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Thread: Looking back at Carter

  1. #1
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    Default Looking back at Carter

    I don't have a lot of memories of Jimmy Carter. I remember the hostages and a failed attempt at their rescue.

    I remember him warning us that we could face gasoline shortages if OPEC decided to provide less oil, and I remember us ignoring those warnings, then blaming him when we had lines at the gas stations.

    I think I remember him giving the canal to Panama

    I'm guessing he had something to do with cars becoming more fuel efficient.


    Could one argue that his presidency was defined by the four years history dealt him?

    Anyone have more memories of his presidency, good or bad?
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I was ten when Reagan became president, so no, not a lot of memories. I do remember somebody on his staff straightening out the VA's issues with my Father's disability. We basically went 9 months without a cheque because somebody there decided that a man with Colitis and two artificial hips was 100% able to work a tough menial job.
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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    It turned out that our nation was looking more towards the sunny lies that followed. My work in those days brought me up against diverse federal agencies from Agriculture to Consumer Product Safety Commission to HUD and on. I was deeply impressed at how rapidly and deeply the Carter administration got some of those moribund outfits moving. Not a lot of folk noticed. Even among my colleagues there was more attention to what seemed to me manufactured criticisms of Carter's "leadership", really criticisms of his direct and personally modest approach, and an amazing overlooking of his administrative skills.

    Carter was going the right way for our nation but had not the leadership magic to get the nation to share. Reagan had the leadership magic to embark on a course of national destruction that people still venerate.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    It turned out that our nation was looking more towards the sunny lies that followed. My work in those days brought me up against diverse federal agencies from Agriculture to Consumer Product Safety Commission to HUD and on. I was deeply impressed at how rapidly and deeply the Carter administration got some of those moribund outfits moving. Not a lot of folk noticed. Even among my colleagues there was more attention to what seemed to me manufactured criticisms of Carter's "leadership", really criticisms of his direct and personally modest approach, and an amazing overlooking of his administrative skills.

    Carter was going the right way for our nation but had not the leadership magic to get the nation to share. Reagan had the leadership magic to embark on a course of national destruction that people still venerate.
    Nailed it.

    We need to elect someone in 2020 who can simultaneously lead us toward a green Earth, and crush the Party Of Sedition into paste.
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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian McColgin View Post
    Carter was going the right way for our nation but had not the leadership magic to get the nation to share. Reagan had the leadership magic to embark on a course of national destruction that people still venerate.
    That about nails it. Carter lacked excitement. His failure was substance over style and it seems we have fallen down that hole further every year. Carter looked at the problems of the present and future and saw that change was needed. We did not want to change. We did not want to conserve. We did not want to be told that our own desires were not all that mattered.

    Carter has shown us that he is an exceptional human being from the Navy, to the farm, to the Governor's House, to the White House and he did it all with character and ongoing personal growth. We chose an actor as shallow as a puddle on the parking lot after a rain storm.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Carter was going the right way for our nation but had not the leadership magic to get the nation to share. Reagan had the leadership magic to embark on a course of national destruction that people still venerate.
    Just about right. He looks far better in retrospect. And personally, he's a genuinely good man.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I have several thoughts about Jimmy Carter and his presidency. He made some bad judgement errors such as the Mariel Boat Lift which allowed lots of undesirable immigrants from Cuba into the USA. He cancelled the 1980 US participation in the Moscow Olympics because of their invasion of Afghanistan. The failed attempt to rescue the Iranian hostages was also laid on his plate.

    His efforts toward energy independence were laudable and effective but not popular in a country geared to fossil fuel use with power in the hands of fossil fuel producers. Sound familiar? I was a member of the Georgia Solar Coalition and Reagan's first act was to eliminate all incentives and subsidies for development of solar energy. That killed such organizations as the GSC as well as our promising head start in this field where we still lag the rest of the developed world. The fossil fuel powers are still fighting all alternative energy efforts much too successfully although they will eventually lose this battle because both wind and solar are breaking through on cost even without subsidies.

    Carter was a member of the same woodworkers guild as I was in the early 1980's and attended several meetings where I was able to meet him in spite of the Secret Service hovering around. His main love was working with green wood in making furniture. The building of The Carter Center in Atlanta which resulted in the taking over of considerable greenway acreage for a roadway caused much discord and resulted in his dropping out of the Guild.

    Like many prominent people, his reputation has greatly improved since he retired although there are still plenty of people who love to bad mouth his work. He is called naive in his many attempts to broker peace between belligerent factions all over the world. Too bad we don't have lots of others to help in that endeavor. He started an effective organization of Habitat For Humanity which still operates in providing self help building of thousand of homes for many who otherwise are unable to afford one for themselves.

    An imperfect man who always tried to do the right thing and was successful more often than not. A better president and a much better man than many who followed him.
    Last edited by Tom Lathrop; 02-10-2019 at 10:32 AM.
    Tom L

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    It took me a while to put down my thoughts about Carter as he is the only president I have ever personally met and talked to and several others posted ahead of me.. I'm pleased that many others have similar thoughts about his legacy. I do not agree with everything he proposed or everything he did but do believe he was a genuinely good man who acted in the best interest of the country and others. A rare trait among political leaders.
    Tom L

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    A native American friend of mine worked for him. I won't draw from our discussions, but I do recall this issue and was amazed by it. It didn't inspire my confidence in his abilities......

    Carter came into office determined to set a rational plan for his time, but soon showed in practice that he was still the detail-man used to running his own warehouse, the perfectionist accustomed to thinking that to do a job right you must do it yourself. He would leave for a weekend at Camp David laden with thick briefing books, would pore over budget tables to check the arithmetic, and, during his first six months in office, would personally review all requests to use the White House tennis court. (Although he flatly denied to Bill Moyers in his November 1978 interview that he had ever stooped to such labors, the in-house tennis enthusiasts, of whom I was perhaps the most shameless, dispatched brief notes through his secretary asking to use the court on Tuesday afternoons while he was at a congressional briefing, or a Saturday morning, while he was away. I always provided spaces where he could check Yes or No; Carter would make his decision and send the note back, initialed J.)

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    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Indeed Tom, he remains the only president I have personally met when I helped with a habitat home. He is indeed a great man and somebody I am proud to say I have met.
    "If you think you are too small to make a difference, try sleeping with a mosquito"

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Many good qualities, some very large flaws. He couldn't (or wouldn't) understand the challenges needed to lead his own party, and it cost him dearly.

    My my mom (a small "d" democrat to the core) thought Carter was a great man and a poor leader, while Reagan was a small man who could play the role of a great leader. I don't completely agree with her, but she was on to something.

    Jeff C

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Thanks. All of this seems to fit my recollection.

    Did he have a hand in higher MPG for cars? I seem to remember that became a 'thing' about then.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I remember the failed hostage mission, the mechanics of which where not his making .
    His weak posture and extremely poor negotiation skills are what lead to the failed mission.

    For a USNA grad he lacked any leadership ability.
    He pardoned draft dodgers from Vietnam.
    Interests rates where 21% or higher.
    He washed his dirty laundry about lusting after other women.
    Camp David Accords where a huge failure.
    He let the Russianís do what the wanted with little opposition to there invasion of Afghanistan.
    I came back from my 1979 WESPAC cruise to where gas went above a $1.00 a gallon, first time I filled my tank post cruise I put in $5.00 , I went to pay and the lady said thatíll be $10.00! I said I pumped five bucks , she said you just got back from cruise didnít you? You have to double the amount the pump says , weíre working on getting new pumps so we can put in larger dollar amounts . Good thing I had the extra money in my pocket, it was at the Navy Exchange gas station

    He did work with Habitat.
    He seems to be a decent person.
    He should have shut his mouth post Presidency , his was one of the worst of my life time, we didnít need to hear his advice.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Carter was probably the most moral president we have had in a long time, and they laughed at him! He was probably the only president that lived at one time with his wife in low income subsidize public housing, and they were qualified for it.

    The self made man in the White House should try it.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by oznabrag View Post
    Nailed it.

    We need to elect someone in 2020 who can simultaneously lead us toward a green Earth, and crush the Party Of Sedition into paste.
    The obsession with show pony and faux celebrity politicians will stuff you up yet again. You need a capable and meticulous administrator, and especially now, to rebuild the nation's fabric.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I have respect for Carter, as with most, he's a better ex-president than president, and he's done much more than most post-presidency.

    My primary flaw with Carter is that he waffled at a critical moment. No, I don't think he should have immediately attacked Iran. What he should have done is go before the nation on television and say:

    "I don't agree with Iran taking hostages. But their anger is our fault. In 1953, The United States Central Intelligence Agency, acting under the authority of President Dwight Eisenhower, staged a coup to depose Iran's democratically elected president, Mohammad Mosaddegh, and replace him with Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi. This was done at the behest of the United Kingdom government, because Mosaddegh sought to nationalize UK oil wells in Iran. This was a civil dispute, and should have been resolved as such. Instead, by installing Pahlavi, the Iranian people were terrorized for decades by a leader who employed a ruthless secret police and who pilfered the country's wealth. As president, I have tried to change that culture within the US government. The beginning of reforms has started with investigations by the Church Committee in 1975, and revealed this as well as many other abuses of power. For the actions in Iran, I sincerely apologize on behalf of the US government. The people of the US have no reason to apologize, for they were unaware, as these actions of aggression were kept secret from them. While I am concerned about the fate of the hostages held by Iran, I would ask the Iranian government to pause and consider what I have said, and what course of action will lead to the best outcome for the nation of Iran and its citizens."

    But no, Carter didn't say the above. He knew about it, and knew it was wrong, but didn't have the guts to buck the power structure and admit to wrongdoing by our government, and face down the fist-shaking men in the streets calling to attack Iran.
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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Either Biden or DeBlasio would fill the bill.

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    The obsession with show pony and faux celebrity politicians will stuff you up yet again. You need a capable and meticulous administrator, and especially now, to rebuild the nation's fabric.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Didn't Raygun interfere with the Iran hostage situation BEFORE he became president?
    I was out of the country for the whole four years of Carter, smokin weed and sailin around. I had a wee solar panel when they were still a novelty, rarely seen. Carter installed em on the White House,Raygun had them removed...what a pisser.

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    Default

    I remember him saying the election process in Venezuela were perhaps the best in the world. Disgraceful.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    Thanks. All of this seems to fit my recollection.

    Did he have a hand in higher MPG for cars? I seem to remember that became a 'thing' about then.
    you don't think the oil crises of 1973 and 1979 had anything to do with reducing gas use in automobiles?
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    you don't think the oil crises of 1973 and 1979 had anything to do with reducing gas use in automobiles?
    Yes, I see that America has a focus on reduced gas usage.... not
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I don't think that Carter was an especially great President... but much of the woes the country suffered during his term in office were not his fault.... it was a very strange time, in the economy, if you can recall.

    I do agree with some of the comments made in this thread; yes, he was probably the most moral man to occupy the Oval Office in recent history. He was also a micro-manager, which is a bad trait, for a President. I don't fault him for the failure of the hostage mission... those are ALWAYS a gamble.
    "Reason and facts are sacrificed to opinion and myth. Demonstrable falsehoods are circulated and recycled as fact. Narrow minded opinion refuses to be subjected to thought and analysis. Too many now subject events to a prefabricated set of interpretations, usually provided by a biased media source. The myth is more comfortable than the often difficult search for truth."







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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I remember peanuts and Billy beer.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    I was 16 when he took office.I remember him as being quiet and reserved. He didn't, "come through the screen," the way most elected officials did ( and do).

    I remember the hostage crisis quite clearly. This was a time when public sentiment was very nationalist. For example, " F*** the Ayatollah," and " F*** Iran" T-shirts, buttons and bumper stickers were all the rage, some might remember. When the mission failed, he took the blame big time. I always thought his subsequent, post-presidential work in international negotiations was, in some part, his way of trying to make up for that.

    Of course, his flamboyant brother, Billy, was a constant side show, using his brother's presidency for personal gain.Carter handled it gracefully. Remember Billy Beer?

    Screen Shot 2019-02-11 at 9.25.07 AM.jpg

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    The obsession with show pony and faux celebrity politicians will stuff you up yet again. You need a capable and meticulous administrator, and especially now, to rebuild the nation's fabric.
    Rattling the teacups.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Girouard View Post
    I remember the failed hostage mission, the mechanics of which where not his making .
    His weak posture and extremely poor negotiation skills are what lead to the failed mission.

    For a USNA grad he lacked any leadership ability.
    He pardoned draft dodgers from Vietnam.
    Interests rates where 21% or higher.
    He washed his dirty laundry about lusting after other women.
    Camp David Accords where a huge failure.
    He let the Russianís do what the wanted with little opposition to there invasion of Afghanistan.
    I came back from my 1979 WESPAC cruise to where gas went above a $1.00 a gallon, first time I filled my tank post cruise I put in $5.00 , I went to pay and the lady said thatíll be $10.00! I said I pumped five bucks , she said you just got back from cruise didnít you? You have to double the amount the pump says , weíre working on getting new pumps so we can put in larger dollar amounts . Good thing I had the extra money in my pocket, it was at the Navy Exchange gas station

    He did work with Habitat.
    He seems to be a decent person.
    He should have shut his mouth post Presidency , his was one of the worst of my life time, we didnít need to hear his advice.
    Yep, in the late summer of 1980 home mortgage rates went up from 18% to 22% for about 5 weeks till the banks cried foul and couldn't make a loan at all. Then they started dropping dramatically when Reagan was elected. down to 12% almost overnight.

    Gas prices doubled along with gas shortages and gas lines out of the station down the street with sometimes a 45 minute wait and off and on a limit of 10 gallons .

    The totally failed Iran hostage situation, and the whole problem with Iran, which we are still dealing with is due to Jimmy peanut farmer Carter big moment when he ordered the Shah Of Iran to get out of Iran.

    The economy crashed in the late 80's due to Carter's economical policies as well as the federal reserve, and took 5 years to recover.

    Yep that's jimmy peanut farmer's legacy, he was an absolute moron and should have never ben president.

    And for those that didn't or ever would know, more world up set. --Despite this, the Democrats in 1976 nominated Jimmy Carter, who had supported the Vietnam War, and who, upon election included pro-war advisors in his inner circle. His National Security Advisor was Zbigniew Brzezinski, who had been a founder of the Trilateral Commission. Jimmy Carter himself had been recruited into the Trilateral Commission in the summer of 1973.

    https://www.antiwar.com/berkman/trilat.html

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    Didn't Raygun interfere with the Iran hostage situation BEFORE he became president?
    I was out of the country for the whole four years of Carter, smokin weed and sailin around. I had a wee solar panel when they were still a novelty, rarely seen. Carter installed em on the White House,Raygun had them removed...what a pisser.
    I believe Reagan interfered before the election. Yes, he took down the solar panels.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    you don't think the oil crises of 1973 and 1979 had anything to do with reducing gas use in automobiles?
    Yes, but regulations came into being during that time, no? both for mpg and emissions?
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by RonW View Post
    Yep, in the late summer of 1980 home mortgage rates went up from 18% to 22% for about 5 weeks till the banks cried foul and couldn't make a loan at all. Then they started dropping dramatically when Reagan was elected. down to 12% almost overnight.

    Gas prices doubled along with gas shortages and gas lines out of the station down the street with sometimes a 45 minute wait and off and on a limit of 10 gallons .

    The totally failed Iran hostage situation, and the whole problem with Iran, which we are still dealing with is due to Jimmy peanut farmer Carter big moment when he ordered the Shah Of Iran to get out of Iran.

    The economy crashed in the late 80's due to Carter's economical policies as well as the federal reserve, and took 5 years to recover.

    Yep that's jimmy peanut farmer's legacy, he was an absolute moron and should have never ben president.

    And for those that didn't or ever would know, more world up set. --Despite this, the Democrats in 1976 nominated Jimmy Carter, who had supported the Vietnam War, and who, upon election included pro-war advisors in his inner circle. His National Security Advisor was Zbigniew Brzezinski, who had been a founder of the Trilateral Commission. Jimmy Carter himself had been recruited into the Trilateral Commission in the summer of 1973.

    https://www.antiwar.com/berkman/trilat.html
    High interest rates worked both ways. My mom had CD's getting 17% interest or such.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by John Smith View Post
    High interest rates worked both ways. My mom had CD's getting 17% interest or such.
    No she didn't. Or if she did it was only for a very few months at most, and I seriously doubt that,.During the economic crash of 1980 due to jimmy carter.

    The highest CD rate I know of in the late 70' and early 80"s was in the 7% range, generally CD's pay approx. 1/2 of what the home mortgage rates are.
    Last edited by RonW; 02-11-2019 at 11:18 AM.

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    Default Re: Looking back at Carter

    Quote Originally Posted by RonW View Post
    Yep, in the late summer of 1980 home mortgage rates went up from 18% to 22% for about 5 weeks till the banks cried foul and couldn't make a loan at all. Then they started dropping dramatically when Reagan was elected. down to 12% almost overnight.

    Gas prices doubled along with gas shortages and gas lines out of the station down the street with sometimes a 45 minute wait and off and on a limit of 10 gallons .

    The totally failed Iran hostage situation, and the whole problem with Iran, which we are still dealing with is due to Jimmy peanut farmer Carter big moment when he ordered the Shah Of Iran to get out of Iran.

    The economy crashed in the late 80's due to Carter's economical policies as well as the federal reserve, and took 5 years to recover.

    Yep that's jimmy peanut farmer's legacy, he was an absolute moron and should have never ben president.

    And for those that didn't or ever would know, more world up set. --Despite this, the Democrats in 1976 nominated Jimmy Carter, who had supported the Vietnam War, and who, upon election included pro-war advisors in his inner circle. His National Security Advisor was Zbigniew Brzezinski, who had been a founder of the Trilateral Commission. Jimmy Carter himself had been recruited into the Trilateral Commission in the summer of 1973.

    https://www.antiwar.com/berkman/trilat.html
    Well, OK then, Maurice.
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