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Thread: Pa. drop box suit

  1. #1
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    Default Pa. drop box suit

    Trump's people have filed suit against Pa. for installing drop boxes for mail in ballots.

    Found a couple of articles on this but they don't answer my question: Does Pa. have to win in court to use these drop boxes, or does Trump have to win to prevent it?
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    WA state, at least King County, have many drop boxes. I always use them. Ballot can't be taken from my mailbox from someone other than the mail carrier. Can't get lost in the mail. Easy. And no postage needed (was a factor before but now ballot envelopes don't require postage). Still saves somebody postage.
    When you can take the pebble from my hand, it will be time for you to leave.

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob (oh, THAT Bob) View Post
    And no postage needed (was a factor before but now ballot envelopes don't require postage). Still saves somebody postage.
    Postage paid by co./state, or waived by PO?

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    A Trump appointee says to the Trump campaign to put up or shut up:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/13/polit...nia/index.html

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/11/o...ction-day.html

    There’s no mystery about what President Trump intends to do if he holds a lead on election night in November. He’s practically broadcasting it.

    First, he’ll claim victory. Then, having spent most of the year denouncing vote-by-mail as corrupt, fraudulent and prone to abuse, he’ll demand that authorities stop counting mail-in and absentee ballots. He’ll have teams of lawyers challenging counts and ballots across the country.

    He also seems to be counting on having the advantage of mail slowdowns, engineered by the recently installed Postmaster General Louis DeJoy. Fewer pickups and deliveries could mean more late-arriving ballots and a better shot at dismissing votes before they’re even opened, especially if the campaign has successfully sued to block states from extending deadlines. We might even see a Brooks Brothers riot or two, where well-heeled Republican operatives stage angry and voluble protests against ballot counts and recounts.

    If Trump is leading on election night, in other words, there’s a good chance he’ll try to disrupt and delegitimize the counting process. That way, if Joe Biden pulls ahead in the days (or weeks) after voting ends — if we experience a “blue shift” like the one in 2018, in which the Democratic majority in the House grew as votes came in — the president will have given himself grounds to reject the outcome as “fake news.”

    The only way to prevent this scenario, or at least, rob it of the oxygen it needs to burn, is to deliver an election night lead to Biden. This means voting in person. No, not everyone will be able to do that. But if you plan to vote against Trump and can take appropriate precautions, then some kind of hand delivery — going to the polls or bringing your mail-in ballot to a “drop box” — will be the best way to protect your vote from the president’s concerted attempt to undermine the election for his benefit.

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Don't Republicans also vote?
    The Algorithm Is Watching

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    The suit itself should not stop the use of the drop box. The Traitors will need to file for an emergency restraining order. For this, they'll need to provide some proof of exigency -- ie, voter fraud. Likely the courts will recognize fraud when they see it.
    "The future is already here — it's just not very evenly distributed." William Gibson

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    More chaos. More attacks on normalcy. More plowing the fields getting ready to sow dysfunction... leading to tyranny.
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    It is encouraging that a Trump appointed judge told Trump and the GOP to show their evidence or shut up.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by kgr1 View Post
    Postage paid by co./state, or waived by PO?
    Postage on returned ballots is paid for by the counties who are then reimbursed by the state.

    ETA: There are 17 other states that pay for postage so we aren't alone
    Steve

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    Trump's people have filed suit against Pa. for installing drop boxes for mail in ballots.

    Found a couple of articles on this but they don't answer my question: Does Pa. have to win in court to use these drop boxes, or does Trump have to win to prevent it?

    Neither. iDJT lacks standing. He's not a resident of a Pennsylvania, nor a registered voter in Pennsylvania.

    And, to quote the Constitution, Art II, section 1, on the election of the President:

    "Each state shall appoint, in such manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a number of electors, equal to the whole number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or person holding an office of trust or profit under the United States, shall be appointed an elector."

    A state can appoint its Electors however so its legislature sees fit.

    And each state conducts its elections as it sees fit.

    Trump lacks standing.

    He is, after all, not, strictly speaking, on the ballot: a particular slate of Electors is, who have promised to vote for the iDJT.
    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    My boss said this morning that he turns on the TV news and watches a democracy being dismantled. What needs to be done to stop it? Short of beheading a handful of the scumbags at the top- trump, McConnell, Pence, Kushner and others- including vile pukes like Hannity and Carlson who keep stoking the flames. It's frustrating to watch it unfold pretty much unimpeded. JayInOz

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Gotta stop those uppity colored folks from voting. Dang free postage!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JayInOz View Post
    My boss said this morning that he turns on the TV news and watches a democracy being dismantled. What needs to be done to stop it? Short of beheading a handful of the scumbags at the top- trump, McConnell, Pence, Kushner and others- including vile pukes like Hannity and Carlson who keep stoking the flames. It's frustrating to watch it unfold pretty much unimpeded. JayInOz

    The patents on the guillotine ("La Raccourcisseuse Patriotique" - the Patriotic Shortener) have expired.

    Pretty sure some modern linear motion bearings would sort out any shortcomings in the design.
    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Gray View Post
    A Trump appointee says to the Trump campaign to put up or shut up:

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/13/polit...nia/index.html
    That's now beside the point. Postal service will NOT deliver ballots in a timely manner. Your mail in vote is likely to not be counted.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bow View Post
    Don't Republicans also vote?
    Seems the polls show about 3 times as many Biden voters plan on voting by mail than Trump voters
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas Carey View Post
    Neither. iDJT lacks standing. He's not a resident of a Pennsylvania, nor a registered voter in Pennsylvania.

    And, to quote the Constitution, Art II, section 1, on the election of the President:

    "Each state shall appoint, in such manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a number of electors, equal to the whole number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or person holding an office of trust or profit under the United States, shall be appointed an elector."

    A state can appoint its Electors however so its legislature sees fit.

    And each state conducts its elections as it sees fit.

    Trump lacks standing.

    He is, after all, not, strictly speaking, on the ballot: a particular slate of Electors is, who have promised to vote for the iDJT.
    Without drop boxes, voting by mail this election will not work. Trump has gutted the postal service, and there's not a damned thing congress can do. The can investigate, but what does that do for this election?

    ACLU should have already sued the PMG.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by JayInOz View Post
    My boss said this morning that he turns on the TV news and watches a democracy being dismantled. What needs to be done to stop it? Short of beheading a handful of the scumbags at the top- trump, McConnell, Pence, Kushner and others- including vile pukes like Hannity and Carlson who keep stoking the flames. It's frustrating to watch it unfold pretty much unimpeded. JayInOz
    I keep asking Bezos to buy FOX and make it WAPO TV

    Trump has co-opted virtually the entire GOP.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    "First they came for………………." donald's voters should remember that. But then again have they enough education to know what it's about? And if they did would they care?

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Could the states authorize vans of some sort to replace post boxes? A marked vehicle at a pre determined location for a set amount of time- collect ballots from that area and deliver them to where they need to be? Mobile post box/polling stations? Has to be a way to beat trump at his own game- although just strangling the bastard would be nice. JayInOz

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by JayInOz View Post
    Could the states authorize vans of some sort to replace post boxes? A marked vehicle at a pre determined location for a set amount of time- collect ballots from that area and deliver them to where they need to be? Mobile post box/polling stations? Has to be a way to beat trump at his own game- although just strangling the bastard would be nice. JayInOz
    We seem to focus on mailing our ballots IN. Someone has to mail the OUT, and if we never get it, we can't mail it in.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    The key (I think) is early mobilization. Get those ballots back to your respective county offices ASAP. Takes to whole question of them getting there too late out of the equation. We have official drop boxes here and I can track my ballot online to see it has been received and if my signature has been challenged.

    Sheer laziness to wait until the very last minute.
    Steve

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  23. #23
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by stromborg View Post
    The key (I think) is early mobilization. Get those ballots back to your respective county offices ASAP. Takes to whole question of them getting there too late out of the equation. We have official drop boxes here and I can track my ballot online to see it has been received and if my signature has been challenged.

    Sheer laziness to wait until the very last minute.
    Again, this assumes one RECEIVES their ballot in a timely manner.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    "First they came for………………." donald's voters should remember that. But then again have they enough education to know what it's about? And if they did would they care?
    Some of these people proudly flaunt the Nazi flag, so no, if it isn't them they don't care.

    Assuming ballots get delivered mobilizing a "get in" the vote sounds like a great idea.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    Again, this assumes one RECEIVES their ballot in a timely manner.
    This goes back to early mobilization. Get people to request their absentee/mail in ballot now or as early as they can, vote and get it back. I don't know what is done with the "undecideds" but then I don't understand how they can't see the stark difference between the two choices they'll be offered either, or why there is any question.
    Steve

    If you would have a good boat, be a good guy when you build her - honest, careful, patient, strong.
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  26. #26
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    What sort of security is provided for early ballots? And when are they counted? When they come in, or on election night?

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Don't put anything past this slimball! 20200814_114822.jpg

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Historically, the postal service has treated election mail BETTER than first class.

    That has changed.

    I'm also not sure it will work out as Trump hopes. A good chunk of his voters are in more rural areas, and the Postal Service may be the ONLY delivery service they have.

    Meanwhile, 651 ( I think I heard) letter sorting machines have been removed across the country.

    Even without an election pending, that does not bode well.

    The question here is Can the federal government dictate whether a state has drop boxes?
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    How does dating on drop boxes work?

  30. #30

    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Drop boxes are likely valid until close of polls on Election Day. Suspect most election boards will have drop location monitored 24/7 and emptied daily or multiple times daily. Ballots will likely be signature checked (the affidavit on the outside envelope) and prepped for counting on Election Day. Ballots likely are not counted in advance, but stored pending actual polling.

    The Post Office is removing postal curbside drop boxes in major cities in Montana and moving pickup times to earlier and earlier cut offs. It used to be that you could drop Priority and First Class at 8 pm at the regional sort center in town--now that is being moved to 5 pm. Sure fire way to chase off the business.

  31. #31
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    I think it's simple, don't be the April 15th crowd.

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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    Another wildcard in this mess is how would the Supreme Court deal with an inevitable election challenge as states slog through what could be days and even weeks of counting?
    They have made a big deal about respecting precedent.
    So would they cite Bush v. Gore as a green light to stop the counting and install a winner?
    Would they rule for Biden if he were ahead?
    John Roberts could well be the decider.

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Pa. drop box suit

    "John Roberts could well be the decider."

    Ah, the Kingmaker eh? So the actual votes seem to have less and less importance as time goes on…………….. Convenience is of more importance than any inconvenient democracy. Not the first time of course, there's lot of dead Americans and Iraqis, amongst others, as a result of that decision by…….the Kingmakers.

  34. #34
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    Default Pa. drop box suit

    Quote Originally Posted by Wadsworth View Post
    Another wildcard in this mess is how would the Supreme Court deal with an inevitable election challenge as states slog through what could be days and even weeks of counting?
    They have made a big deal about respecting precedent.
    So would they cite Bush v. Gore as a green light to stop the counting and install a winner?
    Would they rule for Biden if he were ahead?
    John Roberts could well be the decider.

    Bush v. Gore explicitly stated in the decision that it "was not to be used as precedent."

    Bear in mind that that means bupkes - a technical term meaning "nothing", from the Yiddish, kozebupkes, or "goatsh*te".

    Any and every court decision IS precedent. That is how the Common Law is built. The court does not get to opt out of its [shoddy, unconstitutional, and partisan] decision being a part of the Common Law. Saying, "this is a piece of sh*te and while we know it stinks, we're still going to cram it down your craw", doesn't cut the mustard... though it does cut the cheese.

    That is only one of the very many reasons that [i]Bush v. Gore[i] was, to put it mildly, a pile of steaming cowsh*te that should have never have left the floor of the barn.
    You would not enjoy Nietzsche, sir. He is fundamentally unsound. — P.G. Wodehouse (Carry On, Jeeves)

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