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Thread: The Birth of the Night Heron

  1. #246
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    You are proceeding with care, I've no doubt you'll come up with something attractive!

  2. #247
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    I like the direction Joe, but I wonder about the balance of cockpit to cuddy cabin space. Is the helm placement fixed at this point? If it's not, and if you are committed to the golden ratio proportions, I wonder how it would work to reverse the arrangement of spaces so that the cockpit is the larger part of the equation? I've always liked this design as an example. It's a similar size to Night Heron and the larger cockpit seems more useful to me.


    - Chris

    Life is short. Go boating now!

  3. #248
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Arch Davis's Jiffy 22 is much like the Night Heron. Not sure you'll like the tall pilothouse, though...

    This is the Jiffy V-not the original flat bottom, but you get the idea.
    RobertMason.jpg

    Here's an original Jiffy 22

    jiffy2.jpg

    Colors that you choose for hull and deck make a difference in how the proportions look.

  4. #249
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    One more of the Jiffy 22, from abeam.

    robert-mason-2008-3.jpg

  5. #250
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan H View Post
    You are proceeding with care, I've no doubt you'll come up with something attractive!
    Hey Alan,
    Thank you for the vote of confidence. . . appreciate it!

    We're striving for a "cruiser friendly" layout for Night Heron as we hope to cruise the local shallow rivers, bays and barrier islands (or "keys") sweeping shallow beaches This makes the cockpit and cuddy/helm station take on a different dimension. Couple that to the flat bottom, proportioning for aesthetics and you've got a design conundrum as to space allocation and sizes.

    So, read on. . .

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  6. #251
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    I like the direction Joe, but I wonder about the balance of cockpit to cuddy cabin space. Is the helm placement fixed at this point? If it's not, and if you are committed to the golden ratio proportions, I wonder how it would work to reverse the arrangement of spaces so that the cockpit is the larger part of the equation? I've always liked this design as an example. It's a similar size to Night Heron and the larger cockpit seems more useful to me.


    Quote Originally Posted by Alan H View Post
    Arch Davis's Jiffy 22 is much like the Night Heron. Not sure you'll like the tall pilothouse, though...

    This is the Jiffy V-not the original flat bottom, but you get the idea.
    RobertMason.jpg

    Here's an original Jiffy 22

    jiffy2.jpg

    Colors that you choose for hull and deck make a difference in how the proportions look.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alan H View Post
    One more of the Jiffy 22, from abeam.

    robert-mason-2008-3.jpg

    Hey Chris and Alan,
    We normally don't answer posts with a multi-quote reply, but as your recommendations are similar. . .

    The ratio we are projecting for the cuddy cabin/helm station/open cockpit area is our best guess to address the ultimate purpose of the Night Heron. We built her for shallow water so that we could get into those areas where a normal "V" bottom couldn't go. As ex-rag sailors on a deep keeled sloop (great for blue water cruising) there were many beautiful areas we couldn't access - even with our hard bottomed "V bottomed" 8' (2.44m) dinghy.

    As you know, we're on a canal where the few "V's" that are used here must await high tide to slip their lines- for Night Heron low water is not an issue at 7" (18cm) draft. Our plan is to live on Night Heron for at least 4 nights straight cruising the river, beaches, "keys" and bays. My better half asked for a small two burner propane s/s cook-top, an ice chest with dry ice and a place to sleep in some comfort (Florida is very wet at times.) We promised her a porta-pottie not only for environmental reasons (the Myakka and Peace Rivers are pristine) but for some on-board decorum. A larger (height and length) cuddy is needed for these "amenities." The helm station is basically a sun protection feature as is the bimini behind it over the open cockpit. Fishing is not the number one priority although we'll do it for some (if we're lucky) fried fish breakfast, lunch or dinner!

    To entertain friends and family, after this C-19 issue is settled, we plan on doing no more than 4 additional persons on board for a total of 6, or 5 if the better half doesn't want to participate. These friends and family cruises will last 6 hours max during daylight only.

    That's the plan.

    The Jiffy 22 - The plan and photos of the boat looks short on cuddy cabin for extended cruising; she looks like a fishing day out and occasional overnighter. We believe our need for being comfortable at night or on the hook during the day cannot be met with this configuration. We're not married to the golden ratio; just because we'd like aesthetics for Night Heron doesn't mean we're going to forego comfort and practical purpose - but if both are achievable, or as close to each other as possible - great!

    We thank you both for your suggestions - we do appreciate your taking the time to give us another dimension for the Night Heron's topside design. Hang in there guys we still have a lot of design issues to tackle and the more suggestions we get the better!

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  7. #252
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 29 November, 2020
    Weekly Build Update

    Hey All,
    It was a heck of a week that due to a finish drying failure, we were forced to do design work not programmed for this time-frame. Triggered by that unexpected event, we went from transom and middle grate finishing to taking a shot at the cuddy cabin/helm and cockpit layout and making a "trial post and cabin crossbeam assembly."

    Weather-wise, we were blessed with a dry, rain-free week that was conducive to good laborious, manual work. It was not a week meant for "design work" indoors!

    Anyway here is the story. . .

    Monday and Tuesday's Tasks
    Monday and Tuesday Tasks.jpg
    1 - On this Monday morning, 23 November, photo shows the transom center floor grate missing. Well, it was because it hadn't been reconfigured yet;
    2 - Cutting the center grate to size was a tiring task with multiple trips to the boat and climbing over the side to insure that the thing was easy to install and remove while ensuring it wouldn't move underfoot;
    3 - After all that effort on Monday, we were finally able to finish the center grate on Tuesday. The center grate hold-down, seen in photo 1, in front of the battery box, was also cut to size, and:
    4 - On Tuesday night the still tacky center grate was dry fitted inside the hull but little did we know that for some reason, the finish did not harden as expected.

    Wednesday's Task
    Cuddy Cabin - Helm Station Dimensions Wednesday.jpg
    So, on Wednesday we went to design mode and after a day of "doodling" we came up with these general dimensions (subject to change) and posted the process as a "Design Update." The design got mixed reviews but, nevertheless, we appreciated the recommendations.

    Thursday
    Roasted Lamb Chops.jpg
    We don't do Turkey. . . we went for the Roasted Lamb with a Mediterranean accompaniment of couscous, baked bell peppers with mushrooms and tomatoes, homemade pita bread and hummus. The wine had to be a Chianti - Antinori Chianti Classico Reserva. (Uncompensated Recommendation)

    Friday and Saturday
    Friday and Saturday Task.jpg
    1 - We did a sketch of the general configuration of the vertical posts and crossbeams for the cuddy cabin and posted it on the "Design Update" on 26 November;
    2 - The verticals became reality on Friday, made from SYP scrap wood we had on hand. Here they are in their "raw state" awaiting sanding;
    3 - The arched crossbeam was drawn on a 2" x 6" x 96" (5cm x 15cm x 2.44m) SYP plank using a bow we made from a wood slat and string bent to provide a 3" (75mm) arch at the center (the height we wanted for the crossbeam.) Using a bow makes for a quick arch - for those wanting a scientific approach, we refer you to the "cabin construction advice needed" post initiated by Bernadette on 28 March 2020, where Debenriver so beautifully posted the sketch and math. The photo shows the plank, the bow (exaggerated for the shot) and the machines used to cut and shape the resultant beam shown at the bottom. BTW, we double checked the dimensions across the drawn arch every 4" (100mm) end to end and they were within 1/32" (.8mm) that we found acceptable, and:
    4 - We set the unfinished crossbeam (needs final sanding) across the hull to ascertain the dimension - this is beam 5 of 6 (6 being a "half beam" affixed to the helm stanchion.)

    That's how the week went by. . . overall, well, you be the judge.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 11-29-2020 at 11:23 AM.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  8. #253
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Looking good! It's funny how parallel some things are, as I struggle to get the proportions right for the helm station and bimini. I was mocking up a bimini on my project and there are a lot of factors - being able to walk under it, attachment points, ease of storage, aesthetics, functionality, size, etc. The bimini height I ended up with was 78", only 4" different! I think it comes down to the problem of the non shrinking human...on a larger vessel it is easier to make the lines and proportions whatever the designer fancies, but on smaller boats we are restricted by our own size. I don't have a cabin top, so the bimini is going to extend to the windshield. I think having a removable section between the bimini and the windshield would be useful. How are you going to connect the cabin top to the bimini?

    I like the the proposed cabin, I think your drawings are very helpful in visualizing any aesthetic issues that might pop up, rather than noticing after some wood has been glued. I notice that in many professional designs the windshield rake is much more than I would expect, the ClipperCraft included.

  9. #254
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by Powerwagon View Post
    Looking good! It's funny how parallel some things are, as I struggle to get the proportions right for the helm station and bimini. I was mocking up a bimini on my project and there are a lot of factors - being able to walk under it, attachment points, ease of storage, aesthetics, functionality, size, etc. The bimini height I ended up with was 78", only 4" different! I think it comes down to the problem of the non shrinking human...on a larger vessel it is easier to make the lines and proportions whatever the designer fancies, but on smaller boats we are restricted by our own size. I don't have a cabin top, so the bimini is going to extend to the windshield. I think having a removable section between the bimini and the windshield would be useful. How are you going to connect the cabin top to the bimini?

    I like the the proposed cabin, I think your drawings are very helpful in visualizing any aesthetic issues that might pop up, rather than noticing after some wood has been glued. I notice that in many professional designs the windshield rake is much more than I would expect, the ClipperCraft included.
    Hey Powerwagon,
    Thank you for the comment - hopefully the sketch will become a reality soon!

    Our "struggle" to get the bimini dimensions and anchor points right is exacerbated because we're building or modifying "custom boats" whereas commercial builders are making these for boaters using standardize configurations acceptable to the general public. As we are doing customization, we should build for our heights, girths (or lack of) and particular body attributes - not for our kids, brothers/sisters or friend's body ergonomics.

    Aesthetics and functionality as you note are important but more than that is our own comfort. We went to 72" (1.82m) on the inside of the helm and bimini interior height because with normal heel shoes (not low heeled Sperry Topsiders or equivalent) our height is 70" or 5' -10" (1.77m). We may go another 2 inches (50mm) if this height feels "too low." The bimini we were gifted has to be modified as the beam of Night Heron is wider than the aluminum frame. So, we will widen it and use a 7 point anchoring method with 2 straps to either side (4 total) and 3 from the top forward pipe to the helm station frame. [see sketch attached.]

    BTW, we do sketches and simple drawings because when we cut wood or make an assembly we use manual or electric hand tools - we don't have a fancy shop with woodworking tools of the first order - like some of our more fortunate forum members. [see photo attached.] So, everything we make or build is "handmade", meaning time consuming, not to mention materials waste if we make a mistake. We also try to make our sketches simple - we were taught to use KISS not only at home but at the university too.

    Finally, as to windshield rake - too slanted or "reverse slanted" is not what we're looking for. There has to be a "happy medium" out there and we're still searching the various wood boat windshield designs on the web. And that's it. . . we think we addressed your, and our, concerns.

    Night Heron Cabin Helm Bimini Concept.jpg
    General Layout of Cuddy Cabin/Helm Station and Bimini (not to scale)

    Our Outdoors Shop.jpg
    Our Outdoors No Shop

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 12-02-2020 at 11:11 AM.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  10. #255
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 6 December, 2020
    Weekly Build Update

    Hello Everyone,
    We just changed our salutation because the wordsmiths now consider "Hey" an irritating way to start an e-mail. . . go figure.

    Anyway, our week started out with a wet Monday and when that happens - we doodle! This time we posted our doodle in a reply to Powerwagon who is also in that design quandary we found ourselves in too - comfort versus aesthetics.

    Tuesday wasn't wet - it was freaking cold in the morning; it started at 38 degrees F (3.33 C) and at my age. . . well we waited till mid-day to set up our "Outdoor No Shop." Here is the week in photos:

    Monday and Tuesday
    Monday Tuesday Tasks.jpg
    1 - This was the doodle we posted - a top view of Night Heron showing how we plan on building and assembling the cuddy cabin/helm station/bimini;
    2 - On Tuesday we used the post and cabin crossbeam design and went at it for a number of hours that resulted in 3 and 4, below;
    3 - After cutting another crossbeam we photographed how we form it using the belt sander to shape to the line, and:
    4 - Two crossbeams were sanded to form the arched shape - they still need the ends to be cut to form the tongues. Also in the photo - a pesticide to keep the ants at bay.

    Wednesday and Thursday
    Wednesday Thursday Tasks.jpg
    1 - The posts for the crossbeams were all sanded smooth and taken to final dimension after the grooves were rechecked for fit;
    2 - Posts all sanded and identified for position - the crossbeams number 2, 3, 4 and 5 (1 and 6 are last on the list) on the ladder sanded to dimension awaiting tongues;
    3 - We edge-glued a panel for the infamous locker doors (2 from this panel) we're still working on. . . here shown clamped down on the flattop of the table saw, and:
    4 - The edge-glued panel on Thursday morning getting sanded prior to "epoxy glassing" that occurred an hour later.

    Friday and Saturday
    Friday Saturday Tasks.jpg
    1 - The locker door panel on Friday morning, fiber-glassed on one side and awaiting penetrating epoxy on the other side prior to the homemade finishing compound;
    2 - Dry fitting number 5 crossbeam to verify dimensions and placement prior to glueing the tongue and groove ends with epoxy;
    3 - Fixing the angles, and dimensions of number 5 crossbeam on our simple plank beam setup gauge. The beam heights are checked every 4 inches (100mm) to determine consistency. We were able to achieve +/- 1/32 inch (0.8mm) on the height long the width and 5 degrees from the bottom of the post to the top of the beam. Yes, it was very time consuming as it involved setting and resetting, and;
    4 - Saturday was slipway re-orienting day as we were not happy with the slipway to winch cable alignment. . . we also took the opportunity to change a few tires on the slipway that had small rips in them. At a 4 dollars (3.3 euros) each, the 3 tire task was not too painful.

    A parting photo of one of our visitors as we slipped Night Heron, very carefully, into the water on Saturday morning. . .
    Wellington Jackson Visits.jpg

    All in all, it was a very good week.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 12-06-2020 at 09:24 AM. Reason: spelling
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  11. #256
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Hey Joe,

    Now they can't complain about using the title of that Billy Roberts song that Hendrix sent to the top of the charts can they? That just doesn't compute.

    Anyway, love seeing your progress, fancy your accuracy (1/32"), and enjoy all the photo's. But it seems to me that you're in kind of a tough hood. Slipway tires getting ripped up by gators who hang around after the fact just to see your reaction? MMMMmmmmm, I hope the supervisor has a high perch!

    Thanks and keep up the good work!

    Eric
    “Retiring feels like death of self, but I'm looking forward to the rebirth - The opportunity to re-imagine my purpose.”

    Michael Bennett

  12. #257
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by FishoutaFlorida View Post
    Hey Joe,

    Now they can't complain about using the title of that Billy Roberts song that Hendrix sent to the top of the charts can they? That just doesn't compute.

    Anyway, love seeing your progress, fancy your accuracy (1/32"), and enjoy all the photo's. But it seems to me that you're in kind of a tough hood. Slipway tires getting ripped up by gators who hang around after the fact just to see your reaction? MMMMmmmmm, I hope the supervisor has a high perch!

    Thanks and keep up the good work!

    Eric
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Hello Eric,
    Good to hear from you. . .

    Today, Tuesday, is freaking cold and windy again (42 F, or 5.5 C) after a wet Monday (yesterday) that hit us with two showers - one in the morning and one at mid-day. . . we feel we're in that 1990's Bill Murray/Andie MacDowell movie, Groundhog Day. We don't know if Divine Providence is sending us a message to become better persons by repeating Monday and Tuesday. . . can't wait for next week to see what happens as we feel three repeats will definitely seal that question.

    Your reference to the 1970's Billy Roberts song, Hey Joe, sent us back to the web to listen to it once again as we remotely remembered it. BTW, that Joe shot his girlfriend and absconded to Mexico! We're happy with our first mate and sea-wife and, hopefully, we won't fall into that dilemma. It was a quick-witted way to respond - good show!

    And in response to your remarks. . .

    Working to a tight dimension for the cuddy cabin framework is our attempt to have a decently proportioned and level topside. This photo, not included in Sunday's post, shows our "hash-marks" on the plank beam setup that helps us maintain uniformity across all the crossbeam's heights. We know that a 1/32" (0.8mm) is excessive, especially when these crossbeams will have to be shaped to slope forward. . . chalk it up to my compulsive nature.
    Crossbeam Dim Check.jpg

    Our slipway's inflatable tires were ripped by Night Heron's bottom strakes, not by Wellington Jackson - here is the latest photo showing why the feathered one is safe from the jaws of that silent menace. The high perch suits the Supervisor well as he has a full 360 field of vision; he's the only one allowed to peek over my shoulder, [Photo taken through the Lanai window by the Better Half.]
    The Supervisors Overview.jpg

    Almost forgot to mention - we did not doodle on Monday as we normally would on rainy days - instead we did an "inventory list" in the morning and a quick trip to, and a slow stroll through, the big box store to replenish the sanding and finishing supplies.

    Finally. . . you'll find us in our Outdoors No Shop in a few hours once the Sun does it's job on the temperature. . . post ya Sunday!

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  13. #258
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Love the picture of the supervisor!

  14. #259
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan H View Post
    Love the picture of the supervisor!
    Hello Alan,
    This post is for you and those ornithology aficionados or in plain English, bird watchers, who like Black-crowned Night Herons. . .

    The Supervisor being hand fed.
    Hand Feeding The Supervisor.jpg

    The Supervisor being stick fed due to height restraints (Better Half is too short.)
    Stick Feeding The Supervisor.jpg

    Our favorite "portrait" of The Supervisor
    The Supervisor.jpg

    Our other favorite Night Heron
    Leaving For River.jpg

    We'll be posting our regular build update, tomorrow, Sunday, 13 November. . . have a great Saturday everyone!

    Stay safe, stay healthy!

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 12-12-2020 at 09:32 AM. Reason: missing text
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  15. #260
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    That's a handsome bird. Handsome boat too!
    - Chris

    Life is short. Go boating now!

  16. #261
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    That's a handsome bird. Handsome boat too!
    Hello Chris,
    Thank you for the feathered one and the wet one!

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  17. #262
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 13 December, 2020
    Weekly Build Update

    Hello Everyone,
    We had a Groundhog Day moment for two days this last week as we mentioned in one of our midweek post replies. . .

    Undaunted by the cold weather we soldiered on. . . [Jeez, sounds like a good opening for a war novel.] Anyway, our body only functions well between 55° F (13° C) and 80° F (27° C) in our Outdoors No Shop. We did get in a decent number of hours starting on Tuesday afternoon through Thursday - starting around 1100 hours every morning as the Sun warmed up the yard. Friday and Saturday were spectacular - we got in a full 7 hours per day doing something that took almost all that time to do - mounting 3 cuddy cabin crossbeams!

    Here's the scorecard for the week. . .

    Monday - rain.

    Tuesday to Thursday
    Blog Presentation 13 Dec.jpg
    1 - We had one crossbeam (number 5) at the end of the previous week; so we continued with the crossbeam project this week as well. By Wednesday evening we had finished making 4 more. The photo shows them prior to epoxy filling and getting the penetrating epoxy finish;
    2 - Photo 2 shows all 5 crossbeams filled and finished with epoxy;
    3 - This is a "file photo" of the transom seating area and lockers - it still looks the same this week as it did 2 weeks ago - yeah, still waiting for the doors and the 2 floor strakes to finish the task, and:
    4 - Here are the 2 locker doors after getting smeared with our homemade finishing compound drying beneath the crossbeams. Maybe this coming week???

    Detail of Crossbeams
    Epoxy Coated & Filled Crevices & Pockets.jpg
    This photo shows the wood flour/cabosil/epoxy fill used to strengthen the tongue and groove corners we purposely left gaped so as to make the angles easier to obtain from the post bottom to the crossbeam top.

    Friday and Saturday
    Saturday Afternoon.jpg
    It's hard to believe that we spent 10 hours, starting on Friday afternoon through Saturday afternoon, mounting 3 crossbeams. Time just slipped by surreptitiously [wow, what a word!] although we did feel tired after moving back and forth from starboard to port at least 6 times per crossbeam. Adjusting heights, angles and dimensions were a bear.

    This coming week we hope to mount the 2 front crossbeams before tackling the floor strakes and infamous locker doors.

    Please Divine Providence. . . no more Groundhog Days!

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  18. #263
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Monday, 14 December 2020
    ERRATUM

    Hello Everyone,
    On Sunday's Build Update, above, the text referring to photo 4 of the Tuesday to Thursday composite, was erroneous - it identified the topping of the locker doors as "our homemade finishing compound". . . it should have read "our homemade fairing compound."

    Must be old age rearing it's ugly head, anyway, we don't do fake news!

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  19. #264
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    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 20 December, 2020
    Weekly Build Update

    Hello Everyone,
    The Suncoast lived up to it's name this week with beautiful days, albeit with chilly mornings and one very cold day (for us) on Friday, 17 December. But enough of the weather reporting. . .

    Monday and Tuesday
    Monday and Tuesday.jpg
    1 - Last week we posted a final photo of the Night Heron with only 3 cabin top frames affixed to the carlins. On Monday we finished mounting the other 2 and began mechanically and permanently fixing them and applying thickened epoxy;
    2 - Frame number 5 post embedded in epoxy into the starboard carlin;
    3 - The frames were re-checked for accurate spacing with a story stick prior to embedding them in epoxy, and:
    4 - By Tuesday night all the frames had been embedded in epoxy and let to dry.

    Wednesday
    Wednesday.jpg
    1 - Starboard frames were checked for cured epoxy, sturdiness and dimensions (to notes) prior to fairing;
    2 - Starboard frames faired and rechecked for fairness from frame 5 to frame 1;
    3 - Port frames were also checked in conjunction with the starboard as these have to match precisely, and finally:
    4 - The port frames were faired and checked for fairness from frame 5 to frame 1.

    Thursday
    Thursday.jpg
    1 - Fairing the crossbeam to the required and predetermined penciled slope line using the belt sander;
    2 - Checking the slope from one frame to the other with a steel square that is also used to check for straightness across the top;
    3 - Checking the faired crossbeam slope with the story stick from frame 5 to frame 1, and;
    4 - Rounding the bottoms of the crossbeams so as to prevent those "oh s**t!" moments we are prone to suffer when rummaging through a low cabin.

    Friday
    Friday.jpg

    It was a cold Friday. . .

    Saturday
    Saturday.jpg
    1 - Using our Friday sketch we conducted a few tests on Saturday morning cutting the slats to various angles before settling on a 15° angle. 15° provides a better fit around the varying radii of the post/crossbeam frames and are able to bend to fit the contour of the cabin;
    2 - The slats dry fitted to the top of the starboard side frames to determine how to mount them effectively to minimize the required sanding to fair them into a "rounded corner";
    3 - The slats dry fitted to the port side of the frames - we found that they will conform to the radii of each frame and bend as needed, but require individual mounting - a task that is both messy and time consuming as epoxy is the bonding agent. We'll use pins to mechanically hold them in place as they bond to each other and each frame's geometry, and:
    4 - A bow photo showing the slats dry fitted to both sides of the cabin top - assembly to begin shortly after we first cut the 1/2" (12mm) thick plywood top and sides to size and router the overlapping flaps that go over the slats. The flaps will be moistened to make shaping over the faired slats easier.

    And that was our very productive week - if any crew members on the forum have experience with these processes. . . well, we would appreciate your tips or ideas that can make these tasks easier to handle.

    Merry Christmas, and a belated Hanukkah to all.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 12-20-2020 at 10:01 AM. Reason: Missing photos
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  20. #265
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    Jan 2013
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    11,618

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Looking great!

    i'm really enjoying this thread.
    Skip

    ---This post is delivered with righteous passion and with a solemn southern directness --
    ...........fighting against the deliberate polarization of politics...

  21. #266
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    Jan 2017
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    South Patrick Shores, USA
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    710

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Looking good Joe!

    With regard to your slat corners, your process is very similar to what I used to build the rails of a hollow wood surfboard. The process as developed by Chad Stone/Timeless Surf Company.com is shown in his book "Building Your Hollow Wood Surfboard". The idea is to use triangular slats to build up a curved rail which is then carved down to the correct shape. Here is an illustration from the book:

    Rail Construction.jpg

    Your process should work great. May be a bit tough to cut the plys out of the ply to get that overlap, but I have trouble cutting plywood anyway, so that may be a moot point.

    Thanks and keep up the good work!
    “Retiring feels like death of self, but I'm looking forward to the rebirth - The opportunity to re-imagine my purpose.”

    Michael Bennett

  22. #267
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
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    Zbigit
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    2,101

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Oh the lines defined by your beams look good. Yeah, this is going to be a nice looking cabin. Which it had better, because the Supervisor is one good looking heron!

  23. #268
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Posts
    250

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Lookin good!
    Are you going to put a hatch up front? Just wondering about access to bow while on the water for anchor, lines, docking etc. Side deck is angled so might need a toerail if walking around cabin. A hatch would give safe access and great ventilation.

  24. #269
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by SKIP KILPATRICK View Post
    Looking great!

    i'm really enjoying this thread.
    Hello Skip,
    Thank you for staying aboard with us. . . highly appreciated!

    Hopefully, this weeks build will be more interesting as we tackle the cabin with determination - while pulling the few hairs left on our head, out.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  25. #270
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    [QUOTE=FishoutaFlorida;6345055]Looking good Joe!

    With regard to your slat corners, your process is very similar to what I used to build the rails of a hollow wood surfboard. The process as developed by Chad Stone/Timeless Surf Company.com is shown in his book "Building Your Hollow Wood Surfboard". The idea is to use triangular slats to build up a curved rail which is then carved down to the correct shape. Here is an illustration from the book:

    Rail Construction.jpg

    Your process should work great. May be a bit tough to cut the plys out of the ply to get that overlap, but I have trouble cutting plywood anyway, so that may be a moot point.

    Thanks and keep up the good work![/QUOTEks fbr />

    Hello Eric,
    First, thanks for the kind words, it's always encouraging. . .

    We visited the site of Timeless Surf and they have a really neat way to make rounded and oblong edges for the surfboards from scratch, thanks for the heads up. This is good information for future reference as we continue to explore "rounding out corners."

    As for our effort - we just went with simple geometry - "find the cord" of the arc and a practical cut of 8 long slats (24 pieces) at 10°, 15° and 20° to experiment between three crossbeams to ascertain the best fit. The changing arc geometry from one post/crossbeam to the next made for a few hours of cutting and mounting as the height of the slats were fixed at 1/2" (12mm) to be consistent with the ply panels we intend to use. BTW, the cabin will have 8 slats per side to make the rounded corner with 15° angles.

    In response to your plywood point. . . Cutting the plywood to make a flap of the face is a challenge! The router is our weapon of choice for this one with a homemade fixture to insure a clean cut to height and maintain consistency. We know going in that we're bound to make a few "oops" and "oh s**ts" but if we don't try we'll never know if it's possible or if we're capable of doing something like this. Stay tuned.

    Stay safe stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 12-23-2020 at 10:05 AM. Reason: spelling
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  26. #271
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
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    North Port, Florida, USA
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    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan H View Post
    Oh the lines defined by your beams look good. Yeah, this is going to be a nice looking cabin. Which it had better, because the Supervisor is one good looking heron!
    Hello Alan,
    Thank you from us and the feathered one! Quoting an old idiom - "From your mouth to God's ears."

    This week will define the cabin as the sides go up and the slats get stuck. . . stay tuned.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  27. #272
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by gray duck View Post
    Lookin good!
    Are you going to put a hatch up front? Just wondering about access to bow while on the water for anchor, lines, docking etc. Side deck is angled so might need a toerail if walking around cabin. A hatch would give safe access and great ventilation.

    Hello gray duck,
    Yes, you're right on both points!

    The cabin will have a hatch very close to the bow's hawsepipe so that we can safely weigh anchor standing up through the hatch. We purchased a small Bruce anchor with an anchor bow roller cradle for this purpose; being at "arm's length" makes for safe ground tackle handling especially from our local apex predator, the American Alligator, that sits at the top of the food chain. A few posts back we uploaded a photo of our local, favorite water predator, Wellington Jackson, swimming behind Night Heron as we lowed her into the canal. . . yeah, we get it, from both a convenience and safety viewpoint.

    And on your second point - the entire "sloped deck" around the cabin will have a toe rail so that only planned dives are effected off the deck. We'll be making cabin top wood hand rails too - for safety's sake and prevent being lunch for our water friends, or antagonists, as the case may be.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 12-23-2020 at 10:43 AM. Reason: spelling
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  28. #273
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 27 December, 2020
    Weekly Build Update

    Hello Everyone,
    It was a very cool and cold week on the Suncoast but in-spite of that we were able to get some work done. We also lost a half day trying to find where our promised epoxy package was delivered as we face a "materials shortage" of sorts. . . it was delivered to a neighbor down the street who "forgot" to tell us after three days at their house.

    Anyhow, here is the week in photos. . .

    Monday and Tuesday
    Monday and Tuesday.jpg
    1 - Using our sophisticated cutting jig we cut a blank from 1/4 inch (6mm) thin plywood for the cuddy cabin side pattern. . . just one pattern was cut as both the starboard and port sides are, within tolerances, equal;
    2 - With our state of the art scribing tool we made our initial cut line for the bottom of the pattern;
    3 - Our oldie but goody Wen jigsaw cut the blank to conform to deck profile, and:
    4 - The yellow number 2 pencil was the final scribing tool to "finesse" or refine the pattern bottom.

    Wednesday
    Wednesday.jpg
    1 - On Wednesday morning we mounted the detailed pattern to ascertain the top edge height required for mounting the strips to round out the top corner of the cabin;
    2 - We mixed our last 4 ounces (118ml) of resin and 2 ounces (59ml) of hardener, 6 ounces (177ml) total,to adhere the first, port, panel. We had ordered the epoxy with three weeks anticipation (because of Xmas shipping issues) and when we did not get it - we had to track it to a neighbor's house where it had been for three days!;
    3 - After the epoxy rescue, we traced the finished pattern to a 1/2 inch (12mm) thick plywood panel and cut both walls. After sanding to smooth out ridges, we mounted the port and starboard panels with thickened epoxy and bronze silicon screws to the frames, and;
    4 - As twilight fell we were able to start sealing the bottoms and screw holes with our wood flour thickened epoxy.

    Thursday
    Thursday.jpg
    1 - The task of filling the internal seams with the wood flour thickened epoxy continued on Thursday morning;
    2 - The port side was started as well but as it was a "half day" due to Christmas Eve, we did not finish the task;
    3 - Here is Night Heron as left her on Thursday afternoon, around 1400 hours, and:
    4 - Here is Christmas dinner, Spinach and Ricotta Stuffed Cannelloni served with a Çoban salatası (Turkish Choban Salad) and an unpretentious red Greek wine, Kotrotsos Agiorgitiko.

    Friday
    Friday.jpg

    Saturday
    Saturday.jpg
    1 - We spent Saturday cutting and assembling frame number 6 - or "half frame" and the corner posts;
    2 - The frame and posts were dry fitted to refine the dimensions that are required for 2 corners where the helm is merged to the cabin's starboard side;
    3 - The tongue and groove end for the arched top beam to post assembly was manually cut as well, and;
    4 - The dry fitted 6th half frame/corner assembly as of Saturday afternoon, awaiting epoxy and subsequent wood flour filling and seaming.

    That was our week, we pray you and yours have had as good, or better, week as well.

    We wish all the forum members a very prosperous 2021.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  29. #274
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 3 January, 2021
    Weekly Build Update

    Hello Everyone,
    We hope everyone has had an excellent New Year's Eve and Day - and we wish all the forum members the best for 2021.

    The week was full of excellent weather days but due to the "holidays" and our slipway's needed modifications, our productivity on Night Heron has been awful.

    The Slipway
    A few weeks ago we modified the land portion of the slipway and that turned out well; however, the "wet" part's structure became too light as the weight of Night Heron increased. Time to reinforce and make a stronger structure to hold the weight.

    On the morning of the 29 December, Tuesday, we started to pull onto land the "wet slipway" with our winch and the better half who was feeding the Supervisor, asked - "Why are you pulling that thingy out of the water?" We replied - "Cause Night Heron picked up weight over the holidays as we have and the structure can't hold that much weight."

    That night we got 2 Nathan's hotdogs and buns with French's Yellow Mustard, no sauerkraut, and a few French fries and a Diet Dr. Pepper in lieu of the homemade sushi and saki wine promised earlier in the day. BTW, the better half learned to make real sushi from the first mate aboard the Japanese flagged sailboat ホーム丸 (Home Maru) a 38' (11.5M) Pearson, Home Port, Kyoto, Japan. We met Asahi and Youta while anchoring in the crystal clear waters of Montijo Gulf on the Southern shore of Panama. [We've never come across another Japanese flagged sailboat after that and to this day.] Ah. . . so much for reminiscences and saying dumb things about weight, especially to our first mates.

    The Old Wet Slipway Frame
    Wet Slipway Frame.jpg
    When we first built Night Heron she was a light 650 pound (295kg) boat so our wet slipway's frame was an easy to build, light structure too. However, as our plans became more precise and on-board accommodations became "must haves" so too did her weight begin to increase- to the point where the light structure was inadequate. Back to the drawing board - yes, being "old school" we have a real drawing board with "T" square, triangles, mechanical pencils, drafting paper and such. Here is that Monday's doodling session.

    The New Wet Slipway Frame
    New Wet Slipway Frame.jpg
    The first thing we did was add 10 additional plastic wheels to rotate around galvanized rod axles bolted and indexed along water resistant wood runs. That was a necessity as the added weight of the boat will not make the wheels sag as the wood becomes waterlogged, as it did when we only used bolts. We also increased the number of runs from three to four to make the transition from wet to dry slipway smoother and easier on Night Heron's bottom and our electric winch. A gradual sloping of the wheels from "0" level at mid tide to 2 inches (50mm) at the entry wheels to the dry structure helped to lower the entry level to the front of the wet slipway. In other words, we are now able to launch and retrieve Night Heron at a lower tide level. The 10 plastic wheels added are rated for 1100 pounds (499kg) service each, four across in two rows and two at the third row, that should be more than necessary to take the expected 1200 pounds wet weight of Night Heron as she transfers from wet to dry slipway wheels.

    Drying her bottom
    Transition from Wet to Dry.jpg
    Here is a photo of Nigh Heron back on her perch drying her bottom after four days and three nights tied to the dock. The "ride" up the wet slip was smoother than anticipated and rewarding too as every wheel performed as expected. Oh, BTW - not one drop of water inside her. . .

    That was our week. . . more slipway and less boat build. . . but well worth the effort.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    Last edited by Kapiteinterzee; 01-03-2021 at 02:45 PM.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  30. #275
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW Washington/ At Sea
    Posts
    470

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Slipway is looking beefy! I like the progression of design, seems like that is usually the way a perfect setup is developed. I like the idea of the slipway too...very easy to work on and modify.

    Your post describing a 10 hour day to place three deck beams sounds about right! It's funny how much goes into construction that isn't visible, especially if you get it right. It just looks like it was meant to be that way. The aft facing seats on my project are taking forever to build for similar reasons...improvements and modifications to get it 'right'. Your hatch project is also something we are working on. We found a cool old round aluminum hatch and had it refinished, now we're making a wooden 'donut' for it to mount on. Sculpting the camber of the deck into the bottom of the donut has been time consuming (still not done). I'm interested to see how you tackle this next step.

    Thanks again for posting!

  31. #276
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
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    Zbigit
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    2,101

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Your gangway / slipway is the subject of much jealousy here!

    The cabin looks to have a lot more interior space than I thought it was going to!

  32. #277
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by Powerwagon View Post
    Slipway is looking beefy! I like the progression of design, seems like that is usually the way a perfect setup is developed. I like the idea of the slipway too...very easy to work on and modify.

    Your post describing a 10 hour day to place three deck beams sounds about right! It's funny how much goes into construction that isn't visible, especially if you get it right. It just looks like it was meant to be that way. The aft facing seats on my project are taking forever to build for similar reasons...improvements and modifications to get it 'right'. Your hatch project is also something we are working on. We found a cool old round aluminum hatch and had it refinished, now we're making a wooden 'donut' for it to mount on. Sculpting the camber of the deck into the bottom of the donut has been time consuming (still not done). I'm interested to see how you tackle this next step.

    Thanks again for posting!
    Hello Powerwagon,
    Yes, we had to beef up the framework of the "wet" part of the slipway as the weight of Night Heron increased; this time we calculated for 2000 pounds (807kg) although Night Heron will probably come in around 1200 pounds (544kg) on the high end. It took 3 1/2 days and getting wet to make these changes. Hope not to do this again soon!

    Getting the beams and posts "squared" was a slow, exhausting task that really tired us. . . and you're right - it isn't visible and that in-itself is frustrating. We don't doubt that your seats will take time - ours did too. On the job "running changes" are inevitable when you design and build something that has never been detailed, drawn or built by others.

    The hatch is a case in point. . . here is how we're going to "round corner" the thing":

    Round Corner Sketch
    Making a Round Corner Box.jpg
    We did this sketch for our son when he asked a "how to" question after we built a cabinet with rounded corners. The sketch is self explanatory.

    As for the "round corner framed" hatch - we will make the hatch first and then using cardboard, make a template of the hatch's exterior shell, tape it to the cabin top and then jigsaw cut the outline over the frame below the plywood shell. After the cut we will clean it up and refine the hole's dimensions (we anticipate it will need some re-cuts due to angular displacement) before slipping the hatch into the cut hole, epoxy it in place, seal it and finish the entire cabin top.

    Working with a round metal hatch is a tougher cabin/deck coupling task to tackle - we know that you'll do it well if you take your time, work slowly and re-check your dimensions, not twice but three to four times!

    Thank you for your comments. . . we really appreciate them.

    Stay tuned. . . this one's a doozie!

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  33. #278
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan H View Post
    Your gangway / slipway is the subject of much jealousy here!

    The cabin looks to have a lot more interior space than I thought it was going to!
    Hello Alan,
    Heck, compared to the projects you've posted, Alan, this slipway is "child's play" in comparison. But, thank you for the kind comment - we do appreciate it.

    The cabin is large because we wanted to have "room" so as to have a decent night's sleep without feeling cramped. Also, we needed room for a one burner S/S propane stove, some food storage and a Century portable toilet as we plan on "cruising" the local rivers, bays, keys and such. We stopped being rag sailors but our cruising hearts couldn't give up that lifestyle altogether. . . even if it's only for a few days (or a week here and there) at a time now that we're "an older couple" living in retirement.

    The cabin is taking shape as the walls are going up. . . stay tuned.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  34. #279
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    North Port, Florida, USA
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    Sunday, 10 January, 2021
    Weekly Build Update

    Hello Everyone,
    In-spite of a week filled with cold mornings on the Sun Coast, and a break in the work on 6 December to view the darkest day in Washington, DC's (and America's) history on television; we were able to get a lot of work done.

    Here is the week's accomplishments. . . we purposely left out the daily timeline as the entire effort was one of those that could be classified as an "all over the place activity."

    Wall Locator Sketch
    1 Cuddy Cabin Walls Locator.jpg

    Here is a sketch of the cabin walls and frames we were able to build. Permanently mounting the walls is scheduled for this week if we get decent weather for finishing all of them with four top coats each.

    Frames
    2 Cuddy Cabin Framework.jpg
    1 - This is the frame base for the Amidships Cockpit/Cabin and Amidships Helm/Cabin Walls mechanically fixed and epoxied in place;
    2 - The top of the frame attached to the cabin-top crossbeam that will support the two walls noted above;
    3 - The base for the helm is visible in the left hand center of the photo - this base is independent of the other frames; frame to the right is the one shown in photo 1, and:
    4 - This photo shows the frames where the Amidships Helm/Cabin and Starboard Helm/Cabin Walls will be mounted - on the outside of these of course.

    Amidships Helm and Amidships Cockpit Walls
    3 Amidships Walls.jpg
    1 - This is the simplest wall of the four cut - it' the Amidships Helm Wall that is basically a long rectangle with the top part cut at an angle;
    2 - The Amidships Helm Wall finished and drying as it sits, safe from bugs and bumps, inside the lanai;
    3 - Here is the Amidships Cockpit Wall dry-fitted prior to finishing; to the left is the entryway that resulted - a 28 inch (71cm) wide entrance, and:
    4 - The Amidships Cockpit Wall finished and drying in the Lanai, safe from bugs and bumps.

    Starboard Helm Cabin Wall
    4 Starboard Helm Wall.jpg
    1 - This wall took the longest time to layout and cut as it required making a pattern from 1/4 inch (6mm) plywood as shown in the photo;
    2 - After countless trips to the wall's frame inside the hull, trimming and "fiddling little details" that took one day, the pattern's profile was transferred to the 1/2 inch (12mm) panel;
    3 - The Starboard Helm Cabin Wall cut and trimmed to appropriate size, prior to finishing, and:
    4 - The wall finished and drying safely in the Lanai.

    Port Cockpit Cabin Wall
    5 Port Cockpit Wall.jpg
    1 - Slightly less trying than the Starboard Helm Wall - it was nevertheless, a half day of pattern measuring, trimming and preparation before transferring the profile to the 1/2 inch (12mm) panel;
    2 - The wall as it was being cut from the panel - after this photo was taken the wall was taken to the frame often, trimmed and re-trimmed to make it fit properly in place;
    3 - The Port Cockpit Cabin Wall dry-fitted in place before finishing, and,
    4 - All 4 cabin walls after the first coat of topside paint prior to them being stored inside the Lanai to keep them safe from bugs and harm - a practice that will be repeated 5 more times in the coming week

    As we continue with wall finishing - in lieu of watching paint dry. . . we'll paint in the morning and continue the required work inside the hull to make a comfortable, roomy, cuddy cabin.

    That was our week. . . we hope yours was as productive too.

    Stay safe, stay healthy.

    J.
    "Ships are the nearest thing to dreams that hands have ever made." Robert N. Rose

  35. #280
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Mountain lakes of Vermont
    Posts
    15,573

    Default Re: The Birth of the Night Heron

    I just caught up with this thread.
    Wonderful work!
    It's great that you can enjoy the boat while finishing her.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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