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Thread: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

  1. #1
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    Default down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    i have sourced an aluminum mast and a sail for not too much $$. I have a section of lightweight pipe for the boom. now, I need the hardware to rig up my 50sqft bermuda sail to the mast and boom. I went by the local West Marine and was appalled that a single cam cleat is $35.

    I'm looking for a list of required items and inexpensive alternatives. keep in mind this is a canoe, thanks!!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Look at the oz goose racer site, they've got everything pared to bare minimum for that... https://www.opengoose.com/building-a...goose-rigging/
    2019: returning from being sidelined with medical probs, crossing fingers worst is over, still in "armchair enthusiast" mode for time being.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Was trying to dig up the old sailing canoe vintage plans, but could only find this one, not canoe specific, can maybe use ideas from it... http://www.vintageprojects.com/boats...conversion.pdf

    But in general I remember seeing a few times "uses hardware store fittings" on some of those old plans, but I can't remember which ones specifically.. http://www.svensons.com/boat/ but you'll find more rigging ideas on the small boats there.

    Edit: and not sure if you noticed this thread although it's recent, it has some simpler ways of rigging and such tips in... http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-12-feet-skiff
    2019: returning from being sidelined with medical probs, crossing fingers worst is over, still in "armchair enthusiast" mode for time being.

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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Bacon Sails in Annapolis is not far from you.

    https://baconsails.com/

    I have had really good luck scrounging in their collection of used boat hardware. You can find all the blocks you need for a sailing canoe at a fraction of the cost of new. The rest of the store is fascinating as well.
    "George Washington as a boy
    was ignorant of the commonest
    accomplishments of youth.
    He could not even lie."

    -- Mark Twain

  5. #5
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Cleat the halyard on the mast and always hold the sheet in your hand, it's a canoe!

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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    West is the last place to look for anything. Start with Duckworks, they cater to the budget-minded. E-bay has tons of boat gear cheap, too. Much of it new. And of course you can always make wooden cleats.
    -Dave

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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Lashings and soft shackles can eliminate the need for almost every bit of hardware--much cheaper, much quieter.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  8. #8
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    I carved all the cleats and a lot of fittings out of oak and used SS bolts or rod to make all the rest on Helium.

    Take a look at the Helium website, particularly at the end.

    Alan

    https://sites.google.com/site/helium12sofsailboat/

  9. #9
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    I ended up winning a big pair of leeboards at the Wooden Canoe Heritage Association auction. They are modern leeboards and I am not sure what they originally went with, but if you need a pair, let me know. I can send some photos.

    Fitz
    "Wherever there is a channel for water, there is a road for the canoe. " - Thoreau

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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Sure, let me know. Thanks!

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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz View Post
    I ended up winning a big pair of leeboards at the Wooden Canoe Heritage Association auction. They are modern leeboards and I am not sure what they originally went with, but if you need a pair, let me know. I can send some photos.

    Fitz
    Leeboards? For canoe sized boats? Ooh. Now you’re talking my language?

    Peace,
    Full Of Ideas

  12. #12
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    75 and 85 sq. ft. lateen sails are pretty common on antique canoes. I steer with a paddle. Bring a bailer .

    Weeeeeee!!!!

    Sailin.jpg
    "Wherever there is a channel for water, there is a road for the canoe. " - Thoreau

  13. #13
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Note the main sheet attachment...
    The lessons of experience!


  14. #14
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    "Wherever there is a channel for water, there is a road for the canoe. " - Thoreau

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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    I have tried to rig my canoe as cheaply but functionally as possible. I do have some cleats but can avoid them if needed. I do like having the main halyard on one so I can drop the rig fast, aka sudden high winds and just ran into a protected inlet. A cleat does work just fine for this. At one point I had a round thwart I could reach, I could make all kinds of things off to this when needed, I like that set up. What I haven’t been able to avoid is a significant amount of small blocks to run my lines right to the cockpit and to gain good mechanical advantage on the halyard and downhaul. In my canoe experience moving about the vessel doesn’t work most of the time, due to the inherent less than stable characteristics of a canoe. I want to be able to control everything from where I sit. Halyard, reefing, downhaul, rudder up and down, and boom-end preventer.

    Duckworks is where it is at for me, great selection, price, and quality.

    I use a 46 square foot balanced lug. I would not go bigger, and 40 would be fine. I do like the large size in light or almost unnoticeable air.
    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    I wouldn't worry about the price of cam cleats. Chances are that with a 50 sq. ft. Bermuda sail you won't feel secure enough to cleat the sail off the vast majority of the time. I'd rather see a hook, an open fairlead of some sort, or a horn cleat down at gunwale level (attached to a thwart or the leeboard bracket) which you can pass the sheet under to create some friction, with the end of the sheet being hand held. The other advantage of this, as opposed to just holding the sheet coming off the boom, is that mainsheet tension will be pulling you down into the boat, rather than trying to pull you up and out of it.

    Lightweight pipe booms work, but you can make a tapered one which works much better and generates better sail shape with a sabre saw and a Home Depot 2x4. Nearly all of the stuff you need can be home built or sourced reasonably cheaply if you know what you are doing or have some good instructions to follow. I suggest this one, published and available from our hosts, containing 262 pages and hundreds of drawings explaining how to add sail rigs of various types to canoes. The author can be a cranky old bastard, but generally has a decent grasp of the subject matter.

    https://www.woodenboatstore.com/coll...ucts/canoe-rig

    (It's not cheap either, but there is an awful lot of info in there, aimed at designing and turning out things like this. Other than the sails themselves, all other parts were built by the boat owners.)

    cs1 (1).jpg

    cs2.jpg

    cs3.jpg

  17. #17
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    very cool. thanks for all the input.

    i have limited experience and always in small or home built boats (ie, sunflower beer cooler boat, or canoe with downwind only sail)

    im not really interested in building the entire thing "on the cheap" as much as eliminating fancy things that cost a bunch if a simple $1 stainless ring could do the same general function as a $30 pulley. im looking for simple 1960's style hardware store solutions to mimic a solway dory bermuda setup. their setup allows reefing by rolling the sail around the mast and i like the idea i can downsize the sail or keep the 50sqft for light wind days

    the sail i picked up cheap ($50), its an actual dacron bermuda sail so i figured i'm already a step ahead of the tyvek one used before. the canoe has a mirage drive and outriggers already just trying to finish up the mast step and figure out fittings. the mast is sched-40 aluminum pipe. Even though its a canoe its not so tippy anymore since i added the outriggers, while i know they wont keep it from tipping if i do something stupid, they do allow some leeway.

    essentially i think i need the following at a minimum - your input is appreciated

    and i apologize in advance, i'm not a sailor and im just learning the proper names for everything. i know this will be painful to read for some of you...

    ring or pully at top of mast to allow me to raise sail - cleat to tie off (halyard?) - maybe not needed if i am using a solway dory clone as it seems they tie the sail to the top of the mast and there is no raising and lowering it
    ring or pully at end of boom to stretch sail to end of boom - cleat to tie off (outhaul?)
    cleat or similar at bottom of mast to keep it from rotating and unfurling the sail from its reef (kicking strap?)
    corresponding anti rotation cleat on boat to tie to
    something to keep mast tied to boat in case of capsize - although i guess the anti rotation stuff would do that...
    Last edited by Eciton; 08-07-2019 at 03:57 PM.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/...010-parent.htm

    7CD4211E-80C7-42E8-B27F-25B706AA5352.jpeg


    D4400189-94CE-4487-AB58-100C36C640F9.jpg


    I don’t know if these are too counter to your vintage hardware style, but they are dirt cheap and you can do a lot with them, one thing that is nice about them is they are easy on the line, nicely rounded. I believe Solway Dory’s technique for keeping the mast from spinning is just to fix the boom to the mast above with a boom-Vang. Then the main sheet controls the position of both. The boom-vang is detached from the mast for rolling up the mast during reefing then reattached. In the picture above it is the black line going from the boom to the mast forming a triangle.
    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
    -The Dude-

  19. #19
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    that is incredibly helpful. thanks!

  20. #20
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Check Lowes or Home Depot, they have stainless rings and outdoor cleats, snaps, etc...over by their cheap line. To go a step up from that check ebay for Sunfish hardware, it is high quality bronze or stainless, looks good and there are blocks (pulleys), cleats, eyestraps, interlocking bolts for spars etc...

    You can check out our sailing canoe blog for ideas, we are getting ready to fiddle with a rudder next. http://smallboatrestoration.blogspot...17-double.html

    Good Luck!

    SCOUT Clark posing.jpg
    Cheers
    Kent and Skipper
    Small Boat Restoration blog

  21. #21
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Quote Originally Posted by Eciton View Post
    ring or pully at top of mast to allow me to raise sail -
    You can sometimes raid a junk drawer for old bakelite or delrin furniture casters that have enough meat on to get chucked in a drill and attacked with round file, blade or stone to cut a groove in them. Or you might find these cheap at the Habitat for Humanity ReStore or similar https://www.houseofantiquehardware.com/sash-pulley
    2019: returning from being sidelined with medical probs, crossing fingers worst is over, still in "armchair enthusiast" mode for time being.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: down and dirty inexpensive sail rigging/hardware for sailing canoe

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Bradshaw View Post
    ... Nearly all of the stuff you need can be home built or sourced reasonably cheaply if you know what you are doing or have some good instructions to follow. I suggest this one, published and available from our hosts, containing 262 pages and hundreds of drawings explaining how to add sail rigs of various types to canoes. The author can be a cranky old bastard, but generally has a decent grasp of the subject matter.

    https://www.woodenboatstore.com/coll...ucts/canoe-rig
    Based on this thread and the post above I ordered this book this past week.

    After having a little bit of time with it...Wow. (I don't use exclamation points but if I did, this would get one)

    In addition to being a valuable reference, this is an excellent 'coffee table' book: a high-quality hard back chock full of eye-catching and interesting illustrations with concise informative and instructional text.

    Well done, Mr. Bradshaw. Kudos also to WoodenBoat Books for publishing such an exceptional work in the form it richly deserves.

    Ken

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