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Thread: Modern Cruising designs?

  1. #1
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    Default Modern Cruising designs?

    I'm looking for information on modern cruising designs in the 30'-40' range suitable for the amateur builder. I'm familiar with (and like) Dudley Dix designs and was wondering what else was available.

    thanks,
    Hugh

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Paul Gartside has designed an excellent 12.9 metre cruising cutter.
    https://store.gartsideboats.com/coll...ter-design-174

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    If I had a dollar for every girl who found me unattractive, eventually they would find me attractive.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    You can buy kits, no Waarschip plans

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    http://www.tadroberts.ca/services/ne...uturecruiser38

    28’-44’ range in this type, and other interesting options.

    CBA9ED97-0F3B-4097-A62D-4C93F1E115F8.jpg
    Last edited by Matt young; 08-14-2018 at 12:30 PM.
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    I'm not sure if RM offer plans but the certainly push the notion of modern cruising designs in epoxy/ply:

    http://www.rm-yachts.com/en/home

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Or try a katamaran, www.multihulldesigns.com . Check out cylinder/molding from Kurt Hughes. Quick building, fast beautiful boats.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Kits are fine. Actually if I'm going to do this I would probably start with a kit. Multihulls are fine also. I've been spending a lot of time at Richard Woods' site as well as Dudley Dix's.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    We sail a Wizard from Richard Woods. I bought the boat in Travemuende when I realized that I could not build cheaper then what a second hand boat might cost. I had studyplans of a 28 ft Gypsy, Woods design and a 30 ft Hughes cat and both would take 2000 hours to complete. And then a professional boatbuilder said to me, " but those are my hours, not yours" , implying he would be more efficient.
    A Waarschip can be bought very cheap now, but I guess you have other reasons to build.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Clarkey View Post
    I'm not sure if RM offer plans but the certainly push the notion of modern cruising designs in epoxy/ply:

    http://www.rm-yachts.com/en/home
    Those are nice. I wonder if someone does offer plans like that....
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    an interesting question. I too was looking for it

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Besides trendy profile lines and a roaches sail, what makes a modern cruising boat?

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    After reading My Old Man and the Sea about a father and son who cruised from Massachusetts down around Cape Horn and back in a 24' sailboat, it completely changed my ideas about what's necessary in a cruising boat.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dannybb55 View Post
    Besides trendy profile lines and a roaches sail, what makes a modern cruising boat?
    A one heck of a lot of electronic stuff, like email and sat phone/ iridium go etc, because advance notice of arrival is mandated in many places now. often 72 hours(+ , you can call up a week or two out for a work around) Other than that , room enough to be comfortable at anchor , because only what? 5 % of the time is passage making.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    A one heck of a lot of electronic stuff, like email and sat phone/ iridium go etc, because advance notice of arrival is mandated in many places now.
    Surely that is only if possible? Small boats wont carry that kind of kit, and any boat can suffer a power outage for numerous reasons. Never heard of a port refusing entry for someone in need of water and provisions.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Oh but they will, everything has been miniaturised to make sure those on small boats need never be disconnected. But of course, no real cruising man would waste money on that stuff.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    "Besides trendy profile lines and a roaches sail, what makes a modern cruising boat? "

    More efficient underbody shapes, better foil hydrodynamics, lighter hull weight, stronger rigs, more efficient sails. Other than that, not much.
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Small boats rock View Post
    Oh but they will, everything has been miniaturised to make sure those on small boats need never be disconnected. But of course, no real cruising man would waste money on that stuff.
    Your right. I have recently looked at what is available and it is quite an eye opener, it is also very expensive and comes with expensive contracts and monthly billing......that never fitted into my previous cruising style, nor will it. That being said, i find it quite shocking how many new gadgets some people fit as a "must have", that i always considered a luxery item, i guess times change and people feel the need to display their position and update their status several times each hour.
    Perhaps i need to set up a Utube channel and a go-fund-me page to pay for all that stuff, and patreons can watch me drink beer while the sun goes down in a quite anchorage ( drone shot, naturally) at their expense........if i start the funding now, perhaps they can pay for the boat too before i spend anymore of my own money.......

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Small boats rock View Post
    Oh but they will, everything has been miniaturised to make sure those on small boats need never be disconnected. But of course, no real cruising man would waste money on that stuff.
    Your real cruising man will have his boat confiscated by Australian customs and face enormous fines. He won't do very well in Tonga or Fiji or NZ either.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    ^ Ironic, some of the places where the local inhabitants often cruised with no navigation aids at all......do those law apply to locals or just foreign tourists?

    Apologise for the thread drift.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    Your real cruising man will have his boat confiscated by Australian customs and face enormous fines. He won't do very well in Tonga or Fiji or NZ either.
    Some years back, a Russian bloke turned up in Darwin having sailed half way around the world in a tiny boat (think it was 12 feet) but his passport had expired by the time he arrived. Although he was half starved and in a pretty poor state when he arrived, good old ozzie refused to let him stay more than a week. He sailed on to NZ to a hero's welcome.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dannybb55 View Post
    Besides trendy profile lines and a roaches sail, what makes a modern cruising boat?
    What mdh said, plus modern sail-handling gear, bathing/boarding platforms, low-friction deck layouts. And all too often, boats that are designed to minimise overall length, and have plumb bows that look trendy but require an anchor bowsprit that costs more than just giving the bow some rake in the first place!

    Oh, and around the Australian east coast the modern cruising boats are mostly cats.
    Last edited by Chris249; 08-25-2018 at 06:13 PM.
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    "What mdh said"

    mdh? MDH!!? Puh-leeze! <grin>
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    Your real cruising man will have his boat confiscated by Australian customs and face enormous fines. He won't do very well in Tonga or Fiji or NZ either.
    You mean to say that if Shane Acton turned up in OZ today, they would throw the rule book at him and confiscate his boat? What happened to free passage for boats under foreign flag?



    I hope you get over that coughing fit MMD You are a valued member....

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew2 View Post
    You mean to say that if Shane Acton turned up in OZ today, they would throw the rule book at him and confiscate his boat? What happened to free passage for boats under foreign flag?
    I believe NZ was imposing rules on foreign yachts when it came time for them to leave. I understand why they did it, having such a huge area to cover in search and rescue, but someone eventually fought the thing in court and it was deemed unlawfull to impose national laws on visiting yachts; that was some years ago so i do not know what the current situation is. What would they do with Sven Yrvind and ExLex had he arrived?
    I knew someone who sailed a 20ft boat to Australia from the UK, and the only electrics he had was a single masthead and interior light. Again, some years ago, but they didnt refuse him entry or denied him leave.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    "What mdh said"

    mdh? MDH!!? Puh-leeze! <grin>
    Oh dear. My profound apologies!
    Has BigFella and SkyBlue on ignore.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Some years back, a Russian bloke turned up in Darwin having sailed half way around the world in a tiny boat (think it was 12 feet) but his passport had expired by the time he arrived. Although he was half starved and in a pretty poor state when he arrived, good old ozzie refused to let him stay more than a week. He sailed on to NZ to a hero's welcome.
    We actually met him. We had just arrived from Singapore in our yacht and here he was tied up to the one of the fingers. Yes it was 12ft. Looked really cramped and uncomfortable. His only water was a 20 litre drum, small cooker, some rice and some dried vegies. Sleeping was very cramped as he couldn't stretch out.

    We yakked for a few hours in broken english, and he told me he was going back to Russia and never again would he do it in a small boat. Don't blame him actually after looking at what he had. He wrote to me some time later and said that when he left Darwin, it took him nearly 3 weeks to get to Indo. Currents kept dragging him away, as there isn't much wind up there. He ran out of water, but luckily he had a small hand pump de-salinator on board, but it wasn't working very well. So the water was always tainted. Last we heard it was nearly a year later and he was back home. We then lost contact. Nice bloke though.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    I recall a Russian couple turning up in NZ in an old converted ships lifeboat, if i recall, non stop across the Pacific. They did not have sat-nav or vhf or even visas, but they were given a warm welcome and much support from the local community, and as far as i know, probably still there, seems the government were happy to bend the regulations for a couple who had proved to have determination to make things work.

    Modern cruising boat, seems to be the latest thing to save even more space and weight by only having small water storage, but expensive watermakers......was you requiring a washing machine?

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    There is compilacted modern than there is modernist. Both are valid and represented. Below is a quote from Tad Roberts in regards to his Future Cruiser line of designs, that I posted earlier in this thread. I also think of Nigel Irens, with his delightful balance of classic and simple modern lines and details. Not fussy or complicated, I like this as one way to think of as modern.

    “For sailing vessels my own take on the Affordable Bluewater Cruisers concept is my line of "Future Cruisers", these are post-modern, less-is-more freedom machines. Sizes run from 28' to 44' to 54' (Future Cruiser 44 MKII), construction is simple, beam moderate, displacement moderate, draft minimized with lifting ballast keels, rigs unstayed, and systems basic.”
    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
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  31. #31
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    What do you mean by 'low-friction deck layouts'? What you and MMD wrote is pretty much what I meant by a modern cruising design.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    A "low friction deck layout" most likely includes the latest in roller bearing technology leading your sheets and halyards to powered winches........or.......you could just use a rig that does not require high tension loads and save a small fortune on all the hardware that you can not fix when it breaks. Tads ideas are worthy of serious thought, not many people do not actually run the process of what they actually intend to do with the boat before plunging in at the deep end. I do not see why a modern cruising boat has to be expensive, you just need to dispense with some of the gadgets, but everyone will have a different idea of what they can live without.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Nope, it's not about adding expense. It's a reference to experience that indicates that deck layouts with rounded corners, 'glass or epoxy-covered surfaces, and clean leads can significantly reduce friction and therefore make sailing easier, as can cascading purchases and other devices that use the improvements in design and technology over the past few decades. Modern rigs can also be low in friction because there's no spar to hoist and no inner forestay to drag a headsail and lines around, and they often use short-foot headsails that don't have to be dragged past stays, spreaders and inner forestays. Such rigs allow you to use simple fittings like this for important high-load sail controls;

    inhauler-1.jpg

    It would be interesting to see objective evidence that there are rigs that require lower tensions, all else being equal. There are claims that bermudan rigs, for example, are intrinsically highly loaded but many such claims, such as the one by Bolger that a tighter forestay is always better, are simply incorrect. Similarly, as noted on another thread, there are examples of the most popular lug-rigged racing dinghy that use FIFTY TWO Harken blocks - vastly more than the modern carbon fibre foiling Moths, for which the same fittings manufacturer recommends just 13.

    Sure, of course you don't need 52 blocks on a 12 foot lug rigged boat - but then again you don't need 13 blocks on a bermudan rig 12 footer either. You can get by happily with none, if you want. The thing is that sometimes a complicated high-speed version of the "modern" rig is unfairly compared to a simplified lower-speed version of a "traditional" rig. And still, it's hard to find proof that a "traditional rig" to the same standard is actually more complex and expensive. What is the extra expense in an extra yard, an extra mast, an extra sail or extra area when compared to the expense of modern lines and roller bearing blocks?

    The Roberts design seems extremely complicated to me! Four sheets to handle, four sets of sheet blocks, fastenings and lines to buy, two masts to build or buy and to support, two spars to hoist, two booms instead of one, four sails to buy and pull up and down instead of two to buy, one to pull up and one to unroll, a boat so heavy it needs an anchor winch, two centreboards.....
    Last edited by Chris249; 08-27-2018 at 12:57 AM.
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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    I believe NZ was imposing rules on foreign yachts when it came time for them to leave. I understand why they did it, having such a huge area to cover in search and rescue, but someone eventually fought the thing in court and it was deemed unlawfull to impose national laws on visiting yachts; that was some years ago so i do not know what the current situation is. What would they do with Sven Yrvind and ExLex had he arrived?
    I knew someone who sailed a 20ft boat to Australia from the UK, and the only electrics he had was a single masthead and interior light. Again, some years ago, but they didnt refuse him entry or denied him leave.
    The current situation here is that in the case of a yacht that has been deemed to be unsafe or poorly equipped for its voyage, even though it may not be legal for the authorities here to stop it from leaving, they wont clear it through customs, which is a perfectly legal thing to do, and which prevents the vessel from legally entering its next port of call. Very few people will leave under those circumstances, so they tend to rush around and get their vessel sorted, and to loudly advertise the injustice of it all when they're talking to other cruisers.
    Suits us, we're responsible under international treaty for what is I think is about the fourth largest SAR zone, I may not be correct in that, but I can say that it stretches from Fiji to the Antarctic, and covers over 30 million square km. Note that we cover Fiji and Samoa as well as our own patch. Its expensive, and for a small country like NZ to do that is a stretch at times. So reducing the risk is a reasonable thing.

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    Default Re: Modern Cruising designs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris249 View Post
    The Roberts design seems extremely complicated to me! Four sheets to handle, four sets of sheet blocks, fastenings and lines to buy, two masts to build or buy and to support, two spars to hoist, two booms instead of one, four sails to buy and pull up and down instead of two to buy, one to pull up and one to unroll, a boat so heavy it needs an anchor winch, two centreboards.....
    Im guessing its about small easily handled sail area, and low centre of effort rig. Could you have the same area on a single stick rig, without increasing the ballast for the same righting moment? Possibly the loss of the mizzen might make up for it? Would you be able to set up the single mast without help? Most of my own boats have been single mast, single head stay, and i agree that they do have merit, new sails, one main,a 120 genoa and a cruising chute, thats only one sail that needs to find a home down below, and they make a good cushion. But some people like redundancy of a second mast and extre sails, just like some people would choose two engines in a powerboat.
    So whats your weight limit on a boat without a windlass? I had no problems in anything around 30lbs and 100ft of chain, but i could not do that today with ruptured discs, but even a long handle lever with chain pawls would work as well as a winch, and is simple to make with little to go wrong.

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