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Thread: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

  1. #1
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    Default 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Hello, I have recently picked up a project, a 1950 Chris Craft Riviera that had sank, damaging the engine.

    The engine is a 292 Y block Interceptor, not original to the boat but a great engine and apparently a common period mod to speed up these boats. For some reason it doesn't have the 2nd water pump. The seller had put on a 12v electric "jet pump" sort of looking device. He stated that the previous owner had used no pump, and just had a scoop to bring water to the conventional water pump on the motor. It didn't work well for him, having to run the boat in a no-wake zone, so he changed to the jet pump.

    Was it normal for the KBL motors to rely on a scoop and forward motion to begin the cooling? Does anyone have a diagram of the cooling for the Riviera? Picture of the scoop if that was indeed original?

    For those interested, here's a picture of the boat, pre-sunk!

    Michael

    00o0o_fmxTeK4wzLT_1200x900 by michael delage, on Flickr

  2. #2
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Uhm,...... What do you mean by second water pump? Raw water cooled engines normally have only one water pump.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Ok, thank you for the info. It looks like I was getting confused while looking at a Correct Craft freshwater setup.

    It's odd that the previous owner installed a 2nd, 12v electrical pump. It's something I'd really like to eliminate.

    It's beginning to think something may be amiss with the factory water pump. We're in the process of tear down; I'll have a look.

    So would the scoop on the bottom likely have been original? Shame, the previous owner said he tossed it.

    image3 copy by michael delage, on Flickr

  4. #4
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    I may be in the dark but I've never seen any 50s boat engine that didn't have a water pump and fwd facing pickup strainer. That's a "modern" engine and came on the scene long after the non pressurized "thermal" recirc engines disappeared (1920s?). Most I've seen or owned in both gas and diesel had bronze gear water pumps with grease cups. When worn to limits you turned the cup and gave it a shot of grease. Once primed it kept pumping. I'd guess someone who didn't know squat set that cooling system up improperly...but I could be wrong and not an expert.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Quote Originally Posted by BillP View Post
    I'd guess someone who didn't know squat set that cooling system up improperly...but I could be wrong and not an expert.
    That's what it seems like.

    It does have one water pump. Previous owner added a 2nd, electric water pump, stating that the first pump plus the "scoop" would overheat in no-wake zones.

    So that, to me, sounds like the original water pump simply isn't functioning properly.

    I'll pull the pump tomorrow and see.

    Does anyone have a pic of what the water inlet scoop on a Riviera should look like?

  6. #6
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    These guys can help you.

    http://www.classicboathardware.com/docs/cbh-catalog.pdf

    The “scoop” is commodity. Any inboard motor boat will have them.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Yep, nothing really special about the “scoop”. There are integral through hulls with scoops, or you can get a separate scoop that just fastens over a regular through hull.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  8. #8
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    So far as I am aware, all inboard outboard engines have 2 water pumps. The normal water pump on the engine like an auto engine and a second raw water pump to draw the water up into the manifolds etc. On a MerCruiser or OMC, there is a rubber impeller inside the outdrive leg that pumps the water up into the engine to be circulated by the engine water pump (ignoring closed systems). Volvo does it a bit different with a raw water pump mounted on the engine that draws water from a scoop on the hull. You should be able to duplicate something of that nature if you want or need to do so. Go have a look at a boat with a Volvo Sterndrive.

    Here are photos of scoops.

    https://www.google.ca/search?q=boat+...w=1920&bih=938

  9. #9
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Quote Originally Posted by nedL View Post
    Yep, nothing really special about the “scoop”. There are integral through hulls with scoops, or you can get a separate scoop that just fastens over a regular through hull.
    Scoops can't be relied on to "force" water up into the engine.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    A standard runabout inboard engine has one water pump. It works on millions of boats, and if properly sized should work on yours. Good luck!

  11. #11
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Quote Originally Posted by pcford View Post
    Scoops can't be relied on to "force" water up into the engine.
    Yea, .......... I was tempted to say the 'scoop' is really more of a crude strainer (so you don't suck up small animals, pets, and the like), but I didn't bother.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Quote Originally Posted by C. Ross View Post
    A standard runabout inboard engine has one water pump. It works on millions of boats, and if properly sized should work on yours. Good luck!

    Yes, ........... Pretty much universal for inboards, raw water cooled = one pump, fresh water cooled = two pumps. (unless you are a competitive raceboat, then it is usually no pump)

  13. #13
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Thank you everyone for the help. I sent my water pump off for overhaul with Jim Harris of The Engine Room in Portland, ME. He said my cast iron impeller pump is the wrong design for a flat bottomed boat where the pump isn't located below the waterline. Instead he built me the slightly more modern design, using two rubber impellers, which he says can scavenge water better, and so is more suited to this engine in a Riviera, where the water pump cannot be located below the waterline.

    So hopefully this will take care of the problems the previous owners had been having.

    Engine overhaul is moving along well! Here's a few pics of balancing the crankshaft and other things.

    Michael

    IMG_1525

    IMG_1527

    IMG_1528

    IMG_1538

    IMG_1530

  14. #14
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    Default Re: 1950 Chris Craft Riviera cooling question?

    Looks like fun!!!!!!!

    yes,..... cast iron impeller??? Hmm,.... Not self primping at all. Completely the wrong type of pump. I wouldn’t recommend that pump on any raw water cooled engine (even if below the W/L.).
    The only place I could see using that pump would be on the fresh water side of a fresh water cooled engine (heat exchanger). I might guess your engine was a “take out” from a fresh water installation, and never properly changed for raw water cooling.

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