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Thread: Bearly Anchored

  1. #1
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    Default Bearly Anchored

    We've been into this cove many times.

    https://www.barrietoday.com/around-o...cident-1031978

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    “I opened the companionway door and found a bear standing about six feet in front of me,” said Mr. Nichols, who described it as standing on its hind legs, about six and a half feet tall and weighing over 250 pounds.
    “I closed the door and we quickly made a plan to frighten the bear off the boat. We gathered several flashlights and a halon gas fire extinguisher. I started spraying him with the fire extinguisher; he was sitting on the captain’s chair,” said Mr. Nichols.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Is that what the "B" in the ABC-type extinguisher stands for?
    "The enemies of reason have a certain blind look."
    Doctor Jacquin to Lieutenant D'Hubert, in Ridley Scott's first major film _The Duellists_.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    What's he doing with Halon fire extinguishers. Hasn't he heard about the environment and the damage that halon does?
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    I think maybe people have been putting bags of garbage on their swim platforms at night.

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    We stayed up all night once in that area, looking for a bear. Some people have all the luck.

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    What's he doing with Halon fire extinguishers. Hasn't he heard about the environment and the damage that halon does?


    The term is often used generically-- though he may have had some old, actual halon extinguishers-- to refer to various gasses the chemically disrupt combustion and leave no residue, often, " halotron."

    Kevin




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  8. #8
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hadfield View Post
    I think maybe people have been putting bags of garbage on their swim platforms at night.


    Or, outright feeding.
    There is nothing like that bear selfie to make one's friends jealous.

    Kevin


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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    I bet that bear had pulled a stunt like that before.

    Marine air horns work great at scaring off bears. And I'm all about scaring off bears. Biggest chicken around.
    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Yeadon is right, of course.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Believe it or not, so does shaking a big orange garbage bag.

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    I think Dave is right. people must have left garbage on a swim grid. Or they cooked fresh fish on the BBQ and did not clean it up.
    I have had bears in public camp sites, because despite warnings they left a lot of food out. One time, one of our neighbours put the food on the roof of the RV...bears got that to. Another time the guy a couple of sites over passed out under the picnic table having been to busy drinking to bother cleaning up....i'd guess it was a rude awakening.

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    I was camped in Yosemite's Camp 4 (the walk-in climber campground) when a black bear wandered in, grabbed the bottle of whisky someone had left on a campsite picnic table (still in its brown paper bag), and ran off into the woods with it.

    When I backpack in bear country, I try to cook supper about 30 minutes before I get to wherever I'm going to be spending the night. I haven't been eaten yet, though I have almost been stepped on by a bear when I was sleeping in the open with no tent.

    I wouldn't want a bear aboard, though... I'm not convinced it would know which side of the boat to sit on, and when to shift over when tacking or gybing.

    Tom
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    From Lt Col Jeff Cooper USMC (Ret), I learned that there are five rules for traveling in Bear Country:

    1. Be alert.
    2. Take bears seriously. They are not cuddly.
    3. Never enter bear country on foot without a powerful firearm and the skill to use it well (if this is not permitted, do not go).
    4. Do not pitch your camp on a bear thoroughfare, most particularly along the banks of a stream full of fish.
    5. Be alert.

    Rules 1, 2, 4, and 5 seem to apply here. Those cute videos of Polar Bears drinking Cokes? Bear propaganda.


    Heute ist so ein schöne Tag...

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Rule 3 sounds like something a retired military man would say. There are other choices that can be made for traveling in bear country.

    Tom
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    It's just an excuse to have a gun....probably makes him feel like a man.
    I have camped in bear country plenty. Sometimes had a gun... but bear aware is way safer.
    Keep food well away from the sleeping area, and hopefully properly stowed, and very possibly up in a tree.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    The man was on Guadalcanal, and a few other places. I tend to listen to those who walked off Guadalcanal. They usually know a thing or two about in extremis situations.

    There are other methods. In this case, two fire extinguishers, and it still took some time before this bear became bored. I wonder if there was a third on the boat. If not, then what?

    Yeah, retired Marines. Who needs them? What do they know? I mean, other than that bit about sheep, sheepdogs, and wolves.
    Heute ist so ein schöne Tag...

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Almost everywhere Canadians go camping is bear-country. Black bears, for the most part. The 2 go together.

    Very few Canadian campers have a gun. Extremely rare, unless it's a long-duration northern trip.

    Yet there are almost no maulings. And that is despite hundreds of thousands of visits per year.

    Generally a bit of common sense, especially regarding fish and garbage, is enough. And the bears themselves tend to be sensible too.

    I've slept in the Bush more times than I can count, gunless. The only time I ever had a midnight bear-adventure was when we'd taken over a trapper's shack for a night, and thus were on a bear's regular rounds. Never while in a tent.

    In polar-bear country however, none of the above applies.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    How many moons d'ye think that reporter just sat and waited until he could use the final line in that article?

    I mean, REALLY!

    (Actually I'm just jealous.)

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hadfield View Post
    Almost everywhere Canadians go camping is bear-country. Black bears, for the most part. The 2 go together.

    Very few Canadian campers have a gun. Extremely rare, unless it's a long-duration northern trip.

    Yet there are almost no maulings. And that is despite hundreds of thousands of visits per year.

    Generally a bit of common sense, especially regarding fish and garbage, is enough. And the bears themselves tend to be sensible too.

    I've slept in the Bush more times than I can count, gunless. The only time I ever had a midnight bear-adventure was when we'd taken over a trapper's shack for a night, and thus were on a bear's regular rounds. Never while in a tent.

    In polar-bear country however, none of the above applies.
    This.
    My yard is bear country.
    The last time we saw one was 2011, but there is plenty of evidence.

    R
    Sleep with one eye open.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    There is stuff made for the purpose. Although you wouldn't expect to need it on a cruising boat.

    -Dave

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Bear sprays can be purchased in every state but some parks ban its use. If you use it to repel a human boarder, you're committing a crime on the same level as using an unlicensed/registered firearm, and these sprays can be deadly to humans.

    Still, were I cruising in bear country, I'd have some spray both for the boat and for walks ashore.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Z. View Post
    The man was on Guadalcanal, and a few other places. I tend to listen to those who walked off Guadalcanal.
    I didn't know there were a lot of bears on Guadalcanal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Z. View Post
    Yeah, retired Marines. Who needs them? What do they know?
    Like all of us, retired Marines know what their experience and training has taught them to believe. Some of it is even true. But the idea that you need to carry guns to travel or live safely in bear country is not true (leaving out polar bears--I'm not so sure there). I'm not casting any aspersions on your ex-Marine friend, or politicizing here. He's just wrong about that. Not a big deal--I'm wrong about lots of stuff, too. I try not to get all insulted when people point out where I'm wrong, and sometimes I even manage to pull that off.

    Nothing will absolutely guarantee your safety in bear country, but acting intelligently and dealing correctly with food will help you far more than any gun (assuming you can even get to that gun if a bear decides to have a go at you).

    Tom
    Last edited by WI-Tom; 09-02-2018 at 04:34 PM.
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

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  23. #23
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Bearly any at Guadalcanal.

    I wonder how many people are killed by guns in bear country each year compared to the number killed by bears?

    Rick

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Yeadon is right, of course.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Oh, bother.

    I'm going to say this once, and be done.

    If you recall, I pointed out that they were someone else's rules, that he had his reasons for his rules, and one of the rules specifically DID NOT APPLY in this case. But you decided to focus on the one that didn't apply. Interesting, but at the same time, a bother.

    I agree with "almost no maulings". I also note that "almost no" is a non-zero number.

    "Be alert" was there twice. Go ahead, substitute "aware" for "alert". You've not changed the meaning.

    Jeff Cooper was an interesting guy. If you want to focus on his time on Guadalcanal, without considering other accomplishments, that's your ignorance, not mine. On the other hand, there are plenty of Police Officers who live today because of things he taught.

    His point with that rule was not that one should just shoot at anything that moves. The point was that sometimes, just sometimes, simple methods stop working. At that point, you have to make a life altering decision. What you do with that decision is up to you.

    From my perspective, saying "I've never needed that", or "people do it all the time" is like saying "I don't have to wear a seat belt. I'm just hyper aware of what other drivers are doing." After all, my Grandfather and Grandmother drove thousands of miles with that method. As did my Father and Mother. I'm ashamed to admit I have a few miles under my belt (no pun intended) with that method. But then I chose to increase my odds of surviving. But that's my perspective. I don't fault you if it's not yours, and I would appreciate it very much if you stop faulting me for mine. Mine is based on experience. It's my experience, I grant you. No, you don't need something to live safely. Plenty of people do it all the time. But I can also show you a list of people who were glad they had it when they needed it. Perhaps the relevant statistic is not number of encounters in relation to number of people in the woods, but number of people who survived an encounter in relation to number of encounters. You'll note the rules above can be boiled down to "How to avoid encounters" (80%), with only one rule referring to "how to absolutely make sure that you survive the encounter when things go seriously wrong (20%)." If the orange garbage bags and bear bangers and pepper sprays do not work, then what?

    I'll confess, in the interests of full disclosure, that I've been to many (but by no means all) of the schools LtCol Cooper attended. I'm a bit too young for Guadalcanal. But I'm not too young for Somalia, or for Afghanistan. If you'd like to say that those places are different than the bear woods, I agree. But I also noticed that you weren't with me when I was driving up to LA in '92, because there was no one left when the grocers were calling 911 to protect their stores... Again, not bear country. But also a time when the thing at my side was not a first resort, but the last.

    Oh, and Ian, a minor correction: I'm assuming you meant "unlicensed/unregistered" firearm, and did not mean one that was not licensed, but registered. That in itself opens a can of worms. For example, in these United States, only California requires you to register a rifle. I can not think of a state that requires a license for the rifle, but I can imagine some interesting lawsuits. So I'm also assuming you meant pistol or revolver, which would be sub-optimal for bear. Either way, you would be most likely to be charged with Assault with a Deadly Weapon, similar to if you used a knife or a baseball bat. Or a flare gun, if that matters. Also, circumstances matter: use any of the above on someone just climbing up the boarding ladder, and you're likely to be charged. Use it on an armed person where a reasonable person would be fearing for his life, and you would not be, or if you were, you'd have a reasonable likelihood of acquittal (unless you were in the UK, in which case you have my sympathy). But again, I am speaking only for the US. By state it would vary: For example, in New York, you have a duty to retreat, the same is not true in Florida. This is called "Castle Doctrine", and is separate and distinct from "Stand Your Ground".

    And that's all I'm going to say about that. Flame away, if you choose. But I'm done.
    Heute ist so ein schöne Tag...

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Quote Originally Posted by WI-Tom View Post
    I wouldn't want a bear aboard, though... I'm not convinced it would know which side of the boat to sit on, and when to shift over when tacking or gybing.
    That's an easy one. When you want rid of it, you just bear away.

    Andy
    "We were schooner-rigged and rakish, with a long and lissome hull ..."

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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    One of my Xs was in th US Forest Service, and so I got to sit in on a lot of folks out in the woods stories. One guy has several good bear stories from Cootenay (?) National Forest in Montana. He told the joke that, the rangers and park people will tell you to use the pepper spray, and also to hang these tiny metal bells from your belt, so you jingle when you move, and thereby make some noise for the bears to know where you are, so you don't walk around some big boulder and surprise one.

    The joke is that you can tell grizz by their scat: It often has tiny bells and smells like pepper.

    ***

    I once saw an albino bear in Yosemite. No, it was really a bear, and it was honey-colored. And no, I wasn't stoned, and I wasn't the only one who saw it. Okay, a little stoned.

    I'm sorry, I thought we were in the bilge.
    I don't care to know what the tough do when the going gets tough.

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  28. #28
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Just this morning on the BBC's website, http://bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-high...lands-45396674

    Solo navigation bid cyclist in 'bear country'

    I don't care to know what the tough do when the going gets tough.

    I am interested in what the enlightened do.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    I am sorry that I confused Don Z with my generalizing attempt to make a simple point about bear spray, not about firearms. I was trying to cover the fact that there are wildly different laws regarding firearms depending on jurisdiction and weapon type. But in the broadest way, if you use bear spray to defend yourself against a threatening human, you have broken the law even if you were at risk of your life, just as if you'd used a firearm in a place where carry and/or discharge of that firearm is illegal.

    There are some interesting and like with firearms jurisdictionally different laws regarding purchase, carry, and use of anti-human pepper sprays. But there are circumstances where one can purchase, carry, and use anti-human pepper spray. Bear spray, being quite potentially lethal to humans, is always illegal to spray at a person.

    That said, when I carried bear spray in the deeper wildernesses of the Pacific Northwest, were I to confront a deadly threat from a human that I could not de-escalate (something I'm actually quite good at) I might very well bear spray my attacker and worry about the legal consequences from the luxurious position of being still alive.

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Mahan View Post
    Just this morning on the BBC's website, http://bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-high...lands-45396674

    Solo navigation bid cyclist in 'bear country'


    is this pic of a bear running from or to a whistle?

    _103276721_bearspl.jpg
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

  31. #31
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    In Canadian parks, which is where most people do wilderness, it is illegal to carry firearms....ever....unless you are a Warden, or a conservation officer or police officer on duty.

  32. #32
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    That's an easy one. When you want rid of it, you just bear away.
    Or, claw your way to windward!

    Kevin
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    And Heywood Island is in Ontario, Canada. Very few US gun laws apply there.

  34. #34
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Actually, bikers (cyclists) are quite at risk in grizzly country. They move so quickly compared to walking speed that they often catch bears completely by surprise. And that's never a good idea. So, how often do you need to blow that whistle as you pedal along?

    By the way, I figured out my bear aboard problem. I can just use urSign language.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  35. #35
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    Default Re: Bearly Anchored

    Not suggesting anything one way or the other, but this is interesting.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTw7qps1WG8

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