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Thread: Small marine diesel install

  1. #71
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Schweiss View Post
    You can always use a pvc pipe to carry the water from the aft portions of the hull to forward of the engine room, thereby making the ER right for any diesel and oil spills.

    In the lovely picture of the engine sitting in its new home, it looks to be fairly tight up against the forward bulkhead? I am guessing that the raw water pump is on the front of the engine. Will there be access hatch in that forward bulkhead to allow service work?

    Lovely job you are doing.
    I've seen it done that way quite often and with fairly large engines too.If you split the pipe there is a much better chance of getting the last few drops to transfer through the semicircular tunnel you create.Then you can apply a couple of layers of glass cloth over the whole area and almost tot he top of the engine beds,which can be flow coated for easy clean up.

  2. #72
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Schweiss View Post
    You can always use a pvc pipe to carry the water from the aft portions of the hull to forward of the engine room, thereby making the ER right for any diesel and oil spills.
    thats what is was trying to say but you said it much betterer.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  3. #73
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    It’s been a while, I got sidetracked extending my shed (never big enough) and erecting a bird-proof veggie garden.

    C55BEFAE-4100-4678-AD24-032524923E9B.jpg03DAE9B8-7D1D-4684-9CE1-8192D4BEC995.jpg

    Anyway on to more important things. I’ve done a bit more on a couple of sides of install. I have the exhaust outlet and gooseneck fitted inside lazerette. Yes the g’neck is tilted back at the top but hopefully that shouldn’t matter. It’s up as high as I can get it so water has more trouble getting back up it. The exh outlet is about 6” above w’line.

    A8B94D8C-AA11-4312-92DD-3794165E88E2.jpeg946D715B-BD25-4A5A-907C-135FE8EC2139.jpeg

    cont....
    Attached Images Attached Images

  4. #74
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Does anyone know why I get those “attached thumbnails” at end of a post?

    Ive glassed and painted the bottom of engine bay and finished constructing the engine bearers. They have a side piece glued on to widen and a brace at the mid-point

    C3AFC13F-DFD3-43BC-90B3-ECBCCFB180D4.jpg

    Im now constructing the male mould to make a drip tray . Using 6mm MDF hot glued together. The narrow strips are 3mm spacers under mould to give the glass room to be built up on underside of mould. I had to cut the mould around the bearers but I’m imaging when the tray goes in I’ll seal it there. also cut some inspection hatches into quarter berths.

    CEBE7F6C-43F4-40F0-AA1D-BC3256EC2DC2.jpg8BD36CEE-DC2B-48AC-8532-9D478595AE3B.jpgBE1AFBF0-E551-4F87-B529-4A6B5230B53B.jpeg

    Today I’ll finish off gluing MDF and then I’ll fillet inside corners with builders bog so that I can curve-off underside corners for glass.
    You can maybe make out that tray will sit above level of limbers.
    Stay tuned
    Last edited by Andrew Donald; 10-06-2020 at 06:06 PM.

  5. #75
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Hi Andrew - will you be able to remove the drip tray after the engine is installed? I’m wondering about the need to make it so wide rather than simply confining it to the inside width of your engine bearers so that you could pull it out at any time to check under it and to clean it if you wanted to.

    Nice shed extension and veggie garden bye the way
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

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  6. #76
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Hi Greg. No it won’t come out not even if I made it smaller because the engine is sitting right down inside the bearers. I did like the idea of being able to remove it , even considered not having one but that would have meant sludge in the cabin via limbers. I posed the question to the board and it came down in favour of putting one in. One of those damned if I do ....... questions. This wider one may catch filter changes etc?

  7. #77
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    I like it a lot. I should have made mine wider and yes, great for catching spills. To clean, just put some water and detergent in it, swish it about, then extract the dirty water etc. with an extractor pump, the one used for extracting oil from the engine. They're very good things.
    Rick

    Lean and nosey like a ferret

  8. #78
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Thanks Rick. I spent about an hour getting it out of its position. All the spacers were wedging it in. There’s a lesson there

  9. #79
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Just took some more pics to show today’s stage.
    I glued in some more blocks and attached cross braces to stiffen it up

    B48C2EFD-36F7-47DB-B54F-9FEC681E124F.jpg

    then took it out of boat. After an hours fiddling getting the packers out from between it and well it was finally free. Tomorrow I’ll see about replacing those clamps with screws so I can get in to put the filler..

    D418DE40-7519-48B8-B076-133A6CC71908.jpg

    And this is the underside that will be the glass side which needs filling and rounding off

    32D0F697-C940-4062-A3D1-97FA9E40454C.jpg

  10. #80
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Coming on well, Andrew. Good work on the shed and garden too.

    Ian
    Old Joke: ‘A bench fitter works to the nearest thousandth of an inch. A loco fitter (steam) works to the nearest inch. A shipwright works to the nearest ship’.”
    Alan Byde, Canoe Design and Construction, Pelham Books, 1978

    “...old maxim, 'A fair line supersedes any given measurement'.”
    Allan H. Vaitses, Lofting, International Marine, 1980

  11. #81
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    What glass will you use, Andrew? And will you cover the mold in plastic or use a release agent?
    Rick

    Lean and nosey like a ferret

  12. #82
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    I’ve got some plain fibreglass , 6oz I think. Prob two or three layers and I may put some tape on too cos it’ll need to stand up a little cos the spacers I used to make the mould were 4mm.
    I’m just going to use packing tape as release.

  13. #83
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Packing tape is a good release agent - so easy! I've been using double bias glass for this sort of thing lately and I'm really happy with it. It goes around corners really well, saturates and collapses how I want it to.
    Rick

    Lean and nosey like a ferret

  14. #84
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Larks has the right idea of making the drip pan simple to remove and clean under. I might add that if you can afford it, making the pan of bronze plate will save a world of curising over rust and muck in the future. Also a spigot at the low end will
    save a thousand curses if it fills and must be drained.
    Jay

  15. #85
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    The boat I am currently swopping a Yanmar 2GM for a Beta 16 has a bit of flex pipe glassed in between the frames for and aft of the engine, so any spills are contained under the engine, up to around 30lts and any water from the seal would pass down to the bilge forward. (boat is that frozen stuff, but same applies)
    Coupling is a flex from R&D, but it makes lining up the engine very difficult. Tolerence is 0.25mm with feelers, but the coupling makes it virtually impossible to measure. So, I pulled it out and used some ally blocks as spacers to fill the gap and measure up.
    Should get it close to running up tomorrow. (Been a bit windy here, up the coast a bit, they clocked 100kts a couple of days ago...)

    Missed the 3rd page, Duh..

    Edit/ The coupling is an R&D
    Last edited by Andrew2; 10-09-2020 at 12:10 AM.

  16. #86
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Ok I have the mould filled and sanded ready for a layer of packaging tape as a release agent. You hopefully can see in photos that I’ve created a return lip on outside of the four ends. I’m worried that I won’t get mould out of finished glass layup so I’m going to do the four ends separately, only coming back onto body about 4 inches. Then I’ll do body as one piece and join ends to it. I may cut the mould into a top/bottom halves so that I can use bottom to align ends..
    Im probably making this way more complicated than it needs to be but “it is what it is”
    That “groove” in the tray is so it can fit over a frame

    1226FA49-9568-4669-80B5-A2C5D6286D58.jpg
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Andrew Donald; 10-08-2020 at 11:49 PM.

  17. #87
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Great looking work Andrew, Looks like it'll come up a treat.
    T
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  18. #88
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Back again with some progress. I’ve completed the drip tray and bearers. They are waiting to be permanently fitted while I finish the inspection hatches and finalise things like the siting of water inlet, fuel tank and filters and exhaust system.
    ‘I’ve taken some pics to show where I’m at and I think they’re pretty self explanatory.

    A20B222A-3C1C-472D-9B8A-FC9AEA78D51F.jpgEBF0014D-D29F-4EB2-9A6E-B24D86E1348A.jpeg

    99F9134A-8CE5-4453-A1D3-EDCB3AECEA9B.jpg4FD2B04A-6A29-43E8-9C79-603C550C60F1.jpeg

    D8E4981A-28EB-4D94-A20A-045711443783.jpg

  19. #89
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    The rest of engine bay will be painted white too and once I have bearers bolted in I’ll seal around tray edges with Sika 291.
    One last photo to show that there’s plenty of room around engine (for a 22’ er)

    D8067665-F525-4C01-B61B-2B9C02F25FCB.jpg

    Another major task is planning the bridgedeck, companionway and cockpit. So all up it’s going to be busy juggling all these things.

  20. #90
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Very nice work Andrew - I love it!!
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  21. #91
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    So do I! Beautiful job Andrew!
    Rick

    Lean and nosey like a ferret

  22. #92
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Thanks Greg and Rick.

    So I’ll write a little about the order of operations that I have taken to get this far.

    1.. first major undertaking is to bore the stern log for the tube. Usually this is drawn on the plans giving the angle but often that’s about all info you get. Sometimes a shaft diameter is given upon which must be added clearance and wall thickness of stern tube to end up with a final diameter. Shaft diameter can be influenced by prop pitch/diameter, Max rpms, distance from coupling to prop, and HP of engine. If the shaft is overlong a second bearing will be needed if you want to keep same diameter of shaft. Also to be thought about for larger engines perhaps is a CV joint such as Aquadrive but you will need something like 250mm length at least, also a bulkhead or frame to fasten the thrust part of this drive too.

    2.. mounting the engine is next, aided by string lines and as many tape measures that you have. It helps immensely to make-up a dummy engine from scrap wood. It should show the major dimensions and don’t forget the point of lowest extent of sump and put on a round plug representing the shaft coupling. This should also show where your mounts are with their bolt holes preferably. I made a pair of dummy bearers once I had a basic idea of where the engine would sit. Together these two dummy jigs will give you a lot of information to make your bearers and where/how you’re going to attach them. Now is the time I decided to make my f’glass drip tray providing clearance under, for limbers to run free. Most engine manufacturers pride good details of dimensions and installation manuals. I have a Nanni engine which is French and their manual is best used along with the Beta (English company) one which clears up a few questions. Beta and Nanni base some of their motors on the Kubota base engine.

    3.. Fitting all the ancillaries such as fuel system, ventilation in/out, seawater inlet for cooling, exhaust system, electrical, both instruments and battery charging.

    4.. Finally I have to build all the woodwork around and over the engine but that will come. Another consideration could be noise suppression through fitting of special insulation purchased.

    I hope this thread helps those that embark on this major undertaking. I will at some point review some of books and websites that have helped me too.
    Last edited by Andrew Donald; 10-30-2020 at 01:52 AM.

  23. #93
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Hell's bells, Andrew!

    You're going to be justly proud of this boat. What beautiful work.

    Cheers,
    John.
    http://fairmaid.blogspot.com.au/

    "It's dawning on me that I should have worked out the tumbler details more in advance, rather than rely on bluster and over confidence. But that's just silly." Jim Ledger.

  24. #94
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Thanks John, I’m keeping my other boat under a Tim-tam wrapper out the back
    Oughtred Feather pram. Due to lockdown it’ll stay there for a while.

  25. #95
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    shweet result Andrew. that came out perfect, well done.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  26. #96
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Looking very good Andrew ....neat and very well executed.
    PeterW

  27. #97
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    installation looks good Andrew. I fitted a 10hp nanni into the 17' Snapper boat designed by David Payne of Mosman, a few notes:
    1. The engine needs a fuel return pipe which runs from near the injectors back to the top of the fuel tank - I didn't do this initially (because I found the 'instructions' hard to understand) and ended up with 5 litres of diesel in the bilges!!
    2. Recommend you fit an isolator beside the battery - I did this and my battery does not discharge when it sits for weeks in the carport over winter.
    3. The control cables for the throttle and gearbox will bend around curves so long as you have curves with a nice large radius
    4, I've found the Nanni to be very reliable and has heaps of torque
    5. Talk to your engine supplier about the most appropriate propellor for your boat - wrong prop is very frustrating and a huge waste of money - www.vicprop.com was a website I found very helpful

    Good Luck and hope you get her in the water for summer Regards Neil

  28. #98
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Thanks for those pointers Neil. I already have the prop which was recommended by Austral in Sydney. I hope it’s pretty close but I’ve heard the pitch can be adjusted so time will tell.
    Dunno if it’ll be this summer even though once I get the engine done all I need is a tiller. Prob is once it’s in the water it’s outta the shed and it’d be even slower to get things done.

  29. #99
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    Default Re: Small marine diesel install

    Yeah, thats the classic dilemma.
    if you can keep it in the shed until fully done, do it! Definitely better.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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