When and If

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  • gray duck
    Senior Member
    • Jul 2007
    • 585

    When and If

    I went to the Keys Easter week with a substantial cohort of many others. We stayed in the middle Keys but took a drive to Key West. Kind of crowded but had a great lunch on the water at a restaurant on the West side. A beautiful classic schooner was coming across and beating up the channel.
    20210404_153627.jpg
    I told my family that boat had to be a classic and have some history. They know I'm a boat-nut and so poked fun at me but my wife said "He could be right... It has happened before"
    20210404_153758.jpg
    It was quite breezy and the schooner tacked easily and glided through the beautiful waters.
    20210404_153813.jpg
    So when we got back to the hotel I searched up sailing charters in Key West and found the boat - The "When and If". Of course the next stop was Google to Wikipedia etc.
    Designed by John Alden and built in 1939 in Maine for (then) Colonel Patton. Double planked with mahogany. Looks great and has obviously been well cared for I think. The boat's name comes from his statement that he would sail her when and if he got back from Europe. I had no idea that he was such a sailor. The sad part of the story is that he didn't get back from Europe to sail the boat because of a fender bender in an Army jeep after the end of the war but while there acting as military governor.
  • WI-Tom
    Seaside Expat
    • Jan 2009
    • 15902

    #2
    Re: When and If

    Is that the same "When And If" that was extensively rebuilt by Gannon & Benjamin on Martha's Vineyard? I suspect it is.

    Tom
    Ponoszenie konsekwencji!

    www.tompamperin.com

    Comment

    • Pelirrojo
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2017
      • 332

      #3
      Re: When and If

      Yes, it is. She's a beauty and they sail her hard.

      Comment

      • tri-guy
        Member
        • Dec 2014
        • 42

        #4
        Re: When and If

        She's moored near me in Salem Harbor during the summer. Both her and the schooner "Fame" are out there every day in season. They're both beauties.
        Walter G
        Chadwick Pond Boats
        www.chadwickpondboats.com

        Comment

        • Garret
          Hills of Vermont
          • Apr 2005
          • 48655

          #5
          Re: When and If

          She was at the last Wooden Boat Show in Newport. I believe that was pre-BG work. Pretty boat!
          "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

          Comment

          • WI-Tom
            Seaside Expat
            • Jan 2009
            • 15902

            #6
            Re: When and If

            Originally posted by Garret
            She was at the last Wooden Boat Show in Newport. I believe that was pre-BG work. Pretty boat!
            I think "When And If" was actually one of Gannon & Benjamin's first rebuilds, back in the 80s? But they may have done more since.

            Tom
            Ponoszenie konsekwencji!

            www.tompamperin.com

            Comment

            • Garret
              Hills of Vermont
              • Apr 2005
              • 48655

              #7
              Re: When and If

              Originally posted by WI-Tom
              I think "When And If" was actually one of Gannon & Benjamin's first rebuilds, back in the 80s? But they may have done more since.

              Tom
              Could've been. IIRC, the last show in Newport was maybe 2008 or so? I could be way off on that. I know she needed a decent amount of work then.
              "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

              Comment

              • Rich Jones
                What boat to build next?
                • Apr 2009
                • 19656

                #8
                Re: When and If

                Originally posted by WI-Tom
                I think "When And If" was actually one of Gannon & Benjamin's first rebuilds, back in the 80s? But they may have done more since.

                Tom
                The boat had been owned by a non-profit, but broke loose from it's mooring in a storm and when ashore resulting in lots of damage. Declared a total loss by the insurance company, G&B rebuilt the vessel and ended up owning it for a while.
                I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.
                Skiing is the next best thing to having wings.

                Comment

                • wizbang 13
                  Senior Member
                  • Oct 2009
                  • 24811

                  #9
                  Re: When and If

                  Seth Salzmann is the Captain of Columbia.
                  And owner of When and If.
                  My wife just wrote an article about him for Classic Boat.
                  Last edited by wizbang 13; 04-20-2021, 07:55 AM.

                  Comment

                  • Garret
                    Hills of Vermont
                    • Apr 2005
                    • 48655

                    #10
                    Re: When and If

                    Originally posted by wizbang 13
                    Seth Salzmann is the Captain of Columbia.
                    And owner of When and If.
                    My wife just wrote an article about him for Classic Boat.
                    Completely OT, but do you guys know Dana Jinkins?
                    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

                    Comment

                    • wizbang 13
                      Senior Member
                      • Oct 2009
                      • 24811

                      #11
                      Re: When and If

                      Dana slept on my Seabird her first night in the Caribbean . 1975 ? Before coffee table books .
                      (In the cockpit with her friend Karla,not with me ,sadly)
                      She moved on quickly, Jens Jul, Kenny and Johnny Summers.
                      I was too poor for most girls taste then.
                      I met Ira Epstein about the same time, decades before Lone Fox.
                      Peter Spronk..Phil Weld
                      Frank Mundus...monsterman
                      Dan Bowen

                      Thinking on the people from those times... they ain't comin back.
                      Last edited by wizbang 13; 04-20-2021, 08:55 AM.

                      Comment

                      • Garret
                        Hills of Vermont
                        • Apr 2005
                        • 48655

                        #12
                        Re: When and If

                        Dana & B'fer are good friends. They are now the proud owners of a 50's CC hardtop that I "rescued" & they then rebuilt.

                        They don't have gobs of money by any stretch & live in a pretty cool place in VT.
                        "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

                        Comment

                        • Hunky Dory
                          Senior Member
                          • Aug 2010
                          • 1729

                          #13
                          Re: When and If

                          There is a webcam for Key West harbor. If you look around sunset you can see her doing her sunset sail most evenings in winter months

                          Comment

                          • boatman1975
                            Member
                            • Sep 2020
                            • 30

                            #14
                            Re: When and If

                            Wow Such a nice boat

                            Comment

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