the woods to kidnapping of children. NATO and the west have not gotten to the main game yet…….

[sandtown]

This is getting absurd. You people do realize you're literally sponsoring these trolls and that way actually helping Russia? (Trolls like this usually get payed per post, if you ever wondered about all these rows of 'one post per sentence' replies.) .

Here is a good short essay that makes two points I have made here repeatedly . .

1. Russia is guilty as hell but was indeed provoked.

2. The US and NATO have blocked negotiations.

If you deny that this empirical reality, then you are the troll hidden away in a magical dark multi-verse.

https://www.counterpunch.org/2023/02...cy-in-ukraine/

[SaltyD from BC]

Here is a good short essay that makes two points I have made here repeatedly . .

1. Russia is guilty as hell but was indeed provoked.

2. The US and NATO have blocked negotiations.

If you deny that this empirical reality, then you are the troll hidden away in a magical dark multi-verse.

https://www.counterpunch.org/2023/02...cy-in-ukraine/

Um, no. Russia says they were provoked by things happening in adjacent countries that "threaten their security". Things happening in an adjacent country that are the will of those people is absolutely none of Russia's business. Russia says it infringed on their security, bull****. Nobody anywhere wants to invade that backwards broken country, no one. And there isn't a spec of evidence to the contrary.

[Peerie Maa]

. . . . . .

Both of those facts have been debunked.
The link discusses the Minsk Agreement
Naive stupidity.

Why has the 2015 agreement failed to end fighting in eastern Ukraine?

The Minsk II deal set out military and political steps that remain unimplemented.
A major blockage has been Russia’s insistence that it is not a party to the conflict and therefore is not bound by its terms.
In general, Moscow and Kyiv interpret the pact very differently, leading to what has been dubbed by some observers as the “Minsk conundrum”.
What is the ‘Minsk conundrum’?

Ukraine sees the 2015 agreement as an instrument to re-establish control over the rebel territories.
It wants a ceasefire, control of the Russia-Ukraine border, elections in the Donbas, and a limited devolution of power to the separatists – in that order.
Russia views the deal as obliging Ukraine to grant rebel authorities in Donbas comprehensive autonomy and representation in the central government, effectively giving Moscow the power to veto Kyiv’s foreign policy choices.

Only then would Russia return the Russia-Ukraine border to Kyiv’s control.

I assume that https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/...t-relevant-now is an acceptable source./

[epoxyboy]

Sweden sending ten Leopard 2 tanks
https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato...o-ukraine.html

[skuthorp]

The phoney war ratchets up.
As for any threat of invasion of Russia, as salty says why would any country or group of countries want to take on the responsibility for such a vast and comparatively backward country?
Better far to have a very secure border, even if that requires a defensive zone, because the threat will not go away, and refugees may well become a factor to consider.

[heimlaga]

The Russians are quite able to take responsibility for their own country. They are a clever bunch. We just need to teach them to think outside the submissive box and they will sort things out and make peace and shoot Putin&co and r´there will be good neihbourly relations for genrations to come.
The one and only obstacle is to make them dare to think outside the box........

Finland is sending 3 mine clearing Leopards to Ukraine. That is as far as we dare to go. Our forces must be at full strenght when it is our turn to fight off a conquest attempt.

[Osborne Russell]

hey johan, speaking of recent history, can you type the words "on the 24th of february 2022, russian armed forces invaded ukraine"? please make this simple and obvious statement of material fact if you are able.

and it is a material fact that requires expression in particular words of particular meaning. because when you state that one nation "invaded" another, you admit that responsibility for the conflict is not symmetrical. which is why you can't type it. your postings here are designed to obfuscate the assymetric responsibility for the "war breaking out".

or maybe you can type it. let's see.

Could be it's his a** if he does

1324-1.jpg

[Osborne Russell]

How so? People droning on for hours on end about their problems both real or perceived, and no solid solution for fixing the problem. Sounds entirely like this place, big on talk+no action= no change in outcome.

Slow walking into the possibility of a global conflict breaking out with eyes wide open.....insanity.

Now how did I know the RusBot that opposes NATO also opposes the United Nations?

Johan should trace the evil back to the Holy Roman Empire. Plenty of Slavophobia there.

[Osborne Russell]

As is your opinion of the UN, its better than nothing......right?

Now how did I know that the Rusbot is also a Xibot?

I must say, it's probably hard to come by some extra scratch in let's say, Russia, China, North Korea. It's not like you could open a weed dispensary or a janitorial business on the side.

So Johan, do you get to double bill?

[sandtown]

Um, no. Russia says they were provoked .

Well, no, not at all - analysts have been writing about those provocations for thirty years or so - Kennan, Kissinger, and many more.

And there exists equally strong evidence of US negotiation blocking.

If you continue to deny this, you are no better than the Blobista tools howling about Iraq WMD's in 2002-03.

[heimlaga]

Well, no, not at all - analysts have been writing about those provocations for thirty years or so - Kennan, Kissinger, and many more.

And there exists equally strong evidence of US negotiation blocking.

If you continue to deny this, you are no better than the Blobista tools howling about Iraq WMD's in 2002-03.

Why do you as a peace activist repeat pro-war and pro-conquest and pro-genocide propaganda over an over again?

I cannot do anything else than deny it because it just isn't true.

This is what the illegal free Russian press writes about the allegedly blocked peace talks: https://meduza.io/en/feature/2023/02...-telling-jokes
Remember theese journalist are as pro-russian as they come. Just not pro-conquest and pro-genocide.

[dutchpp]

The ISW Russian offensive campaign assessment, February 24.
https://www.understandingwar.org/bac...bruary-24-2023

Key Takeaways

• The Kremlin did not comment on the first anniversary of Russia's full-scale invasion of Ukraine on February 24, likely because Russia has failed to achieve any of its stated objectives and has not made significant territorial gains since July 2022.
• A Russian source capitalized on China's release of a 12-point peace plan to inaccurately portray China as supporting Russia's war in Ukraine.
• US intelligence reportedly continues to assess that China is seriously considering sending lethal aid to Russia amid continued pressure from Western sanctions regimes on Russia's defense industrial base.
• Western governments made a variety of statements on the provision of military aid to Ukraine on February 24.
• The Kremlin escalated its information condition-setting for a possible false-flag operation in occupied Transnistria, Moldova.
• Russian forces continued to conduct ground attacks northwest of Svatove and near Kreminna.
• Russian sources confirmed that Russian forces have split certain Airborne (VDV) force formations across at least two axes of advance.
• Russian forces made marginal territorial gains around Bakhmut and continued to conduct ground attacks across the Donetsk Oblast front line.
• Ukrainian officials suggested that Russian forces may feel insecure in east (left) bank Kherson Oblast.
• Russian authorities continue measures to expand the capacity of Russian peacekeepers.
• Russian sources likely attempted to shift the blame for scandals associated with Donetsk People's Republic (DNR) commanders to the conventional Russian military.
• Ukrainian partisans likely blew up a railway segment near Poshtove, Crimea.

[Johan R]

..... that opposes NATO also opposes the United Nations?

Oppose NATO and the UN? Hardly. What evidence do you have?

When someone repeatedly says "NATO is a defensive block and has not attacked anyone", and then pointing out that such a statement is demonstrably false, is not opposing NATO, it is in fact opposing BS and propaganda.

With regards to the UN, as you admit yourself, its better than nothing, to which i agree, even if it is much a paper tiger at times. That is not opposing the UN, it is a complaint that its powers are limited while countries and people burn.

You are free to live in a fantasy world of your own belief, free to write about, and i am free to correct the BS that you and others post, and point out the hypocrisy when i see it. Sorry you and others do not like that, but that is reality, deal with it.

[George.]

Why do you as a peace activist repeat pro-war and pro-conquest and pro-genocide propaganda over an over again?

Sandtown doesn't come across as a peace activist. He comes across as an anti-US-getting-in-a-war activist. He opposes and criticizes all US involvement in wars past and present, but he shows no concern for anybody else's wars.

Very "America first".

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Stefan Korshak’s report today:

https://medium.com/@Stefan.Korshak/f...l-ed9385a3a605

[George.]

WashingtonCNN —

The US has intelligence that the Chinese government is considering providing Russia with drones and ammunition for use in the war in Ukraine, three sources familiar with the intelligence told CNN.
It does not appear that Beijing has made a final decision yet, the sources said, but negotiations between Russia and China about the price and scope of the equipment are ongoing.
Since invading Ukraine, Russia has repeatedly requested drones and ammunition from China, the sources familiar with the intelligence said, and Chinese leadership has been actively debating over the last several months whether or not to send the lethal aid, the sources added.
US intelligence officials have collected information in recent weeks, however, that suggests China is now leaning towards providing the equipment.

[heimlaga]

Russian sociologist Grigorij Yudin attempting to explain why things are the way they are in Russia and what can be expected from the future:
https://meduza.io/en/feature/2023/02...where-they-say

[heimfried]

Thank you heimlaga,
a very interesting interview.

[sandtown]

Why do you as a peace activist repeat pro-war and pro-conquest and pro-genocide propaganda over an over again?.

I am merely reporting the truth . . . and you are not.