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Thread: Vaccines are bad!

  1. #141
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by BrianY View Post
    Can someone explain why anti-vaxxers are not charged with child endangerment ? Doesn't the refusal to vaccinate kids endanger their health and well-being?
    Because reasons.

    I begin to think the whole movement is a psyop against the US
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  2. #142
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    I believe I have read that much of the antivax 'memes' on FB etc., are ruskie trolls. Anything to cause chaos.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  3. #143
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Good think our over vaxxed sailors are safe at sea .

  4. #144
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    Good think our over vaxxed sailors are safe at sea .
    You mean this outbreak of notmumpsatall?
    (CNN)A US warship has essentially been quarantined at sea for over two months and has been unable to make a port call due to an outbreak of a viral infection similar to mumps.

    Twenty-five sailors and Marines aboard the USS Fort McHenry amphibious warship have been diagnosed with parotitis, which causes symptoms similar to mumps, according to US military officials.
    Until CNN asked about the incident, the US military had not disclosed it. The illness first broke out in December, with the most recent case being reported on March 9.
    "None of the cases are life-threatening and all have either already made or are expected to make a full recovery," the Fifth Fleet said in a statement provided to CNN.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  5. #145
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Yes, the notmumpsatall that some call mumps.
    Our military did not call it anything until they were busted .
    I guess they can jab all the other sailors a dozen more times to save them from notmumpsatall in the near future.

  6. #146
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Oh, it’s 27 sailors now, or so we’ve been told .
    I read that parotwhatsit is caused by mumps , ( on the internet so it can’t be true),but they are all safe , nothing to see here .
    Whistleblowers in prison may be safer.

  7. #147
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    Oh, itís 27 sailors now, or so weíve been told .
    I read that parotwhatsit is caused by mumps , ( on the internet so it canít be true),but they are all safe , nothing to see here .
    Whistleblowers in prison may be safer.
    The viral form can be but also from other viruses, the bacterial form not.
    Viral parotitis can be caused by paramyxovirus (mumps), Epstein-Barr virus, coxsackievirus, and influenza A and parainfluenza viruses. Acute suppurative parotitis is generally caused by Staphylococcus aureus, Streptococcus species, and rarely, gram-negative bacteria. Anaerobic bacteria, mostly Peptostreptococcus species and Bacteroides species, and pigmented Porphyromonas species and Prevotella species have been recently recognized as an important cause of this infection. beta-Lactamase-producing organisms can be isolated in almost three fourths of the patients.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1571113
    Now do stop flapping your pregudice in the wind, you are beginning to look silly.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  8. #148
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    You know what any of that means Nick? I sure don’t.

  9. #149
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    You know what any of that means Nick? I sure don’t.
    Then I suggest that you stop posting opinions based on a lack of knowledge.
    Stick to what you are good at.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  10. #150
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    I’m good at being one of the healthiest un medicated persons of my age , or any age , that I know.
    My wife and I were both sickly as kids , now, not so much.
    To repeat, I’m not an anti vaxxer, I just do not trust western over medicating.
    So, you understand what you posted?

  11. #151
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Dang I knew that would happen . I’m not making an argument, I’m commenting on a thread about vaccines. I’m being told to be quiet . If I wanted to convince anyone of anything , I’d post some memes on Facebook.

  12. #152
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by twodot View Post
    Correlation doesn't equal causation. It is that simple. You have made no convincing argument that there exists "western over medicating" and that it results in weakened immune systems and health.
    That can also be said about those who are pro vaccination.

    It is difficult to make a convincing argument when people are not dying. Even in areas where the vaccination rate is low, people are not dying. Few are even getting sick.

    The overall vaccination rate for measles is about 91.2%. (or is it 91.1%?) So 3 million people are unvaccinated. You would like to have them vaccinated despite the facts that people are not dying and few are getting sick. I am in favor of vaccinations and I see the foolishness of that position.

    It is much more effective to go to foreign countries where measles circulates and vaccinate.
    Life is complex.

  13. #153
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    I’m good at being one of the healthiest un medicated persons of my age , or any age , that I know.
    My wife and I were both sickly as kids , now, not so much.
    To repeat, I’m not an anti vaxxer, I just do not trust western over medicating.
    So, you understand what you posted?
    I know the difference between virus and bacillus. I can see that the condition may be caused by 5 different viruses or at least 6 different bacillus.
    I also understand that the antivaxxers jumped on this outbreak and began posting misinformation about it.

    Why, Bruce, did you refer to it on a vaccines thread?
    It seems to me a term for one of several infections of one of the saliva glands, the parotid gland, and is not a condition that can be vaccinated against.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  14. #154
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Can you imagine the anti biotics that are being given to the 700 something crew on dat boat to cure the “bacillus” version of mumpsimeanparrototis .
    I AM an “anti antibiotic “ er ...

  15. #155
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Oh Jesus , am I on the same side as too little time on this . God help me .

  16. #156
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    Oh Jesus , am I on the same side as too little time on this. God help me.
    Frightening ain't it? Time for a rethink and some research?
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  17. #157
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    Good think our over vaxxed sailors are safe at sea .
    and what happens when they get out of the Navy and return to civilian life?

    or what would happen if they were unvaccinated and stopped at ports in countries where vaccination rates are much lower and infectious disease rates are higher than in the US ?
    I rather be an American than a Republican.

  18. #158
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by BrianY View Post
    and what happens when they get out of the Navy and return to civilian life?

    or what would happen if they were unvaccinated and stopped at ports in countries where vaccination rates are much lower and infectious disease rates are higher than in the US ?
    Spoof RN recruiting poster:

    Join the navy,
    Travel to far away places,
    Meet interesting people,
    Catch exotic diseases from them.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  19. #159
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by twodot View Post
    1) Incorrect. There is 150 years of data showing that vaccination prevents disease.

    2) There are great arguments for vaccines against disease even if the pathogen causes zero death. For example, loss of quality of life, loss of work days, etc.

    3) No. Measles vaccination is USA policy, and not foolish.

    4) Yes, it would be great if the USA had a well-funded policy of international vaccination, as well as research into new vaccines. It is not good, however, to have one policy for the USA, and another for abroad. That is why drugs used against, say, malaria, need to adhere to USA FDA guidelines, even if they are not used in the USA.
    1) I never said vaccination did not work. I said the arguments in favor of requiring measles vaccination in the US were foolish.

    2) The phrase is "a convincing argument" not "a great argument." But your short argument fails because everyday you voluntarily incur the greater risks/costs in going about your day to day activities. Everyone seems to be willing to suffer the losses do to vehicle accidents. Which dwarf the losses do to measles.

    3) The comment was: You want to vaccinate 30 million people to prevent a few hundred cases of measles when the current process is more cost effective.

    4) I Have no idea what you think I said.

    I see it is very hard for you (as well as others) to argue effectively that the current measles situation needs action beyond what the CDC and local health departments are doing. You are giving arguments that were appropriate when measles was circulating in the US and people were dying. Perhaps in the future measles will become more prevalent in the US and your arguments will become more relevant. But now all you have is panic that you want to spread.
    Last edited by Too Little Time; 04-14-2019 at 12:28 AM.
    Life is complex.

  20. #160
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    I have to go in for my annual wellness visit soon. I Ďm going to ask my go to give me any booster that I am due for. Shots arenít fun, but they are better then nasty disease. Also, my anemia makes me slightly immune compromised.
    Pet photography, the degree you get when you fail aromatherapy - Duck D.

  21. #161
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    [QUOTE=Too Little Time;5868043

    2) The phrase is "a convincing argument" not "a great argument." But your short argument fails because everyday you voluntarily incur the greater risks/costs in going about your day to day activities. Everyone seems to be willing to suffer the losses do to vehicle accidents. Which dwarf the losses do to measles.

    [/QUOTE]

    Let us examine this straw man.
    TLT, can you live your life without any motor vehicles? Can you shop, can you vacation, can you visit family and friends without riding in a motor vehicle? Can the goods you buy be delivered to the shops that you frequent without motor vehicles. Can your families' children get an education without motor vehicles being involved in some way.
    We both know that the US cannot function without motor vehicles.
    So your government puts laws in place, motor manufacturers build designs, highways are designed to make driving as safe as possible. It is true that irresponsible idiots make the process less safe than we would like, but whilst we try to make driving safer there is a constant supply of idiots. Bottom line is no one voluntarily incurs those risks, no one is willing to suffer those losses. Until you can remove idiots from your population YOU HAVE NO CHOICE IN THE MATTER. That is no justification for arguing that you should stop trying to make driving safer than it currently is, just as there is no justification in your argument that you do not need to worry about a few outbreaks of an infectious but avoidable disease.
    It is the same as arguing that because only a handful of school kids are killed by guns, you need not worry about penny numbers of dead children.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  22. #162
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    Let us examine this straw man.
    TLT, can you live your life without any motor vehicles? Can you shop, can you vacation, can you visit family and friends without riding in a motor vehicle? Can the goods you buy be delivered to the shops that you frequent without motor vehicles. Can your families' children get an education without motor vehicles being involved in some way.
    We both know that the US cannot function without motor vehicles.
    So your government puts laws in place, motor manufacturers build designs, highways are designed to make driving as safe as possible. It is true that irresponsible idiots make the process less safe than we would like, but whilst we try to make driving safer there is a constant supply of idiots. Bottom line is no one voluntarily incurs those risks, no one is willing to suffer those losses. Until you can remove idiots from your population YOU HAVE NO CHOICE IN THE MATTER. That is no justification for arguing that you should stop trying to make driving safer than it currently is, just as there is no justification in your argument that you do not need to worry about a few outbreaks of an infectious but avoidable disease.
    It is the same as arguing that because only a handful of school kids are killed by guns, you need not worry about penny numbers of dead children.
    I explained why the argument was not convincing to me. Your comments show why I feel positions like yours is irrational.

    According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_vi..._United_States
    In 2013, there were 73,505 nonfatal firearm injuries, and 33,636 deaths due to "injury by firearms."
    Your gun argument may be closer to my vehicle argument than to measles.

    While everything you say close to correct, it is not on point. The risk associated with driving a car is greater than the risk associated with measles. Individuals should be more willing to take the measles risk than they are. But that is a large scale assessment.

    On the other hand, the local risk changes if someone enters a school or other public place with measles. The CDC and local health departments seem to handle that well.

    I don't know how to prevent vehicle accidents. They seem to be over quite quickly. But one might argue that the authorities use processes that resemble those used to contain measles in the aftermath.
    Life is complex.

  23. #163
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    Default Re: Vaccines are bad!

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    I explained why the argument was not convincing to me. Your comments show why I feel positions like yours is irrational.

    According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_vi..._United_States

    Your gun argument may be closer to my vehicle argument than to measles.

    While everything you say close to correct, it is not on point. The risk associated with driving a car is greater than the risk associated with measles. Individuals should be more willing to take the measles risk than they are. But that is a large scale assessment.

    On the other hand, the local risk changes if someone enters a school or other public place with measles. The CDC and local health departments seem to handle that well.

    I don't know how to prevent vehicle accidents. They seem to be over quite quickly. But one might argue that the authorities use processes that resemble those used to contain measles in the aftermath.
    It is not about risk. It is about doing everything that you can to remove the hazard. You do not gamble with human lives, you protect them every way you can.

    Oops, silly me. I am addressing a citizen of the US of A. Pl ignore that last sentence.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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