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Thread: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

  1. #1
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    Default The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Rogue’s restoration has been an intermittent affair since 2007. Life got in the way. I’ve posted occasional steps — eg, various success or trauma.

    But now the restoration’s taken on determined progress, starting with Rogue’s return to Auckland, after a 120-year absence.

    And then monthly updates:
    1. February 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/02/
    2. March 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/03/
    3. April 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/04/
    4. May 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/05/
    5. June 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/06/
    6. July 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/07/
    7. August 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/08/

    Work resumes when we get out of lockdown; relaunch scheduled for 5 weeks thereafter. I’ll keep you updated.
    Last edited by PatrickXavier; 09-04-2021 at 10:59 PM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    What a truly wonderful project - am enjoying the blog immensely. Thanks!
    Flat bottomed boats, you make the rockin' world go round.............

  3. #3
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    It's great to see the momentum, sailing in 22?

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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Spectacular!

  5. #5
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Great strides of progress showing in the photo's there!
    She looked a worry sitting in the Evans Bay hardstand with tarps almost over her.
    I remember she was hauled out at Seaview the same week as my yacht Haumuri, and went onto a truck to Miramar.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Quote Originally Posted by PatrickXavier View Post
    Rogue’s restoration has been an intermittent affair since 2007. Life got in the way. I’ve posted occasional steps — eg, various success or trauma. But now the restoration’s taken on determined progress, starting with Rogue’s return to Auckland, after a 120-year absence.And then monthly updates:
    1. February 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/02/
    2. March 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/03/
    3. April 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/04/
    4. May 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/05/
    5. June 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/06/
    6. July 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/07/
    7. August 2021: https://rogue1892.com/2021/08/

    Work resumes when we get out of lockdown; relaunch scheduled for 5 weeks thereafter. I’ll keep you updated.
    I have been waiting for this, this has been a real journey for you. Thanks for sharing the beauty, love, craftsmanship and patience. I will share some of these lovely links and photos to Louie.

    2E27947C-1E27-4502-845E-27178D97640E.jpg
    Without friends none of this is possible.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    We’re presently in lockdown, so I’m dependent on occasional photos of progress from the boatbuilder. Here’s a teaser:

    C1189BED-2763-44F6-965E-BDD250BD3B98.jpg

    50461E7A-64E4-404B-8E91-31B22321ECD9.jpg
    Last edited by PatrickXavier; 10-01-2021 at 06:24 PM.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    HOLY (many deleted expletives) that is some beautiful work!

  9. #9
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Thanks Patrick, though they're 'making my meagre efforts feel rather inferior
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  10. #10
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Come a long way since I used to go and look at her in the 80's and 90s at Nelson.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Damn!!!

  12. #12
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Very kind of you all to say. Thank you.

    More of the boatbuilder’s most recent photos are here.


    It’s worth comparing them with how the project started, here.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    She looks a treat! I love the etched skylight glass. Very exciting.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Better photos of etching here. June 2014! Dear God.

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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    What a beautiful ship she is!!!
    fair winds, Dody
    "They did not know it was impossible so they did it" - Mark Twain
    www.tongabonds.com

  16. #16
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Last edited by PatrickXavier; 10-09-2021 at 09:54 PM.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    In for Christmas then.
    I always set up stops or lanyards for my murrays to stop the nun chuck effect of handle into coaming or kidney, something to think about.
    Are they both clockwise ,or outside to in?

  18. #18
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Wow!
    Nothing more to say other than chuckling at the "nunchuck" Murray winches comment, having smashed myself in the kneecaps with them before.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    In for Christmas then.
    I always set up stops or lanyards for my murrays to stop the nun chuck effect of handle into coaming or kidney, something to think about.
    Are they both clockwise ,or outside to in?
    Thanks John. Sorry, I should have responded earlier. COVID lockdown(s)-willing, in by Christmas. There’s that matter of the Mahurangi Regatta, for which some commissioning first seems desirable, and then the prospect of a Gloriana rematch.

    On winch stops, yes, I was contemplating that just yesterday as I observed even the handle’s socket clips the booby hatch sides. And they’re both outside-to-in (as will be the identical mainsheet Murrays, located to the rear of the cockpit, straddling the coamings).

    F3C83279-3B74-429F-8DC4-1D8C5229D7E0.jpg

    Any helpful suggestions on the Laurent Giles backstay levers? I note Waione’s and Prize’s respective reductions (and Prize’s anti-abrasion/dent devices); are Rogue’s mounted upside down? I’ve been prevaricating on if the downturned handle makes more sense being grabbed to apply the backstay, and if the hook should be facing up, as presently mounted. But I hesitate to discover the error of my ways by disregarding others’ greater experience.

    35FAB482-6518-4C9E-963C-FC304B14D3C4.jpg

  20. #20
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    I have been waiting for this, this has been a real journey for you. Thanks for sharing the beauty, love, craftsmanship and patience. I will share some of these lovely links and photos to Louie.
    Thanks Ted, and best wishes to you and Louis. Vectis was getting some love on a local Facebook page.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    Thanks Patrick, though they're 'making my meagre efforts feel rather inferior
    Hell no, Greg, your Holiday aspiration and internal fit out are way beyond Rogue’s more skeletal and superficial restoration.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Quote Originally Posted by PatrickXavier View Post
    Thanks John. Sorry, I should have responded earlier. COVID lockdown(s)-willing, in by Christmas. There’s that matter of the Mahurangi Regatta, for which some commissioning first seems desirable, and then the prospect of a Gloriana rematch.

    On winch stops, yes, I was contemplating that just yesterday as I observed even the handle’s socket clips the booby hatch sides. And they’re both outside-to-in (as will be the identical mainsheet Murrays, located to the rear of the cockpit, straddling the coamings).

    F3C83279-3B74-429F-8DC4-1D8C5229D7E0.jpg

    Any helpful suggestions on the Laurent Giles backstay levers? I note Waione’s and Prize’s respective reductions (and Prize’s anti-abrasion/dent devices); are Rogue’s mounted upside down? I’ve been prevaricating on if the downturned handle makes more sense being grabbed to apply the backstay, and if the hook should be facing up, as presently mounted. But I hesitate to discover the error of my ways by disregarding others’ greater experience.

    35FAB482-6518-4C9E-963C-FC304B14D3C4.jpg
    The hook is normally up and the handle curved down , but it's not worth disassembling. I have an extra purchase on mine so there is /was no need to cast off on a run, just roll the lever over. Ie if each slot is 500mm Prizes setup generates 1m of slack for the running backstay, Waione's setup generates 1.5 m.
    That's how I ran all my Murray winches too. Not helpful when you get on a modern but it gets the sheets off the coaming etc.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Would a track/pad in-front of the lever help protect the deck from wear?
    looks like the boat on the right in the picture above has such.

    The boat is absolutely gorgeous, unbelievably beautiful. Can I ask, is that foredeck finish going to be really slippy when wet?

    Best wishes for the launch.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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  25. #25
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    I always set up stops or lanyards for my murrays to stop the nun chuck effect of handle into coaming or kidney, something to think about.
    I always think about what you say.

    6EB017FD-9867-4D83-A775-3518E9781BB5.jpg
    BC8AE72F-9ED9-4958-8010-6FD9CC9975E0.jpg
    58E1A6CA-BBE9-4B4C-8247-5A48A642B90F.jpg

  26. #26
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    Default

    Crikey mate, she looks amazing. I recall you telling me about Rogue back at Woodenboat School and I’ve wondered over the years how you’d got on. Well worth the wait. She’s definitely going to be turning heads on Tīkapa Moana.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  27. #27
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)


  28. #28
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Pure Beauty!
    Steamboat

    I get by with the judicious use of serendipity.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Yowsa!
    What a thing of beauty, unbelievable.
    Congratulations.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  30. #30
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    When Bruce Askew designed a new ballast to replace the cast-iron ugliness that had been fixed to Rogue’s keel since 1914 or thereabouts, he calculated it should weigh 1900 kgs and contribute a 29 percent improvement in her tenderness.

    The New Zealand Yachtsman‘s 1937 profile of prominent Wellington sailor, R G Millman, said he had found Rogue “lying on her side with the lead removed from her keel, such metal a short time before being in urgent demand for munition purposes” and Mr Millman had replaced her ballast to get her sailing again. Quite when that was is unclear: prior to WWI, Rogue (then renamed Muritai) was owned by G Bothamley, who returned her to her Wellington importer, R C Renner (one paper says for safekeeping; another says Renner chartered Muritai from Bothamley for the season), when Bothamley went to England in 1912. Was it then she lost her lead ballast? Newspapers reported Mrs Millman sailed Muritai in the January 1914 RPNYC Ladies’ Race. But Bothamley was back in Wellington as RPNYC Commodore by 1915.

    Unfortunately, when cast in 2021, the new lead ballast came in at 1450 kgs. At her initial splash last month, careful distribution of stout personnel on deck identified a further 750-800 kgs of ballast was required, of which at least 200 kgs should be further forward. The additional ballast now has been designed: some 300 kgs in forward extension, and two 250 kg bulbs affixed low to either side, of the current new ballast and substituting for the bottom end of the stem. Forms have been made accordingly, and sent off to the foundry for casting.

    Looking back at the historical record, contemporaneous reports of Rogue’s initial 1892 launch observed she “sailed remarkably well, notwithstanding that she was very lightly ballasted”, and “behaved very well and appeared to be pretty fast. If anything she is a little light”. Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose.

    So what was Rogue’s initial ballast? In 1912, the New Zealand Yachtsman reported she was received in Wellington (in 1900) “carrying 2½ tons of lead, 1¾ on her keel and 15 cwt inside”. The internal ballast, sitting among the floors on top of the keel, must have been carried very high. The New Zealand Yachtsman also reported, on arrival in Wellington, Rogue had two 5 cwt external lead bulbs added low on her keel. Presumably that was in substitution for the internal ballast.

    An imperial ton is 1016 kgs. A cwt is 51 kgs. So Rogue’s supplemented 1900s ballast would have been a little under 2280 kgs. And her 2022 ballast will come in about 2250 kgs. Talk about painstaking, if inadvertent, historical accuracy.

    More here:
    https://rogue1892.com/2022/02/06/slow-learners/
    Last edited by PatrickXavier; 03-17-2022 at 04:40 AM.

  31. #31
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    A slight hurdle in the scheme of things.
    That forward triangle by the stem was used as trim ballast. One year in the 80's Henry decided to remove the lead there on Queenie, the 1901 thereabouts Logan. That lifted her bow but she was slower and he didn't like it, so he took the graving piece back out and refitted the lead next season.
    Prize has numerous changes, including standing the horn timber up a few degrees, Waione had saddlebags added to her keel to go with her hot rod rig in 1930.
    Fine tuning.

  32. #32
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    John, after 15 years of “two steps forward, one back” — and learning professionally as well as personally, despite thousands of years of seafaring, quite a lot of marine architecture involves holding a wetted finger in the air — I’m relatively inured to disappointment. But your encouragement (and Tom’s contribution) nonetheless is welcome.

  33. #33
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    The lack of forward triangle on Janet was probably the reason they changed her to a Bermudan rig sometime in the 1920's..but you're not going there Mr Xavier...and that's a good thing.
    Rogue has come up nicely, well done.
    Focus on the effort not the outcome.

    "Don't take life seriously. Either way, you won't make it out alive."

  34. #34
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    After adding 50% more ballast, Rogue is back in the water for the first time in 15 years, floating perfectly to her lines, and relocated to her berth:

    D3E16B7E-DBAE-4F11-B64B-3383B4863FC7.jpg

    F53C3E5E-3215-48FA-AFB8-01133074D6C9.jpg

    B5881ADF-9F77-4EDB-9D46-B609E4C696FA.jpg

  35. #35
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    Default Re: The restoration of Rogue (1892)

    Terrific news, Tom sent me some photos last night. She looks wonderful.

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