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Thread: Final Presidential Debate

  1. #71
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    .
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy W
    Brian doesn't give a dam* about all Trump's lies.
    This editorial from USA Today seems to be on point (although it is not at all clear the BrianW is actually an anti-Trump Republican):

    It's cowardly and self-indulgent for anti-Trump Republicans to do anything but vote Biden

    No one is going to ask us to die to defend America from Trump. But you should be able to endure a little emotional discomfort and vote for a Democrat.

    Chris Truax
    Opinion columnist

    Maryland’s Republican governor, Larry Hogan, should be ashamed of himself. Don’t get me wrong, Ronald Reagan was a great guy, but voting for him in 2020 is just wrong. We all know people like this. Some of us are people like this. We know what a danger four more years of President Donald Trump would pose to America but we can’t bring ourselves to vote for a Democrat.

    First, don’t get hung up on labels. Trump was a Democrat himself until 2009. And, if you go by what the Republican party actually believed until he came along, he’s still neither a Republican nor a conservative. More to the point, this sort of tribalism is doing immense damage to America. Political parties aren’t sports teams and we shouldn’t root for them like they are. Character matters infinitely more than the letter after somebody’s name. And if you look at what Joe Biden actually believes, in a lot of ways, he’s a far better Republican than Donald Trump has ever been.

    Biden is almost Reaganesque

    The idea that he’s a tool of the far left is silly. He spent a long primary season staring them down. And he showed determination and a refreshing commitment to principle in doing it. Lots of other candidates did their best to please the progressive wing of the Democratic Party. Biden, instead, rejected their demands on Medicare for All, the Green New Deal and a host of other issues, and was almost knocked out of the race because of it. But he didn’t panic and he didn’t flinch. The rest, as they say, is history.

    In some areas, Biden is practically Reaganesque.

    It seems impossible now, but in 1995, America passed a balanced budget constitutional amendment in the House and came within a single vote of passing it in the Senate and sending it to the states for ratification. Joe Biden voted in favor of that amendment. It doesn’t get much more fiscally conservative than that.

    But in a sense, that’s all window dressing. Our political sensibilities aside, we have a duty to the country that transcends our identities as Republicans or conservatives.

    We ask the men and women of our military to do many difficult things and make many hard choices. None of them want to be away from their families. None of them want to witness death and destruction. None of them want to kill. Many of them come back from their service with emotional and physical scars that will not heal.

    But they do all this because they place their country before their personal comfort and even their personal safety. No one is going to ask us to die for our country to defend it from Trump. But if you can’t find it in yourself to endure a little emotional discomfort and vote for a Democrat, you are a coward. Don’t thank these men and women for their service when you see them in the grocery store. You are spitting on that service by refusing to defend America at the ballot box while they are doing it on the battlefield.


    Forget your feelings, vote for US future

    This isn’t 2016. We can no longer tell ourselves little stories about how Trump will grow into the job or how the rest of the Republican Party will control Trump’s worst instincts and keep the ship of state on an even keel. None of that’s going to happen. What you have seen is what you will get for the next four years, only more erratic, more corrosive, and even less restrained.

    When you vote, you are choosing between the American democratic system of checks and balances, and its destruction. And, no, that’s not melodramatic. Biden believes in our constitutional system of government and is intent on restoring it to health. Trump believes in an “Article 2" that gives him the power to do whatever he wants.

    This time, it isn’t possible to maintain a lofty a-pox-on-both-their-houses neutrality. It’s a time for choosing and the choice before us is crystal clear. Refusing to make that choice is both cowardly and self-indulgent. Your vote isn’t about you working through your feelings. It’s about the future of this country. And so — and I mean this in the most non-sexist and South Park way possible — it’s time to man-up and vote like your vote matters and the country’s future depends on it. Because it does.

    Republican Chris Truax, an appellate lawyer in San Diego and CEO of CertifiedVoter.com, is a member of USA TODAY's Board of Contributors.

  2. #72
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Slow Joe's slip up......poor boys!
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  3. #73
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    I'm not sure which is weirder - the fact that 4X% of US voters went for Trump, or the fact that 180 million on the left wing side can't find a candidae who will wipe him off the slate, off the board, and off any other cliches I can come up with.

    Not a bad performance by Biden, but given the USA's size and stature it seems strange that the contest comes down to this. Much as I dislike the current Oz and UK leaders, even they seem incomparably better than Trump, and their potential replacements seem better in many ways than Biden.

    FFS, if we have to have fascists, can't we at least have intelligent fascists with class and breeding?


  4. #74
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris249 View Post
    I'm not sure which is weirder - the fact that 4X% of US voters went for Trump, or the fact that 180 million on the left wing side can't find a candidate who will wipe him off the slate, off the board, and off any other cliches I can come up with.
    That has been my complaint. But perhaps the country is more like Trump and Biden than we would ever admit.
    Life is complex.

  5. #75
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    .
    If the Democratic Party were able to resurrect Thomas Jefferson from the grave and run him as their presidential candidate against the Republican Party candidate, the 2020 general election would still break approximately 51% to 49%.
    Last edited by Tom Montgomery; 10-23-2020 at 10:51 AM.

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy W View Post
    So same as Brian?
    Nah...

    Hallam is merely showing how Sky News in Australia (a Rupert Moredosh owner chanel) is just as demented as its related network in the US. Fortunately it doesn't rate even a tenth of Fox in the US.
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  7. #77
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Thanks Duncan. Looks like i should have made the intention of my post a bit clearer.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  8. #78
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Montgomery View Post
    .
    If the Democratic Party were able to resurrect Thomas Jefferson from the gave and run him as their presidential candidate against the Republican Party candidate, the 2020 general election would still break approximately 51% to 49%.
    If democrats were to ressurrect Thomas Jefferson from the grave, there would be violent riots in many major cities demanding that the man be jailed for life. He would be the ultimate victim of the cancel culture.

  9. #79
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    If Democrats were to resurrect Thomas Jefferson from the grave, there would be violent riots in many major cities demanding that the man be jailed for life. He would be the ultimate victim of the cancel culture.
    Yeah, keeping your own children as slaves wouldn't go over well in 2020. Damn that 'cancel culture', anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris249 View Post
    . . . if we have to have fascists, can't we at least have intelligent fascists with class and breeding?
    Be very grateful we don't. Mr Trump's incompetence is by far his best feature; it limits the damage he can do.
    Last edited by Keith Wilson; 10-23-2020 at 10:10 AM.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

  10. #80
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    We don't actually understand half the crap that comes out of Trump's mouth because the majority of the American people don't live in the "Fox bubble" like the President. Republicans who live in that bubble have at least a clue as to what the guy is talking about. The rest of us don't.
    Tom

    "Leave the gun, take the cannolis"

  11. #81
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Not much changed in the debate. The Minister of misinformation and lies showed he has no idea or plans other than self enrichment. " I have many many banks around the world", and so little for the American people.
    Showing the true soul of the lying coward>
    “I take full responsibility, but China brought it here. It’s not my fault,” — Trump, on the virus.


    Biden, not the best choice but the Only choice.
    Last edited by sonofswen; 10-23-2020 at 11:33 AM.

  12. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccmanuals View Post
    We don't actually understand half the crap that comes out of Trump's mouth because the majority of the American people don't live in the "Fox bubble" like the President. Republicans who live in that bubble have at least a clue as to what the guy is talking about. The rest of us don't.
    The people inside the Trumpery bubble don’t understand what anyone else says. I was unwise enough to open Fox News Australia’s YouTube page and found a few hundred giggling cretins laughing at Biden for calling Trump “Abraham Lincoln”.

    They really are too stupid to recognise sarcasm.

    Of course their Gauleiters will have understood it and pretended not to.
    IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Craig-Bennett View Post
    We have mostly accepted the idea that “going green” is good for jobs.
    Bill Clinton explained this how many years ago? And still, it gets no traction in the US. It staggers me. There are manufacturing jobs, jobs for carpenters, jobs for electricians, jobs for engineers, jobs, jobs, jobs... Oil wells run without workers once they are pumping. Refineries run with skeleton crews. We pump our own gas. Most automobile jobs will just retool for new engine technology. Oil employs truck drivers and it's useful in manufacturing, but those jobs manufacturing plastics will dry up when the wells dry up. Diversity and new technology creates jobs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphie Boy View Post
    If he prepaid his taxes wouldn’t it still show on his taxes?
    Wish Biden had pointed out that being under audit does not prevent one from releasing returns.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  15. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    She is standing up to Trump better than I thought anyone could.

    Biden is making his points and Trump is looking buffoonish. It won't change the election (I think), but it's good to see Biden firing on all cylinders.
    Muting his mike helped.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy W View Post
    Kristen Welker has been good.
    I would have liked her to ask why Trump thought the ACA needed to be repealed before he could replace it.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  17. #87
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    Best worst Brian, compromise and best worst. It is almost always thus.
    You just have to make up your mind how much compromise your principles can stand, and in what direction.

    That said, two damaged old men are surely not the best that even a Disunited States can put up for the top job?
    There is a growing divide in this country. It is driven by those 'alternate' facts, the denial of science, and the acceptance of lying for political purpose as free speech, when it should be treated as fraud.

    We are what we listen to/watch. A lot of Americans get virtually all their information from Limbaugh, Carson, etc. They are fed a bunch of made up stuff, and their audience believes it's all true.

    For over two decades, I've tried to get this changed. Those in office, running for office, working for either, or functioning under the umbrella of 'news' should be required to get matters of fact correct. Many facts are demonstrable, such as the size of an EC victory, and it should be illegal for one to lie about those things.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  18. #88
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    What about all the birds!?

  19. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeeG View Post
    What about the birds!?
    Feed them. Tuppence a bag.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  20. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    That has been my complaint. But perhaps the country is more like Trump and Biden than we would ever admit.
    My theory is; too many primary candidates. The 'not' Trump vote was distributed among 16 other candidates. Imagine if there were only four.

    Democrats started out with a lot of candidates. Too many.

    Assuming Biden wins, my bet is he does one term, so as not to be encumbered by facing another election.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  21. #91
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Yeah, he's intimated as much. Said that he'd serve as a "transitional President," which IMO flags that he'll serve a single term to try to re-balance the country, and lay the table for a successor. It's another reason (besides his age) why his VP choice was so important.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    See my signature. Vote accordingly. Alle' alba vincero.
    Gerard>
    ​Freeland, WA

    #STOP THE COUP

  23. #93
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    Less Rancor But a Still-Stark Divide in Last Debate

    It is finished. The final debate of 2020 is done. Donald Trump walked off his last debate stage on Thursday night, and soon the country will decide whether to let him keep his job or hand the presidency over to Joe Biden.

    Both men were on better behavior than the last time they met, no doubt because they were under constant threat of being muted by the NBC moderator Kristen Welker, but also because both campaigns apparently believe the race is far from finished. Biden wants to solidify, if not widen, his lead while Trump had to go on offensive to avoid a crushing defeat. The result was a contentious but comparatively civil debate at a reasonable volume.

    Biden has made his campaign about combating the coronavirus, and the first question gave him an opportunity to quickly make his case: “220,000 Americans dead,” he said a few minutes into the night.

    “If you hear nothing else, I say tonight, hear this.” According to the former vice president, Trump failed to prepare adequately in the early days of the pandemic and has continued to ignore the guidance of his own advisers. Biden reached into his pocket to pull out a face mask, faulting the president for not encouraging use of the protective material and promising that mask use could save as many as 100,000 additional lives.

    “We’re about to go into a dark winter. A dark winter,” Biden said. “And he has no clear plan, and there’s no prospect that there’s going to be a vaccine available for the majority of the American people before the middle of next year.”

    Unsurprisingly, the Trump forecast was completely different. “I don’t think we’re going to have a dark winter at all,” he predicted before promising that a vaccine was on the horizon. As he has done often in the past, Trump praised himself for his Jan. 31 decision to restrict travel to the U.S. from China, while noting that Biden criticized the move at the time. The president also insisted that his opponent would institute lockdowns at mass scale.

    Trump offered himself and his own bout with COVID-19 as an example. He was sick, he recovered, and so will the rest of the nation. “I say we’re learning to live with it,” Trump said of the interim between now and a safe vaccine. “We have no choice. We can’t lock ourselves up in a basement like Joe does.”

    Learning to live with it? Biden shot back. “We are dying from it.” He also warned, improbably, that another 200,000 Americans will die from COVID-19 before the end of this year. “Anyone who’s responsible for that many deaths should not remain as president of the United States of America,” he added. “I will end this. I will make sure we have a plan.”

    While the last debate was the final opportunity for Biden to level his pandemic attacks against the president in person, it was the first chance for Trump to force the former vice president to address new allegations that his son took money from foreign interests – and that some of that money may have been earmarked for Biden himself.

    Curiously enough, Biden broached the topic first. “Well, I shouldn’t,” he said, trailing off during an answer about foreign meddling in American elections. “Well, I will,” he continued. “His buddy Rudy Giuliani. He’s being used as a Russian pawn. He’s being fed information that is Russian, that is not true.”

    He was referring to how the president’s lawyer tried digging up dirt on his son’s business dealings in Ukraine, an episode that ultimately ended in Trump’s impeachment. Trump took the opening and ran with it, telling the audience about recent reporting by the New York Post that offered a salacious look into purported Biden family business dealings in Ukraine and China, details the paper said were obtained from a missing laptop that Hunter Biden took in for repairs and never reclaimed.

    The most troublesome nugget gleaned from the emails is a May 13, 2017, missive to Hunter Biden from one of his business partners discussing terms of the consulting firm’s prospective involvement in a Chinese-owned energy company. This email outlines “expectations” of the alleged deal, including “renumeration packages” that envision $850,000 going to Hunter Biden, along with a 20% equity share in the joint venture. Another cryptic reference mentions “10 held by H for the big guy” and the same figure for Joe Biden’s brother Jim. Whether this means 10% or $10,000 – or whether anything like this really happened – is unknown at this point, but Trump figured the story needed wider dissemination.

    “You're the ‘big man,’ I think,” Trump told Biden, garbling the shorthand used to possibly refer to Hunter’s father in the emails. “Your son said we have to give 10% to the 'big man.' Joe, what's that all about? It's terrible.”

    While the president has tried to force the issue in the last week, few major media outlets have run with the story other than to disparage it.

    “They were paying you a lot of money and they probably still are,” Trump said at one point before adding during another exchange that “regardless of me, I think you have to clean it up and talk to the American people. Maybe you can do it right now.”

    “I haven’t taken a penny from any foreign source ever in my life,” Biden responded, noting that he had released 22 years of tax returns and challenging Trump to do the same. “Release your tax return or stop talking about corruption.”

    Republicans and Democrats both came away from the exchange convinced they had put points on the board. Their candidates ran rehearsed plays with expected success. But the night was not entirely scripted, and that was to the benefit of the incumbent who earned his job four years ago by winning over blue-collar voters in the Midwest with promises of rebuilding the country’s manufacturing base and putting coal miners back to work.


    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...te_144517.html
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  24. #94
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    I think there are two wild cards out there"

    Senators up for re-election in 2022 might consider their chances if the ACA and Roe are overturned by then. I'm guessing their phones are ringing a lot.

    Given the nature of things, I wonder how many women support Biden but don't dare tell their husband or boyfriend.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    Democrats started out with a lot of candidates. Too many.

    Assuming Biden wins, my bet is he does one term, so as not to be encumbered by facing another election.
    A big tent leads to a lot of candidates. Just like the Republicans need the religious right, the Democrats need to lean way left.

    The Democrats chose Clinton, one of the few people who could lose to Trump. Now they chose Biden, one of the few people who Trump has a chance against.

    Had Obama been another LBJ, Clinton would have had a much better chance of winning. Had Clinton won and continued as an LBJ, the Democrats would have a much easier time in elections.
    Life is complex.

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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    The One Good Thing About Trump's Lies and Cynicism Last Night

    We cannot and will not burn oil forever. Which of these candidates has a plan for the future, and which of them is trying to lie his way to the finish line 11 days from now?


    It is insufficient at this point to say the president lied, or even that he lied a lot, at Thursday night's second and final presidential debate. He lied constantly, freely, and about everything.

    He lied about how 2.2 million people were "expected to die" from coronavirus, making up a benchmark to excuse his appalling record, which he once again fluffed with delusional talk of turning the corner, the latest iteration of his months-long happy talk that the pandemic is just going to go away. He lied when he said he was "kidding" when he suggested COVID-19 patients be injected with disinfectants. He lied when he said a vaccine is "ready." He lied when he said Joe Biden "got $3.5 million from Russia." He lied when he said Biden would destroy Medicare and Social Security. He lied when he said the $750 on his tax returns was a "filing fee"—it was what he paid in federal income taxes. He lied when he said China is paying his tariffs—Americans are.
    The president lied constantly, freely, about everything.

    He behaves this way because he has outright disdain for the people he purportedly serves. He says China, rather than you, are paying the tariffs because he thinks you're an easy mark. He says he's "the least racist person"—a throwback bit he's now resurfaced—because he does not care. Even when he unleashed legitimate attacks on Biden's record, he could not resist roping in some lies. He was right to point out the disastrous consequences of Biden's 1994 crime bill for Black communities, and yet he couldn't help saying Biden used the term "superpredator" when he didn't. It's pathological, but it's also a symptom of this disdain, this cynicism that bolsters his own selfishness and greed. Everyone must be as relentlessly self-interested as I am, he says, which is why at one point he ridiculed Biden for, in Trump's view, pretending to care about middle-class families around a dinner table. Everyone's got their own con they're running, the president believes, just like him.

    You could see this at work towards the end, when Trump tried to "get" Biden on the issue of whether the United States would at some point transition away from burning oil as a source of energy. In the postgame, desperate conservatives seized on this as The Decisive Moment That Biden Lost Texas, itself an indictment of Trump's position. But even in the moment, Trump vocalized his cynical intent, offering meta-commentary as it was happening about the political fallout of Biden's supposed gaffe.

    This content is imported from Twitter. You may be able to find the same content in another format, or you may be able to find more information, at their web site.

    Trump sees this entirely as a political cudgel—"Will you remember that, Texas? Pennsylvania? Oklahoma? Ohio?" he said—because he does not care about any of this. He has no climate or energy plan—or infrastructure plan, or healthcare plan, or much of anything else. He's just trying to lie his way through each day.

    But there was actually a fruitful discussion to be had here about the reality of our situation. Biden's position is that he will end government subsidies to oil companies, some of the largest and most profitable companies in the history of the world thanks in part to this corporate socialism, which moreover are doing their part to make the planet unlivable for future generations of human beings.

    Trump suggests this amounts to destroying the industry, which someday may be true: not only does Biden suggest shifting these subsidies to clean-energy projects, but solar in particular has already become remarkably competitive in just the last couple of years. These same fossil fuel giants, and even Middle East petro-states, have taken notice.

    The fact is we will have to transition away from oil, and it will take vision and commitment to do that until it becomes simple economic reality. As some have pointed out, Biden could and should make the case that there will be jobs for oil and gas workers in new industries like geothermal. He should not shy away from climate commitments, or from a ban on fracking—which, unfortunately, and contrary to the president's claims, he says he will not do. But it's impossible to imagine Trump even engaging with all this, or with any real policy discussion. All he sees is another 11 days to lie himself through.

    And that really is the difference. You could see it in their dueling hypothetical inauguration speeches last night, in which the president's became a resentful recitation of his pre-pandemic accomplishments and various attacks on his opponent. There is no future in the president's platform, only the swirling chaos of the relentless present. This is what's lurking beneath his failures in business—the sensation, one felt by the whole country now that he's dragged us all onto the nauseating rollercoaster of his life, that everything is done by the seat of his pants. Here, as we embark on a new decade where the viability of life on Earth hangs in the balance, we surely deserve more than half-baked scams and the squid-ink of lies until he can sashay off stage. Surely it's time for someone to actually govern the country.


    https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a34462004/trump-biden-debate-oil-industry-fracking-plan/?source=nl&utm_source=nl_esq&utm_medium=email&date =102320&utm_campaign=nl21792156
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    Senators up for re-election in 2022 might consider their chances if the ACA and Roe are overturned by then. I'm guessing their phones are ringing a lot.
    I know a woman who complains bitterly about Obamacare. She lost her insurance and had to get something else. Her old insurance was little more than worthless and her new insurance is only a bit better. They cannot afford to get medical treatment that both she and her husband badly need. But she blames Obama and will vote Trump. Also, her mother had several back-alley abortions many decades ago, aborting her younger siblings in what was a very hazardous treatment. I can't figure these people out. They don't even know what they need, let alone what they want and how to get it. They are pushed around by propaganda without thinking and they are unreachable.

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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate


    Ocasio-Cortez Lets Loose On ‘Unhinged’ Trump Name-Dropping Her At The Debate



    Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) delivered a signature Twitter takedown after she was name-checked by President Donald Trump over her climate policy during Thursday’s nationally televised presidential debate.

    Ocasio-Cortez and her progressive House colleagues Ayanna Pressley (D-Mass.), Ilhan Omar (D-Minn.) and Rashida Tlaib (D-Mich.) were called out by the president in his debate with Democratic nominee Joe Biden in Nashville.

    “You know who developed it? AOC plus three,” the president said of Biden’s climate plan.

    “They know nothing about the climate. I mean she’s got a good line of stuff, but she knows nothing about the climate, and they’re all hopping through hoops for AOC plus three. Not a real plan. It costs $100 trillion.”

    Trump has repeatedly conflated Biden’s plans to mitigate climate change with the set of policy proposals known as the Green New Deal, introduced by Ocasio-Cortez and Sen. Ed Markey (D-Mass.) in 2019. Biden has offered praise for it, but his own policy is different.

    Biden appointed Ocasio-Cortez as co-chair of his climate policy task force earlier this year, which released a number of proposals in July that make no mention of the Green New Deal. His proposals include moving all electric power off fossil fuels by 2035, increasing energy efficiency by upgrading 4 million buildings and 2 million homes over four years, installing 500 million solar panels in the next five years and shifting major cities toward zero-emission public transportation options.

    Ocasio-Cortez took Trump’s shoutout as an opportunity to point out far more than four lawmakers offered support for the Green New Deal:

    She also looked back to her former job prior to her election in 2018.

    If someone had told her then that an “unhinged President of the United States would be repeatedly saying my name at the 2020 debate, I would’ve brought them some water and told them to sober up,” she tweeted.......


    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/ocasi...b695a32fb1fb12
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  29. #99
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    In their final debate, President Trump unleashed an unrelenting series of false, misleading and exaggerated statements as he sought to distort former Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr.’s record and positions and boost his own re-election hopes. The president once again relied heavily on well-worn talking points that have long been shown to be false.The president appeared determined to reinvent the reality of the last four years — and the history of the pandemic in 2020 — as he faces judgment on his actions in just 12 days. He once again falsely dismissed the Russia investigations as a “phony witch hunt.” He insisted that aside from Abraham Lincoln, “nobody has done more for the Black community,” an assertion that people in both parties find laughable. And he tried again to wish away the pandemic, saying “we are rounding the turn” even as daily cases of the virus this week topped 70,000 in the United States for the first time since July.

  30. #100
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    I know a woman who complains bitterly about Obamacare. She lost her insurance and had to get something else. Her old insurance was little more than worthless and her new insurance is only a bit better. They cannot afford to get medical treatment that both she and her husband badly need. But she blames Obama and will vote Trump. Also, her mother had several back-alley abortions many decades ago, aborting her younger siblings in what was a very hazardous treatment. I can't figure these people out. They don't even know what they need, let alone what they want and how to get it. They are pushed around by propaganda without thinking and they are unreachable.
    Obama care is far from perfect, but it was a step forward. Wait till they cannot get health insurance.

    Republican governors (not all) declined to expand Medicaid in spite of the fact it would have saved their state money and covered a lot more people. Go figure?
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  31. #101
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    His proposals include moving all electric power off fossil fuels by 2035, increasing energy efficiency by upgrading 4 million buildings and 2 million homes over four years, installing 500 million solar panels in the next five years and shifting major cities toward zero-emission public transportation options.
    I don't believe he can get all electric power off fossil fuels in 15 years, but he could move maybe half. The rest is totally doable and would create jobs and "fuel" the economy.

  32. #102
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    I doubt whether I'm the only one who noticed following the debate that Jill Biden went to the stage and gave Joe a big hug and a kiss; obvious warmth. OTOH, Melissa Trump stood beside the Donald for a moment and then they walked off the stage with Trump reaching to hold his loving wife's hand while she beamed an "Arm Ornament" smile. Hey body language counts for a lot in current culture. Some tabloid reporter ought to delve into this a bit more deeply.

  33. #103
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    All through history, progress has created new jobs and ended old jobs. Remember BLOCKBUSTER? 8 TRACKS?

    Moving to clean energy that doesn't use fossil fuels may take a while, but like all journeys, it begins with that first step. Great skyscrapers were built one brick at a time.

    We need to start 'laying the bricks' to get off oil.
    Can we have him keel hauled?

  34. #104
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Poll: Majority of viewers say Biden won final debate

    Joe Biden outperformed President Donald Trump in Thursday’s final presidential debate, according to a new POLITICO/Morning Consult flash poll released Friday.

    The survey found that 54 percent of debate watchers believed Biden won the matchup, while 39 percent said Trump did. Only 8 percent of those who watched said they didn’t know or had no opinion.


    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/1...n-trump-432052
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  35. #105
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    Default Re: Final Presidential Debate

    Speaking of oil, if we burn every last drop of crude that we can frack out of the ground in vehicles, we won't have anything left to make polymer compounds out of. Coal is substitute, but not so convenient to work with. Vegetable oil works to some extent, but not as versatile as good'ol black crude welling up out of the ground.

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