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Thread: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

  1. #1
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    Default More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Complete article here.

    https://seekingalpha.com/article/437...-out-gm-swoons

    A few excerpts here.

    This whole Nikola phenomenon was only possible in a market gone willfully blind and nuts.

    Shares of the electric truck maker Nikola (NASDAQ:NKLA) that hasn't made a single truck - not even a working prototype that uses its own technology - started trading on June 4, 2020, through a reverse merger with special-purpose acquisition company (SPAC) VectoIQ Holdings - the boom in SPACs being another phenomenon that shows how nuts this market has gotten. By June 9, Nikola's market capitalization had vaulted to $29 billion as day-trader fans were going nuts over it, trying to get rich quick on this supernatural phenomenon.
    Then the collapse began, the collapse in every aspect, including the collapse of hype.


    Monday morning, the company announced in an astounding SEC filing that CEO and founder Trevor Milton, who is immersed in fraud allegations, was out, and the way it was done, namely effective yesterday, September 20, suggests that this was an orchestrated firing over the weekend, dressed up as "voluntary."

    To help preserve capital and assist the Company in retaining world-class talent to succeed the Executive, the Executive hereby relinquishes each of the following:
    (i) 100% of the 4,859,000 performance-based stock units (the "PSUs") granted to the Executive on August 21, 2020,
    (ii) any right or claim to enter into a two-year consulting agreement with an annual fee of $10,000,000 and
    (iii) any other right and entitlement that the Executive may have or claim pursuant to the Employment Arrangement, except as set forth in this Agreement.
    Milton was forced to announce his departure in the social media:
    Following the Effective Date, the Executive will promptly revise the Executive's employment status on social media, including LinkedIn and other social media sites so that the Executive is no longer identified as holding any position with the Company or serving on the Board.
    Milton has to get approval before posting anything on the social media about the company:
    Prior to using any social media site, blog or other online platform to make any statements regarding the Company Group or any of their respective employees or directors (a "Statement"), the Executive agrees to consult with the Executive's counsel and the Company's Chief Legal Officer as may be reasonably necessary to determine that the Statement complies with the Executive's obligations to the Company.


    The deal with GM, announced on September 8 - though the media and Wall Street analysts oohed and aahed over it and caused the shares of both companies to soar briefly - raised red flags about Nikola's so-called industry-leading core technology upon which all the hype had been built, namely its battery and fuel cell technology that were supposed to power its trucks.
    In the deal with GM, however, it was revealed that GM's own Hydrotec fuel cell technology and Ultium battery systems would power Nikola's Badger pickup trucks, not Nikola's technology, which raised further doubts about the validity of Nikola's technology breakthrough claims.
    Not only would GM provide the core technology for those trucks, Nikola also disclosed that GM would "engineer, validate, homologate and build the Nikola Badger for both the battery electric vehicle and fuel cell electric vehicle variants as part of the in-kind services."
    So that leaves just the name that GM was apparently interested in and the hype surrounding Nikola.




  2. #2
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    That's actually hilarious. Maybe a bit too soon now, but someday we'll all agree.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    That's actually hilarious. Maybe a bit too soon now, but someday we'll all agree.
    I don't think I'll ever find it hilarious but I do find it interesting.
    I'm somewhat attuned to the boom bust phenomenom living in frac sand mining country.
    A lot of good people lost a lot of money here betting on the future of fracing.
    Now a lot of good people will lose big because they bet on a man who it appears may have been more huckster than high brow.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    You do seem to delight in bad news about Nikola. Is it because they aren't mainstream fossil-fueled? Because you have something against Katherine & Paul?

    Nikola is certainly having some problems, but how about we give them a chance?
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    I take no delight in others misery.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Tucker? DeLorean? The lesson to be learned here is to never put too many eggs in a new auto concept basket. - or - History often repeats itself.
    Last edited by Nicholas Scheuer; 09-22-2020 at 05:14 PM.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redrcrvrp1 View Post
    I take no delight in others misery.
    That depends. If they intentionally set out to defraud investors then yes, I’ll take delight in their downfall. Also the switch to non IC transportation is essential. A huckster doesn’t help the cause, only hurts it.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    I and I guess many others had their doubts from the start. I mean, what would you think of a company that wanted to compete in the same market as Ford whilst claiming break through technology and yet calling itself "Henry".

    I did ask Kat early on, what her father (a truck O/O) thought of the Niikola truck. That just elicited an LOL from Paul.

    The stock is up 3% today, so maybe there's something good happening.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    ...
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    There is a rich history of stock speculation in the automotive world. It goes back to the beginning of the phenomenon.
    Fracking? I don't know how you could lose money at that unless you are forced somehow to clean up the mess left behind

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Who is this guy a disgruntled Tesla ventilator engineer?

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh Conway View Post
    Who is this guy. . .
    Milo J Chistensen
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    'bust'?
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    Milo J Chistensen
    Um... really? Hmm.

    In a different thread, I asked:

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob (oh, THAT Bob) View Post
    Do you have short interest in Nikola stock?
    Quote Originally Posted by Redrcrvrp1 View Post
    No. Shorting stocks is too risky for my peace of mind.
    That may have actual legal implications with the SEC if not true.

    Many have said that shorting stocks serves a positive purpose in the market. Perhaps, but not false manipulation. We'll see if those who shorted and trashed Nikola, later jump in and buy.
    When you can take the pebble from my hand, it will be time for you to leave.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob (oh, THAT Bob) View Post
    We'll see if those who shorted and trashed Nikola, later jump in and buy.
    The typical process of shorting a stock is to sell shares that are borrowed and then buy shares to return to the lender. So, yes, they later jump in and buy.
    Life is complex.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    The typical process of shorting a stock is to sell shares that are borrowed and then buy shares to return to the lender. So, yes, they later jump in and buy.
    True. let me rephrase. Buy and hold in the expectation of a recovery in the stock price as they pump the stock. But that's probably harder than trashing it.
    When you can take the pebble from my hand, it will be time for you to leave.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoeyawl View Post
    There is a rich history of stock speculation in the automotive world. It goes back to the beginning of the phenomenon.
    Fracking? I don't know how you could lose money at that unless you are forced somehow to clean up the mess left behind
    You can lose money 'all sorts of ways in the frac sand biz.
    Buy some expensive trucks with a promise that they will pay above market rates to haul sand from the mine to the trailhead. Works for a few months then the rates go so low you cant make any money.
    Build them a multi.illion dollar plant and have them go bankrupt before you get paid.
    Provide them. goods and services and not get paid.
    Have them take sand from your land and not get paid.

    And many other ways.

    I'm lucky. Only lost 40,000.

    Some I know lost millions.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Buy someone trucks on a promise? I'm not doing that

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    'bust'?
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  20. #20
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Many did. Not me.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    'bust'??

    I hadn't seen anything about arrests.
    David G
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    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Why would someone start a determined, repeated attack on a company on a wooden boat forum unless they had some financial interest or a serious grudge?

    It's simple to search the web with a keyword— nikola— and then target social media sites that pop up.

    Russia isn't the only source of this crap. Or should I spell it crvrp?
    We're merely mammals. Let's misbehave! —Cole Porter

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    'bust'??

    I hadn't seen anything about arrests.
    you didnt see the story about trevor milton being arrested at sky harbor airport fleeing the country yesterday???
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    It's especially wrong when we have a member of the forum who is an employee.

    Some people love to hate a company trying to do the right thing. Does the company have issues? Maybe, maybe not.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    you didnt see the story about trevor milton being arrested at sky harbor airport fleeing the country yesterday???
    No... what I see is a troll using leading language to misrepresent and judge a still-fluid situation. Another sort of lying. And we all know how much a appreciate lying.

    Unless it's about Tulsy... we can slander him all we want <G>
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  26. #26
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    you know what david it is hurtful and stressful, the last year has been very very tough on katherine and myself
    and it is such an obvious deliberate anonymous troll

    dse
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Maybe all those promised trucks used for fracking could now be Nikola's?

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    you know what david it is hurtful and stressful, the last year has been very very tough on katherine and myself
    and it is such an obvious deliberate anonymous troll

    dse
    Yes, gratuitously ugly.

    Didja pizzoff any of our currently banned bretheren in particular? The sock puppet's revenge?
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  29. #29
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    The Russian probably

  30. #30
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas Scheuer View Post
    Tucker? DeLorean? The lesson to be learned here is to never put too many eggs in a new auto concept basket. - or - History oftern repeats itself.
    It does, but remember the doubters and such who so dismissed Tesla at the beginning, and now, here in far away New Zealand, right had drive and all, I counted seven when I was out on the road yesterday.

    Some succeed, some dont.

    John Welsford
    An expert is but a beginner with experience.

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob (oh, THAT Bob) View Post
    Um... really? Hmm.

    In a different thread, I asked:





    That may have actual legal implications with the SEC if not true.

    Many have said that shorting stocks serves a positive purpose in the market. Perhaps, but not false manipulation. We'll see if those who shorted and trashed Nikola, later jump in and buy.
    SEC? what SEC?

  32. #32
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    36 posts, and most of them about Nikola's troubles? My.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Meanwhile, this pickup truck owner (Dodge Diesel boat towing vehicle) considers Tesla's pickup truck to be nothing but a bad joke.

    Quote Originally Posted by john welsford View Post
    It does, but remember the doubters and such who so dismissed Tesla at the beginning, and now, here in far away New Zealand, right had drive and all, I counted seven when I was out on the road yesterday.

    Some succeed, some dont.

    John Welsford

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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas Scheuer View Post
    Meanwhile, this pickup truck owner (Dodge Diesel boat towing vehicle) considers Tesla's pickup truck to be nothing but a bad joke.
    Perhaps, but GM and Ford ARE going "all-in" on electric, and that's no joke.

    I used to think that the majority of electric power was lost in transmission, and that was the fatal flaw with electric vehicles. I recently learned that the loss is on the order of 5%. And then I remembered that my previous assumption was based on a column in a car mag decades ago, talking about electric cars, and authored by a columnist and former engineer that I (used to) respect.

    Most internal combustion engines are about 20% mechanically efficient; Most of the energy is lost as heat.

    Large stationary electric power plants, even fossil fueled, are 2-3X that efficient, and increasing. Alternative energy sources such as hydro, solar, and wind provide even greater efficiency, and versatility in feed stock. Rooftop solar on people's houses can help fuel their vehicle.

    Combine the above facts, and electric vehicles are INEVITABLE, provided the battery costs are reasonable and recyclable.

    Huge energy will be saved.

    Carbon emissions will be greatly reduced (or greatly slowed rate of increase), in addition to better air quality for breathing.

    No periodic changing of engine lubricating oil, so both lower maintenance costs and reduced environmental impact.

    Cars will last longer; Batteries are easier to replace than an engine.

    Modern internal combustion engines are a miracle of technology, providing the performance and reliability that they do, given the complexity and durability issues. I'm a huge fan of great engines. But the above is undeniable.
    When you can take the pebble from my hand, it will be time for you to leave.

  35. #35
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    Default Re: More shoes drop in the Nikola bust.

    I think the operative word in all this is "combustion"

    It seems so old school to have to pack around a a combustion device doesn't it?
    (Reminiscent of using flint and steel to get your dinner cooked)

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