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Thread: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

  1. #36
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Dry-test:

    - Option 4d: Steel-Ring with small block hanging in tumb-cleat.

    20190808_142651_HDR.jpg

    - Option 4e: Carabiner in bottom center-bolt.

    20190808_143545_HDR.jpg
    Last edited by Pateplumaboat; 08-08-2019 at 02:23 PM.
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  2. #37
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    A new Option 5: Similar to Option 2, but only 2 Blocks. Sheet fixed onto shackle at traveller between quarter-knees.

    Advantage compared to Option 2: Length of sheet ok now, one block less. (same sheet as for Option 2 not long enough for running with the wind).

    Option_05.jpg

    Dry-Test Option 5:

    20190808_150259_HDR.jpg


    20190808_150954_Burst01.jpg

    Video showing Option 5 (dry-test):

    Note in video below: "safety-line" connected to main-sheet and side-bench near thwart. Needed in case I loose sheet and cannot reach end of sheet any more, as it could end in fwrd block, too far fwrd and on the leeside. This would be a problem in windy condition as one could not hang out to lee (Risk of capsize).

    Last edited by Pateplumaboat; 08-09-2019 at 10:50 AM. Reason: Video added
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  3. #38
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    And here Option 5 on the lake today:

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  4. #39
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Yesterday I tried other option: I bought a ratchet-block and mounted it with a spring onto the bottom of the boat, just 8 inches behind the thwart.

    Option x.jpg

    5.jpg

    6.jpg

    To my experience, made with the different options, up to now this is the best solution. Here my video with slight wind:



    Tried this also in stronger winds with gusts and it works fine. Main advantage is to have the mainsheet coming from the block at the bottom of the boat and with this one is pulling in a more "natural" i.e. more ergonomic way bottom-up. For light winds other options where mainsheet goes down from the beam work ok, but if force increases, I prefer this solution.
    Last edited by Pateplumaboat; 08-09-2020 at 03:45 PM.
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  5. #40
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    That is very similar to the setup I use. My ratchet block is on a loop of line run through the center thwart rather than on the floor so no stubber toes, and I lashed my mainsheet to the end of the boom before running it through a traveler block where you have the shackle and block, which lessens mainsheet tension by ~ 40%.

  6. #41
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by cracked lid View Post
    That is very similar to the setup I use. My ratchet block is on a loop of line run through the center thwart rather than on the floor so no stubber toes, and I lashed my mainsheet to the end of the boom before running it through a traveler block where you have the shackle and block, which lessens mainsheet tension by ~ 40%.
    Hello crackedlid, good point, but my sail is quite small (53 sqft) and mainsheet-tension is no problem also in stronger winds on my small 12 feet boat. If I would lash mainsheet to the end of boom and run it through a traveler block (as Your setup) I would need a longer mainsheet for the case sailing before the wind.
    Last edited by Pateplumaboat; 08-08-2020 at 06:28 AM.
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  7. #42
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    As I was not completely happy with the options shown above, I tried another one on the lake yesterday:

    https://youtu.be/zgs6DhGTr4Q

    This is probably "the best option" found up to now.
    Reason:

    - By avoiding traveler, no interference of mainsheet-rig with the tiller and tiller lines (helm-impeder, lines for kickup-rudder). This is particulary important sailing under slight winds or when running in light winds when travaller and mainsheet is tangeling with lines at tiller, or mainsheet is hanging in water. With this option mainsheet is all fwrd of my sailing-position and therefore easier to control. Also more headroom when ducking under beam.
    - Length of mainsheet is shorter as with last option shown above, therefore now allowing sail to rotate almost 180 plus 180 degrees.
    - Servocleat to get fast of mainsheet in bottom-frame is optionally only, but good to have for stronger constant winds or if one needs to get one hand free. But be aware of gusts (danger of capsize!).

    Tested system in moderate winds yesterday, will have to prove once again with stronger winds.

    But it may well be that "Best option" is different for other 12 feet skiffs with balanced lugsail of similar dimensions. Each boat-design has different characteristics and therefore mainsheet rigging will have to optimized always individually. Only practical testing/trying-out/playing-around will finally result in the optimal solution for each individual.


    Option y.jpg

    Option y stbrd.jpg

    Option y bbrd.jpg
    Last edited by Pateplumaboat; 08-26-2020 at 04:07 AM.
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  8. #43
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pateplumaboat View Post
    As I was not completely happy with the options shown above, I tried another one on the lake yesterday:

    https://youtu.be/zgs6DhGTr4Q
    I don't like cleating the mainsheet, especially on the boats bottom under your feet. Too dangerous, cannot be cast-off in a hurry. You have to bend double in a moving boat, then grope around looking for the line close to the cam cleat and jerk it free.
    I see cleats on the gunnel just aft of a frame head. Hook the sheet around that and hold it in your hand for quick and easy sail trim and easy to let go in an emergency.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  9. #44
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Preferences do vary widely about how to rig a boat, and you have to do what's right for you in your particular boat.

    That said, after multiple thousands of miles in small boats (Edit to add: well, probably just a frog's hair over 2,000 miles in 2 different boats), I would not use any option that cluttered the footspace in the cockpit as your latest posts do. Freedom of movement and elimination of clutter are vitally important. I don't like the look of that at all.

    But it's your boat--have fun, and good luck!

    Tom
    Last edited by WI-Tom; 08-27-2020 at 11:05 PM.
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  10. #45
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    #5 is roughly the way both of my lugsail boats are rigged, minus any sort of block on the gunwales. None of these require a lot of pressure to hold, and the smaller one has no cleat for the mainsheet.
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  11. #46
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Thanks to all for excellent advice. My experience with boats, living in the Alps, surrounded by mountains and small lakes is very limited and I cannot compete with the Experts in this forum, people such as naval architects or sailors with "multiple thousands miles in small boats". Really appreciate discussions in this forum, great resource for greenhorns like me. I am happy to show my builds and my mistakes, this forum allows me to learn a lot and is also gives me the opportunity to get in contact with wooden boat builders around the world. Great!

    But one remark to my last "best option": Knowing that cleating the mainsheet is not considered to be a save option for my 12 feet spike , I mounted a "servo-cleat" on the bottom frame of the boat. I think this is not adding clutter in my footspace, as the bottom-frame is there anyway (my simple skiff does not have floorboards). The only clutter is the mainsheet if not sailing on a breach or let loose the sail. To fix the mainsheet in order to have a short rest for my old (70 +) arms and hands for some while (taking pictures or having a drink), is sometimes required, but I never loose hand-contact to the mainsheet except with very low and constant wind-conditions. With a short lift, in a part of a second, the sheet is free from the servo-cleat and ready to give way. If I would fix the sheet on some cleats at the gunnel, I would have to lean-over to lee and/or uncleat and would need too much time for such action.

    The open servo-cleat I use looks as shown in the following picture:

    servocleat.jpg

    Christian
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  12. #47
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    I am not a big believer in the "never cleat the mainsheet in a small boat" line of thought.

    Frankly, sometimes I am aboard for 10 hours or more in a single day on some of my longer trips. While I don't use a cleat, I often tie off the sheet to an oarlock using a slipped half hitch, being careful to arrange the line so the loop/bight of the slipped hitch will not snag on the horns of the oarlock. One quick tug and the sheet is free. I do take care to make sure to keep the end of the sheet in my lap. Running the sheet forward to an oarlock (whether tied off or not) also means there is less sheet left to clutter the cockpit.

    There are definitely times when it's not sensible to tie off the sheet, for sure. But there are many more times when there's no danger in doing so. And it's those calmer, steadier times when it can be especially handy to have both hands free to take a drink, eat some food, take a compass bearing, etc.

    A quick release cleat like yours does not bother me at all, other than the potential for stubbing my toes on it (I almost always sail barefoot). Just because my individual preferences run in a different direction doesn't make your choice wrong! It's your boat--enjoy it. I think it's great to see you trying out so many options--that's how informed opinions about the best way to do things are created.

    Cheers,

    Tom
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  13. #48
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    I did a piece on quick release mainsheet systems for small oar and sall boats for Small Boat Monthly. I have half pins in the bottom of thwarts and have made cam cleats on pins that can be set into oarslock sockets. And has been noted a rachet block in the system helps. I figure it's worh at least one part of a sheeting system.
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  14. #49
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Ben,

    I added a ratchet block at your advice 3 years ago when I launched and rigged my boat. Thanks for that--very effective, much more comfortable to hold the sheeting loads.

    Tom
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  15. #50
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Gotta respect Wi-Tom's experience, but my approach would be; block with a beckett (and with a jammer cleat) where you have the jammer cleat only now, up to the boom (double block), along to the boom to over the after face of the thwart and back down to a fixed point there. I don't mind some stuff in the footwell, but i do think you have a bit too much going on with that block in the middle of nowhere, for me. (Might be too much purchase with the beckett and double block..... I'd still probably do it).

    As it is, I'd be inclined to put a fairlead somewhere immediately forward of the jammer cleat, close but with enough of a gap to make releasing easy. Must be awkward trying to keep tension and jam it in. Would be difficult to jam it in low down like that anyway - but maybe you're bendier than me

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  16. #51
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    The boom is designed to flex. If it is designed for a centre main sheet and you change the attachment point to the clew end of the boom, it will affect how the boom flexes.

    How much difference it will make will depend on the exact design, but it is a consideration.

    The difference is between (a) the after end of the boom flexing to leeward between the attachment point and the clew (with centre main) and (b) the entire boom bowing between the mast and the clew end (with main sheet attached to the clew end). The direction of flex relative to the wind is opposite, too.

  17. #52
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cormorant27 View Post
    The boom is designed to flex. If it is designed for a centre main sheet and you change the attachment point to the clew end of the boom, it will affect how the boom flexes.

    How much difference it will make will depend on the exact design, but it is a consideration.

    The difference is between (a) the after end of the boom flexing to leeward between the attachment point and the clew (with centre main) and (b) the entire boom bowing between the mast and the clew end (with main sheet attached to the clew end). The direction of flex relative to the wind is opposite, too.
    Cormorant, thanks for consideration. What may be added to Your comment is that the amount of load arriving from the sail onto the attachment point differs comparing (a) and (b).
    In the case of my rig, the flexing of the boom will have minimal effect as boom is quite stiff and sail is bent to boom at clew and at the tack only. A few inches of flexing of the boom will have minimal effect to the 3D-shape of my sail.

    Regards,
    Christian
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  18. #53
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Here a video of "the best option" I found up to now. Tested yesterday with some more wind.



    I will stay with this option until I find a better one.
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  19. #54
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    The boom is designed to flex rather than break but it's not like flexing a boom with an attached foot, which can be used to flatten the foil or depower the leech. You just get a symmetrical bagging of the sail that increases luffing and moves the center of effort back.

    I'd go with a simple double-ended sheet with a block back by the clew and a swivel mounted block and cam cleat on each gunnel. You'll want to add strips of wood as thick as the gunnel and maybe twice as wide to secure the pads for the swivels - spread the load.

    This gives effective power of 2:1. While your current system has 3:1, it's leverage is less advantageous. And the gunnel mounted blocks and cleats will be handier to operate from any place you might be while sailing.

  20. #55
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Pateplumaboat, one of the super attractive design points of your boat like the MayFly 14 is their anvil simplicity

    the MayFly 14 flies 75sqft which is greater than yours and has been proven under the adverse conditions of the Texas 200(25-30mph breezes)

    Jim Michalak suggests/shows/designed in a very simple mainsheet system using a minimum amount of line and the simplest of hardware

    basically secured(tied) to the end of the boom running down thru a low friction eye on the aft end of the tiller and fwd to the skippers hand as it is holding the tiller

    some add an open top cleat on top of the tiller between the eye and the fwd end of the tiller as seen here

    10446506_10152195205446342_7782858242399003446_n.jpg

    here's a pic of the same boat

    13495038_1308061132554576_2305598466951395850_n.jpg

    some nay sayers have to add an extra advantage as seen on this newly rigged 14 butt as seen above on a repeat participant in the Texas 200 it really isn't needed

    016 - Copy.jpg

    3rd boat here uses the single line which has served this vessel well for many runs in the 200

    35348005_10156416284724738_2326419617708244992_n.jpg

    another 14 w/ the added advantage running on a bridle

    19149170_1505221236194972_4532758339938024998_n.jpg

    again my attraction to this type of vessel is their anvil simplicity and how well they perform w/o all the extra whistles n bells some think they need

    btw, my current project is a Michalak AF-3 that flies 90sqftħ and is designed w/ the same rudder/tiller/mainsheet rig

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  21. #56
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Note on the Mayfly that the sheet comes off the end of the boom and the boom is quite long, which gives you a lot of leverage. The OP is dealing with a short boom, made shorter by taking the sheet off in its middle which he has to do given where the boom ends and where he sits in the boat. Looks like a rachet block is already part of the system.
    Ben Fuller
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  22. #57
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    ....

    I'd go with a simple double-ended sheet with a block back by the clew and a swivel mounted block and cam cleat on each gunnel. You'll want to add strips of wood as thick as the gunnel and maybe twice as wide to secure the pads for the swivels - spread the load.
    This gives effective power of 2:1. While your current system has 3:1, it's leverage is less advantageous. And the gunnel mounted blocks and cleats will be handier to operate from any place you might be while sailing.
    Ian, thanks for this alternative option. As I was not sure I understood You correctly I did a dry-test today with the mainsheet-option you describe.
    See attached picture: I used existing locations on my boat for blocks and cleats at both gunnels. Blocks would have to go more fwd, probably to a frame for better load distribution and not to entangle with tiller/tiller-tamer (helm-impeder) lines.
    I think Your option would work fine, small disadvantage could be changing of main at cleats for each tack. If I would still go for the luxury of ratchet-block I would have to use two of them.
    Not figured out yet how this will work during a jibe?

    One more option.jpg
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  23. #58
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    The boom is designed to flex rather than break but it's not like flexing a boom with an attached foot, which can be used to flatten the foil or depower the leech. You just get a symmetrical bagging of the sail that increases luffing and moves the center of effort back.
    Yes. mid-boom sheeting, bending the boom on a loose-footed sail, is exactly what you do not want when the wind pipes up. It moves the tack and clew corners closer together, increasing the sail's draft when you really want the sail to be getting flatter - and it does not take an awful lot of bend to do this. When we design sails, we typically may be working with as little as 1.5%-2.5% of chord width to make the proper draft, bending the loose-footed sail's boom a bit can easily double that amount, and the harder it blows, the more sheet tension there is and the more it bends.

  24. #59
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    A double ended sheet does not need to be readjusted each tack. Put the mast up and lay the boom right abeam. Measure from one swivel block/cam cleat to the block on the boom and back to the other swivel block/cam cleat. Add maybe 8' (4' for each end) and that's the length of sheet.

    Some thoughts: You don't need a ratcheting bloc if you've got a cam cleat and a ratcheting block won't hold the side you're not holding. The swivel matters because the lead of your pull will change.

    Something like this with a swivel base added if the place where that shackle attached does not itself swivel.


    Not cheap but doable.

    If no swivel built into block and cam, get a small jaw/eye swivel.


    Thread a U bolt through the eye and mount all that sticking up from the gunnel. The jaw's pin, if you size correctly, will fit nicely into the unit where the shackle's pin goes in the illustration above. Some clear plastic hose that can be distorted to fit over all from gunnel to block (leave a little gap so you can get at the pin) will ensure that the unit stands up or leaning to make a fair lead without flopping about and maybe causing a tangle.

    Get to know the Defender (https://www.defender.com) for good prices. There are supply problems due to covid interrupting everyone's supply chains.

    G'luck
    Last edited by Ian McColgin; 09-11-2020 at 01:39 PM.

  25. #60
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Oh yeah. With sheets that might run out their blocks, I put a stopper knot about a foot from the end of the line. That way there will be a tail you can grab to pull it all back. Very few frustrations than not having enough at your end of the block to grab, especially if your other hand is busy steering.

  26. #61
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Bradshaw View Post
    Yes. mid-boom sheeting, bending the boom on a loose-footed sail, is exactly what you do not want when the wind pipes up. It moves the tack and clew corners closer together, increasing the sail's draft when you really want the sail to be getting flatter - and it does not take an awful lot of bend to do this. When we design sails, we typically may be working with as little as 1.5%-2.5% of chord width to make the proper draft, bending the loose-footed sail's boom a bit can easily double that amount, and the harder it blows, the more sheet tension there is and the more it bends.
    Todd thanks for this new consideration (flattening of sail), that I have not yet thought of. What I do not understand is the difference of effect to the boom between mid-boom-sheeting and sheet on the clew. Why should there be greater bending of the boom if I fix the sheet in the middle (or near the middle) of the boom? If i would fix the sheet to the end of the boom (at the clew), the bend of the beam would be similar (less force on the sheet at the clew but longer lever).
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  27. #62
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    A double ended sheet does not need to be readjusted each tack. Put the mast up and lay the boom right abeam. Measure from one swivel block/cam cleat to the block on the boom and back to the other swivel block/cam cleat. Add maybe 8' (4' for each end) and that's the length of sheet.

    Some thoughts: You don't need a ratcheting bloc if you've got a cam cleat and a ratcheting block won't hold the side you're not holding. The swivel matters because the lead of your pull will change.

    Something like this with a swivel base added if the place where that shackle attached does not itself swivel.


    Not cheap but doable.

    If no swivel built into block and cam, get a small jaw/eye swivel.


    Thread a U bolt through the eye and mount all that sticking up from the gunnel. The jaw's pin, if you size correctly, will fit nicely into the unit where the shackle's pin goes in the illustration above. Some clear plastic hose that can be distorted to fit over all from gunnel to block (leave a little gap so you can get at the pin) will ensure that the unit stands up or leaning to make a fair lead without flopping about and maybe causing a tangle.

    Get to know the Defender (https://www.defender.com) for good prices. There are supply problems due to covid interrupting everyone's supply chains.

    G'luck
    Iain thanks, one day I will try Your solution. I could do it with the simple blocks I already own and hold those upright from the gunnel with your Idea of plastic hoses. Two cam-cleats in addition only.
    Comparing this with my "best option" Your option could may have some (small?) advantages. Still would have to figure it out how it will work during a jibing-maneuver?
    Hay mas tiempo que vida!

  28. #63
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    If i would fix the sheet to the end of the boom (at the clew), the bend of the beam would be similar (less force on the sheet at the clew but longer lever).
    No, it is not.

  29. #64
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pateplumaboat View Post
    Todd thanks for this new consideration (flattening of sail), that I have not yet thought of. What I do not understand is the difference of effect to the boom between mid-boom-sheeting and sheet on the clew. Why should there be greater bending of the boom if I fix the sheet in the middle (or near the middle) of the boom? If i would fix the sheet to the end of the boom (at the clew), the bend of the beam would be similar (less force on the sheet at the clew but longer lever).
    A loose footed main is connected at the fore and aft end of the boom, creating point loads on the boom. The fore point load is largely balanced by the attachment point of the boom to the mast. The aft one is balanced by the sheet when the sheet is attached to the aft end of the boom. This creates very little bending moment. When you attach the sheet to the middle of the boom you are now creating a point load at a location that is no longer balanced by an opposite support force. This leads to bending.

    To see this in action take a broom stick and hang it by the ends. Then grab the broom stick at each end and hang from it. There will be very little stress on the broom stick and it won't bend much, because the loads from your weight are almost directly below the support attachment points. To mimic mid-boom sheeting, move one of your hands to the middle of the stick and continue to hang. You'll notice the stick now flexes because there isn't a support directly above where your hand is pulling. If you want to minimize boom flex, and you do to preserve sail shape for the reasons Todd gave, then you need have your sheet attachment points close to the sail attachment points.

    In reality, it isn't quite this simple because the sail also compresses the boom because the tension in the sail pulls the ends toward each other, which will still cause the boom to bow some. But you are better off with sheeting at the end than in the middle.
    Last edited by cracked lid; 09-14-2020 at 09:01 PM. Reason: spelling

  30. #65
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    My favorite dinghy mainsheet system with just about any type of boomed sail is this one. You have a simple rope bridle aft from gunwale to gunwale. The aft end of the mainsheet rides side to side along the bridle on a small block or brass ring. The sheet then goes up to a block at or near the aft end of the boom, then forward to another boom block close to the mast. When tacking, the sheet can sag a bit, so a fairlead along the way and between the blocks can be helpful. The reason the forward block is close to the mast is that for some sail types and in installations where you have jaws or something other than a fixed gooseneck (Bermuda, lateen, Leg-O-Mutton, Gaff, etc.) it forms an automatically adjustable downhaul to help flatten the sail when sailing in heavier air with more sheet tension. As you turn more off the wind and sheet tension is eased, the downhaul tension is automatically eased, allowing more draft in the sail. On a lug, you will already be running pretty high luff downhaul tension all the time, but a bit more can't hurt when headed upwind.

    After passing the forward boom block, the sheet runs downward to another block on or near the partners, mast step or whatever you have down there and then turns aft and runs to the sailor who may or may not have a cleat to fix it to. This way, when you are pulling the sheet with a lot of tension on it, that force is pulling you down into the boat, not up and out of it as a sheet hanging from the boom will do.

    SHEET copy.jpg
    Last edited by Todd Bradshaw; 09-15-2020 at 12:00 AM.

  31. #66
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    I have mine set up the same way Todd shows above, with a jam cleat under the center thwart on the starboard side of the centerboard case.
    The downhaul tackle for the lug rig runs back the same way to a jam cleat under the same thwart on the port side of the case.
    A couple of fairleads keeps everything tidy.
    Both are right at hand for where I sit on the bottom while sailing.
    Works great and no lines all over the place to get tangled up in.

  32. #67
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Todd's system is the way iceboats are set up where the sheet loads are very high. Many racing dinghies, Sunfish etc .have a modified version with the sheet running along the boom to a turning block then to a turning block mounted on a thwart, cb trunk etc. The fairleads on the boom are very important, keep slack sheet from catching your hat or head.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Tipsy, Tippy, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity, Look Far, Flash and a quiver of other 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  33. #68
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Bradshaw View Post
    No, it is not.
    Thanks Todd, I had to make a sketch to convince myself that I was wrong and You are right.

    loose footed.jpg

    Sketch is simplifying situation and as "cracked lid" writes correctly "In reality, it isn't quite this simple because the sail also compresses the boom because the tension in the sail pulls the ends toward each other, which will still cause the boom to bow some." ("cracked lid", thanks for comment).

    Probably I was misleaded by thinking of a sail bound to the boom all the way. I think, for such a rig (non-loose-footed), the bending of the boom would be less if it would be attached at mid-boom (comparing with an end-boom attachement of the mainsheet).
    Hay mas tiempo que vida!

  34. #69
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by swoody126 View Post
    ... a very simple mainsheet system using a minimum amount of line and the simplest of hardware
    basically secured(tied) to the end of the boom running down thru a low friction eye on the aft end of the tiller and fwd to the skippers hand as it is holding the tiller
    some add an open top cleat on top of the tiller between the eye and the fwd end of the tiller
    again my attraction to this type of vessel is their anvil simplicity and how well they perform w/o all the extra whistles n bells some think they need ...
    sw
    Swoody, thanks for comment and pictures. I had a similar mainsheet-rig on another small boat I built and it works fine if the wind is not blowing hard. For stronger winds I found it difficult to deal with the mainsheet along the tiller as one cannot fix the sheet on a cleat (risk of capsize). I prefer to have one hand (aft) on the tiller and the other hand (fwd) with the mainsheet. If You do this with the simple rig You describe Your arms have to be crossed and this is not a comfortable situation in sailing the boat and if You have to ride out on the boat this may not be possible at all. In addition, for stronger winds, some purchase of the main for load-reduction helps for better control .
    Hay mas tiempo que vida!

  35. #70
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    Default Re: What is the best way to rig mainsheet for balanced lug sail in 12 feet skiff?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pateplumaboat View Post
    Swoody, thanks for comment and pictures. I had a similar mainsheet-rig on another small boat I built and it works fine if the wind is not blowing hard. For stronger winds I found it difficult to deal with the mainsheet along the tiller as one cannot fix the sheet on a cleat (risk of capsize). I prefer to have one hand (aft) on the tiller and the other hand (fwd) with the mainsheet. If You do this with the simple rig You describe Your arms have to be crossed and this is not a comfortable situation in sailing the boat and if You have to ride out on the boat this may not be possible at all. In addition, for stronger winds, some purchase of the main for load-reduction helps for better control .
    I think I may have posted something about this earlier in the thread, but have you tried any kind of self-steering/tiller tender device?

    I use a simple line/bungee that hooks over a small cleat on the underside of the tiller, and the tension of the line/bungee pulling backward against the clear holds the tiller in place whenever I let go. At the same time, I can grab the tiller and steer at any moment without adjusting tension. This is a VERY handy thing to rig in a small boat, where you typically need one hand for the sheet, one for the tiller, one for the daggerboard/centerboard, one for... oops...

    Here's what it looks like in action:



    I can push the tiller over to tack, and don't need to touch it again until it's time to straighten out on the new tack, for example. Or sail for hours with only a nudge of the tiller now and then. I can't recommend it highly enough.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

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