What Has Been Settled In The Bilge?

[oznabrag]

One of my favorite posters of non-political content here has asked just what political questions have been settled in the Bilge?

pipefitter

So many of you have over 20 years at this politics thing on this forum and what have you settled? Nada, zip, zilch, goose-egg. Oh wait, except for; liberal good, conservative bad. How could anyone dare to compete with that?

To which I responded:

oznabrag
Historical Illiterate



Re: WBF History Thread?

Originally Posted by pipefitter
. . . what have you settled? Nada, zip, zilch, goose-egg. Oh wait, except for; liberal good, conservative bad. How could anyone dare to compete with that?




Uhhhh . . . No.

We have settled that the Republican Party has devolved into a seditious vehicle for an authoritarian coup.

You can deny it if you'd like, but it's true.

Nixon was a treasonous, greed-driven POS, and everybody knows.

Reagan was a treasonous POS, dedicated to the destruction of the power of your duly-Constituted Government, yet you believe he was a patriot.

Bush I was a treasonous, murderous war criminal who ignored the power of Congress, committing various acts of criminality along the way.

Bush II followed in his daddy's footsteps, prosecuted 2 unwinnable wars on borrowed money, and lowered taxes to destroy the ability of your duly-Constituted government to function as intended.

Trump has openly and blatantly violated his oath of office, is demonstrably a tool of a hostile power, and is attempting to foment civil war and the utter destruction of liberal democracy in order that he may avoid dying in prison.

Republicans LOVE these traitors and LOATHE the Constitution.

You asked what has been settled.

The Republican Party is a criminal cabal, bent upon the destruction of this constitutional republic.

That's settled.

'Conservative' doesn't even enter into it.

The number of Conservatives in high office can be counted on one hand.

Rattling the teacups.

Of course, Reasonable Men suggested that such an argument was out of place on a nostalgia thread, so I started this one.

Can anyone deny the accuracy of my assessment of the Republican Party?

[TomF]

One of the talking heads on CNN summed up the label which will hang on the Republican party for a generation or more, especially if what's expected to occur this week occurs. "Willing to be corrupt, if necessary."

I think these people would rather win elections without cheating, but clearly aren't too troubled either way. It's all about winning.

[Keith Wilson]

Right. Why in the world would anyone expect that we would 'settle' a political question by discussions in the Bilge?

[TomF]

... Not getting arrested is the same as being innocent.

Yeah.

BTW, the Georgia staffers observe that the reason they decided to tape this call with Trump is that they hadn't taped the (at least initial) call with Lindsey Graham a couple of weeks back. The one in which Graham had essentially made the same pitch, and when reporting emerged claimed that any suggestion that he'd been pushing to find ways of overturning the vote was a lie and a smear from those dastardly deep state Georgia republicans.

The Georgia higher ups did not want to have any discussions in which the narrative could be flipped by the Trumpists against them. And of course, Raffensberger gave instructions that the tape would only be released should Trump attack him with lies about the call. Which took about 24 hours.

But just think a bit. Have you ever been in the situation where you felt that you had no option in a discussion with a person in a serious position of public trust except to surreptitiously tape conversations with them, for your own protection? That's normative now, with the Trumpist cadre. From Omarosa to Michael Cohen to Stephanie Winston Wolkoff to Bob Woodward to Mary Trump to ... all of them kept tapes, for their own protection.

Really? Really? This is who Republicans are working so bloody hard to appease, to keep in office?

[oznabrag]

Yeah.

BTW, the Georgia staffers observe that the reason they decided to tape this call with Trump is that they hadn't taped the (at least initial) call with Lindsey Graham a couple of weeks back. The one in which Graham had essentially made the same pitch, and when reporting emerged claimed that any suggestion that he'd been pushing to find ways of overturning the vote was a lie and a smear from those dastardly deep state Georgia republicans.

The Georgia higher ups did not want to have any discussions in which the narrative could be flipped by the Trumpists against them. And of course, Raffensberger gave instructions that the tape would only be released should Trump attack him with lies about the call. Which took about 24 hours.

But just think a bit. Have you ever been in the situation where you felt that you had no option in a discussion with a person in a serious position of public trust except to surreptitiously tape conversations with them, for your own protection? That's normative now, with the Trumpist cadre. From Omarosa to Michael Cohen to Stephanie Winston Wolkoff to Bob Woodward to Mary Trump to ... all of them kept tapes, for their own protection.

Really? Really? This is who Republicans are working so bloody hard to appease, to keep in office?

Yes, he is.

If they can't pull off this coup, they will be politically irrelevant for decades, maybe even eternity.

They are MOTIVATED.

[Ian McColgin]

What was settled by the increasingly divisive arguments between Pelagius and Augustine?

Value arguments or discussions are always process, not eternal conclusion. The important thing about even the most acrimonious Bilge brawls is that each is an opportunity to share the pleasures and displeasures of what we find worthy or disgusting or good or bad. This time of Trump has rather narrowed the topics - Remember those endless abortion threads? - this is still a place where we share ourselves and reveal our values, albeit at time through the haze of Internet Tourette's.

[Osborne Russell]

What a F ing stupid question. Stop drifting.

What has been settled since Australopithecus?

[TomF]

What a F ing stupid question. Stop drifting.

What has been settled since Australopithecus?

preference for bipedal vs. quadrupedal

[oznabrag]

preference for bipedal vs. quadrupedal

Bipedal wins, hands down.

[Keith Wilson]

What has been settled since Australopithecus?

Oh, I dunno . . . Absolute monarchy is decidedly out of fashion, when it once was the standard form of government. Slavery is mostly extinct and universally condemned, when once it was as common as beer. The idea that men and women should have equal rights is becoming the norm, when once it was unthinkably radical. We do make progress, if slowly.

But none of these were settled in the Bilge.

[TomF]

bipedal wins, hands down.

[Flobart]

Value arguments or discussions are always process, not eternal conclusion. The important thing about even the most acrimonious Bilge brawls is that each is an opportunity to share the pleasures and displeasures of what we find worthy or disgusting or good or bad. This time of Trump has rather narrowed the topics - Remember those endless abortion threads? - this is still a place where we share ourselves and reveal our values, albeit at time through the haze of Internet Tourette's.

This post deserves a sticky.

[Osborne Russell]

We may consider it settled: it's a stupid F ing question. Ignorant.

[Hugh Conway]

The trouble for Republicans, former Republican and “conservatives “ for the statement of fact in the OP is that arc includes them and they have a role in it and this makes them uncomfortable.

[oznabrag]

This post deserves a sticky.

It belongs in the postmodernism thread.

[David G]

One of my favorite posters of non-political content here has asked just what political questions have been settled in the Bilge?



To which I responded:



Of course, Reasonable Men suggested that such an argument was out of place on a nostalgia thread, so I started this one.

Can anyone deny the accuracy of my assessment of the Republican Party?

I could... but then I'd be betraying my own core commitment to truth and accuracy. You may get some of the details wrong, or some of the analysis a half-bubble off or overbaked... but the essential truth is there. The R's have become full-throated allies of the oligarchs efforts to take over our country and end our little experiment in self-governance in abject failure and shame.

[Breakaway]

Settled: A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still.

OK. That's more confirmed, than settled, but the point is taken, eh?

Kevin

[CWSmith]

The Bilge is the online version of meeting up at the local diner for breakfast. People talk, exchange ideas, hopefully they listen, their thinking evolves (or not as seems increasingly to be the case). What is settled?

This is why I find The Bilge History thread to be so silly. What is the value of a written history of breakfast at the diner? The value is in the moment.

[Keith Wilson]

What is the value of a written history of breakfast at the diner?

Not much - but the 'history' thread is about remembering folks who no longer come to the diner for various reasons, and particularly memorable discussions over the eggs and hashbrowns. None of it matters all that much, in the larger perspective. For that matter, taking the long view, little of what we do matters very much, except to us and our friends and family.

[htom]

Long ago, my best friend said "Tom, you're so conservative you'd be leading the tea-tossing in Boston Harbour."
Liberal and Conservative have changed sides several times in the last couple of centuries.
I now consider myself a "Rational Anarchist."* Make what laws you like; if obeying them is the right thing to do, I'll obey. It's much easier to figure out right from wrong than legal from illegal.

* “A rational anarchist believes that concepts such as 'state' and 'society' and 'government' have no existence save as physically exemplified in the acts of self-responsible individuals. ... Individuals. Each responsible for his own acts.” R. A. Heinlein, "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress"

[TomF]

Long ago, my best friend said "Tom, you're so conservative you'd be leading the tea-tossing in Boston Harbour."
Liberal and Conservative have changed sides several times in the last couple of centuries.
I now consider myself a "Rational Anarchist."* Make what laws you like; if obeying them is the right thing to do, I'll obey. It's much easier to figure out right from wrong than legal from illegal.

* “A rational anarchist believes that concepts such as 'state' and 'society' and 'government' have no existence save as physically exemplified in the acts of self-responsible individuals. ... Individuals. Each responsible for his own acts.” R. A. Heinlein, "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress"

So, you're voiding the Social Contract? Hmm.

[oznabrag]

Not much - but the 'history' thread is about remembering folks who no longer come to the diner for various reasons, and particularly memorable discussions over the eggs and hashbrowns. None of it matters all that much, in the larger perspective. For that matter, taking the long view, little of what we do matters very much, except to us and our friends and family.

'John Riley stands and he drinks alone at a bar in Vera Cruz,

And he wonders if it matters much if you win or if you lose.'

[Keith Wilson]

Los San Patricios, poor bastards.

[oznabrag]

Los San Patricios, poor bastards.

'Victims of some wanderlust and divided loyalty'

[Hallam]

Then there was the butter thread. No one particular butter conclusively came out on top but we got introduced to a lot of very good options.
As usual New Zealand featured in the top tier of options with their Red Feather Brand, it's virtues first estoled by Bruce in his fantastic voyage thread us Ozzies followed with bated breath........

[C. Ross]

I dunno. I’ve learned a fair number of things in the Bilge. There are matters on which I’ve changed my views because of discussions here. YMMV.

[SKIP KILPATRICK]

Before his passing, Jack Grebe established that it was near impossible to find a box of .22 Short cartridges.

Still up up for debate is if the shortage is Obama’s fault.

[Paul Pless]

Still up up for debate is if the shortage is Obama’s fault.

hillary's

[Curtism]

It's pretty well settled that pless is a shameless troll.

[Paul Pless]

yup

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

I believe Oznabrag and I have a dispute in the Bilge about Nathan Bedford Forrest and I believe it has not been resolved. However I cannot now recall what we are disagreeing about.

[Old Dryfoot]

The only settled issue in the bilge, that I'm aware of, is that a large caliber guide gun is the preferred tool when venturing into far northern climes.

[John Smith]

bilge water?

How would we keep score? Why would we keep score?

[David G]

It's pretty well settled that pless is a shameless troll.

There seems to be some debate about whether 'shameless' is a strong enough description... but yeah <G>

[Hallam]

.....some people turn on the blige pump.



I'm sure that has settled a few issues!