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Thread: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

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    Default A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.


    A slightly bigger boat for this new design, just introduced to the Selway Fisher Design stable - the Trinity Cove 55 is a strip planked motor yacht - 55' x 13' x 4'1" with 2 double cabins, large saloon and galley for electric or diesel propulsion. Capable of long range cruising offshore. Drawings are also included for grp construction.
    More details at - http://www.selway-fisher.com/Mcover30.htm#TRIN


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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Lovely, though I'd have made a flush deck rather than the trunk. The pilot house looks glorious.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Nice, but just a few inches too long for my garage.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Looks a bit fat arsed for my taste. Looks hard to provide a sweet run if that stern cabin is to be usable.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    Looks a bit fat arsed for my taste. Looks hard to provide a sweet run if that stern cabin is to be usable.
    There's no accommodation down low aft. I'd need to see the lines to judge.
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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    There's no accommodation down low aft. I'd need to see the lines to judge.
    I see a double bed at what, a foot above the waterline.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    High enough.
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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    High enough.
    Draw the section at the aft side of that rectangular double bed, and think about the shape of the rebate. Then consider the buttock lines and the room to fit the engine/gear box.
    Tricky, we do need a lines plan.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Yes, I can't properly judge without a lines plan.
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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Your gonna need a bigger Hi-Lux Mr Sibley......

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Much, much to big for me but attractive for a powerboat.
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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    More of a river boat me thinks, all that length and not a single sea-going berth. And anyone who has ever slept anywhere near a prop will know that aft berth will only be habitable when its not turning, and the pitch motion of the forward berth pretty much rules that out too. To be fair, it would cross the North sea with only one night at sea, so maybe not a big deal.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Much, much to big for me but attractive for a powerboat.
    I've always had an eye on Rufus 22

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    I have to agree with Nick on that ample "arse" being a more than a thing of beauty! More of a fanny than a fan tail! I would imagine that the diagonals are not all that sweet there.
    Jay

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post

    A slightly bigger boat for this new design, just introduced to the Selway Fisher Design stable - the Trinity Cove 55 is a strip planked motor yacht - 55' x 13' x 4'1" with 2 double cabins, large saloon and galley for electric or diesel propulsion. Capable of long range cruising offshore. Drawings are also included for grp construction.
    More details at - http://www.selway-fisher.com/Mcover30.htm#TRIN


    Saw it and loved it. To big for my intended purpose. I'd like to see something around 35 feet long, 8-9 feet in beam, and around 2 feet no deeper than 3 feet of draft. If it could maintain 6 to 8 knots around 1gph, I'd be happy. Offshore capable would be nice but the only offshore I would do would be crossing the Gulf of Mexico and maybe some islands south. It would be great in moulded ply over frames.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Nice looking boat. Does anyone think there's a market? You can get a big fat plastic planing hull boat with 3 times the accommodation, a flybridge, looking like a fancy tennis shoe in the same length and probably for the same cost. Does anyone with the money also have the taste any more?

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Y View Post
    Nice looking boat. Does anyone think there's a market? You can get a big fat plastic planing hull boat with 3 times the accommodation, a flybridge, looking like a fancy tennis shoe in the same length and probably for the same cost. Does anyone with the money also have the taste any more?
    As you know, planning hulls require lots of power and fuel. Some of us like to slow down and enjoy the trip while puttering along quietly with a low power diesel thumping away as it sips fuel like a little old lady sipping tea on the front stoop. There is a market for the barge and canal boats. They work really well here in the US. We have a ton of inland waterways in the form of lakes, rivers, and most any other body of water you can think of. If you're not familar with the US/Canada Great Loop and ICW, have a quick search. It's very interesting and unique way to see the US and CA. A lot of the cruising is in areas with restricted speeds. A barge or canal boat would be most excellent in a lot of those areas.

    Unfortunately, I'm not familiar with your boating world down in Australia. You guys may have some of the same things down there.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    No, we lack those inland waterways, it's straight out into the Pacific, Indian or Southern Oceans for us. I'm surprised everyone is saying this is a sheltered water boat. Looks like an old fishing boat hull to me. Similar to that one with a thread that's now run to 50 million pages or so, with not an awful lot actually happening on the boat. Salmon troller? Or those wonderful, North Sea fishing boats. But I'm pretty much ignorant on the hull form characteristics of motor boats. I do like the look of this one. Just the market seems to be all about those awful sport fisherman abominations.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Y View Post
    No, we lack those inland waterways, it's straight out into the Pacific, Indian or Southern Oceans for us. I'm surprised everyone is saying this is a sheltered water boat. Looks like an old fishing boat hull to me. Similar to that one with a thread that's now run to 50 million pages or so, with not an awful lot actually happening on the boat. Salmon troller? Or those wonderful, North Sea fishing boats. But I'm pretty much ignorant on the hull form characteristics of motor boats. I do like the look of this one. Just the market seems to be all about those awful sport fisherman abominations.
    I'm not real sure how to explain it but long somewhat narrow boats with shallow keels like to roll a lot in waves like the ocean has. That can get uncomfy quick. Also, because of their length, they could break up trying to span tall waves with long periods between them. If they survive shooting over the waves, the bow will pound pretty badly as it crashes on top of waves. Even though the bow has a curve, the lower hull is still fairly flat. The design of the hull could be changed a bit to compensate for pounding and the keel made deeper and ballasted to help with rolling. Those features would hurt the shallow draft properties that these boats are made for. I'm no navel architect but this is loosely how I understand the canal barges and narrow boats to work in rough conditions. If I'm wrong, someone will be around to correct me.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Y View Post
    Similar to that one with a thread that's now run to 50 million pages or so, with not an awful lot actually happening on the boat. Salmon troller?
    Ouch. I mean, true - but still.... just twist the knife a bit more Phil!

    More relevant to the thread, I like the Paul Fisher design personally. I agree that the stern might be, ah, hmmm "imposing" in reality. I'll leave discussion of the hull form up to the professionals, but I'd note that there have been plenty of long, slim boats making ocean passages for some hundreds of years now. Sure, they have these tall stick things on top and I notice that this one doesn't, but it does seem like it should be possible to make a decent long range cruiser along these lines.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    Ouch. I mean, true - but still.... just twist the knife a bit more Phil!

    More relevant to the thread, I like the Paul Fisher design personally. I agree that the stern might be, ah, hmmm "imposing" in reality. I'll leave discussion of the hull form up to the professionals, but I'd note that there have been plenty of long, slim boats making ocean passages for some hundreds of years now. Sure, they have these tall stick things on top and I notice that this one doesn't, but it does seem like it should be possible to make a decent long range cruiser along these lines.


    The press of sail provides stability the poweryacht lacks. I find this form most uncomfortable. Even in orotected water, boat wakes--which are steep, short period waves--take all the fun out of such a boat. For me.

    I like the dynamic stability provided by planing, the extra noise and fuel burn be danged.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breakaway View Post
    The press of sail provides stability the poweryacht lacks. I find this form most uncomfortable. Even in orotected water, boat wakes--which are steep, short period waves--take all the fun out of such a boat. For me.

    I like the dynamic stability provided by planing, the extra noise and fuel burn be danged.

    Kevin


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    While I've cruised planing and displacement boats and have found both to be comfortable in reasonable conditions, I'm an inshore power boater and have zero offshore or sailing experience so I can't comment from experience at all here. That said, I'm not one to let inexperience keep me from having an opinion (it's the American way you know) so a few thoughts.

    - I agree that it seems like some sort of stability mechanism would be a good addition to this boat. Steadying sails perhaps, or paravanes. It does need a mast or two just for aesthetics. Might as well put it to good use.

    - I note from the Fisher site that it was originally designed for electric power with a (presumably large and heavy) battery bank under the cabin sole. I suspect that much internal ballast down low would give it a pretty strong righting moment. Might have less of a tendency to roll than it seems just looking at the shape.

    But is there a market? No. Because the people who would actually use this boat as designed are all buying Nordhavns. Or rather, maybe. Because George Buehler did have some success with his Diesel Duck line, which isn't too far off from this concept. Still they are the outlier. People buy boats not based on actual capabilities but on perceived ones. The Nordhavn just looks seaworthy, with high bows and an icebreaker-tough aesthetic. A boat like the Fisher design might be equally seaworthy and far more economical but everyone looks at it and thinks "it will roll", "it will break up".

    Maybe as a looper* though, as ben2go suggested.

    *looper = a boat or crew making the Great Loop along the Eastern Seaboard of the US. Mostly protected waterways - rivers and canals - with a few larger lakes and passages across exposed inlets. I did a small part of it as a kid, coming down the ICW from Connecticut to Baltimore.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    Ouch. I mean, true - but still.... just twist the knife a bit more Phil!
    Oh bugger, I didnt notice you there! Should be more careful what I say. Actually I still enjoy reading your thread from time to time, and admire your steady progress.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    ^^ Thanks. I'll say that "steady progress" would be an exaggeration. "Occasional twiddling interspersed with brief flurries of activity" might be closer to the mark. It's what I can do between work, being Dad and various obligations to family, etc. I'm philosophical about it. Mostly. As for the mounting pile of posts on the thread - what else am I going to do when I'm awake at 3:00 am? Can't sleep. Can't work on the boat. Might as well post something about boats, no matter how trivial.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Having experienced the slamming crashing planing type I can safely say that the motion is horrendous. An hour or two of jarring jerky bashing through moderate seas is surprisingly tiring. The rolling displacement motion would be a better choice if the cruise was to take days or weeks under way.

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    Default A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Small boats rock View Post
    Having experienced the slamming crashing planing type I can safely say that the motion is horrendous. An hour or two of jarring jerky bashing through moderate seas is surprisingly tiring. The rolling displacement motion would be a better choice if the cruise was to take days or weeks under way.


    You ve likely never been aboard a well designed V -hull; at the least not one operated by someone who knew what she was doing.


    If you did want to take weeks to get somewhere, though, the round bilged displacement craft ability to carry a load makes it the one to do it in.

    Every boat is a compromise.


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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    I guess I don't think of a boat as the fastest way to get somewhere, just the most pleasant. A pleasant motion is very important.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    I guess I don't think of a boat as the fastest way to get somewhere, just the most pleasant. A pleasant motion is very important.


    I agree. Its what prompted my original statement. Displacement powercraft are rolly and wet, on the whole. More comfortable to plane at a moderate speed.

    Or, sail.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Or a steadying sail.
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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Given that small sailing boats, such as say a vertue or folkboat, can cruise near hull speed with motors as small as 10 hp, I imagine a similar sized power boat which doesn't need to lug around a ballast keel, nor suffer the windage of a sailing rig, must also be able to cruise at hull speed with very small motor. If true, the displacement type power boat would surely run on the smell of an oily rag? Someone correct me, do I imagine all wrong? Is the engine required bigger than I think?

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.



    This boat would make a mighty fine Thames liveaboard.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Small boats rock View Post
    . If true, the displacement type power boat would surely run on the smell of anSomeone correct me, do I imagine all wrong? Is the engine required bigger than I think?
    Yes bigger than you think. A boat like this would be a stupendous pia with an under powered engine. Maneuvering around docks and other boats in windy conditions or currents requires an adequate power source to change direction and move the boat from forward to reverse in a sort space.

    Underway in high winds, waves, chop and strong currents it definitely needs plenty of power.
    Last edited by navydog; 07-06-2018 at 11:58 AM.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    It would look similar to Pioneer built in 1899. Only 3 owners!

    https://www.findafishingboat.com/cor...-boat/ad-86346
    Last edited by Edward Pearson; 07-06-2018 at 12:59 PM.

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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.


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    Default Re: A new motor boat design from Paul Fisher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Small boats rock View Post
    Given that small sailing boats, such as say a vertue or folkboat, can cruise near hull speed with motors as small as 10 hp, I imagine a similar sized power boat which doesn't need to lug around a ballast keel, nor suffer the windage of a sailing rig, must also be able to cruise at hull speed with very small motor. If true, the displacement type power boat would surely run on the smell of an oily rag? Someone correct me, do I imagine all wrong? Is the engine required bigger than I think?
    Depends on the engine. a 50hp Scandia/ Kelvin/ Hundestad twin would have no issues when fitted with a pitching prop, that most were. Even a Perkins P3 will throw a prop 3ft in diameter with 50hp, and that gives a lot of bite in the water. There was a trading vessel running across the Pacific with a P3 perkins and had it running at lowest possible speed to make the huge distances. I did have friends replace a 2 cylinder 40hp hot bulb engine with a modern Iveco 120hp, the boat didnt go much faster, but the fuel bill did go up quite a bit.

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