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Thread: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

  1. #36
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
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    Seattle, WA
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    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    I'm enjoying reverse engineering the design, figuring out why he did the things he did, and why this boat failed in the ways it failed. This one's a really fun project to say the least. Glad to hear you're following along. At the very least, I hope this page will be a good reference to any future owners of this boat, or any similar repairs or new builds. There's not a ton of info available on this particular model, so I'm trying to fill the void a bit.

    20201114_144520.jpg

  2. #37
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
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    Seattle, WA
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    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance


  3. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
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    Seattle, WA
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    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Well, it's been a long month of repeatedly thinking I'm done removing wood and can get on with replacing wood, only to change my mind. I'm well aware I'm on a very slippery slope, but I think I have finally found a foothold so to speak. Time will tell...

    From the beginning, you see a boat with a missing forefoot. The stem to keel joint and accompanying deadwood/knee are entirely missing. The previous owner has cut the garboards back a bit. I took them a bit further until I felt that the rabbet was reasonably solid.

    Working my way up the stem, I never quite seem to find solid wood, at least in a way or place that I can imagine scarfing in new wood. The decision to remove the stem was an easy one.

    20201128_180127.jpg

    Before I took anything apart, I used the inside faces of the keel and the stem to make a reference system. Using a straight edge, I found the point where they would intersect. I lifted the angle off those lines, and for the stem, I screwed a board to the back face, and marked where the keel would intersect it.

    I picked up a slab of white oak and cut the new keel and stem shapes. I have roughed in the rabbet to match the old stem where possible. I copied the rabbet and bearding lines by measuring distance from the keel intersection line up the stem, and from the back face of the stem forward.

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    I cut the deadwood out of a black locust log I had laying around. There just wasn't quite enough white oak, and I didn't want to laminate it. I made 3/8" silicon bronze bolts to length, and bedded it in pine tar and roofing tar.

    20201125_151918.jpg

    Now that they're together, I can connect the lines from the keel and the stem with a batten.

    20201127_153701.jpg

  4. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Seattle, WA
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    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Back in post 32, you'll have noticed that I pulled the mooring cleat out. That showed me that the king plank was pretty rotten, so I pulled it. Underneath, I see that the deck beams are not really holding fasteners anymore. Similarly, the white oak blocking and breast hook aren't doing much either. All of this is staring to explain the gap between the covering boards and the deck planking.

    20201112_201257 (1).jpg

    There have been a few things that have surprised me on this boat:

    1. As mentioned before, there are no floors forward. The garboard basically hold the frame ends to the keel.
    2. The breast hook was only attached to the shear plank and the king plank above it. No connection at all to the stem or shear clamps.
    3. The fwd coaming was nailed into the covering board and shear plank edge with big nails. I didn't see that coming...

    Here are some pics test fitting the keel/stem. I'll update more later.
    20201208_195924.jpg
    20201208_195913.jpg

  5. #40
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Posts
    501

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Beautiful work! thanks for sharing

  6. #41
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Walney, near Cumbria UK
    Posts
    60,037

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Quote Originally Posted by lukes View Post
    3. The fwd coaming was nailed into the covering board and shear plank edge with big nails. I didn't see that coming...
    Not really an issue. There is a boat building adage: Nail where you can, screw where you must, and bolt where you have to.

    After all the toe rails did stay put
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  7. #42
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Agreed. Not an issue at all. It might have been the most solid connection on the boat! It was just a surprise to me after digging out so many little bronze screws to encounter some big ole iron spikes.

    I like the old adage, but I'm learning on this boat the difference in 50 year old bronze and iron.... I'm going to make an effort not to nail, with the possible exception of that toe rail.

  8. #43
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
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    Seattle, WA
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    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    So at this point I know I need to replace everything down the center of the deck. Breast hook is a gnarly looking piece of oak that has let go of its screws. The blocking between beams is in similar shape, not helped by the iron nails that were used to hold it in. The deck beams aren't exactly rotten, but are no longer holding the screws, and one of them got a big extra hole for a bolt at some point in it's life. I put in a new breasthook, but added a pocket hole to attach to the stem this time. I will also probably tie it to the shear clamps. I'm replacing the center line blocking, and will sister or replace deck beams as I work back. As I get into this work, it becomes clear that the covering boards need to come out, both for access, and to let the boat get back to it's original shape. Almost every screw in the covering board spins, and the ones into beams are all pulled over at an angle due to the movement of the board relative to the beam.

    20201216_172940.jpg

    20201216_171827.jpg

    It looks to me as though the frame ends above the shear clamp have straightened out a bit. There is a gap between the shear plank and the end of the beams, similar to the gap that was between the covering boards and the decking.

    Overall it looks good in here. I don't like the nails holding the beams to the clamp, but I don't think I'll go to the extreme of removing them just because they're rusty iron in white oak... maybe.

    And here is where I think I'll draw the line. I'm able to sneak this board out without removing the coaming. Any more, and I have to pull the coaming, and I can see the beginning of some rot in there. I'm going to poison that wood, and maybe put some CPES on it, and save that project for later.

    20201216_172759.jpg

    And that's my foothold on the slippery slope. The coaming.

    Next up, get the keel/stem glued in. Get the rabbet right, and start getting planks fastened. I'll feel much better when the shape is locked in again, and I'm adding wood instead of taking it away.

  9. #44
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Wongawallan Oz
    Posts
    16,720

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Nice project Luke, good on you for taking it on. I’ve enjoyed catching up on what you’ve done and am looking forward to following progress.

    What do you plan to use to poison the wood for the rot? I’ve seen Boric acid promoted as a wood rot killer and our local hardware store has a few products that supposedly kill wood rot and/or harden rotten pulpy wood restoring it to “near original strength”, all intended for home DIY projects if course, but I’ve never used or heard how successful any of these are.

    No doubt you’ll get quite a few cries of anguish on here that you’re not cutting it out now because the direction on boats has always been to cut it out all rot and replace it. However I for one would be interested to hear if there’s a suitable alternative, even if just a short term one that’d allow you to concentrate more fully on the hull and structure now and then come back to that area later on so that you can get her out on the water sooner.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  10. #45
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    Hi Larks,

    Glad you're enjoying the ride.

    I cooked up a recipe I found on the forum of antifreeze, borate, and borax over on my Henrietta thread a while back. I plan to use a bit of that, plus some CPES on any spots of rot that I won't be removing right away. I think that one corner of the coaming is the only place I wont' get to this time, but we'll see.

    Regarding removing vs. delaying: If I keep pulling bits of this boat off without putting any back on, I'm at real risk of end up with a pile of firewood. Maybe not really, but I need to draw the line somewhere I think. The nice thing about the current plan is I can finish up the bow, and then come back to the coaming later and it won't be any harder to get to than it is now. The only thing that's got me second guessing myself is if I do end up replacing the covering boards along with the king plank, the deck planks in between will still be original and wont' match. I believe these are pine, and I will probably replace with AYC.

    Another bit that's surprised me about this boat: The caulking is just one thin thread stuck into a compressed line or trough that he rolled into the edge of the plank. This would have been put in place before the adjacet plank was clamped to it, and so on until the shutter plank. There's no caulking bevel to speak of, at least not the parts I think are original.

    I can't tell if the deck was made this way as well, but it appears to be edge nailed, and perfectly square (again, no bevel), so I'm guessing he did the same up top and it's just moved and been gooped over enough times that the tiny cotton thread is no longer there.

    20201217_174447.jpg

    20201026_163316 (1).jpg

  11. #46
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    161

    Default Re: Concordia Sloop Boat #5: Reliance

    One thing that's been bothering me this whole time is a little split at bottom of the stem. I had been considering packing it full of epoxy, or tar, or maybe nothing because it's all outside the rabbet... Or so I thought. As I started to rough in the rabbet, it became clear that the split ran deeper and farther than I thought, and while it probably wouldn't be an issue, now is definitely the time to address it. I just routed out a deep slot until there was no more visible crack, and glued in a filler with G-flex. I'm not sure it was ever going to leak, but it's one less thing to worry about.

    Now to finish cutting the rabbet, and getting this thing in the boat!
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