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Thread: Trump's threats

  1. #1
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    Default Trump's threats

    Are they worth any more than his promises?

    Just cause he threatens to declare an emergency doesn't mean he will.

    His saying he has absolute authority doesn't make it so.

    Response was disappointing to my thought of opening in the government in concert with forming a commission to study border problems and have 90 days to suggest solutions in order of efficiency.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    it's all bluster. Right now he has backed himself into a corner and his ego is too big to get him out. He will find a way, you can see it with his blaming the Dems for the shutdown
    "If you think you are too small to make a difference, try sleeping with a mosquito"

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    He has indeed backed himself into a corner. But, with his ego, he will never give in. He'd rather see people starve then admit a mistake. Plus, being devoid of empathy, he does not care that people suffer.
    The only answer is for Mitch to grow a pair and take action. Over a presidential veto if necessary.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    I don’t see that happening- it would essentially emasculate trump, and the republicans. And McConnell doesn’t give a damn about the people, either.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    The primary thing Mitch McConnell cares about is power. He shares that with TRump.
    War is peace.
    Freedom is slavery.
    Ignorance is strength.
    Tribalism is family and extended family.
    Trump is doing beautifully.





  6. #6
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Yes, bombast and bs. Doesn't mean he won't do it, as his fragile psyche may demand it. If he does, it'll simply hasten the day when his party, and the public, will turn decisively against him.
    David G
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    My understanding- the moment he does, the dems will file a lawsuit contesting the order, stopping it, which also allows govt to open while awaiting a court ruling. It may be his only out.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    The Trump Shutdown: a tragedy of errors --

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/10/o...wn-pelosi.html


    How did we get into this sorry situation? A meltdown of this magnitude typically has many causes. In this case, the president’s inability to reach some sort of deal rests heavily on several basic failures of understanding by him and his team. These include:

    1. A failure to grasp how divided government works. The president somehow came to believe that he’d have more leverage once the Democrats took control of the House. Maybe someone convinced him that, after the transfer of power, he could shift blame for the impasse onto Speaker Nancy Pelosi — a favorite villain of Republicans. Or maybe he assumed that Pelosi & Company would fold in the face of the dysfunction and public outcry a shutdown would bring. Whatever the logic, Team Trump assumed Democrats would become more pliable, and a deal would emerge.

    Unfortunately, Mr. Trump has been spoiled by two years of Congress being led by weak-kneed members of his party who, even when troubled by his excesses, largely let him run amok, lest he call down upon them the wrath of the Republican base.
    But for their part, Ms. Pelosi and her new majority are concerned about presenting a united front against Mr. Trump’s challenges to constitutional authority. With the president’s wall having become a flash point, the political costs to Democrats for cutting a deal seen as advantageous to Mr. Trump would be steep.

    2. A failure to understand the costs of playing only to the base. While Republican lawmakers may be awed by Mr. Trump’s command of their party’s troops, Democrats are more motivated by the fact that the bulk of the electorate is tired of the president’s divisive demagogy. Time and again, Mr. Trump has chosen partisanship over leadership, doing nothing to expand his appeal. This puts him at a disadvantage in wooing the public to his side of the wall debate.

    3. A failure to understand Nancy Pelosi. Apparently, Mr. Trump never got around to reading “The Art of War,” or at least not Sun Tzu’s admonition to “know your enemy.” If he had, the president would have tried to develop at least a basic working relationship with Ms. Pelosi. The White House clearly assumed that, at some point — maybe after she secured the speaker’s gavel — Ms. Pelosi would bend to Mr. Trump’s will. But the speaker is not impressed with bluster. She is seldom cowed by political pressure from her own team, much less the opposing one. She plays the long game, and her will is as formidable as Mr. Trump’s, possibly more so. One key difference: Ms. Pelosi knows how the legislative process works.


    4. A failure to understand shutdown politics. If you don’t want to be blamed for one, don’t say you’re going to own it. Mr. Trump sacrificed that option when he boasted how “proud” he’d be to grind the government to a halt.

    5. A failure to understand how the government works. Neither Mr. Trump nor anyone on his team had a clue how disruptive even a partial shutdown could be — and how they’d need to scurry to prevent millions of people from losing food stamps, housing or tax refunds.

    6. A failure to understand how members of Congress operate. Standing by the president when he’s tweeting out empty threats and insults is one thing. But when a shutdown starts causing pain and outrage back home, Republican lawmakers, especially those in vulnerable districts or states, start asking themselves which they value more — their president or their political hides. Even casual students of Congress know that this is not a tough call.

    Bottom line: Mr. Trump loves to boast that he leads with his “gut.” He really can’t be bothered with all the humdrum details of governing, remaining proudly ignorant of how anything works in Washington — the presidency, the Congress, the Constitution. That’s left him in a standoff for which he was wholly unprepared.

    For the sake of the millions being hurt, let’s hope he manages to blunder himself back out of this mess soon.


    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Sums it up nicely, David.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Trump may finally snap, declare an emergency at our southern border, and move to annex Mexico.
    Rattling the teacups.

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    He's UNHINGED this morning with 12 Kra Kra tweets



    Donald J. Trump
    Verified account @realDonaldTrump
    1h1 hour agoMore
    ....I do have a plan on the Shutdown. But to understand that plan you would have to understand the fact that I won the election, and I promised safety and security for the American people. Part of that promise was a Wall at the Southern Border. Elections have consequences!
    This post is temporary and my disappear at the discretion of the managment

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Before you say authoritatively that his threats are bluster, just remember for a moment that it is easier to break something than to build it...
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Trump may finally snap, declare an emergency and move to Mexico.
    This would work for me.
    I don't care to know what the tough do when the going gets tough. I am interested in what the enlightened do;

    Life is what it is. Then it isn't.

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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    "If he does, it'll simply hasten the day when his party, and the public, will turn decisively against him."

    From the outside view it is hard to see just what may be holding the public back. Hoping you don't wait too long! / Jim

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Yes, bombast and bs. Doesn't mean he won't do it, as his fragile psyche may demand it. If he does, it'll simply hasten the day when his party, and the public, will turn decisively against him.
    Perhaps, but the more emphatically he tells us how he has the 'absolute' power to do so, the more I question if he actually believes it.

    Given the circumstances this puts airport security into, I'd like to see pilots go on strike out of concerns for safety.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    Before you say authoritatively that his threats are bluster, just remember for a moment that it is easier to break something than to build it...
    Absolutely. Repairing is always longer, harder, and more costly than destroying.

    My guess, and it's just a guess, is even Trump and those around him can't actually manipulate this into a legitimate emergency, considering he's had two years to deal with it. That's why I suspect it's an empty threat.

    Even if he goes through with it, if I'm wrong, I don't see how he convinced any court that it's a legitimate emergency, since it will take some length of time to build his wall, and he's shown no sense of actual urgency thus far.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Quote Originally Posted by chas View Post
    "If he does, it'll simply hasten the day when his party, and the public, will turn decisively against him."

    From the outside view it is hard to see just what may be holding the public back. Hoping you don't wait too long! / Jim
    I have that that same thing, over the years, about issues that eventually turned (and usually quickly) like the Vietnam War, and gay marriage. And about some issues that didn't/haven't.
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Trump had the House and the Senate for two years. Didn't get his wall then either. This is just a diversion.
    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Yeadon is right, of course.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Quote Originally Posted by Yeadon View Post
    Trump had the House and the Senate for two years. Didn't get his wall then either. This is just a diversion.
    Yeadon is right, of course... at least in this case. <G>
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    [..], just remember for a moment that it is easier to break something than to build it...
    Humpty Trumpty didn't build his wall, nevertheless
    Humpty Trumpty had a great fall...

    The other issue that will stop the wall dead in it's tracks if the toddler in chief does decide to declare a state of emergency, aside from legal challenges to the declaration itself, is the fact hundreds of land owners will challenge any compulsory land acquisitions as well:

    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/...der-wall-fight

    Texas landowners prepare for border wall fight

    NationJan 10, 2019 10:58 AM ESTHIDALGO, Texas — As President Donald Trump travels to the border in Texas to make the case for his $5.7 billion wall, landowner Eloisa Cavazos says she knows firsthand how the project will play out if the White House gets its way.
    The federal government has started surveying land along the border in Texas and announced plans to start construction next month. Rather than surrender their land, some property owners are digging in, vowing to reject buyout offers and preparing to fight the administration in court.
    “You could give me a trillion dollars and I wouldn’t take it,” said Cavazos, whose land sits along the Rio Grande, the river separating the U.S. and Mexico in Texas. “It’s not about money.”
    Trump is scheduled to visit the border Thursday in McAllen , a city of 143,000 on the river.
    Congress in March funded 33 miles (53 kilometers) of walls and fencing in Texas. The government has laid out plans that would cut across private land in the Rio Grande Valley. Those in the way include landowners who have lived in the valley for generations, environmental groups and a 19th century chapel.
    Many have hired lawyers who are preparing to fight the government if, as expected, it moves to seize their land through eminent domain.
    The opposition will intensify if Democrats accede to the Trump administration’s demand to build more than 215 new miles of wall, including 104 miles in the Rio Grande Valley and 55 miles near Laredo. Even a compromise solution to build “steel slats,” as Trump has suggested, or more fencing of the kind that Democrats have previously supported would likely trigger more court cases and pushback in Texas.
    Legal experts say Trump likely cannot waive eminent domain — which requires the government to demonstrate a public use for the land and provide landowners with compensation — by declaring a national emergency.
    While this is Trump’s first visit to the border in Texas as president, his administration’s immigration crackdown has been felt here for months.
    Hundreds of the more than 2,400 children separated from their parents last summer were detained in cages at a Border Patrol facility in McAllen. Three “tender-age” facilities for the youngest children were opened in this region.
    The president also ordered soldiers to the border in response to a wave of migrant caravans before the November election. Those troops had a heavy presence in the Rio Grande Valley, though they have since quietly left. A spokeswoman for the border security mission said they closed their base camp along the border on Dec. 22.
    READ MORE: Trump says walls work. It’s much more complicated
    But Trump’s border wall will last beyond his administration. Building in the region is a top priority for the Department of Homeland Security because it’s the busiest area for illegal border crossings. More than 23,000 parents and children were caught illegally crossing the border in the Rio Grande Valley in November — more than triple the number from a year earlier.
    Homeland Security officials argue that a wall would stop many crossings and deter Central American families from trying to migrate north. Many of those families are seeking asylumbecause of violence in their home countries and often turn themselves in to border agents when they arrive here.
    The number of families has surged. DHS said Wednesday that it detained 27,518 adults and children traveling together on the southern border in December, a new monthly high.
    With part of the $1.6 billion Congress approved in March, U.S. Customs and Border Protection announced it would build 25 miles (40 kilometers) of wall along the flood-control levee in Hidalgo County, which runs well north of the Rio Grande.
    Congress did not allow construction of any of Trump’s wall prototypes. But the administration’s plans call for a concrete wall to the height of the existing levee, with 18-foot (5.5 meters) steel posts on top. CBP wants to clear 150 feet (45 meters) in front of any new construction for an “enforcement zone” of access roads, cameras, and lighting.
    The government sued the local Roman Catholic diocese late last year to gain access for its surveyors at the site of La Lomita chapel, which opened in 1865 and was an important site for missionaries who traveled the Rio Grande Valley by horseback.
    It remains an epicenter of the Rio Grande Valley’s Catholic community, hosting weddings and funerals, as well as an annual Palm Sunday procession that draws 2,000 people.
    The chapel is a short distance from the Rio Grande. It falls directly into the area where CBP wants to build its “enforcement zone.”
    The diocese said it opposes a border wall because the barrier violates Catholic teachings and the church’s responsibility to protect migrants, as well as the church’s First Amendment right of religious freedom. A legal group from Georgetown University has joined the diocese in its lawsuit.
    Father Roy Snipes leads prayers each Friday for his chapel to be spared. Wearing a cowboy hat with his white robe and metal cross, he’s known locally as the “cowboy priest” and sometimes takes a boat on the Rio Grande to go from his home to the chapel.
    “It would poison the water,” Snipes said. “It would still be a sacred place, but it would be a sacred place that was desecrated.”
    The Cavazos family’s roughly 64 acres (0.25 square kilometers) were first purchased by their grandmother 60 years ago.
    They rent some of the property to tenants who have built small houses or brought in trailers, charging some as little as $1,000 a year. They live off the earnings from the land and worry that a fence would deter renters and turn their property into a “no man’s land.”
    On the rest of the property are plywood barns, enclosures for cattle and goats, and a wooden deck that extends into the river, which flows serenely east toward the Gulf of Mexico. Eloisa’s brother, Fred, can sit on the deck in his wheelchair and fish with a rod fashioned from a long carrizo reed plucked from the riverbank.
    Surveyors examined their property in December under federal court order. The family hasn’t yet received an offer for their land, but their lawyers at the Texas Civil Rights Project expect a letter with an offer will arrive in the coming weeks.

    “Everybody tells us to sell and go to a better place,” Eloisa Cavazos said. “This is heaven to us.”
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  21. #21
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Having just watched a video of flying the border I think the wall is fantasy. I seriously doubt Trump has any idea of much of the terrain.
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    If only his next threat could be that he will leave the white house.
    Don't worry I'm happy

    "The law is what we have to live with.
    Justice is sometimes harder to achieve."

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  23. #23
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    Default Re: Trump's threats

    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    Having just watched a video of flying the border I think the wall is fantasy. I seriously doubt Trump has any idea of much of the terrain.
    He doesn't want to know. I cannot believe his legal people have told him he can do the 'emergency' thing with no hitches.

    I can't KNOW, but I suspect that if he truly believed he could do it, it would have been done by now.

    Graham told him to go ahead, and I don't know if that means Graham believes he CAN do it, or just wants him to pull the trigger sooner rather than later, regardless of whether or not it works.
    How do we form a mutiny? Our new captain is navigating poorly.

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