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Thread: Beavers are coming back.

  1. #1
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    Default Beavers are coming back.

    A pair of beavers have been relocated to a country park 66 miles from my home.

    Cumbria Beaver Group has announced that two adult beavers, a male and female, have been released into a 27-acre enclosure at Lowther Estate near Penrith, for a five-year scientific trial. The aim is to obtain data on the impact of beavers in an upland environment, in particular on a stream in a farmed landscape.
    The female, named Dragonfly, was trapped and relocated from the River Tay catchment in Scotland, under licence from NatureScot, the public body responsible for Scotland's natural heritage. She was then was held at Five Sisters Zoo in West Lothian, for health screening. The male, named Glen, was rescued from the outflow of a hydroelectric plant in Perthshire by the Scottish Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (SSPCA). It’s thought that Glen became trapped while moving between areas, trying to establish his own territory. The SSPCA carried out health screening on Glen, before releasing him a week later at Lowther.
    https://www.cumbriawildlifetrust.org...JgOVjMAtpHGrO8
    They can also be seen outside of Scotland
    Knapdale, the Tay and the Otter are the only places in the UK with wild, free-ranging beavers. The species has also been introduced to Kent, Essex and the Forest of Dean, but these populations are kept in large, fenced enclosures. The impact of these enclosed beavers is being monitored, with hopes they will reduce flood risk and boost biodiversity.
    Beavers were originally hunted to extinction in the UK around 500 years ago. In 2009, the Scottish Government approved a trial reintroduction at Knapdale, Argyll. However, these were not the first beavers to return. A few years earlier, beavers were discovered on the River Tay, having either escaped from captivity or been illegally released. In 2010, a similar situation occurred on the River Otter in Devon, with a population of unknown origin discovered.
    https://www.woodlandtrust.org.uk/tre...ammals/beaver/
    From the Grauiad https://www.theguardian.com/environm...ation-flooding
    While licenses only permit beavers to be placed in large “trial” enclosures, escapees from privately owned collections have created a burgeoning population of truly wild beavers on the River Otter in east Devon.
    The Guardian has learned that there are other secretive populations of free-living beavers on rivers in Kent, north Somerset, Gloucestershire, west Devon and Wales.
    Beaver ecologist Derek Gow, who has overseen many of the licensed reintroductions, said escapes occurred because beavers’ strong teeth were like bolt-cutters.
    Hailing beavers as “ecosystem engineers”, Gow said: “They turn landscapes that are largely dead into environments that wildlife can recolonise.”
    The five-year government study of both fenced and wild beavers will show how their dams can prevent flooding by drastically slowing the flow of streams, purify water polluted by nitrates and phosphates, store carbon and create an explosion in other wildlife.
    In these days of increased flooding this can only be a good thing.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    I'm idly looking to relocate a Beaver too... but we might not be talking about quite the same thing.

    In Canada, old-school cast iron woodworking power tools were made by Beaver - which eventually was subsumed into Rockwell-Delta. I've been musing about getting a spindle-turning lathe...
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Next, wolves!

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    We have them - almost as numerous as groundhogs. One friend has them dropping trees in her back yard, placing her house in danger.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by George. View Post
    Next, wolves!
    No, the authorities will not allow that, as it would be an act of cruelty to the animals that they prey on.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  6. #6
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    No, the authorities will not allow that, as it would be an act of cruelty to the animals that they prey on.
    OMG! Then you must immediately shoot or poison all otters, foxes, and badgers, not to mention hawks and eagles!

  7. #7
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    Default

    While slowing streams may prevent flooding it some places it will increase it in others. My parents home was in a flood risk area that was greatly exacerbated by beavers moving in. Took quite a bit to get them removed.

    They were doing devastating damage to my property in NH last year and I had four of them trapped. 60, 40, and two 20lb. No issues so far this year.

    Depends which side of their dam you are on as to whether they decrease flooding.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Tom Wilkinson; 10-26-2020 at 09:13 AM.
    Tom

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Uhm. Have they met Tories?
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by TomF View Post
    Uhm. Have they met Tories?
    Ha! I noticed it when it posted but naturally forum software isn’t letting me edit.
    Tom

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by George. View Post
    OMG! Then you must immediately shoot or poison all otters, foxes, and badgers, not to mention hawks and eagles!
    U R Silly.

    Humanity did not turn them lose, now did we?
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  11. #11
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wilkinson View Post
    While slowing streams may prevent flooding it some places it will increase it in others. My parents home was in a flood risk area that was greatly exacerbated by beavers moving in. Took quite a bit to get them removed.

    They were doing devastating damage to my property in NH last year and I had four of them trapped. 60, 40, and two 20lb. No issues so far this year.

    Depends which side of their dam you are on as to whether they decrease flooding.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    May well be the case where you are, but we are talking about head waters in woodland, not deforested flood plains where people live here in England.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  12. #12
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wilkinson View Post
    While slowing streams may prevent flooding it some places it will increase it in others. My parents home was in a flood risk area that was greatly exacerbated by beavers moving in. Took quite a bit to get them removed.

    They were doing devastating damage to my property in NH last year and I had four of them trapped. 60, 40, and two 20lb. No issues so far this year.

    Depends which side of their dam you are on as to whether they decrease flooding.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    A beaver baffle can prevent flooding by limiting the pond's water level, no matter how high the beavers build the dam.

    https://fishinabarrelpond.com/2009/0...fling-beavers/

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  13. #13
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by UCanoe_2 View Post
    A beaver baffle can prevent flooding by limiting the pond's water level, no matter how high the beavers build the dam.

    https://fishinabarrelpond.com/2009/0...fling-beavers/

    In my parents location I believe that solution was attempted but flow was still far too restricted by the dam to mitigate the problem. There was no pond in the area. Just a decent size stream that would see heavy flow in periods of high rainfall. A trapping permit was eventually issued after other remedies had been attempted.
    Tom

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wilkinson View Post
    60
    nice beaver

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    ^ Yeah.It probably works in some scenarios. A friend in upstate NY tried a baffle when beaver moved in about five years ago. It clogs and requires at least weekly cleaning out to prevent his property from flooding. Easier to get rid of the beaver.

    Kevin
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    This is why it works for us.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  17. #17
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    U R Silly.

    Humanity did not turn them lose, now did we?
    Humanity killed all the wolves in Britain. Like the beavers, they should be brought back.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by George. View Post
    Humanity killed all the wolves in Britain. Like the beavers, they should be brought back.
    No, beavers are beneficial, and do no harm.

    In addition to deliberately releasing a predator in among wild life, thereby causing cruelty. One landowner wants to release wolves into a huge fenced park, but
    Secretary of State’s Standards of Modern Zoo Practice12
    Section 5
    -Provision of protection from fear and distress
    5.1 Animals must be handled and managed only by, or under the supervision of, appropriately qualified and experienced staff. Handling must be done with care, in order to protect the animals well-being, and avoid unnecessary discomfort, stress or physical harm.
    5.2 Any direct physical contact between animals and the visiting public must only be for restricted periods of time and under conditions consistent with animals welfare, and not likely to lead to their discomfort.
    5.3 Animals must not be provoked for the benefit of the viewing public.(See Appendix 6 Animal contact areas)
    5.4 Animals which may interact in an excessively stressful way must not be maintained in
    close proximity.
    We run sheep on most of our uplands and cattle and sheep on the lower pastures. Wolves would be a disaster.
    Last edited by Peerie Maa; 10-26-2020 at 11:55 AM.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  19. #19
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Depends on your perspective. The wolves would have a great time.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    https://www.livingwithwolves.org/wol...hing-solution/

    We've been struggling with re-introducing wolves to their historic territory for a long time. If the statistics cited in the linked article are to be believed weather kills far more sheep than wolves. The introduction of non-native grazing animals into an ecosystem has it's own set of hazards. We are going to have to figure out how to balance the needs of the ranchers who have been given use of the commons for years with the overarching need to protect the greater environment.
    Steve

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  21. #21
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by stromborg View Post
    f the statistics cited in the linked article are to be believed weather kills far more sheep than wolves.
    Compared to the British Isles you must have really ****e weather or crappy shepherds,
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  22. #22
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by TomF View Post
    I'm idly looking to relocate a Beaver too... but we might not be talking about quite the same thing.

    In Canada, old-school cast iron woodworking power tools were made by Beaver - which eventually was subsumed into Rockwell-Delta. I've been musing about getting a spindle-turning lathe...
    When Rockwell absorbed other companies, it usually adopted some of that company's designs.

    Notably a couple of radial drill presses, one from Boice-Crane, and the other from Walker-Turner.

    I would be curious to learn what designs Delta chose from the Beaver line.
    Rattling the teacups.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    I have a Beaver drill press. It’s old school ​heavy.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    So the OP is to alert us to the happy development: the beavers are... coming. I love it!

    We bill ourselves in Oregon as 'The Beaver State'. There are beavers all over the place. I'd estimate something like 2 million of 'em. And they really do contribute SO much. So I've always loved and appreciated beavers... and am glad to hear the news.

    Therefore, I'd offer up a profound and heartfelt HUZZAH!!!!
    David G
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  25. #25
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    I have a Beaver drill press. It’s old school ​heavy.
    I have a Beaver band saw, it’s just old school.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    I'm a lot less than convinced as to the "Does No Harm" claim.
    I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    I'm a lot less than convinced as to the "Does No Harm" claim.
    Why dat?

    Read the links and let us know if you find something.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  28. #28
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Years ago, when beaver release was first being considered the BeeB found a farmer to interview, and being the BeeB they did an OB.

    Picture this: An interviewer and a farmer walking beside a babbling brook tumbling down a steep hillside in a bit of unproductive woodland, with the farmer bemoaning how harmful beavers would be.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  29. #29
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    We run sheep on most of our uplands and cattle and sheep on the lower pastures. Wolves would be a disaster.
    I see. So all land for humans, none at all for nature. Sad.

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by George. View Post
    I see. So all land for humans, none at all for nature. Sad.
    how else to build a libertarian paradise

  31. #31
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    The impact of these enclosed beavers is being monitored, with hopes they will reduce flood risk and boost biodiversity.
    At this stage such introductions are experimental - I wonder what effect the dams and quasi static pools will have on the migratory salmonids.
    I'd much rather lay in my bunk all freakin day lookin at Youtube videos .

  32. #32
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Of course the core of the problem is and always has been……… humans……..

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    At this stage such introductions are experimental - I wonder what effect the dams and quasi static pools will have on the migratory salmonids.
    Wrong sort of river head water I think.
    Knapdale Forest

    Have a read of this
    https://www.rewildingbritain.org.uk/...n-beaver-magic
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  34. #34
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    At this stage such introductions are experimental - I wonder what effect the dams and quasi static pools will have on the migratory salmonids.
    Not typically an issue. They've coexisted for a very long time around here. And the wildlife biologists have workarounds for the odd few instances where they're needed. ---

    Fish Passage

    The outlet end of a Snohomish Pond Leveler. The discharge slot creates a strong fish attractant into the device for easy passage through the beaver dam.



    Beaver and salmonids (trout and salmon) have co-evolved over millennia, so beaver dams typically pose no significant barrier to salmonid movement except during very dry periods. The overall effect of beavers and their dams on salmonids is overwhelming positive, not negative. (See the link below for journal articles).

    Scientific researchers have proven that beaver dams improve juvenile salmonid survival and growth. More beaver dams on salmon producing streams result in more and bigger juvenile salmon. Therefore in the Pacific Northwest a critical component of current salmon recovery efforts aims to increase the number of beavers and beaver dams on salmon producing streams.

    https://www.beaverinstitute.org/mana...monid-passage/
    David G
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  35. #35
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    Default Re: Beavers are coming back.

    Quote Originally Posted by George. View Post
    I see. So all land for humans, none at all for nature. Sad.
    U R being silly again.

    We would not have this thread http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-This-Is-Wales
    Or this http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...is-is-Scotland If we followed your dumb logic.

    Humans are life too.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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