Page 1 of 8 12 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 35 of 270

Thread: Losing friends in divisive times.

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Saint Helena Island, SC
    Posts
    9,572

    Default Losing friends in divisive times.

    May have lost 2 tonight. One Iíve known since high school, another for over a decade. I can no longer abide the gun worshippers that cannot, or will not admit this nation has a serious problem.
    The Dayton shooter was armed with an assault weapon with 2 100 round rotary magazines. He fired 41 rounds in 30 seconds.
    This should not be possible. Period.
    A very small percentage of the population, and indeed a small minority of gun owners own such a weapon. Their rights to own such a weapon DO NOT obviate the rest of us having the right to not be gunned down by it.
    Anyway in my attempt to drive this point home I most likely ended 2 friendships. Over the ability to own a gun that isnít good for hunting or target shooting, but rather is designed for the sole purpose of killing as many humans as possible as fast as possible.
    This latest tragedy took a somewhat personal note when I realized that Iíve been to that bar in Dayton, as have some of my coworkers. Had I been on a layover there I could have easily been a victim as could many people i work with. Selfish I admit, but it does serve to get ones attention.

    I think in the next couple of years we may have to make some hard choices. Ending friendships hopefully will be the most trying.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Hills of Vermont, USA
    Posts
    30,585

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Sorry to hear this - but I get it. I may well be losing a few myself. I've long been quietly against large magazines, but I'm afraid the time for quietly working against them is over.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Bellingham, WA, USA
    Posts
    612

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Pandora's box has already been opened. These guns are here. They are not going anywhere, no mattrr what rules or laws are passed.

    If you think alienation of friends is the only way for you, then I hope it works. But it will not stop what is happening.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Hills of Vermont, USA
    Posts
    30,585

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    The alienation of friends is a result, not a cause. All due to the division in today's US.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Sorrento Australia
    Posts
    1,898

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garret View Post
    The alienation of friends is a result, not a cause. All due to the division in today's US.
    And when you speak of division, this was a key tactic of Trumps election campaign with the employment of Cambridge Analytica targeting false news videos and information on Face book with the use of data mining to build profiles of voters etc etc during the last election.
    A great documentary on this is now out on Netflix.
    The Great Hack

    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.




  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Saint Helena Island, SC
    Posts
    9,572

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    Pandora's box has already been opened. These guns are here. They are not going anywhere, no mattrr what rules or laws are passed.

    If you think alienation of friends is the only way for you, then I hope it works. But it will not stop what is happening.
    Its not about the alienation. It’s about speaking my mind when I feel its necessary. If that makes someone uncomfortable to the point of ending a friendship then so be it.

    And I don’t believe that Pandora’s box cannot be nailed shut. I would take political courage, which is in VERY short supply lately, but it’s doable.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    northern Georgia, or Mississippi Delta USA
    Posts
    18,853

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    Pandora's box has already been opened. These guns are here. They are not going anywhere, no mattrr what rules or laws are passed.

    If you think alienation of friends is the only way for you, then I hope it works. But it will not stop what is happening.
    The idiot in Dayton bought his rifle online. He had it shipped to and picked it up from a FFL dealer. If that had been illegal, he would not have been able to do it that way. Making the rifles and magazines illegal might not get rid of them instantly, but would keep them from being advertised and legally acquired by any nut that decides to murder a bunch of folks.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    oklahoma
    Posts
    5,504

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy W View Post
    The idiot in Dayton bought his rifle online. He had it shipped to and picked it up from a FFL dealer. If that had been illegal, he would not have been able to do it that way. Making the rifles and magazines illegal might not get rid of them instantly, but would keep them from being advertised and legally acquired by any nut that decides to murder a bunch of folks.
    What is your complaint about going through a FFL dealer?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    2,296

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    Pandora's box has already been opened. These guns are here. They are not going anywhere, no mattrr what rules or laws are passed.

    If you think alienation of friends is the only way for you, then I hope it works. But it will not stop what is happening.
    What a defeatist attitude, hey I know, how about do nothing? Actually not nothing T&P brother, T&P
    whatever rocks your boat

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    afloat with at least 6' of water under me.
    Posts
    62,300

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    Pandora's box has already been opened. These guns are here. They are not going anywhere, no mattrr what rules or laws are passed.

    If you think alienation of friends is the only way for you, then I hope it works. But it will not stop what is happening.
    So you're happy to just sit on your butt and not even try. Got it.
    Women didn't think there was ever a chance to gain the vote, it took almost 100 years to get it and getting it was not sitting on their butts or giving up.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Gulf Islands B.C.
    Posts
    895

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Copied from another thread, from your post:


    Americans made up 4 percent of the world's population but owned about 46 percent of the entire global stock of 857 million civilian firearms."[5] U.S civilians own 393 million guns. That is 3 times as many guns as the armed forces of the Russian Federation (30.3 million), China (27.5 million), North Korea (8.4 million), Ukraine (6.6 million), United States (4.5 million), India (3.9 million), Vietnam (3.8 million), Iran (3.3 million), South Korea (2.7 million), Pakistan (2.3 million), and all the other countries (39.7 million) combined.[6] American civilians own more guns "than those held by civilians in the other top 25 countries combined."[7]


    "American civilians own nearly 100 times as many firearms as the U.S. military and nearly 400 times as many as law enforcement."[8] Americans bought more than 2 million guns in May 2018, alone.[8] That is more than twice as many guns, as possessed by every law enforcement agency in the United States put together.[8] In April and May 2018, U.S. civilians bought 4.7 million guns, which is more than all the firearms stockpiled by the United States military.[8] In 2017, Americans bought 25.2 million guns, which is 2.5 million more guns than possessed by every law enforcement agency in the world put together.[8] Between 2012 and 2017, U.S. civilians bought 135 million guns, 2 million more guns than the combined stockpile of all the world's armed forces

    Just bears repeating. These numbers are mind boggling. I have no idea how any law would control the existing guns at this point.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Saint Helena Island, SC
    Posts
    9,572

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Decourcy View Post
    Copied from another thread, from your post:


    Americans made up 4 percent of the world's population but owned about 46 percent of the entire global stock of 857 million civilian firearms."[5] U.S civilians own 393 million guns. That is 3 times as many guns as the armed forces of the Russian Federation (30.3 million), China (27.5 million), North Korea (8.4 million), Ukraine (6.6 million), United States (4.5 million), India (3.9 million), Vietnam (3.8 million), Iran (3.3 million), South Korea (2.7 million), Pakistan (2.3 million), and all the other countries (39.7 million) combined.[6] American civilians own more guns "than those held by civilians in the other top 25 countries combined."[7]


    "American civilians own nearly 100 times as many firearms as the U.S. military and nearly 400 times as many as law enforcement."[8] Americans bought more than 2 million guns in May 2018, alone.[8] That is more than twice as many guns, as possessed by every law enforcement agency in the United States put together.[8] In April and May 2018, U.S. civilians bought 4.7 million guns, which is more than all the firearms stockpiled by the United States military.[8] In 2017, Americans bought 25.2 million guns, which is 2.5 million more guns than possessed by every law enforcement agency in the world put together.[8] Between 2012 and 2017, U.S. civilians bought 135 million guns, 2 million more guns than the combined stockpile of all the world's armed forces
    Just bears repeating. These numbers are mind boggling. I have no idea how any law would control the existing guns at this point.
    Interstate highway system, Panama Canal, Moon Landing. We used to tackle big problems in this country. Why not now?

    A lot of guns owned by not a lot of people. Whittle it down to just the guns that need to be taken out of circulation and the number of people gets even smaller.
    A big job, but doable.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Gulf Islands B.C.
    Posts
    895

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Interstate highway system, Panama Canal, Moon Landing. We used to tackle big problems in this country. Why not now?

    A lot of guns owned by not a lot of people. Whittle it down to just the guns that need to be taken out of circulation and the number of people gets even smaller.
    A big job, but doable.
    Heres a few issues as I see it:
    - not many of those are registered. How do you get non registered out of circulation? Compliance rate in Canada for long gun registry was 20%. I have heard much the same for Auz, and expect NZ will achieve much the same. Even if the US achieves 50%, the number remaining is staggering. And then the remaining are all underground.
    - how will the militias react? Yes, I do think that may be a real concern, fat and slow as they are. Particularly if they think that "now is the time".
    - Who arrives at a criteria for what is acceptable?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat - Australia
    Posts
    4,075

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Decourcy View Post
    Heres a few issues as I see it:
    - not many of those are registered. How do you get non registered out of circulation? Compliance rate in Canada for long gun registry was 20%. I have heard much the same for Auz, and expect NZ will achieve much the same. Even if the US achieves 50%, the number remaining is staggering. And then the remaining are all underground.
    - how will the militias react? Yes, I do think that may be a real concern, fat and slow as they are. Particularly if they think that "now is the time".
    - Who arrives at a criteria for what is acceptable?
    Usually its the electorate.
    But in the case of the USA the lobbyists will make that decision.


    Is 'It's hard' a good excuse to do nothing?
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Gulf Islands B.C.
    Posts
    895

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    Usually its the electorate.
    But in the case of the USA the lobbyists will make that decision.


    Is 'It's hard' a good excuse to do nothing?
    No, but "it's effective" matters more. I expect other actions, possibly more effective, are harder.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat - Australia
    Posts
    4,075

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Decourcy View Post
    No, but "it's effective" matters more. I expect other actions, possibly more effective, are harder.
    No mass shootings in Oz since certain guns were made illegal.

    I'm not actually sure what you are trying to say.
    You seem to be championing the cause of 'it's hopeless so leave it alone', yet slipping around saying anything specific.

    There is also a generational thing, in a hundred years time the ban will remain and the number of automatic weapons would be greatly reduced.

    The very first thing to do is ban the guns, then follow up with 'actions' (is that raiding houses?) that can support that law.
    Its the first step in the thousand mile march. This is why gun lobbyists send up every obstacle against a ban - it is the very first step and as long as it is not taken nothing further will happen.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    On the river, Auckland, New Zealand
    Posts
    5,572

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Decourcy View Post
    Heres a few issues as I see it:
    - not many of those are registered. How do you get non registered out of circulation? Compliance rate in Canada for long gun registry was 20%. I have heard much the same for Auz, and expect NZ will achieve much the same. Even if the US achieves 50%, the number remaining is staggering. And then the remaining are all underground.
    - how will the militias react? Yes, I do think that may be a real concern, fat and slow as they are. Particularly if they think that "now is the time".
    - Who arrives at a criteria for what is acceptable?
    Gathering in all those guns which are now illegal, will be a long game. But our government and our police will play that long game. Making it difficult to get semi auto and automatic guns here does two things, one is that every time a crim is raided his or her weapons get picked up, and the crims associates will find it much more difficult to replace them, and the new laws around gun security and the compulsory registration of every individual gun will make it easier to track them. That, with compulsory storage in approved, locked gun safes which will make it more difficult to steal them in casual petty burglaries makes that line of supply more difficult as well.
    It worked in Australia, it will work here, it doesnt stop it completely, but it can much reduce the occurrence. But it takes time. We can do that.

    John Welsford
    An expert is but a beginner with experience.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    new zealand
    Posts
    3,914

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Decourcy View Post
    Heres a few issues as I see it:
    - not many of those are registered. How do you get non registered out of circulation? Compliance rate in Canada for long gun registry was 20%. I have heard much the same for Auz, and expect NZ will achieve much the same. Even if the US achieves 50%, the number remaining is staggering. And then the remaining are all underground.
    - how will the militias react? Yes, I do think that may be a real concern, fat and slow as they are. Particularly if they think that "now is the time".
    - Who arrives at a criteria for what is acceptable?
    None of that matters. If you don't start, you'll never finish. Ever. If you do start, don't expect to finish for decades, and dont expect that bad things will immediately stop happening - of course, all that will need sustained bipartisan support, and in the case of th US, defanging the NRA - start by calling lobbying the bribery it really is.
    Or just accept that there is a higher probability than any other civilised country on the planet, that somebody you love might never come home, because it was too easy for some idiot to bear arms.
    I'm wondering what scale of massacre it is going to take, to make the status quo unacceptable. What happens if more than a couple of these guys actually get their collective chit together, and you get a body count in the hundreds. Would that do it?

    Oh, and regarding your nice pie chart, what is it that enables mass shooters? Assault weapons and high capacity magazines, made easily available in large part due to the activities of the NRA and what seems to be a dollar driven interpretation of the second amendment. Your chart is correct in identifying that Islam has nothing to do with the problem.

    Pete
    Last edited by epoxyboy; 08-06-2019 at 04:53 AM.
    Don't underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers!

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat - Australia
    Posts
    4,075

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    If people are defensive there is fear somewhere.

    It appears to me, outside, that there is very little constructive debate on certain emblematic subjects in the USA. Whether its gun control or healthcare, even talking about it seems to represent an existential threat to some people. The resistance to considered debate seems to represent a threat to others.
    And around and around.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Freeland, WA
    Posts
    27,889

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    ...and don't forget body armor. Why it is legal for a civilian to own it is beyond me.
    Gerard>
    ​Freeland, WA

    Resistance is NOT futile.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Bellingham, WA, USA
    Posts
    612

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    So hypothetically, we ban all semi-automatic rifles that fire medium caliber cartridges. How do we get the 5+ million out of circulation?

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat - Australia
    Posts
    4,075

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    So hypothetically, we ban all semi-automatic rifles that fire medium caliber cartridges. How do we get the 5+ million out of circulation?
    That is actually a completely different problem and (counter intuitively) unrelated.
    Banning guns and ammunition is an issue of legislation, enforcing it is a matter of policing. As it happens, #2 gets easier if #1 is in place.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Uki, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    30,425

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    So hypothetically, we ban all semi-automatic rifles that fire medium caliber cartridges. How do we get the 5+ million out of circulation?
    Many many ways, first you ban them making ownership illegal. Governments can then do a buy back or even offer something of equivalent value in exchange. It could be a new big screen tv, a mortgage payment or even a medical procedure.
    Trump, a man who can't hold a coherent thought till the end of the sentence.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    The Garden State
    Posts
    5,213

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    So hypothetically, we ban all semi-automatic rifles that fire medium caliber cartridges. How do we get the 5+ million out of circulation?
    Some would be turned in, some would be lost to crime and arrest of the owner, and many will sit quietly in some small collection doing nothing. Eventually they will turn into the equivalent of a civil war rifle, still deadly, but not worth the effort to clean up and use
    "If you think you are too small to make a difference, try sleeping with a mosquito"

    -Dalai Lama

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Winnipeg MB
    Posts
    19,930

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    So hypothetically, we ban all semi-automatic rifles that fire medium caliber cartridges. How do we get the 5+ million out of circulation?
    Gradually, while taking other measures such as permitted ownership, background checks, safe storage and transportation laws, and tight restrictions on handguns.

    It's called harm reduction for a reason. Perfection is the next door down.

    Oh, wait, there is no next door down.

    What are you doing about it?




  26. #26
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    28,208

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    I have many relatives who hunt. As far as I know, they have traditional hunting guns. They don't carry in public and they keep their weapons in a safe. I have no problem with them. However, they are the old NRA. The new NRA is a diiferent beast entirely. I could not keep a friend who carried a gun in public.

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Western Washington
    Posts
    3,128

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    I have many relatives who hunt. As far as I know, they have traditional hunting guns. They don't carry in public and they keep their weapons in a safe. I have no problem with them. However, they are the old NRA. The new NRA is a diiferent beast entirely. I could not keep a friend who carried a gun in public.
    We have a relative who always carries, including at family gatherings, it's visible if you are observant. Most people aren't. It's not something I do, or ever desire to do, but I've known him since he was a kid, I like him and I don't consider him a threat. He has never gotten out of line with relatives or strangers. He's also a Trump supporter, the only one in our extended family. I seldom discuss politics with him. He has other qualities that I feel outweigh these two factors. If you ever needed assistance in almost any way he would provide it, relative or not. He's pleasant and interesting to be around. What could I possibly gain losing him as a friend / relative? Part of the socialization process is getting along and functioning cooperatively with all sorts of people. I have no reason to think ill of him.

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Traverse City MI and Charlotte NC
    Posts
    3,418

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Wright View Post
    We have a relative who always carries, including at family gatherings, it's visible if you are observant. Most people aren't. It's not something I do, or ever desire to do, but I've known him since he was a kid, I like him and I don't consider him a threat. He has never gotten out of line with relatives or strangers. He's also a Trump supporter, the only one in our extended family. I seldom discuss politics with him. He has other qualities that I feel outweigh these two factors. If you ever needed assistance in almost any way he would provide it, relative or not. He's pleasant and interesting to be around. What could I possibly gain losing him as a friend / relative? Part of the socialization process is getting along and functioning cooperatively with all sorts of people. I have no reason to think ill of him.
    Very well said.
    Capitalism is the ideology of parasites.

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    22,536

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    So you boys feel that if you can’t do ‘perfect’ in one move, you just give up and do nothing? Wow. Almost appears you prefer ‘nothing’.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  30. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Northwest Oregon coast
    Posts
    28,973

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    I dont talk politics or religion with my friends, I will listen to them. I have never asked anyone how many guns they own. Yeah , my liberal friends like to lecture me but I dont engage. Course if they come over I make them bow to the Sarah Palin shrine.

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Bellingham, WA, USA
    Posts
    612

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Not at all. But everyone is saying that we need to "ban these weapons of war!" With no input on what will happen once they are banned.

    Give me an honest answer of how you think we can reasonably remove these firearms and I will consider it.

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    22,536

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanM26 View Post
    Not at all. But everyone is saying that we need to "ban these weapons of war!" With no input on what will happen once they are banned.

    Give me an honest answer of how you think we can reasonably remove these firearms and I will consider it.
    you may have a point. Damn difficult to even imagine, isn’t it? If only we had a blueprint, guidance from someone who had been through this, successfully. Too bad that doesn’t exist, eh? Bet you’d jump at that!
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Gulf Islands B.C.
    Posts
    895

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    you may have a point. Damn difficult to even imagine, isn’t it? If only we had a blueprint, guidance from someone who had been through this, successfully. Too bad that doesn’t exist, eh? Bet you’d jump at that!
    Once again:

    Americans made up 4 percent of the world's population but owned about 46 percent of the entire global stock of 857 million civilian firearms."[5] U.S civilians own 393 million guns. That is 3 times as many guns as the armed forces of the Russian Federation (30.3 million), China (27.5 million), North Korea (8.4 million), Ukraine (6.6 million), United States (4.5 million), India (3.9 million), Vietnam (3.8 million), Iran (3.3 million), South Korea (2.7 million), Pakistan (2.3 million), and all the other countries (39.7 million) combined.[6] American civilians own more guns "than those held by civilians in the other top 25 countries combined."[7]


    "American civilians own nearly 100 times as many firearms as the U.S. military and nearly 400 times as many as law enforcement."[8] Americans bought more than 2 million guns in May 2018, alone.[8] That is more than twice as many guns, as possessed by every law enforcement agency in the United States put together.[8] In April and May 2018, U.S. civilians bought 4.7 million guns, which is more than all the firearms stockpiled by the United States military.[8] In 2017, Americans bought 25.2 million guns, which is 2.5 million more guns than possessed by every law enforcement agency in the world put together.[8] Between 2012 and 2017, U.S. civilians bought 135 million guns, 2 million more guns than the combined stockpile of all the world's armed forces

  34. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat - Australia
    Posts
    4,075

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by Decourcy View Post
    Once again:

    Americans made up 4 percent of the world's population but owned about 46 percent of the entire global stock of 857 million civilian firearms."[5] U.S civilians own 393 million guns. That is 3 times as many guns as the armed forces of the Russian Federation (30.3 million), China (27.5 million), North Korea (8.4 million), Ukraine (6.6 million), United States (4.5 million), India (3.9 million), Vietnam (3.8 million), Iran (3.3 million), South Korea (2.7 million), Pakistan (2.3 million), and all the other countries (39.7 million) combined.[6] American civilians own more guns "than those held by civilians in the other top 25 countries combined."[7]


    "American civilians own nearly 100 times as many firearms as the U.S. military and nearly 400 times as many as law enforcement."[8] Americans bought more than 2 million guns in May 2018, alone.[8] That is more than twice as many guns, as possessed by every law enforcement agency in the United States put together.[8] In April and May 2018, U.S. civilians bought 4.7 million guns, which is more than all the firearms stockpiled by the United States military.[8] In 2017, Americans bought 25.2 million guns, which is 2.5 million more guns than possessed by every law enforcement agency in the world put together.[8] Between 2012 and 2017, U.S. civilians bought 135 million guns, 2 million more guns than the combined stockpile of all the world's armed forces
    What are you saying?
    It's too hard so don't do it?
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  35. #35
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    northern Georgia, or Mississippi Delta USA
    Posts
    18,853

    Default Re: Losing friends in divisive times.

    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    What are you saying?
    It's too hard so don't do it?
    That is exactly what he is saying.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •