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Thread: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Macchiato or pumpkin-spiced latte?

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    Perhaps it is required that protesters are white, grey-haired and middle aged or older.
    Perhaps you should look more carefully. Probably half of the folks in St. Paul were under 35.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

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  3. #38
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Note: the counterprotesters were the ones holding a double-tall house, splash of 1/2 & 1/2.

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    Note: the counterprotesters were the ones holding a double-tall house, splash of 1/2 & 1/2.
    No counter-protesters here. They don't come out in the snow.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest




    Kevin
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  6. #41
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Grumble, grumble, complain, complain....

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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest


  8. #43
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest


  9. #44
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    I don't think it works a day or two after an election. It's ill-timed. There's protest fatigue, and diversity seems to be an issue. Same with the pink hat protests and all the rest of it. Same crowd, different day.

    It's a bust.

  10. #45
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Thanks to everyone at the protests--I appreciate it.

    Protests in Madison, Wisconsin, in 2011 started out with maybe 100 people on day one. Got up to well over 100,000 per day very quickly. Starting with one guy protesting police corruption, Egypt threw out Mubarak at the same time in less then three weeks. I hope the same happens here.

    Tom
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  11. #46
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by leikec View Post
    Oh come on, we know you lifted that from the inauguration!

    Good luck and cheers to all of you!! It's a great pity that more people aren't prepared to act!

    Rick

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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Will do. It'll be getting pretty dark by the time it starts, though.
    In Laramie, we did a wee march and holler in front of the courthouse, 'til it got too dark to be seen (and way to cold to carry a sign).

    Don't give a damn for Sessions, who's a smirking racist swine.

    What I go against is Trump's Red Queen notion that he's above the law.

    We're merely mammals. Let's misbehave! —Cole Porter

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip-skiff View Post

    Don't give a damn for Sessions, who's a smirking racist swine.

    What I go against is Trump's Red Queen notion that he's above the law.

    Have to ask how you feel about Broward County Elections Supervisor Brenda Snipes? Some question why Snipes has been allowed to remain in her position after showing a willingness to destroy ballots. A state judge ruled as much back in May, which found that Snipes oversaw an effort to destroy ballots to advantage Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz in the Democratic Primary.

    Nobody above the law? Right.........

  14. #49
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    You guys are on our news tonight.

    Rick

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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    I don't think it works
    Is it about what you think? None of this occurs for your benefit or amusement. You are expected to be less and less amused. It's understood that it's not possible to affect your team's most ardent. The thrust going forward is to swell our ranks. You are free to encourage the Trumpites to man the barricades. These events are solely about solidarity and the understanding that people of good will do not exist alone in a vacuum, that hope for a brighter future will be maintained and that eventually, all the truth will be out.

    You lost the House. What's next?
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  16. #51
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    The protest would appear to have some sort of message or aim, Lew. I don't think it works. And it "occurs for my benefit and amusement" if I say it does. I get to decide what amuses me and what I consider to benefit me (or not). Not you.

    The evidence is that we have the older, whiter, greying MSNBC-addicted bunch with the wealth and leisure to run out and yell in the street and sing songs. The whole thing reeks of privilege. These people aren't sticking it to the establishment. They are the establishment.

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    The evidence is that we have the older, whiter, greying . . .
    Again, as far as I could tell, at least half the people in St. Paul were under 35. The percentage of white folks seemed to be about that in the general population here, or a little higher. None of them seemed very poor, although I didn't do a survey. So what? 'Reeks of privilege' is utter nonsense.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

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  18. #53
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    my small town next to Oakland had about 400. Oakland/Berkeley was obviously going to be bigger and more raucous crowd. I recognized dozens of my neighbors and other town folks. The crowd was so well behaved: There were hippies, moms, melting pot of nation, songs, sharing and every voice heard. many conservatives who fly the flag in front of there house were there to protest that no one was above the law. There was even 4 there that own wooden boats.

    The crowd rally took a long minute in silence for the Thousand Oaks shooting taking 12 lives while standing in the smoke filled air due to fires.

    Nobody is above the law. We were all there to protect and defend the republic against forces of tyranny. Their other agenda of social activism took a step back so we all were on the same constitutional page.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

  19. #54
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    ♫. . . to get my fair share of abuse . . . ♫

    The pitch was, protest the firing of Sessions. That was about 10% of it. The first speaker gave an excellent speech about the rule of law, etc.

    The rest of it was a tedious list of grievances against Trump, on shuffle play, repeated ad absurdum et nauseum. Chiefly immigration. No attempt was made to relate any of it to the firing of Sessions, or what to do about it.

    And the cheerleading, OMG it makes me grit my teeth. "Hey Hey Ho Ho, When do we want it, we want it now!" Two hours.

    F off. This is not an appeal to reason or conscience. It's an appeal to mob emotion, which is an appeal to violence.

    For which these people are entirely unprepared, morally or technically, offense or defense. Pitiful.

    So let us not talk falsely now, the hour's getting late.

    All right, he said to himself. I'm sorry, if that does any good.

    It doesn't, he said to himself.

    All right then, drop it, he said to himself.

    All right, it's dropped.

    But it would not drop that easily. How many is it that you have killed? he asked himself. I don't know. Do you think you have a a right to kill anyone? No. But I have to. How many of those you have killed have been real fascists? Very few. But they are all the enemy to whose force we are opposing force. But you like the people of Navarra better than those of any other part of Spain. Yes. And you kill them. Yes . . . Don't you know it is wrong to kill? Yes. But you do it? Yes. And you still believe absolutely that your cause is right? Yes.

    It is right, he told himself, not reassuringly, but proudly. I believe in the people and their right to govern themselves. But you mustn't believe in killing, he told himself. You must do it as a necessity but you must not believe in it. If you believe in it the whole thing is wrong.

    -- Ernest Hemingway, For Whom The Bell Tolls
    Last edited by Osborne Russell; 11-09-2018 at 02:33 PM.
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  20. #55
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    Nobody is above the law.
    au contraire, monsewer. All of Wall Street is demonstrably above the law. When it comes to your pocketbooks, not a one of you has a nickel's worth of principles.

  21. #56
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by on the border View Post
    au contraire, monsewer. All of Wall Street is demonstrably above the law. When it comes to your pocketbooks, not a one of you has a nickel's worth of principles.
    There is a difference in being prosecuted for breaking of the law and being above the law. The wall street criminals got a pass on illegal activities - everyone can agree on that. The criminal activity was allowed by both parties of government. They were rewarded for looking the other way by campaign contributions. Bush, Obama and Clinton were beneficiaries in that.

    However once the rule of law according to our constitution is broken then chaos and erosion of confidence will ensue. If our representatives in government are above the law - the greater impact means that no law has standing if we are truly equal. Challenging those who try to break the constitutional compact is subject to protest and petition.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

  22. #57
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    ^ Excuses, excuses.

    The fact is, presidents from Nixon to the present, the sainted Obama included, have broken the laws with impunity. You don't like the Donald so suddenly it's a huge issue.

    Principles don't work that way. You either gottem or you don't. It's not a convenient thing that you can pull out when you feel like it.

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Clinton Inc., clearly is above the law. Both Bill and his wife.

  24. #59
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by on the border View Post
    ^ Excuses, excuses.

    The fact is, presidents from Nixon to the present, the sainted Obama included, have broken the laws with impunity. You don't like the Donald so suddenly it's a huge issue.

    Principles don't work that way. You either gottem or you don't. It's not a convenient thing that you can pull out when you feel like it.
    Your supposition of me and my position on this is faulty - i have always thought they were guilty of crimes of complicity and misdemeanors. Whether our elected representatives chose to prosecute is subject to the will of the people and the oligarchs who manage them; then it is law. When the people as a majority begin to move against the government - the constitutional laws and practices should be enforced.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

  25. #60
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    The sad thing is that these people don't recognize that they are mere tools for Soros, Move On and the other various and sundry funding entities invested in keeping people angry and out in the streets, all with the hope of bringing down a duly-elected government that they oppose. Nobody believes these people are concerned first with rule of law.

    In a way, I feel sorry for them. They're being manipulated. They don't really know what they are doing, or for whom.

  26. #61
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    Isn't it funny how the alt-right squeal constantly about 'privileged' liberals, veterans and 'the rule of law' when their big hero is a spoiled brat whose daddy kept him out of the draft, kicked him off with millions of dollars and who has no regard for the law at all.

    Rick

    And repetition: lock her up, make America grate again - that's working at least.

  27. #62
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    The sad thing is that these people don't recognize that they are mere tools for Soros, Move On and the other various and sundry funding entities invested in keeping people angry and out in the streets, all with the hope of bringing down a duly-elected government that they oppose. Nobody believes these people are concerned first with rule of law.

    In a way, I feel sorry for them. They're being manipulated. They don't really know what they are doing, or for whom.

    Keep spreading... Something artificial and poisonous oughta grow soon.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

  28. #63
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    Your supposition of me and my position on this is faulty - i have always thought they were guilty of crimes of complicity and misdemeanors. Whether our elected representatives chose to prosecute is subject to the will of the people and the oligarchs who manage them; then it is law. When the people as a majority begin to move against the government - the constitutional laws and practices should be enforced.
    My supposition is only faulty because I read what you said. And you just said it again -- when it's stuff you don't care about, it doesn't matter. But when it's something you approve of, then by all means we should enforce the law.

    This is not how the rule of law is supposed to work, you know.

    btw, don't get your undies in a twist, generally I like what you have to say. But on this subject you are in error. Laws either mean something all the time to all the people or they are arbitrary and capricious. When they are arbitrary and capricious that's not the rule of law at all. It's "might makes right" which we supposedly dropped a couple centuries ago.

    People squalling about Trump breaking the law at this time are hypocrites. They didn't say a word when it was one of their heroes.

  29. #64
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by on the border View Post
    My supposition is only faulty because I read what you said. And you just said it again -- when it's stuff you don't care about, it doesn't matter. But when it's something you approve of, then by all means we should enforce the law.

    This is not how the rule of law is supposed to work, you know.

    btw, don't get your undies in a twist, generally I like what you have to say. But on this subject you are in error. Laws either mean something all the time to all the people or they are arbitrary and capricious. When they are arbitrary and capricious that's not the rule of law at all. It's "might makes right" which we supposedly dropped a couple centuries ago.

    People squalling about Trump breaking the law at this time are hypocrites. They didn't say a word when it was one of their heroes.
    Complacency falls on everyone shoulders. Where was your pig stick prior to Obama and why do you not want to use it now with all the outrage about government corruption. You would find yourself in good company with these protestors including me... they are not all what you think. There are many who like me who are feed up with the system of corruption. Asking for direct adherence to the recognized constitution protocols and demand evenhandedness is more timely than ever. Both you and I agree on a few issues here on the forum. It is in the common agreement we begin to sort out the government for benefit of the law abiding citizens with equal protections and rights.

    No person is above the law when the majority demands and receives transparency and openness in government and under the rules granted in the constitutions. Moreover - the justice and law is to enhance and protect the greater good of the people. Talking about the past transgressions is pointless. It is now and how we shape the future that matters based on the prescribed existing constitution.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 11-09-2018 at 08:45 PM.
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  30. #65
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Ted, the AG serves at the pleasure of the President. The idea that his firing somehow implicates rule of law considerations is pretty silly.

    Liberals screaming in the street do not get to decide who the AG is.

  31. #66
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    Ted, the AG serves at the pleasure of the President. The idea that his firing somehow implicates rule of law considerations is pretty silly.

    Liberals screaming in the street do not get to decide who the AG is.
    You are in error. The AG must pass an advise and consent portion examination before being appointed. By jumping the senate examination and not following the law of succession for the appointment of a head of government, Trump is in error.

    You clearly understand this is not about liberals, conservatives or Trumpians - it is about rules in our parliamentary government which serves as a checks and balances. If a president intentionally does not follow the laws of advise and consent of the other arm of government, then we are subject to presidential tyranny which clearly follows.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

  32. #67
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Ted, the AG serves at the pleasure of the President and may be removed at will. That's the law.

  33. #68
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    Default Re: Nobody is above the law! Time to protest

    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    Ted, the AG serves at the pleasure of the President and may be removed at will. That's the law.
    The AG must pass an advise and consent portion before being appointed the head of Justice. That is the law.

    Trump can nominate whomever he wants. Rosenstein should be acting attorney general until properly relieved or replaced by another whom has passed the advise and consent phase done by the Senate.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

  34. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    The AG must pass an advise and consent portion before being appointed a head of Justice. That is the law.
    I think you will see that the current succession is lawful, though it be temporary. Trump does not need to consult the Senate in terminating his AG, nor is Sessions required to get their permission to resign. You're getting bad information somewhere. Move On?

  35. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky Blue View Post
    I think you will see that the current succession is lawful, though it be temporary. Trump does not need to consult the Senate in terminating his AG, nor is Sessions required to get their permission to resign. You're getting bad information somewhere. Move On?
    No - luckily enough I do work for several federal assistant Attorney Generals and other federal US attorneys. Was in discussion with them today preparing for a large local trial here at the 9th circuit here in San Francisco.

    They pointed me to wikipedia -
    The United States Attorney General (A.G.) is the chief lawyer of the Federal government of the United States and head of the United States Department of Justice per 28 U.S.C. § 503, concerned with all legal affairs.
    Under the Appointments Clause of the United States Constitution, the officeholder is nominated by the President of the United States and appointed with the advice and consent of the United States Senate. The U.S. Constitution provides that civil officers of the United States, which would include the U.S. Attorney General, may be impeached by Congress for treason, bribery or high crimes and misdemeanors.[4] The United States Attorney General may be removed at will by the President of the United States under the Supreme Court decision Myers v. United States, which found that executive branch officials may be removed without the consent of any entity.[5] In cases of the federal death penalty, the power to seek the death penalty rests with the U.S. Attorney General.
    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

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