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Thread: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    I don’t drop in here often but just spotted this thread today.

    AJZimm — I agree the author makes less than one might like from a commercially published book, unless it’s a Harry Potter. FWIW, as publisher I receive 3/8 of the cover price on trade sales of my books, after the wholesale margins, and distribution and repping charges, and I have to wait 4 months after the sale for it. But those bricks & mortar functions carry overheads I don’t, so I don’t begrudge them their cut. That 3/8 has to pay the author, the printer, and my operating costs like computers, software, and what I laughingly call promotion. And though I may not sell all the books printed, I still have to pay for them. If it were not for direct online sales, niche publishing like mine would not be viable. It’s no surprise I have little or no direct competition in the run-sizes I print — typically hundreds not thousands. I’m not in it for the money of course but it’s nice if it keeps its head above water. Self-publishing has made leaps and is far more respectable than it used to be, and it can be a good route if you have the time & aptitude.

    WI-Tom - Thanks for the mention, and I’m glad your book worked out. I still regularly get into the T-shirt!

    Cheers

    Dick

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dick Wynne View Post
    Self-publishing has made leaps and is far more respectable than it used to be, and it can be a good route if you have the time & aptitude.

    WI-Tom - Thanks for the mention, and I’m glad your book worked out. I still regularly get into the T-shirt!

    Cheers

    Dick
    Well, one big reason self-publishing can approach the quality of traditional publishers is that authors without the aptitude can hire out the truly expert jobs like layout, design, and massaging the text. So many self-published books I see are just so poorly designed and laid-out, with tiny margins and text all crammed together. I never would have gotten the quality I wanted if I hand't handed off those highly technical jobs to you, so many thanks again. I don't even exactly understand all that you did, but I sure appreciate the results.

    And a self-published author can operate at scales and cash flows that aren't realistic for traditional professional publishers, I'd bet. The "labor of love" vs. "gotta pay the bills and salaries." I think any trad publisher would have lost money on my book. Over time, I made out better than OK (not enough to quit any day jobs) with far lower volume of sales. Trade-offs, trade-offs.

    Glad to hear the Jagular T-shirt is still with you. I'm actually wearing mine right now!

    Are you getting any sailing in these days?

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  3. #38
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dick Wynne View Post
    I donít drop in here often but just spotted this thread today.

    AJZimm ó I agree the author makes less than one might like from a commercially published book, unless itís a Harry Potter. FWIW, as publisher I receive 3/8 of the cover price on trade sales of my books, after the wholesale margins, and distribution and repping charges, and I have to wait 4 months after the sale for it. But those bricks & mortar functions carry overheads I donít, so I donít begrudge them their cut. That 3/8 has to pay the author, the printer, and my operating costs like computers, software, and what I laughingly call promotion. And though I may not sell all the books printed, I still have to pay for them. If it were not for direct online sales, niche publishing like mine would not be viable. Itís no surprise I have little or no direct competition in the run-sizes I print ó typically hundreds not thousands. Iím not in it for the money of course but itís nice if it keeps its head above water. Self-publishing has made leaps and is far more respectable than it used to be, and it can be a good route if you have the time & aptitude.

    WI-Tom - Thanks for the mention, and Iím glad your book worked out. I still regularly get into the T-shirt!

    Cheers

    Dick
    Dick, it was explained to me by my publisher where the money all goes and it all makes sense. As a first-time author, I was naive about the business, I guess, and didn't expect the margins to be so low for the publisher and the author.

    However, as I have trooped around (mostly virtually so far, what with COVID) to bricks and mortar bookstores, I find that they all assume at first that I am yet another self-published author with a book that has poor production values and they are very wary. The attitude changes somewhat when I explain that the book is published by a traditional publisher and that they can order it from a distributor they know and stock it, just like a bestseller. Whether it sells or not, of course, is another question.
    Alex

    "ďI am but mad north-north-west. When the wind is southerly, I know a hawk from a handsawĒ " Hamlet, Act 2, Scene 2 - Shakespeare

    http://www.alexzimmerman.ca

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Like many I spend more time messing about with boats than in them. My Albert Strange Emerald is ashore being worked on but I hope we’ll sail later this year. Here she is under previous ownership on the Clyde a few years ago. She now lives on the East Coast in Woodbridge, Suffolk.

    Last edited by Dick Wynne; 07-19-2020 at 06:49 PM.

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by AJZimm View Post
    ...However, as I have trooped around (mostly virtually so far, what with COVID) to bricks and mortar bookstores, I find that they all assume at first that I am yet another self-published author with a book that has poor production values and they are very wary.
    It is the case that many self-publishers pay too little attention to production standards. Good editing, typesetting and proofreading matter a lot. And a garish cover is not a good indicator -- in particular don't go mad with text effects. Page format is important also -- in the UK, anything printed A5 or A4 size (ie office stationery dimensions) screams 'amateur' and is not going to be taken seriously by the trade. This stuff can be learned from books, or simply by looking at them. These days many self-publishers recognise all this and hire someone to do the production for them -- self-publishers have become an important market for freelance editors & typesetters. Anything which eases the process for a bookshop is good, which is why most in the UK these days buy from a single wholesaler only. Back in the day when I was a publisher's rep (early 70s) shops in the UK would deal with scores of individual publishers -- a nightmare I imagine. Despite e-books, Amazon etc there are glimmers of a resurgence in small, well-curated bookshops -- or there was pre-Covid...

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Tom, I’m sorry I haven’t written much at all about small boats in the last six years. I have been busy adapting to life in a new country, and my sail & oar adventures have become special treats a few times a year rather than a regular diet. For whatever reason, I’ve mostly been keeping them to myself. I assume no one here cares about stories of sailing fiberglass racing dinghies at the club, so I don’t write about that either.

    Right now Rowan is in her garage in Anacortes, and I have no idea when, if ever, I will return to that failing plague-nation. She’s safe where she is though, and some day I’ll come get her.

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    I was going to say that the cruising reports are not as much fun when there's no-one to tell you how you are doing it wrong, but if James is checking in that should liven it up again .

    Hello James, you got out in time....

  8. #43
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    I would think there plenty of self appointed know it alls to help you will your unfounded confidence in your skill.
    Myself included.

    I do agree McMullen does it better.

    James,
    Would you consider trans pack self delivery of Rowan to give others a chance at unfounded criticism?

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    Makes me remember Dave Perillo's cruise in his Navigator. Anyone remember that, there used to be a great account online.
    He shipped the boat from NZ to Fiji and cruised the Yasawas for a few months. Time to come home he gave the boat away to a local family. It's still there working for a living, we saw it in 17 and went to see it at its market garden mooring last year. It's had a couple of bottoms in it since Dave had it, a cyclone or two did damage.
    20190708_102818.jpg
    Photo of Dave's Fiji Navigator taken about this time last year at it's home in the Yasawas.. The owner loves sailing, I laughed when in 17 he told me about taking goats to the lautoka market in it. Thats about 20 or 30 miles through a real system of reefs, seriously tricky piece of water.

  10. #45
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Tom, I’m sorry I haven’t written much at all about small boats in the last six years. I have been busy adapting to life in a new country, and my sail & oar adventures have become special treats a few times a year rather than a regular diet. For whatever reason, I’ve mostly been keeping them to myself. I assume no one here cares about stories of sailing fiberglass racing dinghies at the club, so I don’t write about that either.

    Right now Rowan is in her garage in Anacortes, and I have no idea when, if ever, I will return to that failing plague-nation. She’s safe where she is though, and some day I’ll come get her.
    James,

    welcome back! I hope your exile isn't permanent, both physical and/or Forum-wise. Has it really been six years already?

    I still harbor some faint hope of crossing paths with you and Rowan in the wild at some point, either in the PNW or the Great Lakes.

    Take care--I hope you're doing OK over there. I never made it more than 2 years in a row living overseas myself, but I can sure understand the attraction.

    Cheers,

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    I don't think I'll be likely to go back and live full time in North America any time soon, if ever. I'll probably still visit now and then once the death toll and political malfeasance subsides a bit though.

    I went sailing today at my club. Katie and I took out a Pacer for a couple of hours.

    I'm thinking of buying a Weta for our next boat, though. Warm water very much changes the sorts of shenannigans you're willing to get up to in lil' boats.



    Last edited by James McMullen; 07-21-2020 at 06:45 AM.

  12. #47
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    20190708_102818.jpg
    Photo of Dave's Fiji Navigator taken about this time last year at it's home in the Yasawas.. The owner loves sailing, I laughed when in 17 he told me about taking goats to the lautoka market in it. Thats about 20 or 30 miles through a real system of reefs, seriously tricky piece of water.
    I came across another photo of Daves boat, now owned by Toki and family. They have a market garden unlike anything you would expect to see, uphill and down, some valley, lots of interplanting of species as you do see in Fiji.
    This is 2017 alongside with some produce. We were at the end of the queue so choice was getting limited as I recall.
    FB_IMG_1596497795283.jpg

    I wonder if any other JW boat actually works for a living, this surely does.

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Great! Thanks, John.

  14. #49
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    We just got back from the Les Cheneaux Islands - Northeast of Mackinac Island in Michigan. The water was swimmable, some interesting destinations to visit, and delicious fish to catch and cook! We rented a cabin for five nights as a base camp and kept the boat on the beach. We did not quite get to Government Island which is the only island where backwoods camping is allowed, but we did a long hike on Marquette Island in the nature preserve there. We had really nice weather and nothing broke on the boat. Here are a few pictures:
    IMG_20200801_145758715_HDR.jpg

    We did not see another soul on Marquette Island

    Les cheneaux Islands 8-2-2020.jpg

    We caught the Pike in the narrow channel to the lower left in the picture

    IMG_20200801_132220159_HDR.jpg

    Maybe we will make it to Government Island next year! We are waiting for the Canadian border to open to do more exploring.

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Thanks for that, Steve! We're heading up there mid-September - renting a cabin with a dock on Snows Channel. We'll try for Government Island as we've sailed there from McKay Bay (east of Government Island). We also want to explore west of Hessel - just to see what there is to see.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Sorry about the image being sideways. Can't seem to rotate it or delete it...

    Photo is our Pathfinder in McKay Bay, Les Cheneaux Islands last August.

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Hi BobW,
    Have a great trip in September. Do you have any recommendations for other destinations in the Great Lakes?

  18. #53
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Yesterday I did 40.8 miles in my First Mate from Windmill Point to Gloucester Point over 10 hours. I've generally tried to avoid rowing, but it was a necessity on this trip at times. I'll make a thread once I have time to write it up.




  19. #54
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    I like your blog! Fair winds...

  20. #55
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Wow, that looks like a great trip. And great to come across someone else sailing in my home grounds. Glad to see someone is getting out, but especially there.


    Quote Originally Posted by The Jeff View Post
    Yesterday I did 40.8 miles in my First Mate from Windmill Point to Gloucester Point over 10 hours. I've generally tried to avoid rowing, but it was a necessity on this trip at times. I'll make a thread once I have time to write it up.




  21. #56
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by SailorSteve View Post
    Hi BobW,
    Have a great trip in September. Do you have any recommendations for other destinations in the Great Lakes?
    NOW you've done it! Bob will have his own ideas, no doubt, but as for me: recommendations? Oh, yeah.

    The North Channel, anywhere from Blind River, Ontario east to Killarney, Ontario is great. Particular favorites: the Turnbull Islands (7 mi east of Blind River); the Whalesback Channel and Beardrop Harbour (6 mi east of the Turnbulls); the Benjamin Islands/Fox Island group (20 mi east of Beardrop Harbour).

    Georgian Bay, begin in Killarney, Ontario and sail east and then south along the shore for as far as you can--FANTASTIC small boat sailing.

    A thread on a trip through both the eastern North Channel and Georgian Bay:

    http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...Bay&highlight=

    Pukwaska area of Lake Superior (NE corner)--haven't done this yet, deadly cold water, real wilderness, big exposure/big fetch, looks great but fairly challenging.

    Isle Royale--either a 20-mile hop from the west, or (if your boat is 18' or shorter) put the boat on the ferry from Houghton, Michigan (would need a hand-launchable boat). Haven't done this one yet either.

    Grand Island, Michigan--2 miles from shore in Munising (the Upper Peninsula). Camping available onshore, sandy beaches, sea caves/arches to sail/row under, little development and no motor vehicles on island.

    A thread on a Grand Island trip:

    http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...Oar&highlight=

    That oughta last you a while--great stuff for small boats.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  22. #57
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Jeff View Post
    Yesterday I did 40.8 miles in my First Mate from Windmill Point to Gloucester Point over 10 hours. I've generally tried to avoid rowing, but it was a necessity on this trip at times. I'll make a thread once I have time to write it up.
    Excellent--I look forward to hearing/seeing more about it.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Thanks SailorSteve.

    Barry, as I was going past Winter Harbor Haven I recalled some pictures you took of your beautiful Mellonseed at the house on the sandy island.

    Tom, I've got newfound appreciation of your long days in a small boat! haha.

  24. #59
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    IMG_6379.jpg

    IMG_6426.jpg

    Report: I went on a trip.
    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Yeadon is right, of course.

  25. #60
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Steve,

    I have some ideas but with little experience (as yet), no real recommendations. But...

    Grand Island off Munising is on my list (added after viewing Tom's thread when he first posted it).

    The multiple bays between Les Cheneaux Islands and the St Marys River offer decent anchorages and maybe (maybe not) shoreside camping. Those bays are, however, exposed to S, SE winds so exploring them would be weather-dependent. Of course, all of the Great Lakes destinations are weather-dependent, particularly for small boats.

    North and South Manitou Islands (10 and 14 miles off Leland, MI) in Lake Michigan look interesting. I'll be talking with a friend (who has a 36' boat and who has visited both) for info about these islands.

    Beaver Island, Garden Island, and Hog Island are in northern Lake Michigan 20 miles off mainland Michigan. Beaver Island has a good harbor but is more developed than one might like. Garden and Hog Islands are smaller and less developed (private?) than Beaver Island and may be better suited as anchorages for larger boats heading to the Straits. Again, my big boat friend will be my source of info.

    The Apostle Islands off Bayfield, Wisconsin, are an attractive destination. Not sure how they are in terms of developed or 'wild' but I think they'd be worth visiting.

    As Tom has shown us, the North Channel is a great destination. We are planning to trailer our boat to some spot in that area next summer to meet up with Andy (he of the 36' sailboat). My wife's family has ties to the founding of Killarney so we want to visit.

    Do you have any suggestions/recommendations for sailing destinations in Wisconsin's Great Lakes shores?

  26. #61
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by BobW View Post
    The Apostle Islands off Bayfield, Wisconsin, are an attractive destination. Not sure how they are in terms of developed or 'wild' but I think they'd be worth visiting.
    I only did one trip to the Apostles, a 2-person trip back in 2013. Haven't gone back yet. Nice enough, but lacks the craggy Canadian Shield granite I so love about Georgian Bay. And while they're not developed, they are extremely popular (crowded--you'll see multiple boats and people every day). So, given a chance for a trip, I head for Georgian Bay.

    The Apostles also have a fair bit of red tape if you want to camp ashore. You have to register for actual campsites, reserve them ahead of time, pay for them, and then stick to your registered itinerary. That just doesn't fit my MO for small boat cruising so well. That's my main reason for not doing more sailing there.

    Then, too, the water is too cold for long swims, which is something I really enjoy in the North Channel and Georgian Bay.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  27. #62
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    Absolutely nothing compares with seeing a sunk or semi submerged boat on a night passage to give a bad case of the willies. Seeing rocks under and around the boat in a flash light comes pretty close.......
    All of that sentence is terrifying.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  28. #63
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    Default Re: Where Are All the Small Boat Cruising Threads?

    Tom,

    Thanks for the info re the Apostle Islands. Since we don't have unlimited time to personally explore every possible destination, we rely on those who have been places before us - realizing that we have to filter such information through our own lens for our own needs.

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