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Thread: Biden polls climbing

  1. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    Really? Trump is still viable for you?
    Trump was never viable for me. I have made that clear and have been absolutely consistent.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    Trump was never viable for me. I have made that clear and have been absolutely consistent.

    Yet you will perhaps leave a vote between Trump and the centrist Biden up to game day? It makes hollow your claim that Trump is not viable.
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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by peb View Post
    Will definitely not vote in the democratic primary. Biden in the general election? Likely a game day decision.
    So... what’s this? It’ll likely be Biden... or trump.

    oops- I see I’m not the only one. Really curious your thoughts. Trumps such a disaster- I can’t imagine the scenario where he’s even an option
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

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    Quote Originally Posted by twodot View Post
    Yet you will perhaps leave a vote between Trump and the centrist Biden up to game day? It makes hollow your claim that Trump is not viable.
    2016 convinced me that my vote is worth something. I will not give it away simply because I dislike one candidate. I no longer choose the lesser of two evils. Now, I am not saying right now that Biden would or would not be an acceptable choice. Game day decision was perhaps too strong, I am sure I will have a decision before election. Also, I do not know who any possible third party candidate is. And I have no problem going to the polls and skipping over any given race, even the presidential race, if I find no candidate acceptable.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Lathrop View Post
    I'm detecting something here that should be highly unlikely but it seems to be true anyway. Republicans mounted a campaign against Hillary that was filled with lies and only a modest amount of fact. Way too many democrats accepted that she was not only not the best candidate to ever run for president but was a female Satan in disguise. Not perfect by any means but plenty good enough that democrats should not have been so controlled by the right wing wackos. Look at the result.

    Now I'm seeing the same thing happen to Joe Biden, another less than perfect human being, but basically a good and decent man with some flaws. Any of you that allow yourselves to be so hoodwinked again deserve to be part of Trump's favorite whipping boy cadre. Just compare these two men as to which is capable of making reasonable well considered decisions as opposed to the gut reactions of a pre-schooler. Any centrist or person that values the future of this republic as a democracy that votes for Trump is an ignoramus.
    It is curious, isn't it. It took decades of vilification for the Republicans to do that to Hillary, but people are buying into it more quickly with Biden. I really wish I could understand why.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    It is curious, isn't it. It took decades of vilification for the Republicans to do that to Hillary, but people are buying into it more quickly with Biden. I really wish I could understand why.
    Perhaps because their eyes are now open to how some people take advantage of office. I hear Hunter Biden is being asked to attend a hearing to give testimony on his vast lucrative dealings he has had in Ukraine and China. Under the circumstances of some suggesting Don Jr should be hanging from a lampost for doing deals with the enemy, the hypocrisy given the same possible scenario is clear to those outside watching.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    EVERY Republican has a responsibility to see to it that their party nominates someone other than Donald Trump. If they fail to do so, ALL Republicans will once again own the election result.
    "Trump's authoritarianism is a feature not a bug." -- Sky Blue






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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    After decades of smears, I understand the Clinton thing. What have they got against Biden?
    The same thing they have against Clinton, Bush, and now Trump; they’re establishment, they don’t represent them. Trump was about a government for them, every establishment voice, including the republicans was against Trump, that meant he was they’re guy. They’re done getting screwed by the government. They admit Trump was a huge mistake but one they still feel that we’re given no choice but to make.

    The thing I learned; to them, whenever Obama got involved with a culture war issue, he was distracting for bad policy that would really impact them. He’s an auto mechanic, he’s got two guys that make $25/hr, but the rest make $14-$18/hr. That’s all he, as the shop manager, can afford to pay them. It pisses him off. He doesn’t know how to fix it, all he knows is it needs fixing and doing the same old thing over and over isn’t working. I feel the same way. They won’t vote for Biden, and Biden might make him vote for Trump again . . . she said she won’t ever vote again, she feels, more than ever, that the system is rigged against them. I agree, it is.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Montgomery View Post
    EVERY Republican has a responsibility to see to it that their party nominates someone other than Donald Trump. If they fail to do so, ALL Republicans will once again own the election result.
    I no longer consider.myself a republican, but if there is a primary challenge I will, in all likelihood, vote in the GOP primary.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    Here, we have an entire political party dedicated to making it harder for people to vote -- especially people of color and young people. They know a minority of voters nationally support them, and they are determined to make that be enough to keep them in power.
    To keep them in power by dint of undermining the Constitution.

    Therefore, the 'Republican' Party is the Party Of Sedition, or POS.
    Rattling the teacups.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    The same thing they have against Clinton, Bush, and now Trump; they’re establishment, they don’t represent them. Trump was about a government for them, every establishment voice, including the republicans was against Trump, that meant he was they’re guy. They’re done getting screwed by the government. They admit Trump was a huge mistake but one they still feel that we’re given no choice but to make.

    The thing I learned; to them, whenever Obama got involved with a culture war issue, he was distracting for bad policy that would really impact them. He’s an auto mechanic, he’s got two guys that make $25/hr, but the rest make $14-$18/hr. That’s all he, as the shop manager, can afford to pay them. It pisses him off. He doesn’t know how to fix it, all he knows is it needs fixing and doing the same old thing over and over isn’t working. I feel the same way. They won’t vote for Biden, and Biden might make him vote for Trump again . . . she said she won’t ever vote again, she feels, more than ever, that the system is rigged against them. I agree, it is.
    You said they think Biden is so bad they'd vote for Trump again. What is it that's worse about Biden than Trump?

    Still sounds like you expect one guy to fix everything real quick. Ain't gonna happen. We got here because of a well-funded, persistent political movement that appealed to racism in order to get more power for the rich. Trump turned out to be the latest manifestation of this. Yet they think Biden is worse. It makes no sense.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    You said they think Biden is so bad they'd vote for Trump again. What is it that's worse about Biden than Trump?

    Still sounds like you expect one guy to fix everything real quick. Ain't gonna happen. We got here because of a well-funded, persistent political movement that appealed to racism in order to get more power for the rich. Trump turned out to be the latest manifestation of this. Yet they think Biden is worse. It makes no sense.
    Stop putting words in my mouth. And, Biden represents the same thing Clinton does, if not as viscerally hated. If you don't understand what that means, that explains why do still don't get what happened in 2016. Don't worry, you're not alone, and your ignorance is the exact thing that will bring us another 4 years of Trump.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    Stop putting words in my mouth. And, Biden represents the same thing Clinton does, if not as viscerally hated. If you don't understand what that means, that explains why do still don't get what happened in 2016. Don't worry, you're not alone, and your ignorance is the exact thing that will bring us another 4 years of Trump.

    And I am condescending.
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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    Stop putting words in my mouth. And, Biden represents the same thing Clinton does, if not as viscerally hated. If you don't understand what that means, that explains why do still don't get what happened in 2016. Don't worry, you're not alone, and your ignorance is the exact thing that will bring us another 4 years of Trump.
    These are the words as you wrote them:

    Originally Posted by McMike
    My Girlfriends parents voted for Trump, her mother voted for the first time in her life. Both voted hard against Clinton. Her mother, during mother's day dinner, exclaimed, "I wish I never voted for that fu34er", her father nodded in agreement. He then followed with his concerns for his retirement and said, "I just couldn't allow Clinton to be president", followed by, I won't vote for Trump unless I have to, If they run Biden, I don't know, I might have to". . .
    I'd still like to know what Biden represents that's worse than what Trump represents. You'll call me ignorant, but so far, you won't answer the question.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    Those wacky voters are out to make me look like a fool. I've repeatedly said I don't think Joe Biden will be the nominee, but his poll numbers keep going up:




    Personally, I'd prefer a policy wonk like Warren, but I think I understand the appeal of Biden. He represents 'a return to normalcy.' He's an old white guy who's been in government forever, seems well-intentioned, and has a track record of moderation. That track record is supposed to be an albatross around his neck, but it isn't turning out that way so far.

    It's early days, but I'm already being surprised.
    Yes his poll number when up more then most expected when he announced.
    But now it seems his poll numbers are starting to drop.

    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep...tion-6730.html

    biden.jpg
    "The only rules that really matter are these: what a man can do and what a man can’t do." Captain Jack Sparrow

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Interesting how Bernie & Joe mirror each other. One goes up, the other goes down.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by Garret View Post
    Interesting how Bernie & Joe mirror each other. One goes up, the other goes down.
    Yes it is interesting, since they have 2 different messages.
    It just shows that at this point in time it is all about name recognition and not the message or platform of each candidate.
    "The only rules that really matter are these: what a man can do and what a man can’t do." Captain Jack Sparrow

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    I've read Bernie has 'targeted' Biden as his 'foil'. Hope these guys don't play the part of 'spoiler' in this election, ala' Nader several elections ago.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Neither Bernie nor Joe. We need somebody younger, with less baggage,
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Neither Bernie nor Joe. We need somebody younger, with less baggage,
    Agreed.

    There must be someone under 75 who could be president.

    In Washington State, judges have to retire at 75. In Washington DC they're warming up to run for president at that age
    Elect a clown expect a circus

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by genglandoh View Post
    It just shows that at this point in time it is all about name recognition and not the message or platform of each candidate.

    No it doesn't show that. You can't read that from the graph.
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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Neither Bernie nor Joe. We need somebody younger, with less baggage,
    I'm with you there, but so far we seem to be in a minority.

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    I'm with you there, but so far we seem to be in a minority.
    I'm with you both. I'm also in the "it's too early to tell" category - but as I've said before, I wish Bernie hadn't run again & feel much the same about Joe.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    These are the words as you wrote them:



    I'd still like to know what Biden represents that's worse than what Trump represents. You'll call me ignorant, but so far, you won't answer the question.
    It doesn't matter to most people, You think this country is informed enough to be able to answer that question intelligently? All they know is that the government doesn't work for them and that means entrenched life long politicians like Clinton and Biden. They took a chance on Trump, it failed, they'll try again, and certainly won't vote for Biden. See, you're fighting this on an intellectual level that just doesn't exist out there, everyone is to busy to follow the minutia of politics, information is unverifiable to the normal person, and they are sick of being lied to. They don't trust government at all. It's the key point we missed in 2016 and it's being missed by the DNC and people like you. Vote for Biden in the primaries, you'll see.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by twodot View Post
    And I am condescending.
    Why yes, yes you are.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    It doesn't matter to most people, You think this country is informed enough to be able to answer that question intelligently? All they know is that the government doesn't work for them and that means entrenched life long politicians like Clinton and Biden. They took a chance on Trump, it failed, they'll try again, and certainly won't vote for Biden. See, you're fighting this on an intellectual level that just doesn't exist out there, everyone is to busy to follow the minutia of politics, information is unverifiable to the normal person, and they are sick of being lied to. They don't trust government at all. It's the key point we missed in 2016 and it's being missed by the DNC and people like you. Vote for Biden in the primaries, you'll see.
    I know you're really focused on insulting me, but haven't you read anything I've written about Biden?

    Since the Trump experiment was a failure, why would they try that again?

    If I were approaching this on an intellectual level, I'd expect voters to go for Warren, who has policy ideas to change things. Instead, most are more interested in Biden, who represents everything the pundits told me the Democrats don't want this year. Go back and read the OP. I'm trying to understand why so many support Biden, and it seems like an emotional decision to me.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I suspect it reflects the effects of fear on welding people to Type 1 thinking.
    Seems like there's plenty of time for Type 2 thinking, but most people are not so inclined.

  28. #63
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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    I know you're really focused on insulting me, but haven't you read anything I've written about Biden?

    Since the Trump experiment was a failure, why would they try that again?

    If I were approaching this on an intellectual level, I'd expect voters to go for Warren, who has policy ideas to change things. Instead, most are more interested in Biden, who represents everything the pundits told me the Democrats don't want this year. Go back and read the OP. I'm trying to understand why so many support Biden, and it seems like an emotional decision to me.
    Actually, I'm not trying to insult you as much as get you to see things as the average Trump voter see's them. Seriously, if we don't address what made reasonable people vote for an (then) obvious DB, then those same people will revolt again. And not just them, Biden represents the power brokers in the DNC ignoring a fairly large group of real progressives. Progressives that have historically, over the past 2-3 decades, only voted against conservatives, not for Democrats. They are sick and tired of being ignored. I am tired of being ignored . . . and used. Trump or no, this country's government is broken. I and people like me are starting to see that continuing to merely vote against isn't working . . . we want someone to vote for. I demand it, as do many.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    Seems like there's plenty of time for Type 2 thinking, but most people are not so inclined.
    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I suspect it reflects the effects of fear on welding people to Type 1 thinking.
    An assumption that make's you look like the elitists you're often accused of acting like.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    An assumption that make's you look like the elitists you're often accused of acting like.
    You just told me that it's a mistake to approach this intellectually, now you claim I'm an elitists for not thinking everyone approaches things intellectually. Regardless of what I say, you take exception to it. If you're really trying to make me better informed, that's not the way to go about it.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Neither Bernie nor Joe. I’m starting to like our governor Jay Inslee more all the time, especially since announcing his comprehensive climate change plan. Nothing middle of the road about it.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    You just told me that it's a mistake to approach this intellectually, now you claim I'm an elitists for not thinking everyone approaches things intellectually. Regardless of what I say, you take exception to it. If you're really trying to make me better informed, that's not the way to go about it.
    Right, more games. Whatever dude. Here's the thing, I was right in 2016 and I'm right now. What's your track record? Ohhhhhh, Trump won. Hubris from people like you made that happen. The voters that matter defy your logic, no matter how sound. It's those people that will decide the next election. It's registered Democrats who will either give them someone to vote for or against. They will vote against Biden. We don't simply need a win, we need a win by a large margin or Trump will tie up the results for years. That's the real game, and if you don't play it well, it'll be your (generally speaking) fault Trump wins in 2020.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    Actually, I'm not trying to insult you as much as get you to see things as the average Trump voter see's them. Seriously, if we don't address what made reasonable people vote for an (then) obvious DB, then those same people will revolt again. And not just them, Biden represents the power brokers in the DNC ignoring a fairly large group of real progressives. Progressives that have historically, over the past 2-3 decades, only voted against conservatives, not for Democrats. They are sick and tired of being ignored. I am tired of being ignored . . . and used. Trump or no, this country's government is broken. I and people like me are starting to see that continuing to merely vote against isn't working . . . we want someone to vote for. I demand it, as do many.
    I'm trying to see things the way enough voters see them to oust Trump. The typical Trump voter is not going to vote for any Democrat. What I'm interested in is the persuadable voter.

    Now, here's my problem. In 2018, progressive candidates managed to unseat a number of sitting Democrats. They did not unseat any sitting Republicans. The Democrats who won in red districts were centrists.

    https://www.vox.com/2018/11/7/180717...elections-2018

    So I don't think the solution to winning over Trump voters is moving left. That's too bad, because I stand about where Warren does on the issues. I'm not convinced that she, or someone equally far to the left, can't win, but I'm thinking about this (slowly) and it seems like the move toward Biden represents a desire to move back to what people think of as normal. If so, I'm hoping Warren can change the conversation about policy to have an impact.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by McMike View Post
    Right, more games. Whatever dude. Here's the thing, I was right in 2016 and I'm right now. What's your track record? Ohhhhhh, Trump won. Hubris from people like you made that happen. The voters that matter defy your logic, no matter how sound. It's those people that will decide the next election. It's registered Democrats who will either give them someone to vote for or against. They will vote against Biden. We don't simply need a win, we need a win by a large margin or Trump will tie up the results for years. That's the real game, and if you don't play it well, it'll be your (generally speaking) fault Trump wins in 2020.
    What's your problem? I didn't elect Trump any more than you did.

    If you don't want to play games, stop playing games. You sneer at people and claim they are sneering at you, when all they've done is ask for information. Let go of the chip on your shoulder and make a genuine effort to communicate, maybe we'll make some progress.

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    Default Re: Biden polls climbing

    Quote Originally Posted by johnw View Post
    I'm trying to see things the way enough voters see them to oust Trump. The typical Trump voter is not going to vote for any Democrat. What I'm interested in is the persuadable voter.

    Now, here's my problem. In 2018, progressive candidates managed to unseat a number of sitting Democrats. They did not unseat any sitting Republicans. The Democrats who won in red districts were centrists.

    https://www.vox.com/2018/11/7/180717...elections-2018

    So I don't think the solution to winning over Trump voters is moving left. That's too bad, because I stand about where Warren does on the issues. I'm not convinced that she, or someone equally far to the left, can't win, but I'm thinking about this (slowly) and it seems like the move toward Biden represents a desire to move back to what people think of as normal. If so, I'm hoping Warren can change the conversation about policy to have an impact.
    I disagree, not on the facts you presented but on the idea that local election results will determine the presidential election. I'm going to repeat it. There is a very large group of people out there that made an example out of Clinton and the DNC for their insistence she run. Many of them feel the exact same way about the RNC. Trump was a protest vote for these people. A giant black eye to the establishment. They will vote for a progressive as long as they don't say stupid sh17 like we need to provide free healthcare for illegal immigrants when most legal, taxpaying folks can't afford healthcare for themselves or their families. They'll vote for a progressive that picks one or two issues and commits to fixing those problems, but not a progressive that thinks culture war issues take priority over the real issues they face every day, like the opioid epidemic or the lack of good, middle class creating jobs.
    In the US this perverted idea of “blood and soil” over “constitutional principles” is the most radical and anti-democratic and anti-Conservative idea I have heard in my lifetime.

    ~C. Ross

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