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Thread: Wood rasp

  1. #1
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    Default Wood rasp

    Thinking about buying a half round coarse wood rasp. In the comments for one boat builder's youtube video, he recommends the Kutzall wood rasp. The Kutzall half round coarse wood rasp sells for $47.90 on Amazon which is rather expensive for one half round rasp for my budget. But I'm willing to spend that much if it's a really good wood rasp.

    In an Amazon comment for the Kutzall wood rasp, the poster recommends the Narex wood rasp instead. The $59.99 for 3 Narex wood rasps is more in line with my budget but is the coarse half round rasp better than the Kutzall?

    Any other recommendations for a good coarse half round wood rasp?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    I have a Nicholson 49 pattern makers rasp, they still make them, but I had sticker shock when I saw the price, about the same as the Kutzall. I don't use it all that often.

    A friend of mine is a farrier, she likes her rasps sharp, and she goes through a lot of them, almost exclusively on the fine side; I have a good source of a coarse rasp, they are flat, though, but lately, I have been a disciple of the erster/wizbang school of rapid stock removal.
    Steve Martinsen

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Hmmm,… I can’t really think of the last time I used a rasp in rebuilding my boats.

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    Default Wood rasp

    If you think $50 USD for a rasp is steep, take a look at Auriou and Liogier rasps. Hand-stitched, and they are handed. Stitched differently for lefties vs righties.

    Prices start at about 75 EUR and go north from there.

    https://forge-de-saint-juery.com/han...asps-for-wood/

    https://www.liogier-france.fr/rapes-...ravail-du-bois

    Rasps are precision tools.
    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by nedL View Post
    Hmmm,… I can’t really think of the last time I used a rasp in rebuilding my boats.
    I use a rasp for fine tuning sculling notches. That's about it

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by SMARTINSEN View Post
    I have a Nicholson 49 pattern makers rasp, they still make them, but I had sticker shock when I saw the price, about the same as the Kutzall. I don't use it all that often.
    A friend of mine is a farrier, she likes her rasps sharp, and she goes through a lot of them, almost exclusively on the fine side; I have a good source of a coarse rasp, they are flat, though, but lately, I have been a disciple of the erster/wizbang school of rapid stock removal.
    What is that you're a discipe of? Slang for something? Google searching unsuccessful.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    I use a rasp for fine tuning sculling notches. That's about it
    Yes, I was thinking about using a wood rasp to fine tune notches in frames for the chine logs and inwales.

    But I also need a good wood rasp for home repairs from time to time, including leveling Bondo used to repair rotted wood. I grind the rotted wood out down to good wood using a small hand router and rotary burr bit, then apply Bondo.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by DayTripper View Post
    What is that you're a discipe of? Slang for something? Google searching unsuccessful.

    He means using an angle grinder.


    I second the nomination for the Nicholson #49, they not only make a nice cut but they also last forever. Last one I bought was fifty bucks about fifteen years ago.
    Last edited by Jim Ledger; 06-21-2021 at 10:40 AM.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Wizbang owns no angle grinder.
    never has.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Hand stitched rasps like the Ariou have the advantage of taking off a lot of material per stroke and leaving a fairly fine finish more akin to a file. Not worth it for the average handyman. Buy a Nicholson and a Surform and you'll have everything you need.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    If this is your first time of needing a rasp, and you don't have a friend who might lend you one, then buy a cheap set from your local toolstore, use it and see if you can find any significant fault - in all probability it will do the job and if not you will have a clearer understanding of your needs.

    Should cost under fifteen dollars

    My pet rasp is a Japanese saw rasp, excellent tool but not available in half round.
    I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    You're comparing different critters.

    The 3-rasp set is a traditional cut steel sorta beast. The tungsten-carbide coated Kutzall is a higher order of tool, methinks. Never used one. Probably last forever, even for a pro who used it every day. But, as mentioned, rasps aren't usually a big part of people's arsenal. I am a pro, and I use rasps only occasionally.

    But we all develop work habits based upon the tools we are familiar with. So if you buy a great rasp, you'll find far more uses for it than I do.

    Bottom line - I see no great danger of regret if you go with the 3-tool set. I see real potential for joy and delight with the $$$ tool.
    David G
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    I bought the Narex rasp. Narrex has a good reputation for pretty decent stuff and good value for money. Mines the 200 blade length one (half round) and its about middle in their range if roughness. It looks and feels like a quality tool but i only use it on wood and it leaves a surprisingly fine finish. The half round one side flat other makes it versatile. Its neither too rough or too fine. Think it was about Ģ25-30. Narex also do a cranked arm chisel which works as a mini slick for flush cutting dowl heads or plugs after sawing off close. Quite rare that and it seems to work well. About Ģ25 or so. I havn’t used the rasp for any epoxy scraping as i wouldn’t want to clag it up.

    I also bought a Shinto rasp a decade ago and use that now and again. Its got a rough and a fine finish. Flat surfaces, the saw blades are angled and it seems remarkably efficient. Its quite wide and mine gets used for quick and dirty bevelling when i cant plane or saw it. It got used in anger to bevel the transom/ transom frame lands where planks land (clinker ply) as you can aim it up with the last mold and fet it pretty accurate. Don’t get the tear out you can with a plane and you can stand behind and eyeball the angle. That might also be better for epoxy/ filler. Its an open design and dust andvdebris should fall out quickly. I’m reluctant to rasp as i’d rather plane a surface or use a defined tool for the job, but sometimes for shaping it does seem to work well and be the best option. I shaped some ears on my transom frame recently with the Narex and it was just the job. Code number 872522. I wouldn’t want anything rougher or be bothered with anything finer (a bit of sandpaper will do that) so you might just need that one.

    https://www.narextools.cz/en/halfrou...72521#lightbox



    For anything epoxy/ filler though i’d be reaching for scrapers and the heat gun where possible but if it needs shape in the profile i’d assume rasping it is going to work if its microballoon filler.
    Last edited by Edward Pearson; 06-21-2021 at 09:32 AM.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    I have a pair of Nicholsons: 49 and 50, plus a century old Rex Black King coarse, all flat/round combos. I can say that they are well worth the investment. I find myself reaching for one of them a heck of a lot more often than I ever thought I would. Rough shaping, smoothing, fine tuning a tenon, shaping rolling bevels, etc. Recently I used the Nicholson 50 to flush trim plank ends at the transom. I wrapped a piece of Gorilla Tape around the tip to ride against the flat transom so only the planks were trimmed.

    Hand stitched rasps are amazing, but costly. Nicholsons are machine made but stitched randomly enough to cut smoothly.
    - Anything you can't have fun with is not worth taking seriously.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by DayTripper View Post
    ...

    But I also need a good wood rasp for home repairs from time to time, including leveling Bondo used to repair rotted wood. I grind the rotted wood out down to good wood using a small hand router and rotary burr bit, then apply Bondo.
    Favourite tool for the leveling job is a curved tooth mill file.
    I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Back almost 10 years ago Nicholson moved production of the #49 & #50 rasps and the “new” version was unpopular because it cut poorly. An older model a nice shaped useful rasp, or you can buy a hand stitched Liogier that approximates it. I wouldn’t use a good rasp on bondo. Auriou, Liogier & Gramery Tools offer a number of different shapes & stitching aggressiveness that can serve many purposes.

    there’s a world of difference between “cheap” raps and good rasps in my experience, the cheap ones can be utterly useless tools, the good ones very useful and flexible shaping tools.
    Last edited by Hugh Conway; 06-21-2021 at 02:59 PM.

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    .......buy a cheap set from your local toolstore, use it and see if you can find any significant fault - in all probability it will do the job and if not you will have a clearer understanding of your needs......
    .
    Any Tool ....Although I agree in principle I have also gone down the path of , buy a cheap one, if its ok maybe lay out for a better one, but conversely if it isn't ok, its probably because it is carp, or not what you wanted but, hey, how do you know? and if its not ok, you will think all those tools are rubbish, . I resisted for years a jig saw because the first one I ever bought was rubbish. Swore I'd never buy another, , then one day I borrowed a seriously good one and realised I was wrong..
    And if it is ok why buy a better one.
    Toolaholic's quandary.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Edward Pearson:
    Thanks for your feedback on the Narex rasp. If I end up buying one, I will get the half round 200mm blade length.
    ------------

    SMARTINSEN, Jim Ledger, willin woodworks, gazzer
    Hugh Conway said: Back almost 10 years ago Nicholson moved production of the #49 & #50 rasps and the “new” version was unpopular because it cut poorly.

    Jack Bench Woodworking at 2:30 in this youtube video agrees that old Nicholsons were good but he does not recommend later ones.
    ------------

    P.I. Stazzer said:
    "If this is your first time of needing a rasp, and you don't have a friend who might lend you one, then buy a cheap set from your local toolstore, use it and see if you can find any significant fault - in all probability it will do the job and if not you will have a clearer understanding of your needs."

    With regard to cheap rasps, Jack Bench Woodworking at 8:00 in this youtube video says that he bought the "Golden Rasps" on Amazon and that they are "fantastic and cut very quickly and smooth ..... The best bargin in woodworking" (his words).

    I checked the Golden Rasps that he links to in the comments of his youtube video and the thing that really caught my eye is that the teeth on those rasps extend all the way to the very edges. I want teeth all the way to the very edges of the rasp so when I rasp the notches in the frames for the chine logs and inwales, the rasp will cut all the way to the very inside corners. So I ordered a set of two Golden Rasps from Amazon for $15.98. .... EDIT: To be clear, I will be cutting the notches using a jig saw. Rasping will just be to fine tune the fit.

    Golden Rasps on Amazon.jpg

    .

    I saw pictures of Nicholson rasps that have a margin on the edges of the rasp with no teeth. Seems to me that they will not cut to the very inside corners of notches.
    -------------

    jonboy:
    I resisted for years a jig saw because the first one I ever bought was rubbish. Swore I'd never buy another, , then one day I borrowed a seriously good one and realised I was wrong..

    Exactly my experience. I got a cheap jig saw and used it for a few years. Struggled with it and eventually hated it. Then I bought a Bosch jig saw. It is much heavier and sturdy than the cheap jig saw and it works really well. I enjoy using it every time I need it.

    Thanks all, and thank you to everyone that I did not respond to directly. Your input was read and is appreciated.
    DayTripper
    Last edited by DayTripper; 06-22-2021 at 05:52 AM.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    I use wood rasps frequently but haven't bought a new one in years, and those I have were not expensive, just Nicholson or similar. I even have a couple of really course ones that belonged to my grandfather, though I never use them' too course. However, for my 1/8" shaft Dremel, and 1/4" shaft Craftsman die grinder I use Kutzall bitts instead of fluted metal tips. They last a long time unless I use one on thermoplastic and it becomes gummed up with melted plastic.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by DayTripper View Post

    I checked the Golden Rasps that he links to in the comments of his youtube video and the thing that really caught my eye is that the teeth on those rasps extend all the way to the very edges. I want teeth all the way to the very edges of the rasp so when I rasp the notches in the frames for the chine logs and inwales, the rasp will cut all the way to the very inside corners. So I ordered a set of two Golden Rasps from Amazon for $15.98. .... EDIT: To be clear, I will be cutting the notches using a jig saw. Rasping will just be to fine tune the fit.


    Rasps are good for a lot of things but cutting accurate flats ain't one of them. It will be difficult to not round over the flat and the surface will be poor..


    As good as the Bosch jigsaw is it wouldn't be my choice to cut the angled chine or stringer notches. You can remove the bulk of the waste, but the angles will need to be cut in after.


    The best way to go about this is to use a handsaw and cut to the line. Any adjustments that need to be made should be done with a chisel. This is the one true path, anything else will give you a poor result.


    Jim

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Microplane makes tools for woodworking. https://www.microplane.com/hacksawblade-halfround-rasp
    I find the 12" half round one that fits in a hacksaw frame very useful.

    It is the same company that makes kitchen stuff (zesters, cheese graters, etc)
    Most significant others do not find it funny if you borrow their kitchen stuff for woodworking..... be warned.....

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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    If you want a full round coarse rasp that removes a huge amount of material in hurry, try this, from Lee Valley. It's only problem is it splinters the far side of the hole.

    They have other shapes, and grades of cut, all very good. Hand-Cut Rasps - Lee Valley Tools


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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Ledger View Post
    Rasps are good for a lot of things but cutting accurate flats ain't one of them. It will be difficult to not round over the flat and the surface will be poor..
    As good as the Bosch jigsaw is it wouldn't be my choice to cut the angled chine or stringer notches. You can remove the bulk of the waste, but the angles will need to be cut in after.
    The best way to go about this is to use a handsaw and cut to the line. Any adjustments that need to be made should be done with a chisel. This is the one true path, anything else will give you a poor result.
    Jim
    Very good points. I can now see how different angles come into play when building a curved hull and how a handsaw would work well for that. I saw one guy on youtube who ended up using an oscillating tool to cut his notches after all the frames were installed, since he said it was hard to use a handsaw due to the close spacing of the frames.

    Guess I've been looking at my jon boat build with different rose colored glasses since my build will have straight vertical sides. Basically a rectangular box with an upward sloped bottom at the bow. I understand that sides angled outward result in a drier ride but in my case I'm opting for vertical sides for two reasons:

    1. There's no room on our property for a trailer so I'll have to car top the boat. Storing the boat will be on its side next to a hollow tile wall on our property. Vertical sides will work well for storage.

    2. When I made a jon boat about 30 years ago, it had vertical sides, also for storage reasons. We only went at trolling speeds, trying to catch fish going out and back in so there was little concern for a wet ride. Same for the jon boat I plan to build when 6hp outboards are back in stock (maybe mid 2022 ?). (I would start building now if I could buy a new outboard motor.)

    So my envisioning cutting the notches in the frames for my upcoming build is just cutting really simple notches. My Bosch jigsaw should work OK but I may end up using a handsaw after a cut or two .

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Simple solution to that problem. Get some good quality cloth backed 40 grit sandpaper, shape the edge of some 3/4in wood about a foot long to the curve that you want, and use contact glue to fix a strip of sandpaper along that edge. Make a range of shapes from flat to a very tight curve, they're a tool that you'll come to love.

    John Welsford
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Quote Originally Posted by john welsford View Post
    Simple solution to that problem. Get some good quality cloth backed 40 grit sandpaper, shape the edge of some 3/4in wood about a foot long to the curve that you want, and use contact glue to fix a strip of sandpaper along that edge. Make a range of shapes from flat to a very tight curve, they're a tool that you'll come to love.
    John Welsford
    Very good idea John. I can see how that could work well. Instead of using sheet sandpaper, 40 grit belt for a belt sander would be very sturdy. I just might make some with different grits. Will see how the Golden Rasps work out first. Thanks.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    Sanding belts usually have a coating on the back which doesn't glue well. Simple cloth backed sheets would be a better bet.

    Here's a useful trick, though. Get hold of a coarse sanding belt and cut a block of soft pine just big enough to slide the belt over. The block should be exactly the width of the belt, rounded slightly where the belt contacts, and the fit should be tight. Now you've got a handy thing to use as you see fit.

    Jim

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    My favorite rasp is a farriers rasp. Big and heavy. Course and fine side. Great for some quick shaping and the fine side leaves a decent finish that doesn't take much to sand smooth. It is my go too for bigger things and is great for shaping paddles too.

    Jeff
    Kudzu Craft Skin boats
    SoF boat kits, supplies and plans

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    My two cents. These are tools I use occasionally and all the time, depending.

    Nicholson #49 and a coarse second cut half round file matching length and cross sections.




    Rounded side up, you can see the opposing diagonal cuts of the file.




    Flat side up. Both the old file and the new rasp have the Nicholson trade mark and 'Made in Brazil.'




    The long one with the fancier handle is an old Nicholson, made in the USA, half-round fine file, with very thin and close lines of teeth. When I got it, it had been banged around over time and in addition to being packed with crud, a bunch of the teeth had been flattened in sections, as if someone had used it for a hammer, right down the middle of the round side. After I saw how well it responded to the acid bath electrolysis, I used a magifying lense and fine pick to gently pry the teeth back apart and more or less vertical and parallel as original. And that worked. It will take off the relatively coarse surface just filed or rasped, and leave it smoother than the finest sanding.




    From left to right, the rasps and files are arranged from coarse to fine and large to small. Pretty much all of these were yard sale acquisitions. The set of rifflers at the bottom left were a gift from a friend of my wife, who bought everything for a course in sculpture and then decided to try a different hobby. The rifflers are all double-ended, and they almost all have more curved and less curved toothed ends, and there are round, and flat, coarse rasp and file cut. Most have safe edges. These are extremely useful in certain situations where any other cutting tool can't really get in and do it, like tight inside curves.

    The bottom row of small files are triangular, for saw sharpening, and some round files, short and long.

    After collecting most of the these at the occasional yardsale over a few years, a lot of them were old and cruddy and dull, but I experimented with the electrolysis method of rust removal, and by damn it worked like a champ, and these old abused, bottom of someone's toolbox files are sharp and useful again.



    Not seen in the pic, I have a card file, wire brush, hanging up ajacent, and it cleans files and rasps as necessary. Also not seen is the special one-sided, safe-edge fine toothed file and burnisher for sharpening and turning the hook edge on cabinet scrapers.
    Speak softly and carry a mouthful of marbles.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    So, ya got the Brazillion #49, eh?


    Is it as bad as they say?

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    File under "comedy?"

    I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

  31. #31
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    So, ya got the Brazillion #49, eh?


    Is it as bad as they say?
    How much is a Brazillion?

    I can't remember if it was something that mattered or I knew when I bought it. I'm surprised to read that there is negative feedback over shift in geography of the manufacturer. And I don't have other experience to make a comparison, but I like the way it works. I don't think it's a flaw or bad design but I was surprised at how thin and flexible the long rasp is. I fully buy into the notion that the oranic variation of handcut teeth makes a useful difference in the qualifty of the worked surface.
    Speak softly and carry a mouthful of marbles.

  32. #32
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    Default Re: Wood rasp

    The negative feedback isn’t the shift in geography, it’s what they changed that made a different product. Like when Nicholson shifted some file production and some batches demonstrably wore faster and cut poorer. Maybe it doesn’t matter.
    Last edited by Hugh Conway; 06-23-2021 at 11:53 AM.

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