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Thread: Trump: cheap grace

  1. #1
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    Default Trump: cheap grace

    Dietrich Bonhoeffer, the great German pastor, theologian, martyr, spy was asked in 1943 how it was possible for the Church to sit back and let Hitler seize absolute power. His firm answer: "It was the teaching of cheap grace."


    "Cheap grace is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ." - Dietrich Bonhoeffer


    We live in a time and culture that not only teaches cheap grace but praises it.
    David G
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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Dietrich Bonhoeffer, the great German pastor, theologian, martyr, spy was asked in 1943 how it was possible for the Church to sit back and let Hitler seize absolute power. His firm answer: "It was the teaching of cheap grace."


    "Cheap grace is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, communion without confession, absolution without personal confession. Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross, grace without Jesus Christ." - Dietrich Bonhoeffer


    We live in a time and culture that not only teaches cheap grace but praises it.
    Damn that Martin Luther for providing an alternative to Catholicism with its confessional.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    How Germanic!

    Seems to me that the practice of patriarchal, authoritarian religion had more to do with conditioning that sort of blind adherence than any lack of religious rigor.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Hung by Hitler in the final days of WWII.
    Trump would do the same if given the chance.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    From what I've read, the silence from the Vatican was more a matter of survival than grace. It was a political decision.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    From what I've read, the silence from the Vatican was more a matter of survival than grace. It was a political decision.


    .......not exactly how Jesus responded to the politics of the situation he found himself in with the Rabbinical set, Herod and the Roman governor of the province of Judea.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

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  7. #7
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Or so the story goes.

    What do we really know.
    A society predicated on the assumption that everyone in it should want to get rich is not well situated to become either ethical or imaginative.

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  8. #8
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Quote Originally Posted by elf View Post
    Or so the story goes.

    What do we really know.
    There was an interesting documentary on a few nights ago that was based on Vatican documents recently made available.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    From what I've read, the silence from the Vatican was more a matter of survival than grace. It was a political decision.
    Of course it was, they weren't about to loose all that wealth and lifestyle for the doubtful pleasures of an afterlife. I reckon that the Curia, by it's behaviour now and in the past, know full well that they are peddling nonsense, and doing nicely out of it in the meantime thank you.

    But I am also sure that some members of the clergy below the grade of bishop are loyal to their principles and their congregations, and some may actually believe in a god.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Cheap Grace stands on the corner, most nights, with a leg out.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    That's an insult to an honest, hard working woman.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Trump: cheap grace

    Who said anything about a woman?

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