Results 1 to 21 of 21

Thread: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Temecula,CA
    Posts
    6

    Default Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    I am a new guy. So I am ready for the feedback that I stupid and posted this in the wrong place. Just trying to find my way!
    I have begun restoring a 22' cold rolled wooden sailboat. Some of you might have seen this for sale in southern California. Its in my shop now.
    I posted some pictures, including one photo I found that is a sailboat that looks "similar" and I will pass the "information" that the seller passed to me.
    Seller states it is late 50s vintage. Hauled on its trailer from Michigan. Aluminum mast and boom might have replaced original wood ones. Came with 2 sets of sails, and 2 spinnakers and is rigged for a spinnaker with pole. Sanded the gray paint off a 12"x12" area and it has mahogany outer layer. Will look great when stained and varnished. Actually, all is there and if it does not sink, it could be rigged and sailed right now. But will go through it.

    OK, what is it? Any info?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Cushing, Maine
    Posts
    3,551

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Open up the sails and see if there is an emblem on the main
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Tipsy, Tippy, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity, Look Far, Flash and a quiver of other 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Temecula,CA
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Ben
    Great idea! Did not use both sides of my brain. Running over there tomorrow to unfurl the main. It has a crank operated furling system that rolls the main around the boom. Never have seen that before but smart furling system. Stand by..... MiG

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    25,480

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Looks like a Hogdon 21, which I think might also have been sold as the Great Lakes 21.

    https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/great-lakes-21

    If I'm right, plans are available from our sponsor.

    https://www.woodenboat.com/boat-plan...on-class-sloop

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Australia and Tasmania
    Posts
    17,278

    Default

    Roller furling is a pain. Very slow to roll up or down, useless for reefing. Plan on getting rid of it.

    Sent from my CPH1851 using Tapatalk

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Sound Beach, NY
    Posts
    3,729

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Everyone has a preference, before changing anything I would try it in practice.
    Whatever she is, good luck with her, keep us posted.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Bainbridge Island WA
    Posts
    2,739

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    I've been re-reading Maurice Griffiths books about sailing the coast of England, he seems to have rather liked roller furling.
    Steve

    Boats, like whiskey, are all good.
    R.D Culler

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Portland, Maine
    Posts
    17,627

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    We like the roller reefing on Talisman, too. Quick and easy, never any problem.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Alameda, CA
    Posts
    13,079

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    What a fun boat. Paint and sail her fist before changing the rig. A good roller furling would make her easy to handle and depower. Since the former owners changed the rig, there is a good chance she is well thought out. The possibilities to turbo it are good too.

    Yes, keep us informed!
    A large nose is the mark of a witty, courteous, affable, generous and liberal man. My feature suggests an excellent side kick of good index.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Central Coast, Ca
    Posts
    22,985

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Roller furling is especially good if you want to remain on the boat...

    As far as reefing a roller furling jib, my sailmaker suggested "Try it", which I did and noted that Hey! it works.
    Not as well as a 50% smaller jib perhaps, but when conditions actually dictate reefing or furling the jib, staying off the foredeck is the correct answer.
    Racing is different, you can risk your life for that.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Portland, Maine
    Posts
    17,627

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Back to the original post: cold rolled is a process for making steel - cold molded is the technique for building boats with thin veneers and epoxy glue. But I think if your boat is from the 50’s it’s probably hot molded. The veneers were coated with glue then placed over a mold and heated in an autoclave under high temperature and pressure.

    This technique was used in England a lot after the war and in the US, too, a little. I have a hot molded canoe built by Luders in Stamford ct that was built this way in ‘46 or ‘47. Lots of the Luders sailboats were built with this technique. It originated with their minesweepers in the War.

    Like this:


  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 1999
    Location
    Hyannis, MA, USA
    Posts
    46,803

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    During WWII there were many "wooden" airplanes produced in England, the US, and Canada. After the war, lots of pretty big autoclaves and the US economy really broke loose with massive industrial capacity suddenly looking for a civilian market. The post-war pre-glass pleasure boat explosion in the US was fueled right there. Many small boats, like the Thistle, came flying out, and some larger cruising boats.


  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Portland, Maine
    Posts
    17,627

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    If you really want to pinpoint the design accurately record length, beam, draft, sails-shape and size. Spars, too. Then we will know what we are trying to match up with. Any builders plaques or marks inside would be helpful, too. More pics, too. We can see the thumbnail pics on the bottom of one of the screenshots. Maybe you could post them here directly,

    It’s not a Dragon like the last pic you posted, but’s it’s a really nice boat!

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Temecula,CA
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    So we did some snooping about with all the great information posted.
    Yes, the boats hull is molded, not rolled. I mis-wrote the word. The boat is VERY similar to the Hodgdon 21 that Johnw lead us to. Like 95%+ match. Maybe the builder made a few design changes to mine like cockpit combing, etc. So very, very close to the design that if there are no better leads by the time we are done with the resto, she will be a Hodgdon 21 when she hits the water. Then, with my typical luck, some guy will come up to me at the dock and state, thats NOT a Hodgdon 21 its a Smithinheimer 21 you idiot!
    With the great mahogany shell, she will be stripped, stained and varnished. Dont know whats under the paint on deck but its not teak. Darn it! So most likey get white urethane and nonskid.
    Will trailer it from Socal to our lake house on Lake of the Ozarks in Missouri.

    Thanks for all the help. Will post a picture when she hits the water.
    MiG, the feeble minded Naval Aviator

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 1999
    Location
    Woodbridge, Suffolk, UK
    Posts
    23,818

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    She’s lovely. Be warned that getting all the paint off the topsides and transom do you can varnish may be a real chore, and if you settle for just varnishing the transom to show that she’s wooden, the cognoscenti who troop to admire her will understand... The alloy spars may be original; they came in before GRP did.
    IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 1999
    Location
    West Boothbay Harbor, Maine
    Posts
    23,786

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    An emblem on the sail might be an "I" followed by a number. Here's info on the convoluted history of the one design 'classes' of the type: http://www.learn-to-sail.org/bhodhistory.html

    Hodgdon 21s were rarely if ever built 'cold-molded', so the notion that it's a Great Lakes 21 (or International 21) is more likely, especially since Douglass and McLeod built them. They built Highlanders and Thistles out of molded plywood, so the construction of your boat may actually be done in that way, especially given the lack of hull ribs or frames shown in the first photo. http://www.sailhighlander.org/boat_history.cfm
    Last edited by rbgarr; 04-07-2019 at 11:35 AM.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Temecula,CA
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Can't find any picture of a Great Lakes sailboat that looks anything like the boat I have. One data sheet comes up, with no pics, and lists the Great Lakes 21 with a fin keel which my boat does not have. More of a swept foot. Just don't know. Moving forward with resto and see what else we find out. MiG

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    25,480

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Quote Originally Posted by rbgarr View Post
    An emblem on the sail might be an "I" followed by a number. Here's info on the convoluted history of the one design 'classes' of the type: http://www.learn-to-sail.org/bhodhistory.html

    Hodgdon 21s were rarely if ever built 'cold-molded', so the notion that it's a Great Lakes 21 (or International 21) is more likely, especially since Douglass and McLeod built them. They built Highlanders and Thistles out of molded plywood, so the construction of your boat may actually be done in that way, especially given the lack of hull ribs or frames shown in the first photo. http://www.sailhighlander.org/boat_history.cfm
    And yet, the plans include the option of a molded hull. From the link I provided:






    21' 4" Hodgdon Class Sloop






    Stable, easily handled family daysailer with a lead ballast keel. Construction: Carvel planked over steamed frames. Alternative construction: Cold-molded or strip. Lofting is required. Plans include 9 sheets.







    That said, anything built by Douglas & McLeod is likely to have been designed by Sandy Douglas, but one thing still bothers me. Sailboatdata.com lists Hogdon Bros. as a builder of the Great Lakes 21.

    https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/great-lakes-21

    Here is a picture of a Hogdon 21:



    Does that keel look right?
    Last edited by johnw; 04-08-2019 at 08:42 PM.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Temecula,CA
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Yes, that looks like our boat. Same keel. Just a note on the Great Lakes 21 mentioned, the pics i found look nothing like our boat.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    25,480

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthonymigliore View Post
    Yes, that looks like our boat. Same keel. Just a note on the Great Lakes 21 mentioned, the pics i found look nothing like our boat.
    I haven't found any pix of the Great Lakes 21, so you're way ahead of me!

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Temecula,CA
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Trying to identify a wooden sailboat

    Also, that line drawing of the Hodgdon 21 looks just like our boat, some trim changes, but the hull is the same and that drawing does have an "I" on the sail just like ours. Also has a serial number on the sail half way up. Serialized for competition??. All my non-race sailboats never had numbers on the sail. MiG

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •