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Thread: Engine mount piic on double ender?

  1. #1
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    Default Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Anyone clarify for me how these add-on motor mounts work on a double ender..i.e a CY ? Easily understandable when they are placed on a transom but never seeing one in person don't get how they would work on either side of a boat (i'm told they do) that doesent' have a transom. It doesn't appear you can mount the motor 90 degrees to the motor mount. Do I have that wrong or ? I'm refusing to cut a well out in the boat for a motor (just doesn't seem right) but know this fair weather lake boat will be needing one come dead of summer

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    electric trolling motor?

    photos are essential.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?



    This is the type of mount.. -Dan-

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    There are as many approaches to this as there are boats. A pricy version from Edson is at http://www.sailingbreezes.com/sailin...e-bracket.html

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    The Spartan bracket you are showing is for boats with a transom. The one Ian posted is indeed for a double-ender, though I've seen similar on Folkboats.

    I would think a mount like the Edson one could be built fairly easily for a low HP motor.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    I would imagine one could modify the spartan bracket with an angle plate for mouting the motor to allow this type of bracket to deck mounted at the off angle that would result from a double ender hull shape. A bit more work and troubleshooting to it, but could likely work barring any other solutions.
    And is ultimately likely far simler than cutting in and building a well for the motor.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Ahhhh,.... small outboards of the vintage that those brackets were popular normally spun 360 degrees (for ‘reverse’), so mounting it on a “sideways” facing bracket was no problem.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    I had one custom made, made a template out of some scrap ply. Its mounted about 1 meter forward of the transom so I can operate it easily. I use it for an electric motor, a minnkota 55.

    20140317_173813.jpg

    20140317_173758.jpg

    mm3.jpg

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    I once found a picture on the internet (cannot remember where it came from) of a similar, but smaller boat and a homemade solution. Saved it just in case the need for something like that should ever arise.

    Shetland boat with motor bracket.jpg

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Old Town offers clamp on motor brackets for their canoes

    the Dovkies frequently have fully functional motor brackets

    they are typically set on the port quarter

    a key to a successful bracket is for it to be at a 90 angle to the keel line

    when the bracket pad is other than 90 the clamps wont be strong enough to keep the motor from simply twisting off the bracket

    another key is to mount the motor deeper than normally found on a power boat

    when mounting at the recommended depth the prop WILL come out of the water as the stern rises on a wave and when the hull rolls from side to side

    also make sure to mount the motor where you can easily reach the controls from the cockpit if at all possible

    i am not familiar with a "CY" so i am limited on much else

    sw
    "we are the people, our parents warned us about" (jb)

    steve

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Dmq400,

    By the reference to CY do you mean Caledonia Yawl? Is so, my recommendation is do not try a motor mount that hangs off the gunwale. Iain's design show how to build a motor well that fits the boat perfectly. An outside mount is exposed to waves and creates an imbalance to the boat.

    I will post pictures of my Caledonia Yawl with motor well mount if this is really what you are asking about. The motor well box is sealed off top and bottom to seal the opening and preserve the exterior hull surface when the motor is not mounted in the well.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Thanks for the responses. Yes its a Caledonia yawl....but still can not stand the idea of a hole in the hull (motor well). Again, for us it will just be a summer sailer trailer and see the motor srictly to get us back from up the lake when the wind dies down late afternoon. Im certainly open to modifications after giving it a go for a season or so.


    By the reference to CY do you mean Caledonia Yawl? Is so, my recommendation is do not try a motor mount that hangs off the gunwale. Iain's design show how to build a motor well that fits the boat perfectly. An outside mount is exposed to waves and creates an imbalance to the boat.

    I will post pictures of my Caledonia Yawl with motor well mount if this is really what you are asking about. The motor well box is sealed off top and bottom to seal the opening and preserve the exterior hull surface when the motor is not mounted in the well.[/QUOTE]

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    RUUD, can you comment on your success using the trolling motor? Does it have enough power? What do you have for range?

    Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruud View Post
    I had one custom made, made a template out of some scrap ply. Its mounted about 1 meter forward of the transom so I can operate it easily. I use it for an electric motor, a minnkota 55.

    20140317_173813.jpg

    20140317_173758.jpg

    mm3.jpg

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Just because I remembered seeing this video relating to a motor mount on a CY, here is the link to Off-center harbor: https://www.offcenterharbor.com/vide...-carry-review/
    Not my boat, and just a low power electric motor, so YMMV.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dmq400 View Post


    This is the type of mount.. -Dan-
    This pic gets posted on every double-ender outboard bracket thread that rolls through the forum. But the pic is of a stern mount on a Cape Dory Typhoon. Time to do a bit of research guys. Yup, I owned a Typhoon with that mount, exactly as shown.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    20210121_230348.jpg

    Just a laminated ply bracket shaped to fit the boat. Bolted in place. Works fine.
    -Dave

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    A bit bigger boat, long overhang not doubl ended.
    Homemade of wood.

    But if I were you, I'd build the designed well.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    A friend with a Caledonia Yawl messed around with brackets for a while before he put in the motor well. He found it a much better solution.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    It may be worth considering that the bracket could be mounted square to the aft side of a double-ender--let's say that's 45-degrees off centerline-- and the outboard then turned so that the prop faces aft. The engine can be locked in that position either by built-in steering tension adjustment or by jury rig. Steering of the boat can be accomplished using the rudder; the engine can remain fixed most of the time, but could still be released, say, for docking.


    Just a thought for consideration.
    Kevin
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Years ago, I had a double ender with a bracket on the port quarter. It was not a great set up. when the boat rolled the outboard would cavitate
    Elect a clown expect a circus

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    I considered using a bracket on my Eun Mara styled after one I saw in use in Post Townsend. It was fairly far aft but still got very wet when it was on the lee side while sailing. My well is just to starboard of the center line, under power and left to her own devices Marianita will turn to port because of the offset. The faster we go the harder she wants to turn.
    Steve

    If you would have a good boat, be a good guy when you build her - honest, careful, patient, strong.
    H.A. Calahan

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Build the well. The weight is in a better place and controls close to hand. Prop better immersed, easier to fuel. You build a box then a second inner box then run a flush cut saw between so you’ve got a slip fit infill and no hole in the bottom when the engines not in.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Pearson View Post
    Build the well. The weight is in a better place and controls close to hand. Prop better immersed, easier to fuel. You build a box then a second inner box then run a flush cut saw between so you’ve got a slip fit infill and no hole in the bottom when the engines not in.
    Yes, those are all good points favoring the well. However, there are some disadvantages not yet mentioned. The biggest problem is the exhaust gasses. The motor is sitting right there next to you, and you are sitting in a cloud of exhaust gasses. I've done several thousand miles in a large dory with a motor well, and I'll never have another motor well, unless the motor is electric.

    Another problem is the inability of the motor to kick up if it hits an obstruction, especially in a straight drop-in well with little clearance.

    The perfect solution is a decent set of long oars, and excellent sailing skills, and no motor.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    Yeah a Torquedo would suit an easily driven hull like a Caledonia. Pushing a button for on and a whirr is also more civilised beside the emissions. No frayed knuckles or servicing or non starting in the spring.

    Some of the original builders of the shetland boats faced with this conundrum just sawed the boats off at the last mold and gave themselves a mini transom! The boats were not designed with that weight that distance from the center of buoyancy so they wouldn’t have sat right but that characterises alot of fishing boats. Some of the others were adapted with a well or inboard install. There’s at least one in the Shetland museum like this i think.

    Gartside’s small double enders have a small plank that slides out of the topsides for the motor but i’d never have an engine over the side of a small boat after putting up with one on a 24fter.

    A future buyer of a boat like a CY would prefer a well and an electric outboard I’m sure. Always good to make any boat refinements and financial investments better for resale in the broader picture if possible. Given a CY can sail in a zephr it’s probably not needed but getting in against an out flowing tide in light air sometimes makes it necessary on occasion for an easier time.
    Last edited by Edward Pearson; 01-22-2021 at 08:47 PM.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    The perfect solution is a decent set of long oars, and excellent sailing skills, and no motor.
    Exactly my thoughts when I built Terrapin, photo above. But what I've run into are those situations where it's too windy to control the boat with oars, and I'm trying to get in or out of a tight harbor. That's why the motor -- to get to and from the dock or ramp in a stiff breeze. On windless days, the oars actually offer greater maneuverability than the motor.

    Now this boat does have a lot of top hamper, a fair bit more than a Caledonia or similar. But somewhere around 8 knots it gets hard to control -- and over 10 I can slow the boat with the 9 1/2-foot oars, but I don't have real control anymore. The motor delivers something like four times the drive I can summon with the oars.
    -Dave

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    (not the most detailed of photos, ....but all I have at the moment)

    A "well"" just wouldn't work with my mini aft deck. The bracket is 2 pieces of 3/4 ply with a 1/4" piece of alum.. .sandwich. Its mounted with carriage bolts w/wing nuts at the top of the seat bracket and a leg to the floor and another bolt to the bottom of the bracket/floor. That hand hold piece there is friction/wedged thru the gunwhale (?) spacers. i must say it works great. Easy enough to pull the torquedo off and stashed under the seat when things are brisk. 2018 maiden voyage btw. -Dan-





  27. #27
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    Default Re: Engine mount piic on double ender?

    This is ugly but I have a long, straight keel and the boat doesn't like to turn, so having my auxiliary pivot on the rudder gives me control like an outboard motor with the thrust all the way at the back. 80# minnkota on a #5300 boat means it's only for the harbor, but hey, the mainsheet doesn't snag on it.

    Ken
    IMG_2279.jpg

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