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Thread: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    The port wheel is red. Shouldn't the starboard wheel be green?
    Management is the art of counting beans. Leadership is the art of making every being count. --Joe Finch

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Hi Gypsie

    Looks good. The trolley looks to be heading in the right direction. A couple of thoughts:

    1. I know these are the wheelbarrow wheels that you have, but you might want to consider sourcing wider wheels for across the soft sand. The wheels I use are 123 mm across the tyre carcass. At the very minimum, keep the axel long enough to accept wider wheels in the future if these narrow wheels prove too difficult to pull across soft sand. You might also want to consider plastic centred wheels so that they do not rust.

    2. Have you considered how the boat will sit on the trolley right side up? Without having seen the boat in the flesh, it seems that the bow is a lot higher than the front of the trolley which may make the stern too close to the ground. It could be just a visual illusion from the photo.

    3. How are you planning to attached the axel? That is a stainless steel axel right?

    4. I reckon you might have trouble keeping the axel plank in place sitting on its end like that. The leverage of pulling the wheels over uneven surfaces is likely to torque off the axel plank. I would recommend keeping the axel closer to the A-frame rails.

    I look forward to seeing the next version. :-)

    Rex.
    Last edited by rex_wolfe; 05-12-2018 at 03:08 AM.

  3. #38
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    Mocked something up on the boat last night.

    Attachment 15839

    I'll work with that i think.

    Attachment 15840

    Two cross pieces, one at the back and one to support the front.
    I'll have a pad each side of the keel on each cross piece.
    I did try a plank lengthways between the cross pieces, but the rocker would just make it rock...

    Attachment 15841

    Thanks for the inspiration Rex, cometh the challenge, cometh the man.
    I'd work on generally reducing the height of everything. With the set up you have now yo'd have to be in deep water to float the boat on.

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Thanks guys, My axle is a temporary one i think. I want to prove the model so to speak.
    The boat should sit level - to the center thwart i believe. Which will have the bow and stern about the height.
    I've changed the axle support during the building process so not as high, but i'll still need about 30cm to 40cm of water to float it off. Which is about right for where i am launching.

    Assembled the parts as they came together.
    I appreciate Rex's idea about gluing everything so i will, but there will be 6 heavy duty, roofing, screws on the frame. The four on the A frame, holding the cross pieces will be covered by timber epoxied in place.

    IMG_4685.jpg

    Mistakes were made, Lessons learned.

    I notched out the front of the A frame to take the handle. Not my finest hour but fine, the thickened epoxy will look after the gaps. The sticking out bits are to be cut off once final assembly is complete and before final coat of epoxy.

    IMG_4686.jpg


    However, by handle, once installed was clearly never going to do the job. the forces of pulling the trolley, with all of its laden weight, will be transferred through that join. It became completely apparent once i assembled the parts on the boat itself and visualised the thing in action.

    IMG_4691.jpg

    Remade that so it has a more substantial join, and i will augment it when assembles with something to counter the leverage aft of the part that protrudes through the bottom of the join.

    IMG_4693.jpg

    Its not apparant form that picture, but the handle is a piece of 95x45 DF, tapered to 45x45 at the top.
    Gives a far more reassuring join at the A Frame.

    IMG_4694.jpg
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Added a handle to the top of the handle.... Once a mate loaned me a 25mm bit. 2 hardware shops, both out of every kind of 25mm hole saw/bit.

    IMG_4696.jpg

    Some back stops for under the rear of the A Frame to stop the axle torquing off.

    IMG_4695.jpg

    OH! and the axle; the original mock up was only for layout, i had intended to follow Rex's boxed in idea.
    My thinking is the wheelbarrow wheels may be temporary - i found one and the other was a cheap purchase, so i'm not going to lose sleep if they don't work out.
    The axle rod likewise is a piece of steel i have lying around so i'm treating it as disposable.

    So the axle box needs to dismantle.
    Its epoxied inside and will be outside. the axle rod is kep centered by a screw in the middle but its not glued in. It is however extremely snug, i had to use clamps to push it home. I've used 6mm ply for the underside which has been epoxied in place. when i need to change it i'll just plane that off.

    IMG_4687.jpg

    IMG_4688.jpg

    That whole assembly is 65mm wide and about 75mm high. The axle centers at about 60mm from the top.
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    The angle of the A Frame was a little arbitrary.
    i thought, either directly under the points of greatest load - or to the ends of the axle.
    in the end i picked an angle that was somewhat pelasing to the eye for a reference. It turned out to be exactly 20 degrees. Then i thought through that setting my saws and things up for compound or bevel cuts is simply 10 degrees - easy. So i went with that.

    My guess is that the rear cross piece is a little behind the unladen center of gravity of the boat so she should sit into the trolley nicely.
    once the battery is placed forward of center she'll be firmly there.

    The handle - for reference - is 80cm long and at an angle to match the bow transom of about 30 degrees. So it'll be a smidgen lower than 80cm when in use. The handle will be a comfortable lift height and with me holding it in a standing position she'll easily float free of the ground. My boys may find it trickier.

    IMG_4692.jpg

    Everything disassembled and coated with epoxy.

    IMG_4697.jpg

    Not many components really. She's a very comfortable lift when assembled, even with wheels on.
    There is a gnarly not on the SB side of the trolley near the handle. I'm thinking i might support over that. I put the knot on the upper face thinking the weight would put the underside in flex and so it'd be stronger. But thinking about the forces when pulling, that point may actually experience upward pressure as the handle torques forward.
    Perhaps support above there, rather then underneath.....?
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Looks like the trolley is progressing well Gypsie. I would definitely include some braces on the handle join to the A-frame. Also make sure that you leave enough space for the centre runner plus whatever foam/marine carpet you are going to place on the bunks.

    Rex.

  8. #43
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    You might also consider cutting the slots for the runner at an angle so that it is self centring as you pull the boat onto the trolley. Rex.

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Thanks Rex,


    I've left the carpet pads run into the slot so the boat can buffer itself to bed.

    Its all assembled and glued and has had a try out. All success - will post pics as soon as they download.

    On reflection, I built the trolley in 2 halves. I built the A frame so it was structurally strong enough, and then attached the axle to it. I didn't think of the axle as an integral structural piece.
    Hence, the cross beam aft is actually superfluous and only acts to lift the beds by 4.5cm.

    Catch up to follow.
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  10. #45
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    I build my trolleys with the axel case a key part of the A-frame structure. The bunks are really secondary and only need to support the weight of the boat plus pushing and pulling forces during launch. Perhaps an opportunity to lighten/lower the trolley in the future?

    In my opinion, you also do not need a screw to locate the axel in the axel case. With wheels and washers/split pins on either side, the axel is not going anywhere!

    Rex.

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Here are some photos of the dolly I just built for my Hv13. The axel is a 1" OD aluminum tube. I split a 2x4 and hollowed out a recess for the tube, placed the tube, then glued the wood back together. Friction, more or less, holds the tube in position. I drilled a hole at each end for a shop made aluminum keeper pin. All the rest is wood, glued and screwed together. The wheels were the most expensive part at $75 each. They are air filled with delrin bearings. They won't do road speeds, they are for slow travel only.

    Dolly - 1.jpg

    Dolly - 2.jpg

    Dolly - 3.jpg

    So far I've only moved it around the yard. Today will be it's inaugural run to the water along with the boat's first bath!

    Jeff

  12. #47
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Hey Jeff,
    That is very neat - and low! Nice work.
    No vertical handle at the front?
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    First off - my great idea.
    Using beer bottle tops to support the epoxied components while they dried.

    IMG_4710.jpg

    Nice and simple......

    IMG_4712.jpg

    Didn't work, unless you think glueing beer bottle tops to your material is good.......

    All glued up, stuck some carpet on the beds in lieu of the boat carpet and foam i have ordered.

    IMG_4713.jpg

    The back stops behind the axle to stop that part twisting off. This is one spot where the 10 degree angle was useful - easy cutting.

    IMG_4716.jpg

    And hey presto.

    IMG_4718.jpg

    Yes - the height is unwelcome. Should have listened more carefully to Hwyl in #38. Its an ongoing problem of mine to rush in where others are smart enough to pause.
    So quite possibly out with the saw some time soon.
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  14. #49
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Sits the boat nicely - just as expected. Happy camper on that front.

    IMG_4721.jpg

    Trailered fine, light enough to lift easily - no need to disassemble.

    IMG_4723.jpg

    Unloaded from the trailer easily. Just slid it back, dropped the transom onto the ground and flipped it head over heels directly onto the trolley. A little precarious but fine, and for a one man operation about as good as can be expected i think.

    IMG_4725.jpg

    I found a section of the grass/sand zone that was not as difficult. New problem this week was the amount of sea grass washed up in the big winds a couple of weeks ago.
    Jervis Bay is a Marine park because of the sensitive nature of those sea grass fields - nurseries for fish. It makes the bay extremely beautiful but pushing a launch trolley through knee high composting sea grass is not without its challenges.

    IMG_4726.jpg

    But still - success!

    IMG_4727.jpg
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Big guy goes fishing, while dad attends to fluids. Top up diesel, change engine oil, transmission oil, fill water tanks.

    IMG_4729.jpg

    Took big boat for a spin, loosing oil pressure at idle when engine is hot........
    Discover electrics are shorting out because the high winds have driven water into unwanted places........
    Wear on main sheet....
    Deck leaking.........

    There's always something.
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Nice trolley jpatrick. Nice and low too. I am curious about your handle, or lack thereof!

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Gypsie

    Trolley looks great!

    Is the connection between the handle and A-frame strong enough? ie no movement?

    The boat does sit high on the trolley, but hey, if it works ... If you ever get around to lowering the bunks, you might consider making them a little wider, particularly the front one -- it seems to be sitting in the middle of the plywood panel which is not where the boat is strongest. Perhaps there is bracing on the inside that I can not see?

    What did you end up doing about the knot in the A-frame? I was thinking that you could remove most of the weak knot material, fill it with epoxy glue, and then tape it over with some fibreglass tape. That should be more than strong enough.

    Rex.

  18. #53
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    Default Re: Luanch Trolley Ideas, Anyone?

    Hey Rex,
    No, no movement at the handle.
    Its got two large coach bolts through it as well as being epoxied. Also, followed up with epoxy fillets once in place. I suspect the parts around it will break before the epoxy goes.

    The bulk of the weight of the boat sits on those two bunks above the wheels.
    This located about under the center thwart. there is a laminated frame that runs athwart-ships at that point. Which was part of my thinking when designing it.

    I feel quite confident about the structure, but the height is something to be dealt with.
    The trolley still isn't painted/varnished - intentionally so i could work a little more on it.

    I'll cut off the bunk supports, lower the whole bed down the 45mm.
    The trolley floats, but that's probably more to do with air in the tires i think, it makes recovery a little annoying. I don't think there is anything i can do there.

    The knot - I haven't dealt with it, but when i get it back on the bench i might just do what i planned and glue a brace peice above it - and perhaps a strip of glass on the underside - wouldn't do any harm to have that on both sides.

    Thanks for keeping an interest!
    Last edited by gypsie; 05-30-2018 at 11:18 PM.
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
    Robert Menzies - Liberal Party (Conservative) Prime Minister of Australia.

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