Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 35 of 38

Thread: Biden and busses

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,970

    Default Biden and busses

    I know some ( most ) of yall dread what words lay after these but perhaps you may find your morbid curiosity rewarded.

    Firstly I want to express my amusement that Harris who so greatly benefited from bussing is Joe's running mate. Sure its a single issue but it seemed a big one and close to her heart. I can only assume she is dealing with this as a means to greater accomplishments in her future. Still, strange to me she wasn't the nominee.

    Now im not going deep into this because i dont want to go deeper than my own current level of knowledge.
    Anyways, I read up a little on why Joe didn't like bussing. He felt it was a waste of resources that wouldn't do much good it seems. He would prefer to play the longer harder game. He supported housing plans instead. Now I look at that and think, damn. Thats would have had a profound affect on culture today. Imagine the idea of a well blended ethnicity of neighborhoods. How impossible racism would be. No e of these riots etc would have even been possible and our political situation would be very different. I kinda wish that he had been successful in getting his plan implemented. At least, to my limited understanding. Now my torturous brain can't help but honestly wonder... does he feel there was a racial jungle or not after the bussing. Id argue, there is in terms of violence stemmed from racism.

    Ok now I drop off this post to be shredded, and sort through the pieces.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    My mom was a substitute teacher before, and after, busing.

    My home town had absolutely filthy rich people in huge mansions, and dirt poor people at the other end of town. We all went to our nearby elementary schools.

    Mom saw first hand how the white schools got new textbooks, money spent on better lighting, etc. Busing changed that. Now the students were all mixed in all the schools, and it came to be that the schools got equal funding for these things.

    The downside was NO money came to pay for the busing, which is a huge chunk of the school budget, so there's LESS money to spend on those other things. It also meant kids spend an hour every morning and every afternoon on the bus. Friends made in school may live some distance from each other, instead of living close.

    Apparently, this was the best solution to the problems being faced people could come up with.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    usa
    Posts
    8,165

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    So if understand you correctly, your agreeing with Biden that mixed race neighborhoods would have a more profound effect on race relations than mixed race schools? I suppose mixed race neighborhoods would lead to mixed race schools. But my question is, if we couldn’t integrate schools, how would we have any hope of integrating neighborhoods?
    __________________________________________________ ________________________

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by CK 17 View Post
    So if understand you correctly, your agreeing with Biden that mixed race neighborhoods would have a more profound effect on race relations than mixed race schools? I suppose mixed race neighborhoods would lead to mixed race schools. But my question is, if we couldn’t integrate schools, how would we have any hope of integrating neighborhoods?
    I'm saying it was a mixed bag. My local school was all white. That was as much coincidence as anything else. When I went to Jr. high and high school, they were integrated. Far as I could tell, the kids had no problem.

    The high school football team was made up of various colors and races. Parents were just as mixed in the stands watching the games and cheering the team on.

    All I'm say is busing solved one problem and caused others. Did the benefit outway those other problems? I don't know. I'm not sure there's any way to know. I'm also not sure the neighborhoods within my home town are all that integrated. As recently as 2005, when we were living there to take care of my mom, and for the 32 years I worked at the local post office. I saw no noticeable integration of neighborhoods.

    Neighborhoods were not separated by color so much as by finances. That hasn't changed. The schools do all seem to be treated equally as to new textbooks, computers, etc., but busing takes the single biggest chunk of the budget, as it is a federal mandate which came with no federal funding.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    The Garden State
    Posts
    8,235

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    sadly true, CK. In atlantic city, the north end of the island is known as "the inlet". At one time it was beautiful, huge mansions, nicer small homes, and well to do businesses. It was the place to live during that period. Today it is the worst place to live. Back in the sixties the first black families had the money to move into this neighborhood. Rather than trying to drive them back out, "white flight" happened. Within 10 years the Inlet was nearly abandoned, the mansions were falling down, and the people still lived there were black. People fear the unknown and felt that a mixed race neighborhood would lower their property values, their fear made that reality.

    Today block after block of the inlet is nothing but empty city blocks, all within sight of the beautiful Atlantic Ocean and it's wonderful beaches.
    "If you think you are too small to make a difference, try sleeping with a mosquito"

    -Dalai Lama

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    32,091

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    People will always find a way to resist what they can't accept. Making further cuts in budgets at black schools to pay for busing is a good example. We refuse to have a more powerful top-down government for obvious reasons and we get local resistance to change. It's predictable. However, we can fight it.

    I suspect Biden had good intentions. I also thought that busing was a difficult and divisive band aid at the time, but now I think it was the bitter pill that needed to be swallowed because the disease was so pervasive.

    I can tell you based on what teachers tell me that the inequity in school budgets is not what it used to be. That's good news whether it reflects the political power of minorities or the laws and oversight laid down on communities.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Kitty Hawk, NC
    Posts
    9,708

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    I'm saying it was a mixed bag. My local school was all white. That was as much coincidence as anything else. When I went to Jr. high and high school, they were integrated. Far as I could tell, the kids had no problem.
    I went to an integrated high school.

    The white kids had their classes. The black kids had theirs. The white kids waited for class in one area. The black kids in another. No problems.

    But the white kids got a better education.
    Life is complex.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Central Coast, Ca
    Posts
    29,213

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    I went to an integrated high school.

    The white kids had their classes. The black kids had theirs. The white kids waited for class in one area. The black kids in another. No problems.

    But the white kids got a better education.
    In spite of your opening rhetoric, you are describing a segregated school...

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Walney, near Cumbria UK
    Posts
    51,326

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    I'm saying it was a mixed bag. My local school was all white. That was as much coincidence as anything else. When I went to Jr. high and high school, they were integrated. Far as I could tell, the kids had no problem.

    The high school football team was made up of various colors and races. Parents were just as mixed in the stands watching the games and cheering the team on.

    All I'm say is busing solved one problem and caused others. Did the benefit outway those other problems? I don't know. I'm not sure there's any way to know. I'm also not sure the neighborhoods within my home town are all that integrated. As recently as 2005, when we were living there to take care of my mom, and for the 32 years I worked at the local post office. I saw no noticeable integration of neighborhoods.

    Neighborhoods were not separated by color so much as by finances. That hasn't changed. The schools do all seem to be treated equally as to new textbooks, computers, etc., but busing takes the single biggest chunk of the budget, as it is a federal mandate which came with no federal funding.
    Did we not do this on another thread?
    It was suggesting that enforcing school budget distribution so that the funding was distributed on the basis of number on the school role was a better use of resources than bussing.
    I can't see housing plans working. You cannot set quotas for homeownership, and the US does not control social housing.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

    The power of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web
    The weakness of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    n.c. tn
    Posts
    8,378

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by CK 17 View Post
    So if understand you correctly, your agreeing with Biden that mixed race neighborhoods would have a more profound effect on race relations than mixed race schools? I suppose mixed race neighborhoods would lead to mixed race schools. But my question is, if we couldn’t integrate schools, how would we have any hope of integrating neighborhoods?
    Integrating neighborhoods would have been easy - just stop with the denial of entry into certain neighborhoods of certain people - a policy that while it still continues, was Huge in the 50's..70's.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    855

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Reading the thread title, I expected that Joe was nuzzling necks again...

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    32,091

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Durnik View Post
    Integrating neighborhoods would have been easy - just stop with the denial of entry into certain neighborhoods of certain people - a policy that while it still continues, was Huge in the 50's..70's.
    It wasn't that easy. There were a hundred different ways to maintain segregation without admitting to it.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    7,620

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    It wasn't that easy. There were a hundred different ways to maintain segregation without admitting to it.
    Without admitting it? In the 50's and 60's segregation was a selling point. Lots of properties had restrictive covanents excluding anyone not a white Christian.
    Elect a clown expect a circus

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Walney, near Cumbria UK
    Posts
    51,326

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Durnik View Post
    Integrating neighborhoods would have been easy - just stop with the denial of entry into certain neighborhoods of certain people - a policy that while it still continues, was Huge in the 50's..70's.
    It is not about denying people access, it is about making people want to move to historically black locations. You sound like a member of The Soviet Central Planning Committee.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

    The power of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web
    The weakness of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    I went to an integrated high school.

    The white kids had their classes. The black kids had theirs. The white kids waited for class in one area. The black kids in another. No problems.

    But the white kids got a better education.
    We were all mixed together, and I saw no problems. When the football team or basketball team played, the parents ALL cheered when a player did something good, whether the player was black or white.

    I can't recall neighborhoods integrating behind busing. All the schools in my town were, and all the classes in those schools were.

    I was in 5th grade or 6th grade when Elvis hit. My older brother and I had friends who came to our house to listen to records, because their parents wouldn't let them listen to black artists. My parents didn't care. The kids didn't care. If we liked the song, we were unconcerned as to color of the one singing it.

    One thing I do know is the school system I went through had incredible wood, metal, and auto shops, and they've all disappeared because of budget cuts.

    I suspect the cost of busing played a hand.

    I've never understood why anyone feels superior because he's white, as if he chose his parents.

    I'd like to see some actual non biased studies as to the impact of busing, both positive and negative.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    Did we not do this on another thread?
    It was suggesting that enforcing school budget distribution so that the funding was distributed on the basis of number on the school role was a better use of resources than bussing.
    I can't see housing plans working. You cannot set quotas for homeownership, and the US does not control social housing.
    I seem to have no recollection of the other thread, but I find myself forgetting more and more lately.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Durnik View Post
    Integrating neighborhoods would have been easy - just stop with the denial of entry into certain neighborhoods of certain people - a policy that while it still continues, was Huge in the 50's..70's.
    Do we forget Trump lost a suit for discrimination? Bit surprised that wasn't mentioned in the debate.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 1999
    Location
    St. Paul, MN, USA
    Posts
    57,073

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Busing for school integration as a political issue? What, I suddenly got transported back to 1973?? I should grow my hair and wear bell-bottoms again?

    FWIW, my high school in North Carolina had three distinct ethnic groups: The city white kids, whose parents usually had something to do with the university or the Research Triangle, educated and upper-middle-class. The city black kids, mostly working-class parents. And the country white kids, who were, not to lean on it too hard, mostly southern rednecks
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Bainbridge Island WA
    Posts
    3,592

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    We were all mixed together, and I saw no problems. When the football team or basketball team played, the parents ALL cheered when a player did something good, whether the player was black or white.

    snip

    I was in 5th grade or 6th grade when Elvis hit. My older brother and I had friends who came to our house to listen to records, because their parents wouldn't let them listen to black artists. My parents didn't care. The kids didn't care. If we liked the song, we were unconcerned as to color of the one singing it.
    That is an interesting "sliding scale" of discrimination. It's okay if those folks are over there (in their place?) but don't let them get too close.
    Steve

    If you would have a good boat, be a good guy when you build her - honest, careful, patient, strong.
    H.A. Calahan

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    n.c. tn
    Posts
    8,378

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    It is not about denying people access, it is about making people want to move to historically black locations. You sound like a member of The Soviet Central Planning Committee.
    ??

    In the U.S., real estate agents (those who sold & located homes for folk) were actively showing black folks only black folk homes.. and white folk, white folk homes (same was true of other ethnicities). The industry almost existed to make sure segregation was the norm. Simply stop that, and boom! Over the years, folks would have mingled. And desegregated neighborhoods would have had desegregated schools. There were blacks who had white lawyers buy them homes - and found themselves driven from them when they (tried to) moved in. In the U.S., segregation - part of the systemic racism - was official gov policy.

    And further above (I won't quote them), as usual, one of our closet racists has it wrong

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Kitty Hawk, NC
    Posts
    9,708

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Durnik View Post
    ??

    In the U.S., real estate agents (those who sold & located homes for folk) were actively showing black folks only black folk homes.. and white folk, white folk homes (same was true of other ethnicities). The industry almost existed to make sure segregation was the norm. Simply stop that, and boom! Over the years, folks would have mingled. And desegregated neighborhoods would have had desegregated schools. There were blacks who had white lawyers buy them homes - and found themselves driven from them when they (tried to) moved in. In the U.S., segregation - part of the systemic racism - was official gov policy.

    And further above (I won't quote them), as usual, one of our closet racists has it wrong
    interesting piece in the Washington post about current home values in identical black and white neighborhoods. https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...h/?arc404=true
    Life is complex.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    32,091

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    And the country white kids, who were, not to lean on it too hard, mostly southern rednecks
    Hey! Now you're talking about my relatives (on my mother's side). No squirrel was safe when they had ammunition.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Walney, near Cumbria UK
    Posts
    51,326

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Durnik View Post
    ??

    In the U.S., real estate agents (those who sold & located homes for folk) were actively showing black folks only black folk homes.. and white folk, white folk homes (same was true of other ethnicities). The industry almost existed to make sure segregation was the norm. Simply stop that, and boom! Over the years, folks would have mingled. And desegregated neighborhoods would have had desegregated schools. There were blacks who had white lawyers buy them homes - and found themselves driven from them when they (tried to) moved in. In the U.S., segregation - part of the systemic racism - was official gov policy.

    And further above (I won't quote them), as usual, one of our closet racists has it wrong
    Weird system Did their customers not have the wit and gronicles to ask to be shown a bigger range of properties?

    Or maybe the white customers were complicit in the policy.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

    The power of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web
    The weakness of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Bradford, VT
    Posts
    9,259

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    I didn't understand, at the time, nor, really, since, why they didn't bus the teachers. It seems like it would have been much cheaper, and avoided moving outside their neighborhoods.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,970

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    Weird system Did their customers not have the wit and gronicles to ask to be shown a bigger range of properties?

    Or maybe the white customers were complicit in the policy.
    Well, nobody wants to be the one white in an all black neighborhood, and nobody wants to be the only black in an all white neighborhood.

  26. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Nashville
    Posts
    30,187

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    I live in an integrated neighborhood although its composition is more the result of gentrification than by plan which sadly tends to force black people out in the long run. It's a first for me as I grew up in white 'burbs. I like it.
    Last edited by Lew Barrett; 10-23-2020 at 08:26 PM.
    One of the most enduring qualities of an old wooden boat is the smell it imparts to your clothing.

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by Durnik View Post
    ??

    In the U.S., real estate agents (those who sold & located homes for folk) were actively showing black folks only black folk homes.. and white folk, white folk homes (same was true of other ethnicities). The industry almost existed to make sure segregation was the norm. Simply stop that, and boom! Over the years, folks would have mingled. And desegregated neighborhoods would have had desegregated schools. There were blacks who had white lawyers buy them homes - and found themselves driven from them when they (tried to) moved in. In the U.S., segregation - part of the systemic racism - was official gov policy.

    And further above (I won't quote them), as usual, one of our closet racists has it wrong
    I'm sure you've heard Cory Booker's story of having white friends look at houses so his parent could buy.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    2 states: NJ and confusion
    Posts
    36,637

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by David W Pratt View Post
    I didn't understand, at the time, nor, really, since, why they didn't bus the teachers. It seems like it would have been much cheaper, and avoided moving outside their neighborhoods.
    I remember that being suggested. I believe it wouldn't solve the problems of textbooks and other stuff.

    Racism, from my experience, was a much bigger 'thing' for our parents than for us kids.

    I'd guess busing served some purpose and offered some benefit. To deny it had a downside is simply head in the sand.

    I've not seen any kind of scientific study in this regard.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    northern Georgia, or Mississippi Delta USA
    Posts
    22,163

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    I grew up in a county in Mississippi where 2/3s of the population was black. I lived outside of the nearest town and the county paid to have us bussed into town to the public schools there. I rode a bus from first grade through 12th grade. Grades 1-6 were to all white schools. There was one black female in the school in grade 7. I remember people saying how lucky she was because she was the only student that didn't have to go to school with a n****r. The number of blacks gradually increased, but even in the 12th grade they were still a small minority. Shortly after I graduated from high school, all white private segregation academies were started and the public schools became almost all black.

  30. #30
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Gulgong. Central west N.S.W. Australia
    Posts
    3,812

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Quote Originally Posted by sleek View Post
    Well, nobody wants to be the one white in an all black neighborhood, and nobody wants to be the only black in an all white neighborhood.
    I have to do this There was a joke years ago about the white family that moved into an all black neighborhood. Little white kid is looking out the window at all the black kids playing in the street and having fun. He wants to join in so he blacks up with shoe polish and goes outside. The black kids look at him and think what the hell and let him join in. White kids dad gets home from work, recognizes his son immediately and roars at him to get in the house, smacking him upside the head to move him along. Little kid is angry and humiliated and mutters just loud enough to be heard- I've only been black for five minutes and I already hate you white bastards OK- I'm ready...... JayInOz

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    northern Georgia, or Mississippi Delta USA
    Posts
    22,163

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    My place in Mississippi is where I grew up. There is now one mobile home on the street with a black couple living in it. It is about the best maintained lot on the street. There are some racists living in the area, but as far as I can tell, no one has bothered the black family or vice versa. There are also a number of Hispanics in the neighborhood.

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Seattle, WA USA
    Posts
    13,030

    Default

    That word, I do not think it means what you think.

    A "buss" is a kiss (from the French nounun baiser, "to kiss" - pro tip: don't use the verb baiser as it's a faux ami. It does not mean what you think it means, and will get you slapped if you ask a French woman to baiser. THAT mean "to f&ck". And "bussing" is kissing in English.

    A "bus" on the other hand is a vehicle, and "busing" is a program involving buses.
    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

  33. #33
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Bradford, VT
    Posts
    9,259

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Then is the plural "buses"?

  34. #34
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Cantăo - Brazil
    Posts
    12,996

    Default Re: Biden and busses

    Brazilian schools have been "integrated" since I was a kid. Except for the largest cities, neighborhoods are mixed as well. Mixed-race marriages are more norm than exception.

    Still we have racism. Racism begins at home.

  35. #35
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    East Quogue,NY
    Posts
    20,905

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by David W Pratt View Post
    Then is the plural "buses"?


    Yes. Unless we are referring to electrical busses.( or the aforementioned kisses)

    Kevin


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •