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Thread: Republican War Crimes

  1. #1
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    Default Republican War Crimes

    [IMc - Some Republicans, our president for example, proudly promote war crimes but made sure they were physically unfit for service. Others, like Rep. Hunter, served but remain morally unfit. Free fire artillery against civilian targets is a war crime. That order should have been refused and the commander who issued it court marshaled.]

    Published on Tuesday, June 04, 2019, by Common Dreams

    Duncan Hunter Admits His Marine Unit ‘Killed Probably Hundreds of Civilians’ in Iraq
    Republican congressman counts 'women and children' among his probable victims as he brushes off war crimes during interview

    by Brett Wilkins

    "I was an artillery officer and we fired hundreds of rounds into Fallujah, killed probably hundreds of civilians… Probably killed women and children if there were any left in the city when we invaded. So do I get judged too?"

    Rep. Duncan Hunter (D-CA) has come under fire after admitting during a podcast interview that his Marine Corps unit "killed probably hundreds of civilians" during the atrocity-laden First Battle of Fallujah in 2004.

    Hunter's comments came during an interview on Barstool Sports' "Zero Blog Thirty" podcast in which he voiced support for Edward Gallagher, a decorated Navy SEAL facing trial for alleged war crimes, including shooting unarmed civilians and stabbing a critically wounded prisoner of war to death.

    When asked about his support for Gallagher, Hunter doubled down. "I frankly don’t care if he was killed," the congressman said, referring to the 17-year-old Islamic State fighter allegedly stabbed to death by the SEAL. "I just don’t care. And as a congressman, that’s my prerogative to help a guy out like that."

    "Even if everything the prosecutors say is true in this case, then… Eddie Gallagher should still be given a break," Hunter added.

    In addition to premeditated murder, military prosecutors accuse Gallagher, a SEAL Team 7 sniper, of crimes including photographing and staging a re-enlistment ceremony over his victim’s body, as well as "indiscriminate, reckless and bloodthirsty" conduct. Fellow snipers say he shot an unarmed old man, as well as a young girl who was walking with her friends. One SEAL said he saw Gallagher "fire into a crowd of what appeared to be noncombatants multiple times." Gallagher also allegedly confessed that he "killed four women" and boasted that he killed "10 to 20 people a day or 150-200 people on deployment." Other SEALs say Gallagher attempted to cover up his crimes by threatening to murder witnesses and by trying to identify, expose and destroy whistleblowers.

    "Chief Gallagher decided to act like the monster the terrorists accuse us of being," Navy prosecutor Chris Czaplak said of the defendant. "He handed ISIS propaganda manna from heaven. His actions are everything ISIS says we are."

    When one "Zero Blog Thirty" host—another former Marine—suggested that the congressman’s willingness to show leniency to Gallagher "goes against our honor so egregiously" and presents "such a slippery slope," Hunter replied with a stunning admission.

    "So how do you judge me?" he asked. "I was an artillery officer and we fired hundreds of rounds into Fallujah, killed probably hundreds of civilians… Probably killed women and children if there were any left in the city when we invaded. So do I get judged too?"

    Hunter, who rose to the rank of major, completed two tours of duty in Iraq and one of Afghanistan while on active duty, and was later re-deployed to Afghanistan as a reservist. During his second tour in Iraq, he participated in the atrocity-laden First Battle of Fallujah, officially called Operation Vigilant Resolve, in the spring of 2004. According to US veterans of the assault, as well as survivors, journalists, medical personnel, human rights groups and others, Marines indiscriminately killed men, women, children, the elderly and disabled residents of the city. Civilians waving white flags of surrender were cut down by snipers, who also targeted ambulances carrying the wounded and dying to the few remaining functional clinics left in the city.

    According to the US military, 600 civilians were killed during Vigilant Resolve, which failed to achieve its objective of crushing Fallujah’s resistance to US occupation. A second assault on the city in November-December 2004, Operation Phantom Fury, resulted in the deaths of around 800 more civilians. It was during Vigilant Resolve that commanding general James Mattis earned the moniker "Mad Dog." After President Donald Trump nominated Mattis for defense secretary, Hunter responded to questions of whether the general was a war criminal by telling critics to "get over it."

    "Fallujah was the last free-fire zone for artillery for the entire Iraq war," Hunter explained. "I can clearly recall… that the rules of engagement allowed for targeting anyone out during curfew. Did we utterly decimate? Yes… and we won… [so] to [even] question whether Mattis committed war crimes in Iraq is absurd."

    Hunter has a history of confessing to troubling behavior. Last month, he told a town hall meeting that "Eddie [Gallagher] did one bad thing that I’m guilty of too—taking a picture of the body and saying something stupid." According to the Defense Department’s Law of War Manual, enemy military dead must be treated with “the same respect as would be afforded to, or expected for, friendly military dead.”

    In addition to defending alleged war crimes, Hunter has also said that if the US wages war against Iran, it should be a nuclear war.

    There were audible gasps in a San Diego military court after a judge, Capt. Aaron Rugh, unexpectedly ordered Gallagher released from pretrial detention on Thursday, less than two weeks before his June 10 trial is scheduled to begin. Rugh accused prosecutors of interfering with Gallagher’s defense counsel and delaying his trial. President Donald Trump, who has already interceded on Gallagher’s behalf, said he has been considering pardons for numerous US troops accused of war crimes, including Gallagher. While campaigning for president, Trump promised to commit at least two war crimes in the fight against Islamist terrorists. He vowed to "bomb the **** out of" Islamic State militants and "take out their families," and he endorsed torture, saying he would "bring back a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding."

    Meanwhile, Hunter and his wife Margaret—who were indicted last August on 60 counts of conspiracy, wire fraud, records falsification and campaign finance violations related to the alleged misuse of $250,000 in campaign funds for personal expenses—are due to appear in court to stand trial later this year.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    further proof that war can bring out the best in a person.. or the very worst. Usually, it is a case of the very worst.
    Last edited by Art Haberland; 06-05-2019 at 08:36 AM.
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Ian, aside from Hunter’s criminality in campaign finances I don’t see the utility in characterizing the use of artillery on Fallujah a war crime when the entire invasion was criminal. Are you somehow implying there’s a war where only armed combatants get killed?

    In fall of 2004 the fiasco in Iraq was spreading like wildfire and the administration continued its propaganda campaign about the basis for it. Here we are fifteen years later with John Bolton advising the scrotus about Iran. This is an American crime.

    And now Trump continues arms sales to Saudi Arabia so they can “win” in Yemen. The rot in the Republican Party enables this but it takes a supine populace as well.

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    If any of our politicians wants to go to war.. I am all for it. Here is your helmet and here is your gun, let us know how you are doing. I am tired of innocent people being sent off to war to bolster some leaders standing in the world. We should build a modern coliseum and bring back the gladiatorial games so those that want to go to war can pick up a sword and go for it.
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Is that Hunter part of the CA political family of Hunters that goes back several generations? If so, they've been a mainstay in CA Republican politics for decades.

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    A good Indian is a Dead Indian! Sound familiar?

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Iraq II was one giant GOP war crime. Alot of attrocities were committed by private contractors. Purposefully as a plan to foment civil war because Rumsfeld knew that after buying off Saddams' military commanders to stand down https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...er-105987.html we would not have enough troops to occupy Iraq and meet the responsibilities of an occupier. https://www.dissentmagazine.org/onli...from-the-start
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Landrith View Post
    Iraq II was one giant GOP war crime. Alot of attrocities were committed by private contractors. Purposefully as a plan to foment civil war because Rumsfeld knew that after buying off Saddams' military commanders to stand down https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...er-105987.html we would not have enough troops to occupy Iraq and meet the responsibilities of an occupier. https://www.dissentmagazine.org/onli...from-the-start
    My take is that Cheney and Rumsfeld really didn’t see the Al Qaeda type movements as an existential threat and that allowing a power vacuum would likely increase militant jihadism in the region but it would be an acceptable cost as it would occur over there, not here. Atrocities weren’t needed to foment a civil war, it was a natural consequence of the administrations overall strategy. After the chaos and killing we would supposedly reform Iraq in our image. Then on to Syria and Iran. Until Americans stop this it’ll continue even with a Dotard Trump.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeeG View Post
    My take is that Cheney and Rumsfeld really didn’t see the Al Qaeda type movements as an existential threat and that allowing a power vacuum would likely increase militant jihadism in the region but it would be an acceptable cost as it would occur over there, not here. Atrocities weren’t needed to foment a civil war, it was a natural consequence of the administration's overall strategy. After the chaos and killing we would supposedly reform Iraq in our image. Then on to Syria and Iran. Until Americans stop this it’ll continue even with a Dotard Trump.
    You are probably right in the macro sense. But when I saw the pics of Iraqi prisoners (esp the most famous pic https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...-at-abu-ghraib as a failed art student I recognized the staged effect for horror in Arab minds), use of which in propaganda is a war crime, when I heard the "driller killer" stories on Baghdad streets https://www.antiwar.com/blog/2015/01...chers-of-iraq/ , and that men captured after the Golden Mosque bombing were British SAS in Sunni costume https://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2006...4533.html?c=on all in main stream media at the time, I saw it as our American Intelligence community at work.

    Today, we see the same stuff being attempted in Venezuela under Bolton. Like the bribing of their generals, which appears to have failed.
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Landrith View Post
    Iraq II was one giant GOP war crime. . . we would not have enough troops to occupy Iraq and meet the responsibilities of an occupier.
    Yep. You break it, you own it.

    Not just troops, but reconstruction personnel and material.

    You may not have all the stuff before the invasion, but you need it instantly thereafter. These people have come under your power and you are responsible for them.
    Trust me to defend the Constitution just as soon as I'm sure you're going to vote for me again.

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Why does the article have a D after Hunter's name?

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike H View Post
    Why does the article have a D after Hunter's name?
    that is a very good question.
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Misprint. Perhaps because his middle name is Duane.

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    And some Americans STILL ask why some people have a distrust of Americans...... and the D must stand for Dumb*ss, openly admitting to a war crime, but knowing full well he will never be held accountable. You could start with him........

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    I ran a brake press with a former Marine that was imprisoned for war crimes at the end of Vietnam War. His 113 Armored Personnel Carrier was hit with an RPG7 fired by a kid. Their unit turned and attacked everyone in the village. He was in prison through the 70's then released. In 1980 I went through Basic at Ft. Benning, Lt. William Calley had finished his house arrest there, but they strongly emphasized following only "lawful" orders. In my guard unit, my squad leader was an Army sapper seconded to the Marines in Lebanon. He disobeyed orders and directed his team to return fire after days of being shot at clearing bombs. He was jailed, but after the barracks were later blown up, they released him. The Army changes made after Mi Lai mandated training on "lawful" orders. You could tell from the first reports of Iraq prisoner misconduct that all that had been discarded. Instead, they were following directions by "contractors" - the intelligence operators of our MidEastern ally.
    "Song, song of the North
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    Truth is marching on
    Factories all closed, holes in the border fence
    We applied for the jobs but never got a chance
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    Get a college professor to vote like that"

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Landrith View Post
    I ran a brake press with a former Marine that was imprisoned for war crimes at the end of Vietnam War. His 113 Armored Personnel Carrier was hit with an RPG7 fired by a kid. Their unit turned and attacked everyone in the village. He was in prison through the 70's then released. In 1980 I went through Basic at Ft. Benning, Lt. William Calley had finished his house arrest there, but they strongly emphasized following only "lawful" orders. In my guard unit, my squad leader was an Army sapper seconded to the Marines in Lebanon. He disobeyed orders and directed his team to return fire after days of being shot at clearing bombs. He was jailed, but after the barracks were later blown up, they released him. The Army changes made after Mi Lai mandated training on "lawful" orders. You could tell from the first reports of Iraq prisoner misconduct that all that had been discarded. Instead, they were following directions by "contractors" - the intelligence operators of our MidEastern ally.
    Another issue with privatizing the occupation is that it helped rationalize an inadequate guard to prisoner ratio. Executives from the prison industry were invited over to Iraq to advise management and reconstruction of prisons in an occupied country where a civil war was about to break out and they recommended changes that made sense in a country that wasn’t going through all that.
    On top of that the dumb ass assumptions behind the invasion characterized any hostile Iraqi as a potential terrorist associated with Al Qaeda so the number of captured combatants requiring interrogation exploded and the prison population did as well. All of which overloaded a marginal system to begin with.

    Which is why it’s such an abysmal judgement of the American public to have voted for Trump who mindlessly advocated torture as an interrogation technique.

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeG View Post
    Ian, aside from Hunter’s criminality in campaign finances I don’t see the utility in characterizing the use of artillery on Fallujah a war crime when the entire invasion was criminal. Are you somehow implying there’s a war where only armed combatants get killed?

    In fall of 2004 the fiasco in Iraq was spreading like wildfire and the administration continued its propaganda campaign about the basis for it. Here we are fifteen years later with John Bolton advising the scrotus about Iran. This is an American crime.

    And now Trump continues arms sales to Saudi Arabia so they can “win” in Yemen. The rot in the Republican Party enables this but it takes a supine populace as well.
    And an Australian one………….. But the Government politicians who invaded based on a lie are the most culpable, and the least likely to be held to account.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    I agree that our lawless war on Iraq would be a crime even if no criminal tactics (artillery targeting non-military facilities) are used. National leaders should be held to account for an unlawful war. Military personnel should be held accountable for any individual crimes they are involved with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    I agree that our lawless war on Iraq would be a crime even if no criminal tactics (artillery targeting non-military facilities) are used. National leaders should be held to account for an unlawful war. Military personnel should be held accountable for any individual crimes they are involved with.
    But Cheney and all are well retired with Bolton, a propagandist with a documented history, as National Security Advisor. Hey, Support the Troops, We Meant Well.

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    Default Re: Republican War Crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    I agree that our lawless war on Iraq would be a crime even if no criminal tactics (artillery targeting non-military facilities) are used. National leaders should be held to account for an unlawful war. Military personnel should be held accountable for any individual crimes they are involved with.
    The recent press raids by Ausralian government goons and an ongoing 'secret' case over Intell. agency doings for private commercial gain in East Timor on the basis of legislation recently passed at the last moment by BOTH majors are precisely directed at preventing such matters coming to public notice.

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